Intuition - Majority of players might be supporting the downfall of ESO

Scrollup · August 2020

Is it me but i get the feeling ESO players are actually supporting the downfall of the game? Although there is an increase of the game player base joining ESO since roughly 8 months to 1 year ago.

Not enough demand or criticism to the base game and or other aspect surrounding ESO that ZOS will continue to do what they feel like?
I feel like majority of players dont give a rats butt.

But for some reason my guts is telling me this game is going downward once people realized ZOS business model all things ESO.

I could be completely wrong about this but something just tells me otherwise.

redgreensunset · August 2020

Or maybe the majority of players are overall okay-ish with how things are or are going? Idk, just a thought.

Danikat · August 2020

If you think there's some aspect of the game which hasn't already been criticised on this forum please do tell us, I'm sure someone will be able to start a thread to rectify the problem right away. The chance to complain about something which has never been complained about before is pretty rare.

Seriously though (although I'm only 1/2 joking with the above) I think @redgreensunset has a point. If you think there's more people playing ESO now than a year ago, and they're not complaining about the things you're not happy about it's entitely possible that's because those things don't bother them and they enjoy the game as it is.

It would really help if you could be more specific about what you think is wrong that everyone else is missing though, without that information it's difficult to do more than speculate on why different people may have different opinions on what makes a game fun.

BisDasBlutGefriert · August 2020

This should have been a poll

SeaGtGruff · August 2020

I'm okay with the content of the game and the overall business model-- if by "business model" you mean "Crown Store"?

I'm also reasonably okay with the performance of the game and the attempts to improve it-- although that could be because I don't spend a lot of my time in Cyrodiil or other locations (such as Craglorn) where the performance is said to be unbearable.

Also, I got most of my griping out of my system 3 years ago when I first bought ESO and started playing, because I regularly experienced slow-downs, lag, and occasional disconnects way back then. I've come to accept that these sorts of issues are just (IMHO) inescapable consequences of online gaming; even the online games I play on my iPad have occasional issues with disconnects, lag, and downed servers. And ESO performs markedly better on my new computer than on my old one.

bmnoble · August 2020

I don't know about others but I didn't even know how to register for the forums till I received an invite to the PTS and finally looked into the process and joined most never bother until something goes wrong.

MincVinyl · August 2020

I wouldnt say that the majority of players are trying to force a downfall. That sounds like you are saying there is a negative intent behind what people ask for.

I'd say it is more of zos wanting to grab as many players up as possible and seeing newer players not stick around. This leaves zos wanting to appeal to the masses, which inevitably dumbs down the game, but ensures zos employees stay employed for the long haul.

SamanthaCarter · August 2020

I saw 90% of irrelevant comments in this forum that’s why i’m here because they killed my game with their comments nerf this nerf that since 5 years but never l2p

Zodiarkslayer · August 2020

So do I understand you correctly? You say that people not caring about the game is what is going to be its downfall? Or the fact that they dont voice their concerns and wishes for the game?
Mhmmm....
If that is so I cant agree!

First up: The forums are full of people stating their wishes and giving feedback. They seem to care! Albeit for (this is totally conjecture based on personal experience) mostly self centred reasons.
Secoundly: I get the feeling most the above mentioned are also being largely ignored by the game's devs. And for good reason.
Thirdly: The attraction of ESO lies mainly with its deep lore aspects and the diverse ways you get to experience it. That will not disappear unless ZOS decides to nuke the entire project in favour of another IP (pardon the pun).

And concerning the business model: I find it still strange that people dont realise how player friendly ESO is by comparison. You can get the majority of the game and its experience by one(!) upfront payment. Compare that to other MMO's, roleplaying or not, that is really generous. And i my opinion a main reason why the playerbase still grows after 5 to 6 years.

@Scrollup On a personal note: I suspect your feeling comes from the sometimes toxic demeanor of ESO players among themselves.

Athan1 · August 2020

We are too busy enjoying the game so no time to moan

red_emu · August 2020

It's not really that. The problem is, the way ZOS listens to player feedback.

In other MMOs, developers usually listen to the majority of players and the minority unhappy about the changes or solutions adapts.

In ESO it's the other way round. 1% of playerbase will complain about something and ZOS will move heavens and earth to cater to them and the other 99% has to adapt. It is a weird way of doing things but I think we got used to it.

Lalothen · August 2020

I've been gaming online for 23 years, and honestly I've seen statements like this rehashed over, and over, and over - along with all the other negative commentary too. Frankly it's almost always proven to be rhetoric from jaded players not getting what they personally want out of a particular game, though in some instances the "sky is falling" statements have turned out to be true, with notable examples including Shadowbane and Darkfall Online. One thing that's proven to be a common factor in MMO failures like the aforementioned games though, has been a heavy focus on PvP. So long as PvP remains a smallish feature in ESO, and ZOS focuses more of their attention on streamlining general gameplay whilst adding new content, they'll continue to do pretty well - just as MMOs like Allods, RIFT and so on have done.

Yuffie91 · August 2020

For me it seems the chapters are going downhill. Morrowind had way more content than Elseweyr. Not even bought Greymoor as I heard it has even less quests. For me definitely not worth the price.

SeaGtGruff · August 2020

red_emu wrote: »

It's not really that. The problem is, the way ZOS listens to player feedback.

In other MMOs, developers usually listen to the majority of players and the minority unhappy about the changes or solutions adapts.

In ESO it's the other way round. 1% of playerbase will complain about something and ZOS will move heavens and earth to cater to them and the other 99% has to adapt. It is a weird way of doing things but I think we got used to it.

I think that's just your perception. It may have been sorta-kinda the case when ZOS listened to class representatives, but it's my understanding that they discontinued that program. I think ZOS hears every complaint and suggestion, but that doesn't mean they'll try to do something about all complaints and all suggestions. They need to examine each one and consider if it's a good idea or a bad idea, how workable it would be as far as not breaking other things or just being doable or not, whether or not it fits in with their larger plans, etc. And if 1% of the players' ideas are implemented, that really just means that only 1% of the ideas were worth pursuing or fit into the overall plan, etc. Just because 99% of the players want a particular thing doesn't mean it's a good idea-- case in point, flying mounts, which I think would be a disastrous thing if it ever happened, plus it would (IMO) pretty much be the Poster Child of Lore-Breaking.

Eifleber · August 2020

ESO isn't that bad at all.

The frustrating thing is that it's so obvious how much better it could be.

*

bearbelly · August 2020

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

red_emu wrote: »

It's not really that. The problem is, the way ZOS listens to player feedback.

In other MMOs, developers usually listen to the majority of players and the minority unhappy about the changes or solutions adapts.

In ESO it's the other way round. 1% of playerbase will complain about something and ZOS will move heavens and earth to cater to them and the other 99% has to adapt. It is a weird way of doing things but I think we got used to it.

I think that's just your perception.

That is absolutely just his perception.
I haven't seen anything here, with this game or company, that doesn't happen the same way with other gaming companies and their games.
Also, go to any gaming forum and the complaints are all about the same things, and every game out there is the worst game ever.

Fischblut · August 2020

Not enough demand or criticism to the base game and or other aspect surrounding ESO that ZOS will continue to do what they feel like?

I'm actually shocked that people are ok with what was done to Maelstrom and DSA weapons in Greymoor. If many old players are cool with those awful changes, and they happily started to grind vMA/vDSA to get same weapons again... It is really scary

So in some way, I agree with the statement in original post.

Nairinhe · August 2020

Sky's been falling since launch, IIRC.

Danikat · August 2020

Fischblut wrote: »

Not enough demand or criticism to the base game and or other aspect surrounding ESO that ZOS will continue to do what they feel like?

I'm actually shocked that people are ok with what was done to Maelstrom and DSA weapons in Greymoor. If many old players are cool with those awful changes, and they happily started to grind vMA/vDSA to get same weapons again... It is really scary

So in some way, I agree with the statement in original post.

I wonder how many players actually had them in the first place. I know they're recommended for trials and a lot of people on the forum will talk as if everyone has got them or will get them eventually, but the forum tends to attract more hardcore players. It's not difficult to find people in-game who don't use them and have no intention of using them or don't even know what vMA is.

ZOS will never tell us of course, but I'd love to know the actual percentage of accounts (or even accounts with a level 50 character) which have at least 1 of those weapons.

JTD · August 2020

From a business point of view as long as there are players who have multiple accounts are subbed and buy a multitude of crown crates this game isn't having a downfall.

PrimusNephilim · August 2020

naw....I can't wait to see what the next chapter (2021) is going to be. Considering whats currently out there (for me) this is pretty decent MMO to play. I've been playing ESO since 2017 and the mobs were stating ESO was going to fail and wouldn't make it to 2018....and yet, here we are.

Scrollup wrote: »

But for some reason my guts is telling me this game is going downward once people realized ZOS business model all things ESO.

This one always cracks me up. So do tell, just what is Bethesda's business model? I can tell one one major goal they have and that's to stay in business. I could go on and explain yearly budgets, forecasting, market trends, available resources but I'm sure you're already involved with those aspects of operating a business.

Enjoy the game for what it is....a break from this mad crazy reality we live in.

~ Cheers!

MerguezMan · August 2020

Scrollup wrote: »

Is it me but i get the feeling ESO players are actually supporting the downfall of the game? Although there is an increase of the game player base joining ESO since roughly 8 months to 1 year ago.

Not enough demand or criticism to the base game and or other aspect surrounding ESO that ZOS will continue to do what they feel like?
I feel like majority of players dont give a rats butt.

But for some reason my guts is telling me this game is going downward once people realized ZOS business model all things ESO.

I could be completely wrong about this but something just tells me otherwise.

The answer is probably in the question...

Assuming a player joined the game about 6 months ago,
- he doesn't have absolute max level, and probably not enough experience to compare the current state of the game with what it was 2-3 years ago or before.
- he may compare to other MMOs, consider ESO has a few years and hass relatively well aged. Graphics don't make eyes bleed (have a TES 3 - Morrowind run, see for yourself, and come back), the game world is massive and filled with quests, the combat is dynamic and player skill can improvehow well you do on top of xp/character progression.

It's hard to come up with constructive criticism when you have barely experienced half of the product, aside from pointing out bugs. And objectively, new maps have a better look than previous ones, and gameplay mechanics get better on those.

I doubt that if you join ESO today, without having experienced it since game release, you'd think it somehow "degrades".

It's like facing Ri-Atahrashi solo without a clue, you'd think "Oh come on, this is probably a challenge for veteran players, I'll get back there later", and won't realize this world boss is absolutely cheated until you've faced enough other world bosses.

Rungar · August 2020

This game has the elder scrolls ip behind it. It will never really fail as long as they release new lands each year with the chapter and 4th qtr dlc. I imagine they make most of their money off of the chapter and eso plus and the crown store in third place. Pvp, trials, and dlc dungeons are like a weight around their neck.

i do believe though they screwed up following the whole "skill" animation cancelling crowd and that has cost them somewhat as that problem led to the screwup of the dlc dungeons and bad performance since the combat system is faster than they can manage and is easily exploitable. Most people i know that did play the game stopped playing because they didnt like the combat system.

VaranisArano · August 2020

I assumed this was going to be a gripe about players enabling ZOS' monetization schemes by buying crown crates and subbing while the game was broken.

Instead it reads more like, "What do you mean new and casual players still have fun in ESO and ZOS is still making bank off of them? Quick, guys, quit having fun and throw some criticism at ZOS (that agrees with what I think needs to be done, natch) or the game is gonna fail!"

Yuffie91 · August 2020

Rungar wrote: »

This game has the elder scrolls ip behind it. It will never really fail as long as they release new lands each year with the chapter and 4th qtr dlc. I imagine they make most of their money off of the chapter and eso plus and the crown store in third place. Pvp, trials, and dlc dungeons are like a weight around their neck.

i do believe though they screwed up following the whole "skill" animation cancelling crowd and that has cost them somewhat as that problem led to the screwup of the dlc dungeons and bad performance since the combat system is faster than they can manage and is easily exploitable. Most people i know that did play the game stopped playing because they didnt like the combat system.

How much more land can they make if they bring out a chapter each year though? I wonder what happens when we visited everywhere? Will they create something new that's not in the lore?

Rungar · August 2020

Yuffie91 wrote: »

Rungar wrote: »

This game has the elder scrolls ip behind it. It will never really fail as long as they release new lands each year with the chapter and 4th qtr dlc. I imagine they make most of their money off of the chapter and eso plus and the crown store in third place. Pvp, trials, and dlc dungeons are like a weight around their neck.

i do believe though they screwed up following the whole "skill" animation cancelling crowd and that has cost them somewhat as that problem led to the screwup of the dlc dungeons and bad performance since the combat system is faster than they can manage and is easily exploitable. Most people i know that did play the game stopped playing because they didnt like the combat system.

How much more land can they make if they bring out a chapter each year though? I wonder what happens when we visited everywhere? Will they create something new that's not in the lore?

there are still lots of locations and then you have oblivion so i would imagine they have plenty of places to go. What i was really pointing out was that the game thrives on casual experiences and the hardcore experiences are likely a cost to zos.

VaranisArano · August 2020

Yuffie91 wrote: »

Rungar wrote: »

This game has the elder scrolls ip behind it. It will never really fail as long as they release new lands each year with the chapter and 4th qtr dlc. I imagine they make most of their money off of the chapter and eso plus and the crown store in third place. Pvp, trials, and dlc dungeons are like a weight around their neck.

i do believe though they screwed up following the whole "skill" animation cancelling crowd and that has cost them somewhat as that problem led to the screwup of the dlc dungeons and bad performance since the combat system is faster than they can manage and is easily exploitable. Most people i know that did play the game stopped playing because they didnt like the combat system.

How much more land can they make if they bring out a chapter each year though? I wonder what happens when we visited everywhere? Will they create something new that's not in the lore?

They've got multiple realms of Oblivion and continents that we've never seen. We're not going to run out anytime soon, especially when you consider that they can always break regions up (Northern/Southern Elsweyr and Western Skyrim/the Reach).

MerguezMan · August 2020

Yuffie91 wrote: »

Rungar wrote: »

This game has the elder scrolls ip behind it. It will never really fail as long as they release new lands each year with the chapter and 4th qtr dlc. I imagine they make most of their money off of the chapter and eso plus and the crown store in third place. Pvp, trials, and dlc dungeons are like a weight around their neck.

i do believe though they screwed up following the whole "skill" animation cancelling crowd and that has cost them somewhat as that problem led to the screwup of the dlc dungeons and bad performance since the combat system is faster than they can manage and is easily exploitable. Most people i know that did play the game stopped playing because they didnt like the combat system.

How much more land can they make if they bring out a chapter each year though? I wonder what happens when we visited everywhere? Will they create something new that's not in the lore?

Tamriel is 1 continent on Nirn planet. And there are Daedric planes (Oblivion ? Shivering isles ?).
There is still plenty to do without stepping out of the lore.

Tandor · August 2020

I'm sure there are plenty of veteran players who've been here since launch who have never set foot in Cyrodiil or done a trial. The idea that only new players can enjoy the game is simply false. For any kind of non-competitive player the game compares more than favourably with any other, probably performs very well, and offers decent content with balancing and other changes passing them by. I realise that some people have problems with these things, mainly related to competitive PvE/PvP gameplay, but it seems increasingly apparent to me that most do not. As with any game, of course, the forum will largely be populated by those with complaints rather than those with praise.

PizzaCat82 · August 2020

Scrollup wrote: »

Is it me but i get the feeling ESO players are actually supporting the downfall of the game? Although there is an increase of the game player base joining ESO since roughly 8 months to 1 year ago.

Not enough demand or criticism to the base game and or other aspect surrounding ESO that ZOS will continue to do what they feel like?
I feel like majority of players dont give a rats butt.

But for some reason my guts is telling me this game is going downward once people realized ZOS business model all things ESO.

I could be completely wrong about this but something just tells me otherwise.

Hi there, you are wrong. You're welcome! Enjoy the forums.

Mettaricana · August 2020

bmnoble wrote: »

I don't know about others but I didn't even know how to register for the forums till I received an invite to the PTS and finally looked into the process and joined most never bother until something goes wrong.

This right here is why complaints and feedback are so skewed most pc and almost no console players know how to get to forums which also causes huge disgruntled masses because lots of players have no idea a change has happened because no one uses the forums. Ps4 and xbox id love a front page news with the full patch notes to tell me why a build doesn't work right anymore vs waiting for that one forum dweller guildie to break the news that x class or skill is dead. I sughest they add forum access to the launcher for console unsure if its a thing on the pc patcher been about 5 years since i was on pc.