Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »That's kind of how games with collision detection work..they are physical objects represented in 3D space.
Just cause "thats how collision works" doesnt mean its a good thing. Look at the netch for warden.
"Good" is subjective. It's part of the play styles. Learn to stop clicking abilities when something is in your way, that's a L2P issue.
Why would I click the ability if I knew the pet would absorb it? Half the time when youre aiming at sorc the pet gets in the way... cmon this is a learn to read the post issue
scubasteve28 wrote: »You also can't attack through trees rocks and buildings... So that's just a dumb argument. Any good player would agree that pets should be untargetable.
Goregrinder wrote: »
Pros: constant Necropotence 5th bonus, pets cant be stunned – dont need to care healing them, matriarch heal is always available – dont need resto staff
Cons: cant hide between pets
IMO overall it will be huge buff to petsorcs.
Alienoutlaw wrote: »there are only to types of thread in this forum i have seen
Nerf Sorcs
Buff me i die to Sorcs
sorc's got nerfed into the ground and you still find something to complain about, maybe its a "l2p" issue after all this time and you still cant kill a sorc?
Nerftheforums wrote: »Pls no. Killing pets is kinda a crucial part of taking down pet sorcs. I'd much rather see the pet at a constant and minimum 2/3m distance from the caster, so that no los is possible.
Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »That's kind of how games with collision detection work..they are physical objects represented in 3D space.
Just cause "thats how collision works" doesnt mean its a good thing. Look at the netch for warden.
"Good" is subjective. It's part of the play styles. Learn to stop clicking abilities when something is in your way, that's a L2P issue.
Why would I click the ability if I knew the pet would absorb it? Half the time when youre aiming at sorc the pet gets in the way... cmon this is a learn to read the post issuescubasteve28 wrote: »You also can't attack through trees rocks and buildings... So that's just a dumb argument. Any good player would agree that pets should be untargetable.
exactly
well said
all truth
Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »That's kind of how games with collision detection work..they are physical objects represented in 3D space.
Just cause "thats how collision works" doesnt mean its a good thing. Look at the netch for warden.
"Good" is subjective. It's part of the play styles. Learn to stop clicking abilities when something is in your way, that's a L2P issue.
Why would I click the ability if I knew the pet would absorb it? Half the time when youre aiming at sorc the pet gets in the way... cmon this is a learn to read the post issuescubasteve28 wrote: »You also can't attack through trees rocks and buildings... So that's just a dumb argument. Any good player would agree that pets should be untargetable.
exactly
well said
all truth
Rocks and Trees can't attack you. Combat pets can. Imagine a combat pet attacking you and you can't attack the pet back.
Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »That's kind of how games with collision detection work..they are physical objects represented in 3D space.
Just cause "thats how collision works" doesnt mean its a good thing. Look at the netch for warden.
"Good" is subjective. It's part of the play styles. Learn to stop clicking abilities when something is in your way, that's a L2P issue.
Why would I click the ability if I knew the pet would absorb it? Half the time when youre aiming at sorc the pet gets in the way... cmon this is a learn to read the post issuescubasteve28 wrote: »You also can't attack through trees rocks and buildings... So that's just a dumb argument. Any good player would agree that pets should be untargetable.
exactly
well said
all truth
Rocks and Trees can't attack you. Combat pets can. Imagine a combat pet attacking you and you can't attack the pet back.
Alienoutlaw wrote: »there are only to types of thread in this forum i have seen
Nerf Sorcs
Buff me i die to Sorcs
sorc's got nerfed into the ground and you still find something to complain about, maybe its a "l2p" issue after all this time and you still cant kill a sorc?
It's not about being able to kill sorc or not. I'm killing sorcs (pretty good ones) that are using or not pets, the thing is the ones with pets have handicap making the other choice less viable iNerftheforums wrote: »Pls no. Killing pets is kinda a crucial part of taking down pet sorcs. I'd much rather see the pet at a constant and minimum 2/3m distance from the caster, so that no los is possible.
Maybe when you zerg or are an AoE monster, otherwise it's more effective to focus on sorc. If you pressure him good enough he will have sustain issues which leads not only to worse defense but also worse offense.
Pets are handicap for sorcs, same as bear for warden. But unlike sorc pets bear is ultimate taking 2 most important slots, thus I think it's the only pet that should retain its hitbox (same as pets summoned from sets, especially engine guardian).
Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »Goregrinder wrote: »That's kind of how games with collision detection work..they are physical objects represented in 3D space.
Just cause "thats how collision works" doesnt mean its a good thing. Look at the netch for warden.
"Good" is subjective. It's part of the play styles. Learn to stop clicking abilities when something is in your way, that's a L2P issue.
Why would I click the ability if I knew the pet would absorb it? Half the time when youre aiming at sorc the pet gets in the way... cmon this is a learn to read the post issuescubasteve28 wrote: »You also can't attack through trees rocks and buildings... So that's just a dumb argument. Any good player would agree that pets should be untargetable.
exactly
well said
all truth
Rocks and Trees can't attack you. Combat pets can. Imagine a combat pet attacking you and you can't attack the pet back.
No need to imagine that, Shade already does it.
Just bring Sorc pets into line with Shade & make them untargetable & only last 20 seconds. There's no reason any class should have a 1 time cast ability that does damage for an indefinite amount of time with absolutely zero input from the player, while also shielding them from attack.
There are other potentially viable options as well, but the situation as it stands now is a bit absurd in my opinion.
Yes.Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »A fundamental change on every single aspect of the skills. Nice. Many pet sorcs asked for that because it would mean more useable skill slots for them. Along with other conveniences.
Build for more sustain then — problem solved. If NBs can keep their shade up, why can't you handle something similar? Does literally everything need to be easier for sorcs? Have you been coddled for so long you've forgotten what it's like to have to balance between sustain, tankiness, & damage? If that's the case, you'll have to pardon me if I don't care if you're inconvenienced by having to make a tough decision for once.Everyone would be happy then, wouldn't they? Okay, probably not everyone. Stam Sorcs would lose their freshly gained pet again because they couldn't sustain it, Tank sorcs probably as well and the PvP forum would still be littered with nerf requests.
I dunno, haven't given it that much thought. Like I said, bring it in line with Shade. Considering the secondary effect is pretty substantial, I'd say it should cost something, maybe half the initial cost? (Kind of like Grim Focus.)And while we're at it, do we make the secondary effect free on first activation, just like it is on shades? And do we put a debuff on it too? And wo we get rid of the cast time?
Huh? What about any of that is incorrect?Furthermore I'll ignore that "absolutely zero input", "indefinite amount of time" and "any class" is just wrong, especially in PvP.
Yes.Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »A fundamental change on every single aspect of the skills. Nice. Many pet sorcs asked for that because it would mean more useable skill slots for them. Along with other conveniences.Build for more sustain then — problem solved. If NBs can keep their shade up, why can't you handle something similar? Does literally everything need to be easier for sorcs? Have you been coddled for so long you've forgotten what it's like to have to balance between sustain, tankiness, & damage? If that's the case, you'll have to pardon me if I don't care if you're inconvenienced by having to make a tough decision for once.Everyone would be happy then, wouldn't they? Okay, probably not everyone. Stam Sorcs would lose their freshly gained pet again because they couldn't sustain it, Tank sorcs probably as well and the PvP forum would still be littered with nerf requests.I dunno, haven't given it that much thought. Like I said, bring it in line with Shade. Considering the secondary effect is pretty substantial, I'd say it should cost something, maybe half the initial cost? (Kind of like Grim Focus.)And while we're at it, do we make the secondary effect free on first activation, just like it is on shades? And do we put a debuff on it too? And wo we get rid of the cast time?Huh? What about any of that is incorrect?Furthermore I'll ignore that "absolutely zero input", "indefinite amount of time" and "any class" is just wrong, especially in PvP.
By "zero input" I meant your creatures fly/run around attacking people (some of whom you can't even see, let alone target) and shielding you from attack with zero input from you, aside from the initial cast. This is basically free unless they die — they also have special abilities on top of this.
By "indefinite amount of time" I meant that they continue to do this indefinitely unless killed or unsummoned. (How is that not self explanatory?)
By "any class" I meant ... I don't even know what I'm supposed to explain here, lol. WTF is your problem with me saying "any class"?
Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »Yes.Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »A fundamental change on every single aspect of the skills. Nice. Many pet sorcs asked for that because it would mean more useable skill slots for them. Along with other conveniences.Build for more sustain then — problem solved. If NBs can keep their shade up, why can't you handle something similar? Does literally everything need to be easier for sorcs? Have you been coddled for so long you've forgotten what it's like to have to balance between sustain, tankiness, & damage? If that's the case, you'll have to pardon me if I don't care if you're inconvenienced by having to make a tough decision for once.Everyone would be happy then, wouldn't they? Okay, probably not everyone. Stam Sorcs would lose their freshly gained pet again because they couldn't sustain it, Tank sorcs probably as well and the PvP forum would still be littered with nerf requests.I dunno, haven't given it that much thought. Like I said, bring it in line with Shade. Considering the secondary effect is pretty substantial, I'd say it should cost something, maybe half the initial cost? (Kind of like Grim Focus.)And while we're at it, do we make the secondary effect free on first activation, just like it is on shades? And do we put a debuff on it too? And wo we get rid of the cast time?Huh? What about any of that is incorrect?Furthermore I'll ignore that "absolutely zero input", "indefinite amount of time" and "any class" is just wrong, especially in PvP.
By "zero input" I meant your creatures fly/run around attacking people (some of whom you can't even see, let alone target) and shielding you from attack with zero input from you, aside from the initial cast. This is basically free unless they die — they also have special abilities on top of this.
By "indefinite amount of time" I meant that they continue to do this indefinitely unless killed or unsummoned. (How is that not self explanatory?)
By "any class" I meant ... I don't even know what I'm supposed to explain here, lol. WTF is your problem with me saying "any class"?
To make it short, your nerf attempt would backfire on mag pet sorcs while you'd *** with every other pet sorc spec ( pve). Short sighted and not "given it that much thought" indeed. Or tell me where that stam/ tank pet has touched you.
And, if you think pets require "zero input" like shielding, healing, resummoning in pvp, you're just wrong. Just like you're wrong when you think Necro's Blastbones, Warden's bear or Sorc's pet weren't intended to be meat shields. The last 5 years should have made it clear.
Literally everything about that sentence is true. Unless/until they get killed or unsummoned, your pets can & will auto attack people half way across the BG and/or shield you from attack, with zero input from you....a 1 time cast ability that does damage for an indefinite amount of time with absolutely zero input from the player, while also shielding them from attack.
Literally everything about that sentence is true. Unless/until they get killed or unsummoned, your pets can & will auto attack people half way across the BG and/or shield you from attack, with zero input from you.
Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »
Literally everything about that sentence is true. Unless/until they get killed or unsummoned, your pets can & will auto attack people half way across the BG and/or shield you from attack, with zero input from you.
That argument is flawed to begin with. You could also say you summon your shades and they can & will auto attack people with zero imput from you until they unsummon.
Yes, you need to recast them every 20secs but what you don't have to do is to keep them alive via shields and heals, which is what I'd call investment. And if you want to make good use of the scamp, you need to spend mag again for it's AoE/ stun.
Do you now get what I mean? How you set off the meatshield vs the 2 bar slots aspect is up for debate.
So why is spending mag for resummoning some kind of investment while spending mag for keeping the pets alive isn't?