catnamedwill wrote: »

DracoSaggitaExSole wrote: »

catnamedwill wrote: »

DracoSaggitaExSole wrote: »

out51d3r wrote: »

DracoSaggitaExSole wrote: »

You see, this is because as a magica user you have limited access to stamina, but all cc counter mechanics (Break Free, Roll Dodge, Block) are stamina based. So a stamina user will have an advantage but being able to afford higher stamina sustain builds.

So as a light armor magcia player i get hit the highest, and have the least resource to get away, lets say roll dodge or block.

I just don't feel that it is well balanced.

You should probably be thinking about some stam and/or stam recovery on a mag build(stam builds should often do the same for mag). Unless you're building a pure glass cannon, use prismatic enchants. The return on investment in those is really good. Carry tri pots. Maybe use tri foods. I know your instinct is to say "BUT STAM DOESN'T DO THAT!". Many of them do. I do almost all of those things on my Stamblade and my Stamsorc, as my best escape abilities cost mag.

Even my magicka bombblade runs with 14k stam, and it's pure glass cannon. I've been debating pushing it up to 16k stam.

I actually do use 3 prismatic, and have tri-pots but in no-cp since i am still 530 dont fell i can compete in the cc breaking, damage avoidence, mobility game with stam builds runnin with 30-35k stam.

Very few stamina build have 32k stamina, let alone 35k in no-CP. Also, it is intentional that stamina has better mobility. At least now, magicka can get close and magicka sorc can go beyong stamina mobility. Earlier magicka had half the mobility they have now.

Magicka builds have to rely on class abilities and Race against Time for mobility. The advantage for magicka builds is the massive range advantage, use it right and make it hard for melee players to close up on. You have mines for magsorc, fear trap for magblade, etc.

A massive range advantage? Umm... What about Snipe and perma roll dodge? Crit rush? My experience in the game brought me the conclusion to post about the above mentioned builds. And i even understand why they are op, I explained. But some of comments i feel are theory crafts on paper and not real working solutions in game.

Snipe is legit weak outside of ganking so if you are getting 1vXed by snipers, it is on you. Bow is the weakest main bar offensive weapon, which is why nobody outside gankblades use it. 99% of stamina 1vXers are melee. There are some exceptions which can be ranged but often are weaker or harder to master, etc.

Gap Closers like crit rush, is hardly used by 1vXers, who usually use sprint for closing up and even if used, it is on you to keep to keep them at range by kiting or using anti-melee like mine as I said before.

You can't perma roll in ESO, dodge costs stack up very fast. The one comes closest are stamina nightblade, who alternate between Cloak and roll to keep up their stamina. While they can effectively avoid a lot of damage, they build for high sustain to make it possible and are usually very squishy.

exactly

530 cp, started pvping yesterday, gets 1vXed (probably regularly from how you write), creates forum thread to qq.

Regular stuff from regular mobs with fingers

Major_Lag wrote: »

If you know there's a player you cannot possibly kill in your current setup, and you have already identified the reason why you are unable to kill them, then why are you even engaging them to begin with? Repeatedly, no less? What did you expect to accomplish by doing so? (no offense intended, this is a serious question)
There are many words which come to mind here as a way of describing such behavior, but "unwise" is perhaps the most diplomatic one I can think of.

I would like to react to lots of the contributions that you guys wrote, some are pretty good some I could argue with but hey.. thats all good we all see it differently and thats why we have a forum to discuss.

To respond to the quote above, the reason I go back to those fights, and not "just leave them alone", not just flee is simply how I look at a challenges in games, I like them. I don't mind loosing a lot against a difficult content. It forces me to be a better player, to improve my skills, simply practice fighting against difficult opponent. It helps me improve. Honestly if I just steamrolled through what ever comes to my way I would get bored of it.

Some of the other responses where rather interesting, but i will respect everyones sovereign opinion. Although let me just get couple of things off my chest.

I don't find the type of responses useful that say roughly "ahh just a noob got 1vX ed and qq on forums". There is an aspect of player skill in the discussion, yes it matters, it matters a lot. Please don't forget that beyond the player skill some could spot imbalance in the game. The possibility for an imbalance in the game is there, although it could be elusive to spot it due to the player skill factor.

I strive to look at this things in game as objective as possible but me being a human not a robot I could be emotional, like i was when writing the post initially. With a lot of different perspectives that was shared in this discussion I was able to understand the big picture a bit better.

I still think there is a an imbalance in the mobility and CC mechanics. I shared some input on what i think and how could improve it in my oppinion.

I also do agree with the fact that 5 noobs who don't even coordinate not going to beat a veteran player when he fight in advantageous position. True that, no argument on it. But i try hard to look beyond that case scenario.

I also wanted to share a concern. I wonder about some of the responses, do they even play magica light armor? Are they aware or experienced the phenomena that I brought up? If someone plays with and enjoys dominating with the above mentioned supposedly OP setup, would they want this to change? Are they aware of the amount of thought, and observation I was giving to this opinion?

I feel I have enough experience on the subject to express an opinion, an opinion from a perspective of an average player. So basically I say that I firmly believe that there is an imbalance with the CC avoidance and the resource they the use. I could see an improvement on that. Beyond player skill. I say the game should keep the "easy to learn, difficult to master" principle. But I see room for improvement.

So thank you for all the thoughts you guys shared, I learned from some, giggled on some but a lot of good perspectives where shared. Specially thank you for the constructive inputs!

BuildMan wrote: »

Idk. Most of the 1vXs I've done (like maybe 3-4 total) all rap around the idea of the X getting way to cocky in their numbers. My recent setup isn't even tanky it's just glass, mobility, and raw damage. Velidreth, Widowmaker, and spriggans. All divines too. I'm not the best pvper by any stretch but just looking at some of the people in the X gives a good indication of the gap in experience and knowledge.

Your perspective really made a point to me. That is very simply put, but easy to understand. Situational awareness can quickly decide the outcome at any vs any. But skill, experience, motor skill speed, like how fast can you comprehend a situation and than press a combination of buttons, is different in each players. My thought is than why not MMR, and have a number that indicates the current level of skill as match making point and leagues can be defined as well. I cant beat Schumacher to the nearest grocery store, no matter how hard i try, or how long. If he lets me, maybe. But with some one with a similar APM range, i tend to enjoy a game. But thats totally personal preference. Food for thought.

DracoSaggitaExSole wrote: »

UrbWzrd wrote: »

DracoSaggitaExSole wrote: »

I just have get this out of my chest... Sorry for any feelz i might hurt with it.

In my journey of learning to to play against players, study sets, watching youtube videos for several hours and playing in BG-s and Cyro for several hours i came to a conclusion. The PvP in ESO is broken, utterly un-enjoyable unless you do the same thing that certain players do that i seen in the videos. And before all of you reading me start smashing on the buttons of "git gud" "l2p" etc let me elaborate.

It is very simple. Build or copy a high mobility, high sustain, and high weapon damage build, you can easily do this, plenty out there. Run around objects to line of sight your opponents, since you can and thank the CC immunity, stealth, and insane amount of self heals, and constant roll dodge and the lack of their counters. pick couple of high damage skills and there you have it.

Just practice with it and you can be godlike too. Not because you are a good player, its because you exploit a broken PvP system in a game.

It is broken not because they exist in my opinion, it is utterly broken because the lack of counter to this recipe described above.

Yes learning to rotate your buffs, and learning the game, and have a tonn of experience plays a significant role in it. But after you have the learned these, and have the experience you become godlike because of the above mentioned broken PvP CC mechanics in the game.

There are good players in this game, but the game of PvP in this game is far from good.

And just a few things to get out of the way. I been playing games for 20 years. Seen a lot, did a lot. I can say that ESO have the most broken PvP system off the games I have had my hands on. If you don't follow the success recipe and play a certain way you are going to feed AP to the ones who follow the recipe.

This is my opinion and experience, you are free to have yours.

Why don't you just go play CoD or Starcraft if what you are looking is a "balanced" experience? A couple of minutes ago I wrote to a Nightblade hater that what he is asking Pong MMO and because of all the whining about "balance" Zenimax exactly going in that direction, even in the expense of whipping a pillar RPG character like rogue.

This is an RPG, and believe it or not, mostly shaped around PvE. Although I enjoy PvP, the "balance" obsession ruins the RPG aspect of the game. There should not be that much focus on "balance". If people are copying others, fine, you can do the same, and go in your way. What do you think all these balances will end up? Still there will be people copying others - which is not something I am against by the way - but you will also loose any variety, diversity, because everything is balanced, nerfed and all you will have moving bland blocks!

I want options, I want to feel God-like, and if somebody kicks my ass in Battle Grounds, I am fine with that, I don't want an experience who will push X button better decides the fate of the battle, because every char is the same with X amount of defense, Y amount of offence, no matter you name them Templar, Mage or Nightblade. This is what you are asking.

Again, this is an RPG and heavily relies on PvE, that is the reason I play, that is the reason I pay. You cannot ruin it for a "balanced" PvP experience. This is not a battle royale. But sadly, developers also think like you.

I don't mean that player A's gear and skills should do X amount of damage and player B's also should do X amount of damag, and everyone should move the same speed.

I mean by balance is if player A with a melee and medium armor can run fast and hit hard with a 2h than player B with a light armor and magica build should have better CC, and CC avoidance simply because its a squishier build with limited stamina. That is what i mean by balance. That bot players play a different role but their skill level decides who will win. Right now player A will win mostly on equal skill levels simply due to the fact that anti CC mechanics require stamina, and light armor magica user will have limited amount, and gets hit harder than other armor types.

Just take a look how many times you can break free and roll dodge on for example no CP on a medium armor 2h build, and a light armor magica build.

I just made this up, but here is my train of thought
Now if i could "phase out" similarly to roll dodge "arcane shatter" similar to break free with my magica on a light armor build than i would use my main resource pool for damage and avoidance, similar to stamina classes, but i could do it as much as they can so i would feel it more balanced.

In my mind the weakest armor should be the most nimble, and the heavy armor should be turtle like but can take the most beating. And medium armor should be the middle ground decent mobility and decent damage.

Right now my impression is that medium armor high stamina high stamina recovery, and high damage builds are superior to the other armor types, they can move the fastest, and hit the hardest, and avoid the most damage.

Thats is how i see it.

Now i see your point, and agree with what you say - except one thing. My complain is mostly about loosing class identity. And the one thing I don't agree is also about this; medium armor should be the fastest and hit hardest to a single target, which is a rogue identity. Light armor and magic class should be more about AoE and CC.Heavy armor, 2H, that is the warrior, hard to collapse but clumsy. Things should be balanced over these pillars.

I am not against experiments and versatility, but diversities from pillars should not depreciate or nullify value of the main role. In case of Nightblades, 2H should never ever be better than DW, not in PvE, not in PvP, which is unfortunately the case now.

Why should you not be able to kite players into single fights because they lack teamwork. How dare smart gameplay be rewarded.