One-Hand and Rune When?

RefLiberty · December 2019

I would really like to have an option to have a smaller main hand and the off-hand weapon for mage, as far as I concerned, main hand can be a dagger something similar and off-hand can be a magic lantern, skull, whatever, I'm just a bit tired of having a long stick on my back.
Dunno how long wold it take to develop so the stats on items are balanced

KillsAllElves · December 2019

Darkstorne wrote: »

Such a huge archetype in TES, and ESO desperately needs some new weapon options for magicka builds.

Any news on this potential new skill line lately?

EDIT: For those who aren't aware, this weapon skill line was datamined years ago:

This idea is a battlemage and currently damage is based on magic or stamina, staves or bows/bladed weapons - medium armor or light armor.

If a wand and rune were introduced that would be more likely with how damage works in E$OH.

Chicharron · December 2019

it would be the same, currently classes and weapons have no identity, they are all the same.

Dragonknight - Eruption
Templar - Blazing Spear
Sorc - Lightning Flood
Nightblade - Twisting Path
Warden - Winter's Revenge

just to say some, they are all the same, I'm sure it would be the same if we had one hand and rune.

Caligamy_ESO · December 2019

I might have to consider coming back to play if they do :P

saf227_ESO · December 2019

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

TelvanniWizard wrote: »

Also, double rune would be nice.

double shields!!!!

OK, now I want this.

ThePhantomThorn · December 2019

i want that on magdk and magplar and magblade. those classes are mainly melee, so would be great to have a mag melee weapon line.

validifyedneb18_ESO · December 2019

Part time f me has just always wanted a way to cast things like spells and buffs (magical) with swords equipped, specifically a fire buffing swordsman dunmer. Seems thematically appropriate.

Nemesis7884 · December 2019

Juhasow wrote: »

To avoid them ZoS would have to add new items called runes that would fill second slot in 1h+rune combo. And that would also cause additional implementations , changes of drop rates , redesign of unique weapons in specific parts of content (like DSA , BRP etc.) and lot more. Sounds like a lot of mess. Also that would be wierd if we would have 1 handed weapons in 3 separate skill lines.

no they dont - people think WAY too complicated - very easy solution for this: The skill line simply has a passive ability that if you have the skill line and the skill points and you only equip one 1h item and nothing in your offhand the passive ability activates that compensates with regards to set bonuses e.g. treating your 1h weapon as if it was 2h...thats one way to do it - another way to do it is that you have to use dw weapons as if you were dualwielding but that you can activate an ability or equip a passive ability etc. that basically turns your second dw weapon into a rune or no weapon...

There are certainly ways to do this i dont think its THAT complicated...

Juhasow · December 2019

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

To avoid them ZoS would have to add new items called runes that would fill second slot in 1h+rune combo. And that would also cause additional implementations , changes of drop rates , redesign of unique weapons in specific parts of content (like DSA , BRP etc.) and lot more. Sounds like a lot of mess. Also that would be wierd if we would have 1 handed weapons in 3 separate skill lines.

no they dont - people think WAY too complicated - very easy solution for this: The skill line simply has a passive ability that if you have the skill line and the skill points and you only equip one 1h item and nothing in your offhand the passive ability activates that compensates with regards to set bonuses e.g. treating your 1h weapon as if it was 2h...thats one way to do it - another way to do it is that you have to use dw weapons as if you were dualwielding but that you can activate an ability or equip a passive ability etc. that basically turns your second dw weapon into a rune or no weapon...

There are certainly ways to do this i dont think its THAT complicated...

@Nemesis7884 it would be nice to not take pieces of text out of context because I already mentioned what You're proposing. In part of text You removed from quote I said

ZoS would have to implement whole new mechanic that would recognize wheter You have one or two one handed weapons and would count it towards 1 or 2 item slots based on that

which is excatly what You're proposing. That is already complex and hard to implement without flaws. For example if someone is wearing 1h+shield on 1 bar and 1h+rune on the other then game would have to dynamically switch between treatments for 1h weapon. There is lot of stuff that can go wrong here and it's not as easy as "just make it a passive and all will be good". Also fact You want to achieve that through 1h+rune skill line passive makes that skill line crippled because You sacrifice 1 passive for that skill line to be on pair with others but because of that You actively have 1 less passive at Your disposal.

Second idea You have with dual wield off hand being passively covered by slotting some ability sounds impractical and also quite silly. That essentialy means You're wasting 1 skill slot just to acces the skill line so now You have 1 less skill slot for other abilities on Your bars and 1 less active skill in the skill line itself. You're basically solving 1 issue by adding another. There would be also lot of further implications that wearing dual wield with graphically removed off hand would cause. It raises a question should that work only for dual wield or for s&b also. What if I want to level up 1h+rune skill line while grinding with dual wield same as it happens right now with other weapon skill lines ?

Fact something is not THAT complicated or alteast it doesnt sound as such when You say it , doesnt mean it's good and will work. There is plenty of details that usually people forget when they present their "easy solutions". Details that matter and sometimes can be crucial for certain system to work.

Nanfoodle · December 2019

Melee builds have so many options where as Magica builds have staffs. I think the next few weapon lines added to the game should be Magica based. Wands would also be nice

MaleAmazon · December 2019

For example if someone is wearing 1h+shield on 1 bar and 1h+rune on the other then game would have to dynamically switch between treatments for 1h weapon

You mean, like now?

(1h are treated differently if they are on a dw or 1h+s bar, what with the passives etc being different.)

And yeah, you don´t need to add new objects. But why not do that? There is nothing strange about it, we´ve had 2 whole classes added to the game for Vivec´s sake.

validifyedneb18_ESO · December 2019

MaleAmazon wrote: »

For example if someone is wearing 1h+shield on 1 bar and 1h+rune on the other then game would have to dynamically switch between treatments for 1h weapon

You mean, like now?

(1h are treated differently if they are on a dw or 1h+s bar, what with the passives etc being different.)

And yeah, you don´t need to add new objects. But why not do that? There is nothing strange about it, we´ve had 2 whole classes added to the game for Vivec´s sake.

New classes appeal a lot more to the masses, but new weapon skill lines - especially now that we have a fair few classes - would be much better for the existing playerbase I think.

Just takes experienced players to see the appeal, whereas outside people wont really get how cool a new weapon is, but new classes always look good.

Nemesis7884 · December 2019

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

MaleAmazon wrote: »

For example if someone is wearing 1h+shield on 1 bar and 1h+rune on the other then game would have to dynamically switch between treatments for 1h weapon

You mean, like now?

(1h are treated differently if they are on a dw or 1h+s bar, what with the passives etc being different.)

And yeah, you don´t need to add new objects. But why not do that? There is nothing strange about it, we´ve had 2 whole classes added to the game for Vivec´s sake.

New classes appeal a lot more to the masses, but new weapon skill lines - especially now that we have a fair few classes - would be much better for the existing playerbase I think.

Just takes experienced players to see the appeal, whereas outside people wont really get how cool a new weapon is, but new classes always look good.

why not have both as before...alternating with every chapter

validifyedneb18_ESO · December 2019

To be fair, earlier I said making this viable would require hybrids to become a think again which is way too much work.

Not true I think, could simply make the physical damage component scale of magicka and spell damage, and make sword/rune a melee mag line. Conceptially quite different but mechanically just the same as everything else.

Would be nice to see 2 new weps rather than the 3 skill lines required to make a class. Dont kid yourself if you think this is less work though, as ZOS have added classes in the past, the workflow to get these out must be fairly ironed out by now, but they have never added new weapons. The system is likely old, horribly hardcoded, and untouched for the last 5 years.

validifyedneb18_ESO · December 2019

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

MaleAmazon wrote: »

For example if someone is wearing 1h+shield on 1 bar and 1h+rune on the other then game would have to dynamically switch between treatments for 1h weapon

You mean, like now?

(1h are treated differently if they are on a dw or 1h+s bar, what with the passives etc being different.)

And yeah, you don´t need to add new objects. But why not do that? There is nothing strange about it, we´ve had 2 whole classes added to the game for Vivec´s sake.

New classes appeal a lot more to the masses, but new weapon skill lines - especially now that we have a fair few classes - would be much better for the existing playerbase I think.

Just takes experienced players to see the appeal, whereas outside people wont really get how cool a new weapon is, but new classes always look good.

why not have both as before...alternating with every chapter

I mean, you're right, but think of this.

"New class, summon an undead army as the necromancer"
vs
"New wepon, slay your foes with spell and sword"

as an outsider I know (atleast If I didnt dislike the idea of necromancers) I would find the top one a lot more interesting.

I think they could make a good advertisement from a new wep being added, but it lends itself less to an advertisement campaign than a class.

Juhasow · December 2019

MaleAmazon wrote: »

For example if someone is wearing 1h+shield on 1 bar and 1h+rune on the other then game would have to dynamically switch between treatments for 1h weapon

You mean, like now?

(1h are treated differently if they are on a dw or 1h+s bar, what with the passives etc being different.)

And yeah, you don´t need to add new objects. But why not do that? There is nothing strange about it, we´ve had 2 whole classes added to the game for Vivec´s sake.

Your response makes no sense @MaleAmazon . If You would read and understand whole text I wrote not just taken out of context piece of it You would've known that in the part You've quoted I am talking about counting 1h weapon towards item slots not towards skill lines. There is a huge difference between both.

MaleAmazon · December 2019

Your response makes no sense @MaleAmazon . If You would read and understand whole text I wrote not just taken out of context piece of it You would've known that in the part You've quoted I am talking about counting 1h weapon towards item slots not towards skill lines. There is a huge difference between both.

I simply addressed that one point. The game already recognizes what you carry and does so quickly. If you have a 1h weapon in one hand and nothing in the other, it doesn´t count towards any skilline for XP, not even 1h+s. It doesn´t exactly seem like an insurmountable problem to replace this 'nothing' with a 1h+rune skilline. As for Nemesis´s proposals I don´t agree with them but that wasn´t the point anyway.

Unless there is something hardcoded into the game that is hard to get rid of (which seems unlikely since skillines HAVE been added several times in the past) it seems doable.

Anything you add to the game has the potential to add bugs and have unintended consequences. And, indeed, has done so in the past. That hasn´t exactly stopped ZOS.

Seraphayel · December 2019

BejaProphet wrote: »

None of these things would be as hard as adding a new class I suspect.

Unless you throw a Necromancer (or back then, Warden) on us and they suck for years because they’re base concepts are just leftover work.

Ragnarock41 · December 2019

Hotel6 wrote: »

idk if the engine can handle it. and i dont think zos will do that anytime soon even if it's possible.

That is not how game engines work. Its not a matter of ''handling it'' Its a matter of implementing it without breaking other parts of the game.

Juhasow · December 2019

MaleAmazon wrote: »

Your response makes no sense @MaleAmazon . If You would read and understand whole text I wrote not just taken out of context piece of it You would've known that in the part You've quoted I am talking about counting 1h weapon towards item slots not towards skill lines. There is a huge difference between both.

I simply addressed that one point. The game already recognizes what you carry and does so quickly. If you have a 1h weapon in one hand and nothing in the other, it doesn´t count towards any skilline for XP, not even 1h+s. It doesn´t exactly seem like an insurmountable problem to replace this 'nothing' with a 1h+rune skilline. As for Nemesis´s proposals I don´t agree with them but that wasn´t the point anyway.

Unless there is something hardcoded into the game that is hard to get rid of (which seems unlikely since skillines HAVE been added several times in the past) it seems doable.

Anything you add to the game has the potential to add bugs and have unintended consequences. And, indeed, has done so in the past. That hasn´t exactly stopped ZOS.

Sorry but ou still dont get the point of my comment @MaleAmazon . You are talking about recognizing 1h weapon as part of either s&b or dual wield. I was talking about recognizing 1h weapon as 1 or 2 items. There is a massive difference between both. If You combine 1h weapon with other 1h weapon or shield still that 1 handed weapon counts as 1 item and it also counts as 1 item if it's not combined with anything because it's predetermined feature. What was discussed is implementing a system that would recognize 1h weapon as 1 or 2 items based on what it's combined or not combined with which makes it no longer predetermined in situation like mentioned by me having 1h+shield on 1 bar and 1h+rune on another. That makes comparing s&b and dw to what was discussed completly out of context. It's basically comparing apples to oranges.

MaleAmazon · December 2019

I was talking about recognizing 1h weapon as 1 or 2 items. There is a massive difference between both. If You combine 1h weapon with other 1h weapon or shield still that 1 handed weapon counts as 1 item and it also counts as 1 item if it's not combined with anything because it's predetermined feature. What was discussed is implementing a system that would recognize 1h weapon as 1 or 2 items based on what it's combined or not combined with which makes it no longer predetermined in situation like mentioned by me having 1h+shield on 1 bar and 1h+rune on another. That makes comparing s&b and dw to what was discussed completly out of context. It's basically comparing apples to oranges.

This is just pointless. Fact is the game does stranger things, like sometimes allowing 2 mundus stones. The game is quick to recognize what you have equipped and adjust for it. Unless you have the code in front of you there is no way you know that this is in any way impossible. Like I said I don´t agree with the "solution" to begin with, anyway. They have added in skillines before; they could give a new equippable 'rune' item in the offhand (preferrably) or they could implement it so that you automatically get it if you have nothing in the offhand. Yes, making it a part of existing skillines is stupid but that isn´t what I said at all. I simply said the game is quite reactive when it comes to equipped items.

Juhasow · December 2019

MaleAmazon wrote: »

I was talking about recognizing 1h weapon as 1 or 2 items. There is a massive difference between both. If You combine 1h weapon with other 1h weapon or shield still that 1 handed weapon counts as 1 item and it also counts as 1 item if it's not combined with anything because it's predetermined feature. What was discussed is implementing a system that would recognize 1h weapon as 1 or 2 items based on what it's combined or not combined with which makes it no longer predetermined in situation like mentioned by me having 1h+shield on 1 bar and 1h+rune on another. That makes comparing s&b and dw to what was discussed completly out of context. It's basically comparing apples to oranges.

This is just pointless. Fact is the game does stranger things, like sometimes allowing 2 mundus stones. The game is quick to recognize what you have equipped and adjust for it. Unless you have the code in front of you there is no way you know that this is in any way impossible. Like I said I don´t agree with the "solution" to begin with, anyway. They have added in skillines before; they could give a new equippable 'rune' item in the offhand (preferrably) or they could implement it so that you automatically get it if you have nothing in the offhand. Yes, making it a part of existing skillines is stupid but that isn´t what I said at all. I simply said the game is quite reactive when it comes to equipped items.

Still comparing apples to oranges. But TBS (twice born star) is actually decent example of why. If You have TBS set on 1 bar and You dont have it on another then You pick up 2nd mundus stone then bar swap on 2nd bar and once again swap to the bar where You have full TBS You know what happens ? 2nd mundus is gone. because game does not "adjust" the way You think it would have to achieve what You're implying. You still dont understand the core of the issue.

MaleAmazon · December 2019

2nd mundus is gone. because game does not "adjust" the way You think it would have to achieve what You're implying. You still dont understand the core of the issue.

There is nothing strange about the second mundus disappearing. Nowhere does it say it 'saves' that mundus stone. This is not stranger than a pet disappearing and not magically reappearing, if you don´t have it on your bar.

I understand this game and will not partake in this discussion more. HF.

Juhasow · December 2019

MaleAmazon wrote: »

2nd mundus is gone. because game does not "adjust" the way You think it would have to achieve what You're implying. You still dont understand the core of the issue.

There is nothing strange about the second mundus disappearing. Nowhere does it say it 'saves' that mundus stone. This is not stranger than a pet disappearing and not magically reappearing, if you don´t have it on your bar.

I understand this game and will not partake in this discussion more. HF.

Still taking pieces of text out of context. No wonder You cannot bring anything reasonable to the table nor You cannot "partake in this discussion more". You've started from comparing apples to oranges and You never stopped that line of argumentation so I am happy that I wont have to answer to Your non constructuve comments anymore. See ya.

ACamaroGuy · December 2019

How would the CP system work with a stamina one hand and magicka in the other? They would have to raise the CP level a lot.

TheFM · December 2019

KillsAllElves wrote: »

Darkstorne wrote: »

Such a huge archetype in TES, and ESO desperately needs some new weapon options for magicka builds.

Any news on this potential new skill line lately?

EDIT: For those who aren't aware, this weapon skill line was datamined years ago:

This idea is a battlemage and currently damage is based on magic or stamina, staves or bows/bladed weapons - medium armor or light armor.

If a wand and rune were introduced that would be more likely with how damage works in E$OH.

It would be sword and rune, we already have ranged magicka, we need melee magicka

TheFM · December 2019

ACamaroGuy wrote: »

How would the CP system work with a stamina one hand and magicka in the other? They would have to raise the CP level a lot.

It would just be amagicka melee weapon, like in every other tes game, based on magicka and spell damage

regime211 · December 2019

Hotel6 wrote: »

idk if the engine can handle it. and i dont think zos will do that anytime soon even if it's possible.

I really wish yall would stop saying things such as " I don't think the engine can handle it" this game was designed by THEM they will tell us what they want to add and when. If it does NOT get added then oh well, but speaking for them as if you work for them makes no sense.

IronWooshu · December 2019

Faulgor wrote: »

Why do people want a hybrid weapon when they aren't using hybrids right now?

What is this skill line supposed to accomplish?

Just because it has a sword in one hand doesnt mean it needs to scale off stamina. Sword and Run skill line could scale off magicka.

In fact, I'm waiting for the day we get conjuration weapons so magicka has melee weapons that scale off magicka.

IronWooshu · December 2019

I'm seeing alot of people who see magicka melee weapons and assume they scale off stamina, they would scale of spell damage and magicka and on heavy attack return magicka.

See how simple that is? If they were to add say Conjure Two Hand on a skill line, it would take up a bar slot like a pet that is toggled on and off and convert any of two hand weapon skills from the skill line to scale off magicka and spell damage rather than stamina while returning magicka on heavy attack.