I don’t think this is true. There are still some specs that are mathematically better, but it’s mostly about synergy between sets.
Without testing and trying out new things you can get caught behind the meta. Usually with how specs work you tweak and tweak until you take a setup as strong as it can get down a logical progression, but if you tried a different strategy at the beginning you’ll arrive somewhere else. Does that make sense? I think that’s where some people get hung up, they confuse the class with a playstyle, but there are more options out there.
ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »I don’t think this is true. There are still some specs that are mathematically better, but it’s mostly about synergy between sets.
Without testing and trying out new things you can get caught behind the meta. Usually with how specs work you tweak and tweak until you take a setup as strong as it can get down a logical progression, but if you tried a different strategy at the beginning you’ll arrive somewhere else. Does that make sense? I think that’s where some people get hung up, they confuse the class with a playstyle, but there are more options out there.
Oh, I agree about testing out new things and you are 100% correct about the importance of playstyle. That right there sets what you need for stats from your build and you skill selection. The thing that I keep coming back to is that some new set comes out and you go oh, look at that. I'll try that out. It gives me more of this but to compensate I'm going to need to change my mundus or enchants around so my regen is close to the same or my spell pen is close to the same. It just seems like it's the case of rearranging the chairs on the deck of the titanic to get the same result. You need to really change your playstyle to experiment with different sets, enchants, skills and mundus. That's tough. Often you end up going, oh, that won't work very well. Can I get my 500k in gold back?
In terms of going all spell damage, my problem has always been that I play with shields. Thus, I have always considered BTB, Alfiq and Necro the better sets. I think high spell damage makes more sense on templar, cause they get Minor Sorcery and are often played without shields. NB has that easily accessible +8% magicka passive instead.
For the melee playstyle, I consider Auroran's Thunder marginally better than Spinner's, because it can flush other NBs out of cloak. You might wear Overwhelming Surge for the same reason. Both of those sets can proc Minor Vulnerability in case you don't already use Lotus Fan.
There is one thing I want to try, but I again think it will work better on templar, which is combining Onslaught with Mechanical Acuity in a heavy armor build. The idea is to be tanky, but negate heavy armor's weakness that way. Swwps / Jabs procs Acuity. It gives you a good chance of proccing that as part of your opening combo, e.g. gap closer -> Onslaught -> Sweeps / Jabs.
ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »I'm seeing invigorating drain everywhere now. I figured it was basically ranged magicka players looking for a replacement stun. lol.
You're thinking of Temporal Guard for the Minor Protection, no doubt. Cyrodiil's Light may be worth considering, though, esp. if you also use Mist Form. There is an older templar build, called the Phalanx build, which uses that to great effect. If you get interrupted while channeling, you get a free magicka skill afterwards. The idea is to use that for free Mist Forms. E.g. Meditate -> Mist Form or Invigorating Drain -> Mist Form.ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »I'm seeing invigorating drain everywhere now. I figured it was basically ranged magicka players looking for a replacement stun. lol.
I remember there was a dude who used it before. Thing is health % heals can crit and are effected by % healing modifiers.
If you check the tooltip normally it’s a 15% heal per second, add in heal % modifiers and you can probably get it to 25%. Add a 40% crit and it’d be a decent heal.
Downside is the healing amount isn’t tied to your magicka or sp pool, it’d be hard to get it that high as a dps but I should probably try it on my healer.
Edit - checked and it was a 21% heal. Cheap so likely used as a cheap stun and heal, put rat on the same bar and you’d have major protection while it’s up too.
I've used that glyph (Infused) on my ranged bar for the longest time, because I play so much in IC. Good for doing bosses.GhostofDatthaw wrote: »The rise of vamps has one thing my mind. Everyone thinks they are safe because dbos is not as prevalent. Time to bring back the glyph of prismatic onslaught on the back bar.
My buddy ran that like Morrowindish when I was still a vamp blade. That was a deadly deadly rune.
You're thinking of Temporal Guard for the Minor Protection, no doubt. Cyrodiil's Light may be worth considering, though, esp. if you also use Mist Form. There is an older templar build, called the Phalanx build, which uses that to great effect. If you get interrupted while channeling, you get a free magicka skill afterwards. The idea is to use that for free Mist Forms. E.g. Meditate -> Mist Form or Invigorating Drain -> Mist Form.ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »I'm seeing invigorating drain everywhere now. I figured it was basically ranged magicka players looking for a replacement stun. lol.
I remember there was a dude who used it before. Thing is health % heals can crit and are effected by % healing modifiers.
If you check the tooltip normally it’s a 15% heal per second, add in heal % modifiers and you can probably get it to 25%. Add a 40% crit and it’d be a decent heal.
Downside is the healing amount isn’t tied to your magicka or sp pool, it’d be hard to get it that high as a dps but I should probably try it on my healer.
Edit - checked and it was a 21% heal. Cheap so likely used as a cheap stun and heal, put rat on the same bar and you’d have major protection while it’s up too.I've used that glyph (Infused) on my ranged bar for the longest time, because I play so much in IC. Good for doing bosses.GhostofDatthaw wrote: »The rise of vamps has one thing my mind. Everyone thinks they are safe because dbos is not as prevalent. Time to bring back the glyph of prismatic onslaught on the back bar.
My buddy ran that like Morrowindish when I was still a vamp blade. That was a deadly deadly rune.
You're thinking of Temporal Guard for the Minor Protection, no doubt. Cyrodiil's Light may be worth considering, though, esp. if you also use Mist Form. There is an older templar build, called the Phalanx build, which uses that to great effect. If you get interrupted while channeling, you get a free magicka skill afterwards. The idea is to use that for free Mist Forms. E.g. Meditate -> Mist Form or Invigorating Drain -> Mist Form.ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »I'm seeing invigorating drain everywhere now. I figured it was basically ranged magicka players looking for a replacement stun. lol.
I remember there was a dude who used it before. Thing is health % heals can crit and are effected by % healing modifiers.
If you check the tooltip normally it’s a 15% heal per second, add in heal % modifiers and you can probably get it to 25%. Add a 40% crit and it’d be a decent heal.
Downside is the healing amount isn’t tied to your magicka or sp pool, it’d be hard to get it that high as a dps but I should probably try it on my healer.
Edit - checked and it was a 21% heal. Cheap so likely used as a cheap stun and heal, put rat on the same bar and you’d have major protection while it’s up too.I've used that glyph (Infused) on my ranged bar for the longest time, because I play so much in IC. Good for doing bosses.GhostofDatthaw wrote: »The rise of vamps has one thing my mind. Everyone thinks they are safe because dbos is not as prevalent. Time to bring back the glyph of prismatic onslaught on the back bar.
My buddy ran that like Morrowindish when I was still a vamp blade. That was a deadly deadly rune.
Oh I mean percentage heals in general are underrated so might be why they’re using the drain.
A lot of people go to esowiki and see the health percentage and think they suck without checking the health %s out. The health percentage on reinvigorating drain is 15% according to the wiki, with my spec it’s 21% because of modifiers and it can crit.
The dark cloak change clued me into that. When it was a health percentage of 3% per second or whatever people thought it sucked, change the tooltip to a value so 1k per second and suddenly people like it.
It’s like cleanse, people say it sucks because it costs an extra 1.8k magicka or so but they’re clueless, likely pve healers who don’t understand pvp yet. If it said it healed for 5k per effect removed people would be asking for nerfs... which is up on the PTS. That’s why I’m pretty sure despite what people think the devs are way more in tune with the game than people think they are.
brandonv516 wrote: »You're thinking of Temporal Guard for the Minor Protection, no doubt. Cyrodiil's Light may be worth considering, though, esp. if you also use Mist Form. There is an older templar build, called the Phalanx build, which uses that to great effect. If you get interrupted while channeling, you get a free magicka skill afterwards. The idea is to use that for free Mist Forms. E.g. Meditate -> Mist Form or Invigorating Drain -> Mist Form.ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »I'm seeing invigorating drain everywhere now. I figured it was basically ranged magicka players looking for a replacement stun. lol.
I remember there was a dude who used it before. Thing is health % heals can crit and are effected by % healing modifiers.
If you check the tooltip normally it’s a 15% heal per second, add in heal % modifiers and you can probably get it to 25%. Add a 40% crit and it’d be a decent heal.
Downside is the healing amount isn’t tied to your magicka or sp pool, it’d be hard to get it that high as a dps but I should probably try it on my healer.
Edit - checked and it was a 21% heal. Cheap so likely used as a cheap stun and heal, put rat on the same bar and you’d have major protection while it’s up too.I've used that glyph (Infused) on my ranged bar for the longest time, because I play so much in IC. Good for doing bosses.GhostofDatthaw wrote: »The rise of vamps has one thing my mind. Everyone thinks they are safe because dbos is not as prevalent. Time to bring back the glyph of prismatic onslaught on the back bar.
My buddy ran that like Morrowindish when I was still a vamp blade. That was a deadly deadly rune.
Oh I mean percentage heals in general are underrated so might be why they’re using the drain.
A lot of people go to esowiki and see the health percentage and think they suck without checking the health %s out. The health percentage on reinvigorating drain is 15% according to the wiki, with my spec it’s 21% because of modifiers and it can crit.
The dark cloak change clued me into that. When it was a health percentage of 3% per second or whatever people thought it sucked, change the tooltip to a value so 1k per second and suddenly people like it.
It’s like cleanse, people say it sucks because it costs an extra 1.8k magicka or so but they’re clueless, likely pve healers who don’t understand pvp yet. If it said it healed for 5k per effect removed people would be asking for nerfs... which is up on the PTS. That’s why I’m pretty sure despite what people think the devs are way more in tune with the game than people think they are.
When they want to change a unique skill not because it's overperforming but because it "needs" to be standardized, they are not in tune with the game.
OK, I know this is not the templar thread, but I'm starting to feel at home here. This is version 1 of my ranged / melee, kind of like a magblade, single-target magplar, for CP:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=180709
Note we are using Restoring Focus and blocking with stamina on the ice-staff bar.
No Sweeps!
The gameplan is to DOT people up from range while waiting for the Acuity proc, then rush in with Toppling Charge into Onslaught and execute. It is deadly when it comes together. Toppling Charge has a travel time. Caluurion can end up delayed until after Onslaught and, yes, I tested it is buffed by it. As would be Solar Barrage. I think you could still make this work when the DOT meta is over. Just replace the DOTs with Solar Barrage, Force Pulse and Purifying Light.
I played it this morning. Onlaught really only buffs Radiant. Caluurion landing after Onslaught is a bit hit and miss. I was compensating for the lack of AOE with detect potions, but I think Solar Barrage may be in order, as well as switching from Radiant to Sweeps.OK, I know this is not the templar thread, but I'm starting to feel at home here. This is version 1 of my ranged / melee, kind of like a magblade, single-target magplar, for CP:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=180709
Note we are using Restoring Focus and blocking with stamina on the ice-staff bar.
No Sweeps!
The gameplan is to DOT people up from range while waiting for the Acuity proc, then rush in with Toppling Charge into Onslaught and execute. It is deadly when it comes together. Toppling Charge has a travel time. Caluurion can end up delayed until after Onslaught and, yes, I tested it is buffed by it. As would be Solar Barrage. I think you could still make this work when the DOT meta is over. Just replace the DOTs with Solar Barrage, Force Pulse and Purifying Light.
I’d give it a go. I usually plan sets and then switch around skills depending on how I find it performs.
Some things to consider:
- Onslaught is great but buggy and won’t fire in high pop area. I’d try to keep fighting away from zergs
- Against small/large scalers with a good healer they’ll cleanse those dots faster than you can apply them. You’ll have to adjust the spec if you go to this setting
- The snare on ritual is awesome and one of the best defenses against melee. I assume it being on your front bar means you intend to use it offensively?
- Weapon swoping can get interrupted by things like leap, add lag and you can’t count on swoping bars easily
- Aoes hard counter NBs, having one to negate a whole class can be worth it
- Dots are great against sorcs, strip out too many dots for other abilities and they might give you problems
What I’d suggest:
Try it as is, if melee are giving you problems try ritual on your back bar instead and drop a dot.
If you’re having kiting issues try vampire and adding mist form, the extra sustain will help too.
Sorry. Magblade is and remains my main too.brandonv516 wrote: »This is now officially a Templar thread.
I'll be playing Magblade still.
brandonv516 wrote: »This is now officially a Templar thread.
I'll be playing Magblade still.
Thanks, but I don't play vampires. That said, I might modify it. Light armor? Food? Mundus? You got any stam sustain? I assume you get away without any by using Mist?
Not like my build wasn't successful this morning in IC. I killed a nightblade, a DK. Then I won a 3-way 1v1v1 fight. Then I was the last of my faction to die in a larger fight. I didn't mention it, because success against random players doesn't mean much, especially those that play early in the morning. How do you define success?
That 1vXer was a known quantity. Someone who didn't just play well, but had their build sorted out. The damage from the DOTs, Caluurion and Onslaught was shockingly low. DOTs at or below 1K. Onslaught 2.5K. Caluurion 5K (hit before Onslaught). Now he didn't hit me that hard either on average, but his Dizzying ramped up quite a lot, up to over 6K. He clearly had more pressure and ate less damage than I did. He used Corrosive. Neither Corrosive nor Onslaught buff DOTs, so I think the upshot is to use more direct damage skills or forget Onslaught and run a more conventional build, like you.
Something stuck in my mind is a long video of a duelling tournament, organised by Khyleo some time ago. He had ruled out a whole bunch of sets and skills, but the game seemed as unbalanced as I've ever seen. A magblade dominated other players until it ran into the mag DK who won the tournament. You could see the sheer amount of pressure the magblade had applied to other players and, when it faced the DK, the tables turned completely and the magblade seemed out of options. I refuse to believe that was due to much of a skill difference in that case. I saw it as imbalance.
THIS! This is why I ran Pirate + Protective last patch and why I am playing around with a heavy armor option now. I think Living Dark is an incredible new defense, though. It's hard to appreciate, unless you have to play against it. Between that, heavy armor, blocking, BoL and the occasional cleanse, I was able to come back from the brink of death back to full health numerous times, this morning.GhostofDatthaw wrote: »...it's a great way to get off that back bar block bol death sentence.
Coming back to NB, as soon as I saw someone mention this combo in another thread:
Shadowy -> Elemental Weapon -> LA -> Lotus Fan -> LA -> Fear (Caluurion) -> LA -> Soul Harvest -> LA -> Spam or Execute
I knew that would work and, OMG, it does. I just ganked an Imperial Physique guy in basically 2 GCDs with this.
This is a very elaborate combo, which involves a bar swap after cloak in my build. However, in terms of when these abilities hit, it's only after Lotus Fan. NB has the leisure to pull something like this off. I never looked into something this elaborate before, because I quite enjoy a more brawly playstyle, but I almost feel a little foolish now. Got to see how it holds up long term, though.
GhostofDatthaw wrote: »I'm a light armor magplar believer more bols, and bigger bols