llBlack_Heartll wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

llBlack_Heartll wrote: »

Atherakhia wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Item sets and passives that generate Ultimate now require you to be in combat to activate, to help reduce their ability to continuously enter a fight at full Ultimate.

May I ask, what is the problem of being able to enter combat at full (or partialy full) ultimate, aka open a fight with an ulitmate ability ???

As far as I can tell it was always a thing. Why all of the sudden it is an issue ? Certain classes and playstyles even are ment to opretate in that way (gain ulti outside of combat). Some classes are ment to gain more ulti while in combat like (DK or Warden) and other - outside of combat, as a pre-buff. I think the prime example is NB with its potion passive. It is an "assasin" archetype. Class was designed for being able to open a fight with an ultimate.
Now, this tiny change will affect the whole game ecosystem. People will save their ulti for later or even - ignore the whole ultimate system to some degree and slot ultimates mostly for passive.
I have tested it on PTS and it is pretty harsh. New players and solo players will struggle the most, while in group enviroment - it won't be noticable this much.
I have tested this change and it was mostly noticeable on a NB, as it has pretty much no other sources of ulti gain (other than soul harvest that is, but it is still there mostly for passive, and "in combat"). As someone in this thread have already said NB's Catalyst passive is kinda useless currently on PTS. I mean as far as I can tell, this passive was never an issue and was not changed since like... game launched, back in 2014...

If I were to give an advise / suggestion / feedback, I would limit this "only in combat" ultimate gain to sets only, and leave passives as they are. Otherwise, you will have to re-do a lot of passives & abilities, as some classes tend to relay more on passives, and other on abilities. Necromancer is a good example here as this class will still be able to gain ultimate outside of combat (Necrotic Potency).

When every fight starts with 8 meteors and a colossus it's a problem. This change is inconsequential. Yes, it makes these sets useless outside of trash pulls. They're hardly the only sets that will be useless. I honestly don't understand the complaint with this.

Looks like another PvP nerf that PVE suffers for.

Actually it's aimed at pve more so than pvp.

He was referring to every boss fight starting with 8 meteors.
Arkasis genius made it kinda dumb to generate ult outside of combat.

I don't know many that use Meteor as an ulti in PvE, its normally there for stats. Its more used in PvP for the stun attached. that's why I assumed he was talking PvP.

Shooting star with the ultimate return is often used to open on trash fights.
Either way if you are doing endgame trials you should already know about pre buff sets, and arkasis is kinda bonkers for that.
Sadly Zos decided to once again blanket nerf instead of fixing the one set that was causing issues.
Btw arkasis is still heavily.going to be abused in pvp group play as ppl can actually afford to wear it.

katorga wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

llBlack_Heartll wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

llBlack_Heartll wrote: »

Atherakhia wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Item sets and passives that generate Ultimate now require you to be in combat to activate, to help reduce their ability to continuously enter a fight at full Ultimate.

May I ask, what is the problem of being able to enter combat at full (or partialy full) ultimate, aka open a fight with an ulitmate ability ???

As far as I can tell it was always a thing. Why all of the sudden it is an issue ? Certain classes and playstyles even are ment to opretate in that way (gain ulti outside of combat). Some classes are ment to gain more ulti while in combat like (DK or Warden) and other - outside of combat, as a pre-buff. I think the prime example is NB with its potion passive. It is an "assasin" archetype. Class was designed for being able to open a fight with an ultimate.
Now, this tiny change will affect the whole game ecosystem. People will save their ulti for later or even - ignore the whole ultimate system to some degree and slot ultimates mostly for passive.
I have tested it on PTS and it is pretty harsh. New players and solo players will struggle the most, while in group enviroment - it won't be noticable this much.
I have tested this change and it was mostly noticeable on a NB, as it has pretty much no other sources of ulti gain (other than soul harvest that is, but it is still there mostly for passive, and "in combat"). As someone in this thread have already said NB's Catalyst passive is kinda useless currently on PTS. I mean as far as I can tell, this passive was never an issue and was not changed since like... game launched, back in 2014...

If I were to give an advise / suggestion / feedback, I would limit this "only in combat" ultimate gain to sets only, and leave passives as they are. Otherwise, you will have to re-do a lot of passives & abilities, as some classes tend to relay more on passives, and other on abilities. Necromancer is a good example here as this class will still be able to gain ultimate outside of combat (Necrotic Potency).

When every fight starts with 8 meteors and a colossus it's a problem. This change is inconsequential. Yes, it makes these sets useless outside of trash pulls. They're hardly the only sets that will be useless. I honestly don't understand the complaint with this.

Looks like another PvP nerf that PVE suffers for.

Actually it's aimed at pve more so than pvp.

He was referring to every boss fight starting with 8 meteors.
Arkasis genius made it kinda dumb to generate ult outside of combat.

I don't know many that use Meteor as an ulti in PvE, its normally there for stats. Its more used in PvP for the stun attached. that's why I assumed he was talking PvP.

Shooting star with the ultimate return is often used to open on trash fights.
Either way if you are doing endgame trials you should already know about pre buff sets, and arkasis is kinda bonkers for that.
Sadly Zos decided to once again blanket nerf instead of fixing the one set that was causing issues.
Btw arkasis is still heavily.going to be abused in pvp group play as ppl can actually afford to wear it.

ZOS should have known better than to put Arkasis in the game. The logic response is remove it from the game and replace with a new set, not wreck everything else.

I called out the set for being insanely broken like week 1 of pts.
I'm guessing they want ppl to actually commit to wearing the set(and giving up another 5pc bonus), in order to gain the benefits.
Still, they could have given it the clever alch treatment instead of outright changing all ult gen.
To be honest ult gen outside of combat is really only an issue in trial score runs, if you run this in a pvp grp you want to keep generating ultimate with the set even in combat.

With the changes to Nightblade's Executioner Passive, it's clear that this step is in the direction of adding more balance to Hybrid playstyles (or at least welcoming opposite ability costs with your main attribute). In response to that direction, I would like Nightblade's to have another playstyle represented: Stamina Healing.

Here are some changes/additions I think should be considered to make Nightblade Stamina Healing more viable than it is (since not a single non-Ultimate skill aids this currently).

Ambush (Teleport Strike morph) - Add: "Grants empower to allies within 8m for the same duration." (Can be further complicated by designating 8min from point of teleport or point of arrival/enemy.) OR "Using a Heavy Attack on your victim of Ambush spreads the Minor Vulnerability to enemies within 8m and doubles the duration."

Malevolent Offering - Change: Scale this ability with the largest resource (instead of only Magicka). (Stamina Healing is mostly HoTs (Heals over Time); a burst would be very helpful.)
Shrewd Offering (Malevolent Offering morph) - Add: "Healed ally gains Minor Berserk for 8 seconds."

Crippling Grasp (Cripple morph) - Change: Stamina cost. Bleed damage. 8m range. Applies Minor Staminasteal to enemies.

I do not think it's necessary that Path of Darkness or Strife be changed to fit with Stamina builds. An ability's utility can still be realized without making it specific to an attribute. Also, a healthy separation of options allows further player choice.

Ambush and Shrewd Offering are too solo-driven; both Cripple morphs are too similar. By implementing group buffs and giving a clear Magicka/Stamina option to Cripple, these 3 spells can be enough to make Nightblade Stamina Healing a viable and rewarding option.

Thank you.

Resource given back from skills/passive should be affect by major intellect, minor intellect, and CP resource increase.

Naive Passive Example
Combustion gives 500
If major intellect
500 x .4 = 200 + 500 = 700

Naive Active Skill Example
Spell Symmetry gives 3000
If Major Intellect
3,000 x .4 = 1,200 + 3,000 = 4,200

I would like to point out the level 41 level up tip, where the game tells you how to light attack weave.

No. Its not an accident or poor programming. Its part of the design.

Many classes utilities cut

So much unbalance and yet nothing feels unique, everything is just a different flavor, perhaps give class sets or extra class passives if you equip specific sets.

One bis race still, mission statement of "Play how you want" is a trap to be handicapped.

Playing Magicka feels terrible and the numbers don't lie, they are much weaker than stamina.

Buff to global pen makes spell erosion weaker than weapon damage modifier, then account for weapon critical tacked on per piece instead or 5 total for light armor, then Berserking Warrior ( Advancing Yokeda ) Giving more than 1000 crit than Mother Sorrow with no mag equivalent.

Drdeath20 wrote: »

Jodynn wrote: »

There is no balance among classes and magicka/stamina in end game DPS

Stamden 114k
Stamplar 112k
Stamblade 105k
Stamcro 105k
StamDK 101k
Stamsorc : 100k It feels awful and no conclusive report, maybe if air atro or crystal weapon wasn't so... terrible.

MagDK 95k

I don't have any evidence for the other Magicka classes and haven't tested them personally, just magDK, stamsorc, stamDK and stamblade.

My class, magDK, feels very weak..
No execute
Terrible passives
Terrible sustain, Parse food is unrealistic and even then I still have sustain problems WITH a charged staff ( gives more sustain because burning from combustion )
Many skills that seem nice but in use are only usable with sets ( elfbane x burning talons ) or only useful in niche, weird builds ( molten armaments and AoE Heavy Attack Builds with a Lightning staff, Major sorc/brutality is useless in most cases as well )

What I enjoy about end game PvE DPS is comparing my skill to other players, if my baseline DPS is so far off from other classes, it doesn't feel good being weaker just because of class choice, it doesn't feel competitive or like a fair comparison.

They really need to find a great balance with the combustion passive so that sustain is a little better but not OP broken how it was when it was bugged.

Really the hardest part is to add something fun about magdk. Its just lay down all my AoE/DoTs and then whip/force pulse endlessly, especially with elfbane. I understand that this is asking alot but having choices in the rotation makes me feel dialed in.

I totally agree.. an idea I had.

Make empowered chain morph buff whip and itself as a melee attack, into a Chain Sword.

Option 1:
Whenever you hit something with whip 3 times then chain gets a proc and deals extra damage, burning, cost 50% less and a searing DoT for 4 seconds.

Option 2:
Whenever you use whip you get empowered chains for 3 seconds which always causes burning and cost is 50% less
When you use chains you get empowered whip for 3 seconds which always causes burning and cost 50% less

I prefer option 2 because it would be more kinetic feeling and the animation changing would look nice; and also a flaming sword made of chains just sounds awesome.

Gorreck wrote: »

December7854 wrote: »

I would like to point out the level 41 level up tip, where the game tells you how to light attack weave.

No. Its not an accident or poor programming. Its part of the design.

It was (it wasn't part of the original design per se), but it was one they were unable to resolve and is now part of the game.

It has however caused a vast amount of problems over the years.

No it doesn't cause problems only for people who want this game to be wow style combat...
Animation canceling is possible Beacuse we have reactive blocking dodging bar swapping and light/heavy attacks are manual and not automatic.
It's part of the game and after 6 years ppl should accept it.

Based on the changes this patch i think that most minor and major effects are a little underpowered. I feel like every percentage based major and minor buff with the execption of expedition, should be changed to 8/16. 5% feels quite small, and 10% for the most powerful effects feels atrocious on ultimate skills like sleet storm, storm atronach's synergy and glacial collosus.

When it comes to warden specifically, it's previous issues still remain. And as frost staves are getting an update, magicka warden should be getting shifted more into a frost damage focus, i can't expect a massive rework of arctic blast, at least not right now, but extra chilled chance being applied from frost damage animal companions skills would be a huge help to increase uptime of chilled to groups. If not all of the magic animal companions, then specifically deep fissure would be a fantastic start.

December7854 wrote: »

ExistingRug61 wrote: »

I have a couple of concerns regarding the changes to buffs and how they affect magicka vs stamina sustain.

Firstly, the availability of minor intellect vs minor endurance. The value of these buffs have been increased to 20%, so the importance and value of them to builds has increased. However, minor endurance is readily available to all classes via weapon/guild skills, notably momentum, whereas minor intellect is only available to some classes via class skills, and even then perhaps not on a skill as commonly used even by those classes as momentum is by stam builds. As such it seems like almost all stamina builds will gain a sustain buff from this change, whereas this is not the case for magicka builds.

Perhaps minor intellect could be made more readily available via multiple weapon/guild/world skills like minor endurance is to balance this issue.

Secondly, the reduction in the value of minor magickasteal obviously also is a change that only affects magicka sustain, whereas stamina sustain is unaffected (sure there is no equivalent minor staminasteal, but stamina gets a generic cost reduction on all skills, which is unchanged, and this somewhat balances magickasteal). It seems like if sustain was currently balanced in the live version between magicka and stamina, then this change will mean it no longer is. Is there something else that could be done make up for this loss of sustain that only affects magicka builds?

It may be that sustain is simply not an issue anymore given that major intellect and major endurance are now 40% leading to everyone having enough sustain anyway, but if not then it seems like there is now an imbalance.

Perhaps minor intellect on ele drain.

Naw, sustain won't be a problem.

Firstmep wrote: »

Gorreck wrote: »

December7854 wrote: »

I would like to point out the level 41 level up tip, where the game tells you how to light attack weave.

No. Its not an accident or poor programming. Its part of the design.

It was (it wasn't part of the original design per se), but it was one they were unable to resolve and is now part of the game.

It has however caused a vast amount of problems over the years.

No it doesn't cause problems only for people who want this game to be wow style combat...
Animation canceling is possible Beacuse we have reactive blocking dodging bar swapping and light/heavy attacks are manual and not automatic.
It's part of the game and after 6 years ppl should accept it.

Bingo. As long as you can pre-empt a skill to block, roll, swap cancelling will be possible in some form or fashion.

So in addition with the bugs and issues templars have faced since Stonethorn not being addressed, we also have the looming threat of aoe cooldowns and ramping costs completely disabling the class.

I just dont understand, does no one from the devs actually play templar, and if they do, do they play in no cp? Bgs?

Stamplar self healing is so patheticly weak, that im literally better off stacking health recovery.

I can run a 6k weapon dmg build with no built in hp recovery, and be much squishier than running 2k hp recov and half that wpd. Its just silly.

On top of that(and this has already been proven and reported) Backlash is getting double mitigated, which is completely ruining the skill for pvp, a skill that was not overperforming in any way before its nerf.
Its a single target 6!!! second delay burst skill that needs to be built up in damage to actually do anything.
No other delayed burst skill is this unforgiving/hard to manage.

Burning light is literally not proccing even after 4 aedric spear hits, due to the server not registering the hits fast enough, easily fixable by extending the stacks duration to, i dont know, anything more than 1 second??
And even than it would be a shadow of its former self.
I really like all these stamplar parse videos where people just sit on the dummy and spam jabs and whooa so much damage, meanwhile in an actual pve encounter youll be lucky to get half the burning light procs.

Radial Sweep was completely wrecked by the cast time added, the damage is a lot more delayed than the cast time would suggest, making a lot easier to avoid than other ultimates.

And these are just the lastest issues, i dont even want to get into the myraid of useless passives, useless and unused skills(sun shield, healing ritual, sun fire, radiant aura etc..) and much much more.

I really hope next patch we will some much needed adjustments and hopefully reworks.

Plenty of good ideas have been thrown out there by the community on how to improve templars without making them broken, please for the love of Stendarr, listen to feedback just for once.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Gilliam

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

Lol. Remember guys. Class balance is once a year at the end of the year... We also skipped it last time.

You really can't rebalance the classes as long as ZOS completely changes the underlying mechanics ever 3 months.

Whatever you do is already out of date by the next DLC. Take health-based heals, for example, that are a current nerf-thread topic. They are only useful in THIS meta. Prior, they were meh. In the future they may be meh. In isolation they are neither good/nor bad, they are completely dependent on the proc meta that allows players to sacrifice damage for health. Remove that and they are not great.

katorga wrote: »

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

Lol. Remember guys. Class balance is once a year at the end of the year... We also skipped it last time.

You really can't rebalance the classes as long as ZOS completely changes the underlying mechanics ever 3 months.

Whatever you do is already out of date by the next DLC. Take health-based heals, for example, that are a current nerf-thread topic. They are only useful in THIS meta. Prior, they were meh. In the future they may be meh. In isolation they are neither good/nor bad, they are completely dependent on the proc meta that allows players to sacrifice damage for health. Remove that and they are not great.

This is not true. Even before this meta, 40k hp stamdens were already a thing, they were just running new moon/fury/clever and were still hitting hard enough.

Nerf to snipe is justified. Please keep on that track thank you