I was going to make a separate thread for this stuff, but since general Housing feedback is being asked for here, I'll list a few things that would make Housing overall feel less restrictive and at times downright frustrating.

The biggest point is more furniture slots, as others have mentioned. As someone else pointed out and as I myself have complained about to numerous friends on multiple occasions over, we keep getting bigger and bigger houses that have more and more space, but not nearly enough furniture slots to fully decorate a place. 700 slots (which, let's remind everyone, you only get with ESO+, otherwise the max is 350) is not NEARLY enough to really and truly deck out larger homes like the Psijic Manor. As was, again previously mentioned, why do we have around 150-ish or so slots reserved for 'special' furniture like Trophies or Pets instead of lumping all of those slots under the 'general' ones and letting players decide how to make use of them? I almost never use the busts or trophies from dungeons, but I do use practically every other type of furniture. It's really annoying to technically have those furniture slots but not be able to make use of them because they're locked to a type of furniture I will NEVER use so many slots on.

Next up is furniture itself. As someone said, for general building things like walls and floors, we really need more than just a few racial styles of these things and definitely need them to come in ALL the Housing sizes ranging from Tiny to Large. It is EXTREMELY annoying how most houses aren't really houses, they're just buildings that are like one giant empty room, rather than having walls and doors like an actual house (and like certain places like the Psijic manor have). Yet trying to break up houses ourselves with the building furnishings we have now is one heck of a crapshoot, because nearly all the walls are for Large houses, which makes them super hard to work with for smaller houses or awkwardly-shaped spaces, and they also come in a very limited number of styles. Please either make walls/floors for EVERY racial style and make them each come in different sizes, or, an idea I like much better but would obviously be harder (if not impossible depending on the engine's limitations), would be being able to resize any piece of furniture so it actually fits wherever you'd like to put it.

PLEASE, FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING, MAKE THE PLACEMENT AND POSITIONING OF FURNITURE NOT BE TIED TO A CAMERA THAT FOLLOWS YOUR CHARACTER INSTEAD. On top of that, make furniture be locked into place when it's initially picked up! By far the most frustrating part of Housing for me is the furnishing itself. Trying to place larger items in smaller spaces is horrible most of the time because you can't control the camera independently from your character to see where something is relative to the space you're in. Regardless of where you're standing or where you grab an item from, you'll almost always pick it up near the bottom, and it's impossible most of the time to zoom out to see where you're place the item, since moving the camera to try and see where you're putting the item moves the item itself. Plus most of the time when you select an item to move, especially larger ones, the item will inexplicably jump to some location several inches from where it was placed, or at a different angle, and then you have to spend time correcting that before you can work on whatever positioning/placement it was you wanted to do originally. Having a secondary 'free range' camera we can move around and then lock into place (and the camera STAY locked into that position until unlocked) would be so much easier and less frustrating.

Arunei wrote: »

PLEASE, FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING, MAKE THE PLACEMENT AND POSITIONING OF FURNITURE NOT BE TIED TO A CAMERA THAT FOLLOWS YOUR CHARACTER INSTEAD. On top of that, make furniture be locked into place when it's initially picked up! By far the most frustrating part of Housing for me is the furnishing itself. Trying to place larger items in smaller spaces is horrible most of the time because you can't control the camera independently from your character to see where something is relative to the space you're in. Regardless of where you're standing or where you grab an item from, you'll almost always pick it up near the bottom, and it's impossible most of the time to zoom out to see where you're place the item, since moving the camera to try and see where you're putting the item moves the item itself. Plus most of the time when you select an item to move, especially larger ones, the item will inexplicably jump to some location several inches from where it was placed, or at a different angle, and then you have to spend time correcting that before you can work on whatever positioning/placement it was you wanted to do originally. Having a secondary 'free range' camera we can move around and then lock into place (and the camera STAY locked into that position until unlocked) would be so much easier and less frustrating.

All of this - trying to place something in a narrow area is an exercise in frustration at best. Either the object is zoomed in so close that its placement can't be seen or placement is trapped by character backed up against a solid surface. A free range placement camera has been needed since Day One.

Kashya_Vulano wrote: »

I agree; that's exactly why I say that all the other stuff everyone is requesting—day/night/weather cycles, guild banners, and so on, are just frivolous pipe dreams. They refuse to listen to us on the most basic request: Raise a number. So, if they refuse to listen to us with something that benign, [...]

I remember having read/heard somewhere, that the item limit has something to do with stability. So it might not be as simple, as it is usually made out to be. At least not until other matters have been adressed first. I think, they have understood by now, that people would like to give their homes a more lived in look, so I think the suggestion of creating more clustered items (like the bread-basket) is far more constructive than the continued cry for more slots whenever housing suggestions are requested.

That aside, I find the request for more visitors in a village-type home such as Forgemaster Falls much more relateable, as the 12 player limit really is quite constricting. Let's say you use it as the home for a small orc clan that might on occaison have visitors, 12 fills up awfully fast.

tracinyab16_ESO wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

PLEASE, FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING, MAKE THE PLACEMENT AND POSITIONING OF FURNITURE NOT BE TIED TO A CAMERA THAT FOLLOWS YOUR CHARACTER INSTEAD. On top of that, make furniture be locked into place when it's initially picked up! By far the most frustrating part of Housing for me is the furnishing itself. Trying to place larger items in smaller spaces is horrible most of the time because you can't control the camera independently from your character to see where something is relative to the space you're in. Regardless of where you're standing or where you grab an item from, you'll almost always pick it up near the bottom, and it's impossible most of the time to zoom out to see where you're place the item, since moving the camera to try and see where you're putting the item moves the item itself. Plus most of the time when you select an item to move, especially larger ones, the item will inexplicably jump to some location several inches from where it was placed, or at a different angle, and then you have to spend time correcting that before you can work on whatever positioning/placement it was you wanted to do originally. Having a secondary 'free range' camera we can move around and then lock into place (and the camera STAY locked into that position until unlocked) would be so much easier and less frustrating.

Juse use Essential Housing Tools. It's a great addon that makes it SO much easier to manipulate housing objects - once you install it and play with it for a bit, you can't go back. It's called Essential for a reason.

not sure if you know this but 100s of thousands of people play on console.

tracinyab16_ESO wrote: »

Juse use Essential Housing Tools. It's a great addon that makes it SO much easier to manipulate housing objects - once you install it and play with it for a bit, you can't go back. It's called Essential for a reason.

This is like saying just play another game. I use housing mods myself, but our increasing relyance on mods says alot about the state of housing after so many years. They are happy to take us money for large manors or 40 euros statues, but otherwise, improving housing is not on their list. There have been next to zero improvements to housing in the past few years. They keep adding houses, but they did nothing to improve the build engine, sort items (I still can't filter the items in my house to see which are special, collectible or whatever type they set to hamper you from placing the items you like). You still can't snap objects together like you can in Fallout 4, you still can't fine control objects or groups of objects, you still don't have a shared storage for all the furniture pieces, you can't deconstruct the bound furniture, and so on.
The requested furniture is always ignored, so that's useless to bring up again.

Konstant_Tel_Necris wrote: »

I have question about unique furnishing in new dungeons, I soloed normal version several times but didn't loot any furnishing trophies like it was in previous dungeons, is drop rate is so low or its I just was so unlucky or there is no new furnishing at all?

Another question about Undaunted quartermaster, there is only two items urn and flag, can be there more items from new dungeons or those urn and flag get some kind interaction, FX or sound to be more unique?

And last but not the least can this breton ship in Forgemaster Falls become movable furnishing, I really like that boat, can they be purchasable like reed boats from Murkmire?

Better yet make alot of money and put it in crownstore, all the boats in game that size should be in CS

anadandy wrote: »

tracinyab16_ESO wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

PLEASE, FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING, MAKE THE PLACEMENT AND POSITIONING OF FURNITURE NOT BE TIED TO A CAMERA THAT FOLLOWS YOUR CHARACTER INSTEAD. On top of that, make furniture be locked into place when it's initially picked up! By far the most frustrating part of Housing for me is the furnishing itself. Trying to place larger items in smaller spaces is horrible most of the time because you can't control the camera independently from your character to see where something is relative to the space you're in. Regardless of where you're standing or where you grab an item from, you'll almost always pick it up near the bottom, and it's impossible most of the time to zoom out to see where you're place the item, since moving the camera to try and see where you're putting the item moves the item itself. Plus most of the time when you select an item to move, especially larger ones, the item will inexplicably jump to some location several inches from where it was placed, or at a different angle, and then you have to spend time correcting that before you can work on whatever positioning/placement it was you wanted to do originally. Having a secondary 'free range' camera we can move around and then lock into place (and the camera STAY locked into that position until unlocked) would be so much easier and less frustrating.

Juse use Essential Housing Tools. It's a great addon that makes it SO much easier to manipulate housing objects - once you install it and play with it for a bit, you can't go back. It's called Essential for a reason.

While I appreciate the work and talent that goes into EHT - we shouldn't have to rely on a 3rd party add on for what should be basic game functionality. Every time someone says "Just use [X] add on" ZOS gets a pass to not change anything.

Fair point. Someone above also mentioned the poor console players who can't use addons, and to that person again... fair point. I guess I'm just a bit worried that ZOS will actually try and fix it, but instead end up breaking things really badly. Yes, that moment when you don't want improvements,(snip)

(edited for bashing)

SantieClaws wrote: »

Nothing about housing in the PTS natch potes.

So no changes then this week?

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

I don't think they're going to listen, as per the usual. Once again, we're given a thread to use as an echo chamber, to make it feel like we're offering real, genuine feedback.

And now, this thread is going to get buried just like the last one.

It's seriously frustrating.

Arunei wrote: »

@tracinyab16_ESO
It really is frustrating though, like @Kashya_Vulano said. Every new DLC/chapter or other big update we get these Housing threads, but other than certain bugs or visual issues being addressed, it seems none of the concerns that get brought up time and time again are ever given any time of day. They never tell us anything about adding more furniture slots, or increasing the limit of visitors (24 for the biggest places is ridiculous given how big those houses are and how many people they can realistically hold), or any other concerns or problems that are brought up.

Emphasis mine. With all due respect, this is what PTS threads should be about. These threads are created so that the players who are testing things on the PTS can give feedback about bugs and issues that might have been missed while internal testing was done.
These threads shouldn't be used to campaign for features players want but don't exist in the present PTS cycle.

KMarble wrote: »

Emphasis mine. With all due respect, this is what PTS threads should be about. These threads are created so that the players who are testing things on the PTS can give feedback about bugs and issues that might have been missed while internal testing was done.
These threads shouldn't be used to campaign for features players want but don't exist in the present PTS cycle.

It sort of defeats the point of offering criticism, if you think criticism isn't meant to engage change.

If a developer wants my feedback after putting up a new update, and I offer them said feedback, not all of it might be great feedback. I might offer that the developer take a second look at X or Y, so that they can improve on their product before they release it for the masses.

The exact same thing applies here.

People are here to offer their feedback; if something is or isn't in the game that they don't agree with, they're going to make their voices heard, because they were asked to. The player capacity and item limits are current issues in the game. They're already in the game. Consequently, they warrant discussion.

You're not going to rationally ask for feedback, and then when you get that feedback, say "Okay, cool! I'm not actually going to change it, but I did want to see what you thought." Additionally, the person asking for feedback isn't going to rationally say "Give me criticism, but only good criticism. If you ask me to change anything, then just keep it to yourself."

That's just how criticism and feedback works.

Arunei wrote: »

@tracinyab16_ESO
I was waiting for someone to bring up EHT. Like others have said, not everyone plays on PC, and even those of us who do shouldn't have to rely on addons for every major inconvenience ZOS doesn't want to fix themselves. I already have more addons than I'd care to in order to make other aspects of the game more bearable, and in fact have recently uninstalled several because I had so many. It doesn't help that the way addons work now, a lot of libraries that were built into the addons are now their own separate addons. Also I've used EHT in the past and honestly while it is a great addon, I can't work out how to get some of the more advanced features to work.

I do understand the fear of "they'll probably break 10 things fixing 1" though, since ZOS sort of has a track record for stuff like that. I don't code so I'm not sure how easy/hard a secondary locked camera option would be to implement, but if EHT can do it (since it sounds like it can given you mentioned it to begin with) then I don't see why ZOS couldn't do it themselves.

It really is frustrating though, like @Kashya_Vulano said. Every new DLC/chapter or other big update we get these Housing threads, but other than certain bugs or visual issues being addressed, it seems none of the concerns that get brought up time and time again are ever given any time of day. They never tell us anything about adding more furniture slots, or increasing the limit of visitors (24 for the biggest places is ridiculous given how big those houses are and how many people they can realistically hold), or any other concerns or problems that are brought up.

Since the creator of EHT is now on the ZOS housing team, I think that there may be less chance of breaking things with any additions they make to the housing editor.

KMarble wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

@tracinyab16_ESO
It really is frustrating though, like @Kashya_Vulano said. Every new DLC/chapter or other big update we get these Housing threads, but other than certain bugs or visual issues being addressed, it seems none of the concerns that get brought up time and time again are ever given any time of day. They never tell us anything about adding more furniture slots, or increasing the limit of visitors (24 for the biggest places is ridiculous given how big those houses are and how many people they can realistically hold), or any other concerns or problems that are brought up.

Emphasis mine. With all due respect, this is what PTS threads should be about. These threads are created so that the players who are testing things on the PTS can give feedback about bugs and issues that might have been missed while internal testing was done.
These threads shouldn't be used to campaign for features players want but don't exist in the present PTS cycle.

As others have said, the last question asking if we have any other general feedback does leave the door open to bring up requests or issues players have with housing in general. Especially the item limit issue, which is relevant feedback given the size of the homes on the PTS, which are rather large for the item limits allowed. We're telling them that the item limits overall are too low, but then they still give us houses that are too large for the item limits. And thus, we feel the need to provide feedback, yet again, that they either need to raise item limits or give us more reasonably-sized houses within the limits. Which then leads naturally to players offering suggestions on how to provide ways for players to better work within those constraints - clustered/cluttered items (filled bookcases, bowl of fruit, etc.) and building items (which would naturally reduce the number of slots dedicated to creating structures).

Honestly, I think that if ZOS could raise the item limits, they would. The question is whether they are even trying to find ways to do so. There clearly is some issue with the engine that is preventing a higher item limit, which is affected by consoles and low-end PCs, and ZOS want to keep the housing experience the same across the board (though it technically isn't, since consoles don't have access to EHT). I think it's possible that the item limit could be higher for high-end and perhaps even mid-tier PCs, but they want all PC players to be able to visit any players home, which thus necessitates the current item limit across the board. As a console player, I wouldn't mind at all if PC had a higher limit, and the experience on both platforms is already different thanks to add-ons. The only issue is that someone with a low-end PC can't access a friends house if it had, say, 1000 items in it.

But, that brings up the question of why they were able to raise the collectibles limit on notable homes. And why we can't just have one limit. I can see limiting the number of FX furnishings, and perhaps even the assistants/pets/mounts, but why I cannot use the slots allotted for collectible furnishings for regular furnishings is not understood.

Well, since we have no hopes of getting higher player/item caps, then I have no further feedback. Housing has everything else it needs, and it couldn't be improved upon any more than it already is. Primarily because I have no intention of using it further. All my concerns were within the realm of "I can't finish this house because I ran out of item space."

I don't say that to sound passive aggressive. That's just all there is to it. Sorry, ZOS.

Jaraal wrote: »

I like the Thieves Oasis, but would not buy it with the sandstorms. Too annoying and distracting. Also, the huge waterfall that barely makes a splash is immersion breaking.

To provide an alternative view point, I love the sandstorm - please don't remove it from this home.