Please dont que for veteran dungeons if....

shack80 · March 2020

You are unsure of mechanics
You are unsure of your own abilities (need to know how to block, dodge roll etc)
You are not able to handle you class (if you are dd please do damage)

This will only waste every1s time and the damn que timer sucks. If you want to learn mechanics or if you need to learn how to play the game (do damage and handle you abilities) that is what the guilds are for.

In my opinion vet que isnt the place where you go when you want to learn to play. It is just frustrating.

Some1 say that the que is for ppl to learn the game but in my opinion it is the opposite. Guilds are for this. Go for noob friendly guild to get help, not for the que.

Royaji · March 2020

This is going to be a great thread. I've brought some popcorn.

Agenericname · March 2020

If you want a certain expectation met, do not use the dungeon finder. Use a guild. Dungeon finder is a public option.

zvavi · March 2020

Disagree. I pug a lot and many times (not most) "learning" dds and tanks and heals preform better than experienced ones. It is especially true for healers. Dont know what eledrain or orbs are. a problem that i do encounter though, is language barrier.

Hapexamendios · March 2020

Or you can join a guild yourself and just play with them thus avoiding the queue.

tmbrinks · March 2020

The only thing I would ask of somebody queuing for veteran DLC dungeons (base game I could care less), is that you're able to do your role.

If you're a tank. Tank
If you're a healer. Heal (and do some DPS, depending on dungeon)
If you're a dps. Do Damage.

That's it. Perform the base duties of your role, and you'll be fine. Mechanics can be taught and learned, and that's fine.

But, if you're still learning to do the base duties of your role, do those in something other than veteran DLC dungeons, lots of other places to learn those!

zvavi · March 2020

tmbrinks wrote: »

The only thing I would ask of somebody queuing for veteran DLC dungeons (base game I could care less), is that you're able to do your role.

If you're a tank. Tank
If you're a healer. Heal (and do some DPS, depending on dungeon)
If you're a dps. Do Damage.

That's it. Perform the base duties of your role, and you'll be fine. Mechanics can be taught and learned, and that's fine.

But, if you're still learning to do the base duties of your role, do those in something other than veteran DLC dungeons, lots of other places to learn those!

Upvote.

SHANKS_63 · March 2020

In my experience when I run into this, it is typically a fake healer who thinks they are a dps and tries to convince everyone that we can just tank and 3 DD. This fake healer/DD also dosen't have combat metrics or else they would see that jumping around light attacking does about 8% of the dmg being dealt. They don't realize they are being carried because they don't know their own dps. Oh yeah and usually spam group chat to rez them when they die to the easiest of mechanics lol!

RefLiberty · March 2020

Agenericname wrote: »

If you want a certain expectation met, do not use the dungeon finder. Use a guild. Dungeon finder is a public option.

Agreed, OP completely turned the scope around.

If you want a stress free run, go with guild, and when you open yourself a beer, or beverage of your choice, and you are ready for some chaotic Muppet shenanigans, queue in Public Pug Fun Machine.

Neoealth · March 2020

I'll queue for whatever dungeon I want. If I know the mechanics or not. Why? Because I can and I'm entitled to as a player.

The more you protest and complain, the more I want to do it.

Plus everyone else does it, if you can't beat em, join em. You never know, sometimes you get in a fun group with others learning the mechanics.

Granicus · March 2020

While I understand, have certainly experienced, and surely caused some frustration myself for others in Vet Dungeons I almost completely disagree with the OP’s demand. Everyone has paid there money just like the OP and deserve no less to experience vet dungeons. And it’s the best way for them to learn to get better. 😉😁 Though I do agree in part, read up or watch a YT video to help you understand what the dungeon will be like. Being prepared is never a bad thing.

You join a PUG, you take your chances. I’ve seen some truly rude elitists throw absolute tantrums because someone/everyone didn’t meet their standards. It’s a game, meant to be fun and sometimes challenging. If people are having trouble in a dungeon help them, don’t berate them. Light a candle instead of, you know, curse the newbie.

Though I also agree with others here, know your role, do your best to perform it, and work to improve it. I’ve seen a lot of fake tanks and fake healers in dungeons lately, though that is a separate issue altogether.

P.S. And I also agree with OP ‘the damn que timer sucks’.

r3turn2s3nd3r · March 2020

tmbrinks wrote: »

The only thing I would ask of somebody queuing for veteran DLC dungeons (base game I could care less), is that you're able to do your role.

If you're a tank. Tank
If you're a healer. Heal (and do some DPS, depending on dungeon)
If you're a dps. Do Damage.

That's it. Perform the base duties of your role, and you'll be fine. Mechanics can be taught and learned, and that's fine.

But, if you're still learning to do the base duties of your role, do those in something other than veteran DLC dungeons, lots of other places to learn those!

+1

Sorry OP, but PuG is PuG, you get what you get, if you want a guaranteed smooth run, fill your group with guildmates or friends.

idk · March 2020

Royaji wrote: »

This is going to be a great thread. I've brought some popcorn.

+1

It is great that you have an opinion on the purpose of the activity finder but that is not shared by all and this thread will do nothing to change that.

Zos has set criteria and allows us to form our own group if want to set the bar higher as OP wants for their groups. Forming one's own group works well. Works much better than this thread ever could. Hundreds of thousands of times, if not millions, have successfully formed their own group for doing dungeons over the course of this game's life.

Agenericname · March 2020

Granicus wrote: »

While I understand, have certainly experienced, and surely caused some frustration myself for others in Vet Dungeons I almost completely disagree with the OP’s demand. Everyone has paid there money just like the OP and deserve no less to experience vet dungeons. And it’s the best way for them to learn to get better. 😉😁 Though I do agree in part, read up or watch a YT video to help you understand what the dungeon will be like. Being prepared is never a bad thing.

You join a PUG, you take your chances. I’ve seen some truly rude elitists throw absolute tantrums because someone/everyone didn’t meet their standards. It’s a game, meant to be fun and sometimes challenging. If people are having trouble in a dungeon help them, don’t berate them. Light a candle instead of, you know, curse the newbie.

Though I also agree with others here, know your role, do your best to perform it, and work to improve it. I’ve seen a lot of fake tanks and fake healers in dungeons lately, though that is a separate issue altogether.

P.S. And I also agree with OP ‘the damn que timer sucks’.

My experiences are of course anecdotal, but the players that are good players usually aren't the ones that are rude. The players that are rude can't always offer sound advice. There are exceptions, but that's held true more often than not in the vet DLCs. In non-DLC dungeons it's really not an issue.

dazee · March 2020

Scratch out the first one, I agree fully with the rest.

Everyone has a first time. if the others were willing to take just a minute to explain mechanics instead of buttrushing ahead first thing, runs would go smoother.

RogueShark · March 2020

Please dont que for veteran dungeons if....

You have expectations and will be upset by the RNG pugs.

Fixed that for you.

You can make your own group. Most people who are "detrimental" to your pugging experience do not read forums anyway.

colossalvoids · March 2020

No normal dungeon will prepare for a veteran difficulty, period. They should queue vet and get their experience and also nothing bad in experiencing kicks and rude behaviour also as it might happen anyway in the future, even in guilds and better start to grow skin earlier. Most people don't mind learners and are helpful, at least it was my case when i just started years back. One of the easiest ways to find a prog guild also if you're actually doing good.

Only thing i personally mind is fake queue without being able to do any role at all or being reason for wipes in vet dlc's. You can just equip taunt in regular vets and learn to block/shield, don't drag from aoes and then can fake queue as much as you want, but if you're dragging the boss across the room just to die from clear l2p issue it's not going well even for you, not saving time either.

idk · March 2020

RogueShark wrote: »

Please dont que for veteran dungeons if....

You have expectations and will be upset by the RNG pugs.

Fixed that for you.

You can make your own group. Most people who are "detrimental" to your pugging experience do not read forums anyway.

Very good.

Essentially OP queued for a random group of players and is proceeding to complain that they received exactly what was requested. As I pointed out a few posts above, forming your group gives you control to set your standards and works extremely well.

Chicharron · March 2020

shack80 wrote: »

You are unsure of mechanics
You are unsure of your own abilities (need to know how to block, dodge roll etc)
You are not able to handle you class (if you are dd please do damage)
You are elitist and drama queen (me)

xaraan · March 2020

People need to quit being selfish. Help people.

My only issue with queuing buddies is: fake tanks/healers that aren't at least doing the basic job and noobs that are totally unwilling to listen/learn.

Certainly it's nice to have a quick smooth run (although often boring) and it might get old to do training runs every single run of every day. Getting a lowbie or new player occasionally that wants to learn and you can help is a good thing.

Aznarb · March 2020

Go with friend and kick people who doesn't meet DG requirement and hope the next is better.
That what we do when forced to pug.
After kicking 2 horrible DDs we ended with a decent one so we can do Malatar and March in HM easily + farming success and motif, was a fun guy he's now a friend.

It's pug, no one care if you kick someone who is bad.
It's a game, you don't paly to endure someone who not have his place in "hard" content. can't count the number of fake tank/heal, horrible DDs or stupid PP player thinking they can use a Tanky pvp build to tank vet DLC..
With my mates we used all our patience with this part of comunity, now it's a direct kick.

But I agree with previous answer, both type :
- Read the fkng group chat
- Don't rush like idiot and wait for all
- Don't do DLC if you're not good enough, you wast time and fun of the group, it's selfish
- If you think you're good enough, but never run it, don't be stupid and ask people for the strat before the start
- Find guild or Discord (lot of disc around) where you can join people with good level LF pledge/succes/farm, same, be sur to be good or you'll be kick from these, it's farm disc, no learn-disc.
- Find guild so you can learn / run with a team that is not random stranger (doesn't matter if you good or bad, guild & friend is always the best option)
- PuG should always be the last option to learn / farm.
- Bring at least one friend who know he's good to make it easier.

oxygen_thief · March 2020

shack80 wrote: »

You are unsure of mechanics
You are unsure of your own abilities (need to know how to block, dodge roll etc)
You are not able to handle you class (if you are dd please do damage)

This will only waste every1s time and the damn que timer sucks. If you want to learn mechanics or if you need to learn how to play the game (do damage and handle you abilities) that is what the guilds are for.

In my opinion vet que isnt the place where you go when you want to learn to play. It is just frustrating.

Some1 say that the que is for ppl to learn the game but in my opinion it is the opposite. Guilds are for this. Go for noob friendly guild to get help, not for the que.

what does make you think that your opinion matters to someone? people have a right to do any content they want and play how they want if it doesnt break zos rules.

ArchMikem · March 2020

shack80 wrote: »

You are unsure of mechanics

Disagree

You are unsure of your own abilities (need to know how to block, dodge roll etc)

Agree

You are not able to handle you class (if you are dd please do damage)

Agree

If the Boss allows it, Mechanics are VERY easily bypassed and not even witnessed on Normal if the DPS is high enough. I've learned a lot of mechanics running vet Dungeons for the first time because of this. So what if your vet run takes a bit more time cause one person is still learning Boss mechanics, you frankly shouldn't be PuGing Veteran Dungeons if you're in a hurry.

daemonor · March 2020

I dont care about non dlc dungeons either, but it baffles me how people have the audacity to join for DLC pledges with their 300 cp bow 28k hp builds doing 8k dps and expect to get carried thru.
Altho today i pugged HM bloodroot in like 40 minutes, that was a very pleasant surprise.

Raisin · March 2020

If you don't know the dungeon yet, you can say so at the beginning of the run. Then it's up to the rest of the group to decide. That's how PUGs work IMO. You get what you get, but majority vote still plays a part. If 3 people wanna skip and you don't, tough luck. If you're the only one wanting to rush through, tough luck. It's a random group.

There is nothing inherently wrong about going into a dungeon still needing to learn. Whether the rest of the group is the right group for that kind of run is up to them, but most cases (in my experiences) your chances are good. I know a lot of people who just queue up for all vDLCs for the fun of it, often not as a full group. Let me tell you 100% all of the best experiences we have with a PUG is getting an inexperienced player there for a good time. There is nothing as enjoyable as running into a low CP tank there for the first time that's eager af to run the dungeon (whether this involves teaching of mechanics, or them wanting to figure things out on their own). The sheer excitement of someone there for the first time, nervous about what to expect, and getting a wonderful, positive experience out of the whole thing is the best thing about vDLC dungeon finder. They are often the most fun, committed, and enthusiastic players you can find. All they need is a tiny bit of patience from you.

The big deal is that those people need to bring a willingness to learn and do their best. That is the requirement. Don't go in refusing to listen, refusing to put in effort. It's about attitude and the honesty behind why you're there under the circumstances you're there. And being upfront about your situation (not necessarily at the beginning, but when you realize you're in over your head). You need to promise to do your best. And yes, if that truly isn't enough, and the group absolutely cannot clear, then you need to accept that. But that's it.

The same goes for playing your class, even if the thresholds are probably different. If it becomes very clear that you don't know the basics of gameplay and your role, it is likely that the group will hit the point of 'sorry we cannot run this with you' a lot faster. And some people don't have the time or the patience and heck if they're nice about it and that's the majority of the group, that's how it is. But always give people a chance to learn man. You gotta give them at least one opportunity to change.

I don't think it's fair to say that PUGs can't be a learning tool. And as many have already pointed out, this goes both ways and you have no right to expect a good group from a PUG. That's what guilds are for. You are allowed to adjust your PUG, kick someone if necessary, enforce certain standards, choose not to put up with something, that's all fine -- but you have no business expecting to always get that 'good' group immediately. Random's random. And chances are, you are someone's idea of a bad group.

Also, whole nother topic, but unfortunately normal dungeons do a *** job at teaching players basic gameplay mechanics, so vet kind of is the right place to learn them. It's cetainly where many first encounter and are required to perform them.

Granicus · March 2020

Agenericname wrote: »

Granicus wrote: »

While I understand, have certainly experienced, and surely caused some frustration myself for others in Vet Dungeons I almost completely disagree with the OP’s demand. Everyone has paid there money just like the OP and deserve no less to experience vet dungeons. And it’s the best way for them to learn to get better. 😉😁 Though I do agree in part, read up or watch a YT video to help you understand what the dungeon will be like. Being prepared is never a bad thing.

You join a PUG, you take your chances. I’ve seen some truly rude elitists throw absolute tantrums because someone/everyone didn’t meet their standards. It’s a game, meant to be fun and sometimes challenging. If people are having trouble in a dungeon help them, don’t berate them. Light a candle instead of, you know, curse the newbie.

Though I also agree with others here, know your role, do your best to perform it, and work to improve it. I’ve seen a lot of fake tanks and fake healers in dungeons lately, though that is a separate issue altogether.

P.S. And I also agree with OP ‘the damn que timer sucks’.

My experiences are of course anecdotal, but the players that are good players usually aren't the ones that are rude. The players that are rude can't always offer sound advice. There are exceptions, but that's held true more often than not in the vet DLCs. In non-DLC dungeons it's really not an issue.

I agree with you. And I make a distinction between Elite (good players) and Elitists (players who feel they are the best and everyone else is far worse and deserve to be mistreated). I have experienced many people who are both good players and good people in this game. They are patient, helpful, and remember that they once were new too. My assumption is that elitists have the same bad personality traits in game and in real life. To be pitied, somewhat.

pelle412 · March 2020

I think some players who queue for veteran DLC dungeons probably do not know they aren't pulling their fair share of the work because ESO as a game does not teach people how to play effectively in the trinity role system. I think this is more likely than someone queueing knowing they aren't very good expecting to be carried.

If ESO had built in tutorials for how to play each role with some clear measurements it might go a long way. All this stuff does exist but it's obscure to most players.

Hippie4927 · March 2020

Royaji wrote: »

This is going to be a great thread. I've brought some popcorn.

@Royaji

Sharing?

JinMori · March 2020

zvavi wrote: »

Disagree. I pug a lot and many times (not most) "learning" dds and tanks and heals preform better than experienced ones. It is especially true for healers. Dont know what eledrain or orbs are. a problem that i do encounter though, is language barrier.

What you said here is nonsensical.

Someone is not experienced if they do not know what to do. Therefore your argument is nonsense.

ghastley · March 2020

Did anyone else read the OP, as "don't queue unless you can carry me"?

shack80 · March 2020

Hapexamendios wrote: »

Or you can join a guild yourself and just play with them thus avoiding the queue.

This I kinda agree, but the thing is that usually when I play all of the guilds are "dead" because of timezones so thats one reason I try the finder.