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Light attack is OP

  • Mayrael
    Mayrael
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    Heatnix90 wrote: »
    Imagine making thread after thread over light attacks in ESO in 2019.

    Imagine making threads that everything is OP except of Delparis.
    I am doing my best, but I am not a native speaker, sorry.

  • CeroSerotonin
    Lol? What else do you think is OP? Bull Netch?
  • ebix_
    ebix_
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    wow , I thought it's a meme thread ... I was right ...
    if you are in pc eu then I will cu ^^
  • brandoncoffmannub18_ESO
    Delparis wrote: »
    When you are doing a light attack .9 out of everyone second you are in combat, yeah, it's going to be a lot of damage; that's kind of the point.

    It takes some level of skill, and furthermore it's so "OP" on mag because vMA staff buffs it, meanwhile on stam it's not even half of what it is.

    It's part of the game, get over it and get better at it... It's not even that hard, and don't say using a controller is too hard because I do .95 lps with a controller.

    Doing 9% of the total dps on like stamcro parse. imo it should do 5% of the dps.
    On mag build it should be 7-10% of the total dps with vMA staff. Otherwise 5% like stam builds

    Very glad you aren't a dev.
    Raise your arguments, not your insults.

    Jodynn/Jo_oJ PC NA

    PvE and PvP

    MagDK
    StamDK
  • Inig0
    Inig0
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    oh, honey
    GM: Mechanically Challenged
    In game - @Inig0
    Sorc - Inigo- Beautiful Chocolate Man
    NB - Raphiki - Beautiful Chocolate Man
    Temp - Ineegø - ınıgo
    DK - Inigø - Alfeus - Down for Maintenance
    Warden - Help I Made a Warden
    PC NA
    Youtube Stuffs
    Only the best memes die twice
  • Skorro
    Skorro
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    TPishek wrote: »
    ixdjp756zqgf.png
    Doesn't even look close to being stronger than a skill to me.

    Nerf Combat metrics!!
  • Aznarb
    Aznarb
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    Delparis wrote: »
    Heatnix90 wrote: »
    Imagine making thread after thread over light attacks in ESO in 2019.

    Why not many issues are still in game since beta and still didn't get fixed.
    Maybe the new team will fix that rotten legacy.

    Let me explain to you since you have hard time to understand basic thing.
    You LA betwen EACH skill, so you use LA 10 time more than any skill.
    Ofc it's one of the main dmg source in parse result, nothing to do with "OP LA"

    If LA is so OP, why don't you just stop using skill and go full LA ? After-all, it's OP right ? Go for it.



    Edit : typo.
    Edited by Aznarb on August 14, 2019 2:22PM
    PC - EU
    J'Zarhim - Night Blade - Healer
    Orack Magus - Templar - Healer
    Blâme-le-Tank - Warden - Healer
    Orack Herumor - Sorcerer - Healer
    Orack Maesa - Dragon Knight - Healer

    My English is far from perfect but I try my best !


  • Delparis
    Delparis
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    Aznarb wrote: »
    Delparis wrote: »
    Heatnix90 wrote: »
    Imagine making thread after thread over light attacks in ESO in 2019.

    Why not many issues are still in game since beta and still didn't get fixed.
    Maybe the new team will fix that rotten legacy.

    Let me explain to you since you have hard time to understand basic thing.
    You LA betwen EACH skill, so you use LA 10 time more than any skill.
    Ofc it's one of the main dmg source in parse result, nothing to do with "OP LA"

    If LA is so OP, why don't you just stop using skill and go full LA ? After-all, it's OP right ? Go for it.



    Edit : typo.

    look at liko sorc parse



    LA is doing +21k on average, that means 21k per hit and per second.
    that's what i mean when i said that LA is OP, it's doing more dmg than it should.
    ZOS don't fix old bugs, they harbor them
  • Delparis
    Delparis
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    Delparis wrote: »
    Aznarb wrote: »
    Delparis wrote: »
    Heatnix90 wrote: »
    Imagine making thread after thread over light attacks in ESO in 2019.

    Why not many issues are still in game since beta and still didn't get fixed.
    Maybe the new team will fix that rotten legacy.

    Let me explain to you since you have hard time to understand basic thing.
    You LA betwen EACH skill, so you use LA 10 time more than any skill.
    Ofc it's one of the main dmg source in parse result, nothing to do with "OP LA"

    If LA is so OP, why don't you just stop using skill and go full LA ? After-all, it's OP right ? Go for it.



    Edit : typo.

    look at liko sorc parse



    LA is doing +21k on average, that means 21k per hit and per second.
    that's what i mean when i said that LA is OP, it's doing more dmg than it should.

    21k because empower from mage guild passive ( 40% buff ), vMA staff increase, and the weave it basically once per second, butcher is an execute for light and heavy attacks mixed with bloodthirsty, so it's not 21k the entire fight....

    Do your research and own testing, don't just look at others parses and then understand every second of the fight you are sending off a light attack, of course it's the most DPS when mag it's buffs light attacks.

    I did the math behind to get that 21k average LA dps.

    LA is doing 14k dps, so if you add empower (+40% more dmg) and vMA (1k4 dmg) you get those 21k.

    14k dmg per sec is still too much compared to skills that does 14k dots over 10 sec.

    @ZOS_BrianWheeler
    ZOS don't fix old bugs, they harbor them
  • jypcy
    jypcy
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    OP, would the current dps be okay if they were changed to auto attacks between every skill instead of manual light attacks?

    Either way, on the one hand, seeing the amount of players in pug groups and overland tearing through content with naught but a barrage of light attacks, I’m rather thankful that they deal as much damage as they do. Certainly raises the floor, even if the ceiling is lifted simultaneously.

    On the other, I’ve still not seen any reason why the amount of damage that they contribute is too high other than “because that’s how it is in other games.”
  • Muzzick
    Muzzick
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    Delparis wrote: »
    Aznarb wrote: »
    Delparis wrote: »
    Heatnix90 wrote: »
    Imagine making thread after thread over light attacks in ESO in 2019.

    Why not many issues are still in game since beta and still didn't get fixed.
    Maybe the new team will fix that rotten legacy.

    Let me explain to you since you have hard time to understand basic thing.
    You LA betwen EACH skill, so you use LA 10 time more than any skill.
    Ofc it's one of the main dmg source in parse result, nothing to do with "OP LA"

    If LA is so OP, why don't you just stop using skill and go full LA ? After-all, it's OP right ? Go for it.



    Edit : typo.

    look at liko sorc parse



    LA is doing +21k on average, that means 21k per hit and per second.
    that's what i mean when i said that LA is OP, it's doing more dmg than it should.

    Didn't watch a video but that's a 97 k parse. Still only 21% of the parse on a skill being done 50% of every attack. Majority of players don't parse nearly that high or weave as well. Looking at your threads I would not be surprised if you didn't play the game, it seems all your knowledge comes from YouTube and others' combat metrics reports, because your arguments lack substance and focus on one value rather than the whole picture.
  • Rungar
    Rungar
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    vmdbhdp0dga7.png

    You can't look at just the dps, look at the avg and max hits, how many times it hit, LA is the difference between a skilled person weaving and a person who lacks the skill but can still smash buttons.

    Take molten whip for example 81 hits doing 15k dps, 199 light attacks doing 19k
    Look at the avg and max
    Molten whip does DOUBLE the damage, this seems fair in terms of a skill and a weave

    Let's use some more math
    15,335 / 19,032 = 0.81 ( molten whip dps percent of light attack dps )
    199 / 81 = 2.46 ( how many light attack hits per molten whip )
    0.81 * 2.46 = 1.99 ( the percent times hit ratio to achieve the effective damage )

    Therefore, the AMOUNT molten whip hits for is twice as effective as light attack

    The only reason light attacks damage is so "high" is because it's weaved EVERY GCD

    do that again and dont light attack at all. Well see if the difference is 20%.
    We shall know them by their works.
  • MehrunesFlagon
    MehrunesFlagon
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    itsfatbass wrote: »
    Light attacks used to be meaningless back in the day. A massive patch a couple years ago (can't recall which) made heavy adjustments to light and heavy attacks and how they work/perform. They skyrocketed to the top of most parses and certain very much at the top during actual fights as well. It's just the way ZOS has designed their game and its the way we have to play if we plan to be successful at it.
    This whole argument is a logical fallacy
    Delparis wrote: »
    Aznarb wrote: »
    Delparis wrote: »
    Heatnix90 wrote: »
    Imagine making thread after thread over light attacks in ESO in 2019.

    Why not many issues are still in game since beta and still didn't get fixed.
    Maybe the new team will fix that rotten legacy.

    Let me explain to you since you have hard time to understand basic thing.
    You LA betwen EACH skill, so you use LA 10 time more than any skill.
    Ofc it's one of the main dmg source in parse result, nothing to do with "OP LA"

    If LA is so OP, why don't you just stop using skill and go full LA ? After-all, it's OP right ? Go for it.



    Edit : typo.

    look at liko sorc parse



    LA is doing +21k on average, that means 21k per hit and per second.
    that's what i mean when i said that LA is OP, it's doing more dmg than it should.

    This whole argument is a logical fallacy

    You get an insightful.
  • brandoncoffmannub18_ESO
    Rungar wrote: »
    vmdbhdp0dga7.png

    You can't look at just the dps, look at the avg and max hits, how many times it hit, LA is the difference between a skilled person weaving and a person who lacks the skill but can still smash buttons.

    Take molten whip for example 81 hits doing 15k dps, 199 light attacks doing 19k
    Look at the avg and max
    Molten whip does DOUBLE the damage, this seems fair in terms of a skill and a weave

    Let's use some more math
    15,335 / 19,032 = 0.81 ( molten whip dps percent of light attack dps )
    199 / 81 = 2.46 ( how many light attack hits per molten whip )
    0.81 * 2.46 = 1.99 ( the percent times hit ratio to achieve the effective damage )

    Therefore, the AMOUNT molten whip hits for is twice as effective as light attack

    The only reason light attacks damage is so "high" is because it's weaved EVERY GCD

    do that again and dont light attack at all. Well see if the difference is 20%.

    you can't weave anything else other than bashing but to be fair you can weave light attack skill and bash all in one gcd, point is, you can do light attack/heavy attack + skill + bash, but you can't do more than one of each in one second, aka, gcd, so it doesn't make sense to do that.
    Raise your arguments, not your insults.

    Jodynn/Jo_oJ PC NA

    PvE and PvP

    MagDK
    StamDK
  • Delparis
    Delparis
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    Alcast made a guide + test parse with and without LA

    https://alcasthq.com/eso-weaving-beginner-guide-animation-canceling/

    Capture.png

    37k more dps because of LA That's huge !!

    So don't tell me now that only magicka get a boost because of vMA staff


    Edited by Delparis on August 16, 2019 12:48PM
    ZOS don't fix old bugs, they harbor them
  • brandoncoffmannub18_ESO
    Refer to my previous comment
    Raise your arguments, not your insults.

    Jodynn/Jo_oJ PC NA

    PvE and PvP

    MagDK
    StamDK
  • ghastley
    ghastley
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    #nerfcombat

    If I don't make any attacks, I don't do any damage. Any skill or LA/HA increases that by a bazillion percent!
  • jypcy
    jypcy
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    I’ll ask again: OP, would the current dps be okay if they were changed to auto attacks between every skill instead of manual light attacks?

    If that would not be okay, for what reason do you believe that light attacks are over performing other than “because they don’t deal this much damage in other games”?
  • TheZachinator
    TheZachinator
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    Just wanted to tell the OP thanks for giving me so much good copypasta.
    PC/NA

    Magsorc Immortal Redeemer & Gryphon Heart
  • BooPerScOOper
    BooPerScOOper
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    Delparis wrote: »
    Alcast made a guide + test parse with and without LA

    https://alcasthq.com/eso-weaving-beginner-guide-animation-canceling/

    Capture.png

    37k more dps because of LA That's huge !!

    So don't tell me now that only magicka get a boost because of vMA staff

    Yet another logical fallacy argument..

    You cannot use people that are outside of the statistical normal player base range (Alcast/Liko or any of the top 5%) to get accurate data. It's a disingenuous/false argument to just focus on the outliers. You are trying to manipulate the data and emotions of players with your cognitive biases

    You need to provide your own parse comparisons if you're going to bring forth this discussion over and over and over and over..
  • Heatnix90
    Heatnix90
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    Delparis wrote: »
    Alcast made a guide + test parse with and without LA

    https://alcasthq.com/eso-weaving-beginner-guide-animation-canceling/

    Capture.png

    37k more dps because of LA That's huge !!

    So don't tell me now that only magicka get a boost because of vMA staff


    Nice job taking something completely out of context.

    You didn't take into account the actual DPS that Light Attacks contributed (9k if you look at combat metrics and not just make numbers up), the fact that said light attacks were proccing one of the most powerful sets in the game (Perfected Relequen), the fact that there was probably an ult or two thrown in (including the Major Vulnerability debuff), the fact that those light attacks were also proccing enchants, and the fact that Liko probably had trouble doing a parse without light attacking because his muscle memory has been imprinted with a solid rotation using light attacks.

    But yeah you're totally right, LA alone contributes 30k dps LUL.
    Heatnix - NA/PC
    Chill Bros Chat Lounge
  • MehrunesFlagon
    MehrunesFlagon
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    Delparis wrote: »
    Alcast made a guide + test parse with and without LA

    https://alcasthq.com/eso-weaving-beginner-guide-animation-canceling/

    Capture.png

    37k more dps because of LA That's huge !!

    So don't tell me now that only magicka get a boost because of vMA staff

    Yet another logical fallacy argument..

    You cannot use people that are outside of the statistical normal player base range (Alcast/Liko or any of the top 5%) to get accurate data. It's a disingenuous/false argument to just focus on the outliers. You are trying to manipulate the data and emotions of players with your cognitive biases

    You need to provide your own parse comparisons if you're going to bring forth this discussion over and over and over and over..

    Then what dps range should we be looking at?There has to be a standard somewhere. Also,gat range of dps do think the 5% hit,out of curiosity.
  • Juhasow
    Juhasow
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    It is funny that it looks like OP is spending more time on making threads like this one and looking for out of context "evidence" in internet then actually on practicing his skill in the game. What is even funnier is that even if ZoS would remove light attack weaving completly OP would still suck with DPS because he doesnt even realise how much more is required to be good DD then just light attack weaving.

    Seriously when people complain that ZoS is not listening to the community feedback sometimes it's hard to blame them when so many people in community behaves like OP and floods the forum with such non constructive threads.
    Edited by Juhasow on August 19, 2019 3:19AM
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