Nerftheforums wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »I'd rather see some SOFTcounters to blockhealing and buffing other skill lines instead of flat nerfs. Game has seen enough nerfs.
Nerfs are good, whatchu mean. 5 years in and I saw more nerfs than npcs, so good.
Perhaps your inane bigotry has blinded you to see only particular views. I suggest you L2P and try something new for a change.SilverPaws wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »SilverPaws wrote: »So funny how many people here complain about snb are players who don't run snb at all . Sure that 2k heroic slash spam is so hard to survive
Snb runs classes that have no viable alternative - stamdk, stamsorc.
Also both heroic and reverb are expensive abilities on top.
I know crazy... Its almost like players who are using something don't want it nerfed, even if it is overperforming.
Legendary Archer of Valenwood and bow/bow builds okay Player like you should not comment on balance at all.
Toc de Malsvi wrote: »Perhaps your inane bigotry has blinded you to see only particular views. I suggest you L2P and try something new for a change.SilverPaws wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »SilverPaws wrote: »So funny how many people here complain about snb are players who don't run snb at all . Sure that 2k heroic slash spam is so hard to survive
Snb runs classes that have no viable alternative - stamdk, stamsorc.
Also both heroic and reverb are expensive abilities on top.
I know crazy... Its almost like players who are using something don't want it nerfed, even if it is overperforming.
Legendary Archer of Valenwood and bow/bow builds okay Player like you should not comment on balance at all.
SilverPaws wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »Perhaps your inane bigotry has blinded you to see only particular views. I suggest you L2P and try something new for a change.SilverPaws wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »SilverPaws wrote: »So funny how many people here complain about snb are players who don't run snb at all . Sure that 2k heroic slash spam is so hard to survive
Snb runs classes that have no viable alternative - stamdk, stamsorc.
Also both heroic and reverb are expensive abilities on top.
I know crazy... Its almost like players who are using something don't want it nerfed, even if it is overperforming.
Legendary Archer of Valenwood and bow/bow builds okay Player like you should not comment on balance at all.
You are clearly not good pvp player and yet continue discussing balance when you have no clue on the topic.
it has
no bleed
no dot
no aoe
no execute
and no high damage spamable (pierce armor can be used as a spamable, but not on the level of uppercut, snipe, etc)
and receives half benefit from enchants
the WHOLE POINT of the line is utility, you give up every kind of relevant damage in the game FOR that utility, that's the point.
PS: listing "snare" as a utility is dumb, almost every darn skill in this game applies a "snare" its something we are all quite annoyed about.
Extremely biased answer here.
1. "no bleed" The role of bleed is to put pressure. Defile put huge pressure. You also forgot that you can bar swap to an other weapon
2. "no dot" Stam build have either class dot or class burst. Again, you also forget that you can dot from other weapon skill line with a bar swap.
3. "no AoE" Granted, even if it's not the purpose of the weapon
4. "no execute" Every single decent stam build run 2h for rally/FM, the stamina execute can be on 2H.
5. "no high damage spamable" this is the worst. It has been proove several time that S&B spammable deal more damage than uppercut and especially this patch, using LA/ransack/bash deal more damage and is cheaper than using cast time skills like uppercut or snipe.
S&B is op for some reasons :
-You can have a high damage spammable (500 less damage than surpise attack) + having 60% snare + minor heroism + minor main.
-You can also choose ransack for better damage at cheaper cost (bash+ransack+major fracture is better damage than all other spammable for a cheap cost), applying major fractue and giving minor resolve.
-You can combine it with a stun that deal damage and apply MAJOR DEFILE, which is the most powerfull debuff in the game.
-You can slot one of the best defensive ultimate if your class doesn't have one : spell wall.
- By having Huge damage and utility, you also have passively the best defensive weapon in the game, giving better and cheaper block, additional resist and armor trait.
S&B is the best damage weapon for single target in PvP and also the best defensive weapon, both make it the best 1vX and 1v1 weapon in the game.
You can back bar 2h for rally/FM and add execute if needed. You can also use carve next patch for ur lovely bleed.
The fact that S&B is a better single target offensive weapon than every other one while also being the best defensive weapon make it OP. That's simple.
GeorgeBlack wrote: »Even stamNB will turn to SnB now.
Everybody can rely on SnB to carry them through hard times. It's has all the tools and fills all gaps.
Anyway dont take my word for it. Take it from the 1mil tournament competitors.
DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Remember when blocking didn't disable stam regen? That was fun.
This has nothing to do with what I said. Totally irrelevant. Though your claim that 80% of open world Cyrodiil stam builds equip S&B is interesting. You are actually saying that every stam build but NBs use S&B and that seems to be a little to over the top to be accurate. I would like to see how you can back up such an audacious number.
If you carefully read what i wrote you might find that i didn´t write that - ofc you know that because you´re making a strawman argument.
Wolf_Watching wrote: »it has
no bleed
no dot
no aoe
no execute
and no high damage spamable (pierce armor can be used as a spamable, but not on the level of uppercut, snipe, etc)
and receives half benefit from enchants
the WHOLE POINT of the line is utility, you give up every kind of relevant damage in the game FOR that utility, that's the point.
PS: listing "snare" as a utility is dumb, almost every darn skill in this game applies a "snare" its something we are all quite annoyed about.
Extremely biased answer here.
1. "no bleed" The role of bleed is to put pressure. Defile put huge pressure. You also forgot that you can bar swap to an other weapon
2. "no dot" Stam build have either class dot or class burst. Again, you also forget that you can dot from other weapon skill line with a bar swap.
3. "no AoE" Granted, even if it's not the purpose of the weapon
4. "no execute" Every single decent stam build run 2h for rally/FM, the stamina execute can be on 2H.
5. "no high damage spamable" this is the worst. It has been proove several time that S&B spammable deal more damage than uppercut and especially this patch, using LA/ransack/bash deal more damage and is cheaper than using cast time skills like uppercut or snipe.
S&B is op for some reasons :
-You can have a high damage spammable (500 less damage than surpise attack) + having 60% snare + minor heroism + minor main.
-You can also choose ransack for better damage at cheaper cost (bash+ransack+major fracture is better damage than all other spammable for a cheap cost), applying major fractue and giving minor resolve.
-You can combine it with a stun that deal damage and apply MAJOR DEFILE, which is the most powerfull debuff in the game.
-You can slot one of the best defensive ultimate if your class doesn't have one : spell wall.
- By having Huge damage and utility, you also have passively the best defensive weapon in the game, giving better and cheaper block, additional resist and armor trait.
S&B is the best damage weapon for single target in PvP and also the best defensive weapon, both make it the best 1vX and 1v1 weapon in the game.
You can back bar 2h for rally/FM and add execute if needed. You can also use carve next patch for ur lovely bleed.
The fact that S&B is a better single target offensive weapon than every other one while also being the best defensive weapon make it OP. That's simple.
Running execute from another skill line isn’t related to SnB
Running burst on dots from another skill line isn’t related to SnB
10k heroic costs 3k Stam and also takes a lot of dmg to get it there
No one cares about 1 v 1 and anything that adds more defense will be the better weapon in a 1 v x
The reason it performs better than dizzy swing is b/c they nerfed a really bad skill into a now unusable skill this patch which needs to be adjusted.
Savos_Saren wrote: »100% Agree OP. Definitely need to change the SnB passive that gives 5% weapon damage to 2.5% weapon and 2.5% spell damage. It's a nerf... and a buff for some of us.
Militan1404 wrote: »Savos_Saren wrote: »100% Agree OP. Definitely need to change the SnB passive that gives 5% weapon damage to 2.5% weapon and 2.5% spell damage. It's a nerf... and a buff for some of us.
Why on earth should sword&board do mag dmg??? Dosent make any sense at all
it has
no bleed
no dot
no aoe
no execute
and no high damage spamable (pierce armor can be used as a spamable, but not on the level of uppercut, snipe, etc)
and receives half benefit from enchants
the WHOLE POINT of the line is utility, you give up every kind of relevant damage in the game FOR that utility, that's the point.
PS: listing "snare" as a utility is dumb, almost every darn skill in this game applies a "snare" its something we are all quite annoyed about.
10k heroic slash in PvP good enough for a spammable?
Defenders of SnB in pvp will pretend its not OP until they see every NB running it next patch. They honestly should have been doing it 2 patches ago. I won't be in PvP after Monday, so I can enjoy the laughs on the forums when people realize how OP it is.
SilverPaws wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »SilverPaws wrote: »So funny how many people here complain about snb are players who don't run snb at all . Sure that 2k heroic slash spam is so hard to survive
Snb runs classes that have no viable alternative - stamdk, stamsorc.
Also both heroic and reverb are expensive abilities on top.
I know crazy... Its almost like players who are using something don't want it nerfed, even if it is overperforming.
Legendary Archer of Valenwood and bow/bow builds okay Player like you should not comment on balance at all.
Murador178 wrote: »SilverPaws wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »SilverPaws wrote: »So funny how many people here complain about snb are players who don't run snb at all . Sure that 2k heroic slash spam is so hard to survive
Snb runs classes that have no viable alternative - stamdk, stamsorc.
Also both heroic and reverb are expensive abilities on top.
I know crazy... Its almost like players who are using something don't want it nerfed, even if it is overperforming.
Legendary Archer of Valenwood and bow/bow builds okay Player like you should not comment on balance at all.
I think players like u should not be allowed to write in the forums . Why do u think literally everybody except stamina nbs are running sword and board in duels- and stamina nbs also run them in tournaments because its just stronger, but atleast u can slaughter all the squishies with 2h/bow at the duel spot. Why is every duel tournament won by sword and board users - atleast on PC EU. And why is more than half of cyro running sword and board as a main skillline:
- 1st of all: stam dk/ stam sorc lack a viable alternative to heroic slash - lets be fair every spammable in the game is weaker as heroic slash except maybe SA - so pretty sure that in duels even as stamblade heroic slash will be better this patch
- 2nd of all: bashcanceling gives ur more dps than other skilllines and blockcanceling makes u quite tanky. Block migation is quite absurd and the lack of abilities countering block compared to rolldodge makes it a very easy to use defense...
- 3rd: major defile is too strong for an ultimate but seemingly not for a Sword and Board player .
- 4th: Snb Ult is rly good for tanking openworld like 5-6 guys.
Sword and board should be a utility defense skillline and not the best skillline for pressure giving great defense ontop. The sad part is that u dont even notice a big difference between many stam classes since they almost only weaponskills. - Another slash spammer ...
@idk so ur not diversifying between a complain that is based on argumentation and a complain for the sake of complaining. I see u in every thread telling everybody that they are wrong - but u seem to be never on topic... But probably thats why u got 10 stars.
Murador178 wrote: »SilverPaws wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »SilverPaws wrote: »So funny how many people here complain about snb are players who don't run snb at all . Sure that 2k heroic slash spam is so hard to survive
Snb runs classes that have no viable alternative - stamdk, stamsorc.
Also both heroic and reverb are expensive abilities on top.
I know crazy... Its almost like players who are using something don't want it nerfed, even if it is overperforming.
Legendary Archer of Valenwood and bow/bow builds okay Player like you should not comment on balance at all.
I think players like u should not be allowed to write in the forums . Why do u think literally everybody except stamina nbs are running sword and board in duels- and stamina nbs also run them in tournaments because its just stronger, but atleast u can slaughter all the squishies with 2h/bow at the duel spot. Why is every duel tournament won by sword and board users - atleast on PC EU. And why is more than half of cyro running sword and board as a main skillline:
- 1st of all: stam dk/ stam sorc lack a viable alternative to heroic slash - lets be fair every spammable in the game is weaker as heroic slash except maybe SA - so pretty sure that in duels even as stamblade heroic slash will be better this patch
- 2nd of all: bashcanceling gives ur more dps than other skilllines and blockcanceling makes u quite tanky. Block migation is quite absurd and the lack of abilities countering block compared to rolldodge makes it a very easy to use defense...
- 3rd: major defile is too strong for an ultimate but seemingly not for a Sword and Board player .
- 4th: Snb Ult is rly good for tanking openworld like 5-6 guys.
Sword and board should be a utility defense skillline and not the best skillline for pressure giving great defense ontop. The sad part is that u dont even notice a big difference between many stam classes since they almost only weaponskills. - Another slash spammer ...
@idk so ur not diversifying between a complain that is based on argumentation and a complain for the sake of complaining. I see u in every thread telling everybody that they are wrong - but u seem to be never on topic... But probably thats why u got 10 stars.
GeorgeBlack wrote: »
it has
no bleed
no dot
no aoe
no execute
and no high damage spamable (pierce armor can be used as a spamable, but not on the level of uppercut, snipe, etc)
and receives half benefit from enchants
the WHOLE POINT of the line is utility, you give up every kind of relevant damage in the game FOR that utility, that's the point.
PS: listing "snare" as a utility is dumb, almost every darn skill in this game applies a "snare" its something we are all quite annoyed about.
GeorgeBlack wrote: »
I'll give you a hint. Naming your stamdk like your forum account name isn't the best way to not be recognized ingame.
You could deny using that build, but i'm not sure how useful that would be. I'm pretty sure i'm not the only one that has encountered you ingame.
psychotic13 wrote: »it has
no bleed
no dot
no aoe
no execute
and no high damage spamable (pierce armor can be used as a spamable, but not on the level of uppercut, snipe, etc)
and receives half benefit from enchants
the WHOLE POINT of the line is utility, you give up every kind of relevant damage in the game FOR that utility, that's the point.
PS: listing "snare" as a utility is dumb, almost every darn skill in this game applies a "snare" its something we are all quite annoyed about.
How can you compare piece armor to snipe or dizzy? That alone just invalidates everything youve said as snipe and dizzy have cast times and are not comparable.
FYI, piece armor bash cancel does more damage than dizzy so theres that.
It is overperforming.