PTS Update 22 - Feedback Thread for Sunspire Trial

Sorath · April 2019

Did you enjoy this new Trial?
- Yes, Although i do feel like vet is too easy, most of the mechanics don't seem very punishing at all but that could just be me

What level and build was the character you used?
- Max CP, Have completed vet on a magicka templar dps and a stamina necro dps

How did the difficulty compare to existing Trials on Normal and Veteran versions?
- i think normal is at a good difficulty level, but like i said earlier vet felt somewhat lacking, especially compared to all of the other non base-game trials. felt like a similar difficulty to sanctum ophedia. And that is with it being new and people haven't figured out the most efficient ways to do it yet. Could definitely use some more punishing mechanics.

Did you complete Normal or Veteran (or both)?
- Both

Did you try any Hard Modes? If so, which bosses?
- Cleared hard mode on the fire dragon, it was good but i feel like it is at about the difficulty that the vet trial should have been
- Attempted ice dragon hard mode, had a lot of trouble with the sweeping ice breath mechanic, not sure if bugged or just haven't figure out the correct way to do it yet
- Have not tried final boss hard mode yet, Although there seems to be a bug where you can activate it without having done the other 2 on hard-mode first? Im pretty sure i remember reading somewhere that you would have to complete the first 2 hard-modes before being able to turn on last boss hard-mode?

Were there any mechanics you had difficulty with?
- Ice breath on ice dragon is killer
- last boss portals is nice and challenging, but only 3 group members need to do it whilst everyone just twiddles their thumbs upstairs side stepping slow as time stops

Did you complete the trial?
- yes

Do you have any other general feedback?
- feedback/maybe bug? currently you can get perfected gear from just normal vet? not sure if this is intentional or not but i hope it isn't, there are several very good sets that drop from there and having perfected versions drop or non-Hardmode seems kinda dumb as it removes part of the drive for players to push themselves to do the hardmodes.

code65536 · April 2019

Sorath wrote: »

Although there seems to be a bug where you can activate it without having done the other 2 on hard-mode first? Im pretty sure i remember reading somewhere that you would have to complete the first 2 hard-modes before being able to turn on last boss hard-mode?

Not a bug. That requirement was temporarily lifted for the first couple of weeks of PTS so that groups could give early feedback about the final boss HM.

Sorath wrote: »

- feedback/maybe bug? currently you can get perfected gear from just normal vet? not sure if this is intentional or not but i hope it isn't, there are several very good sets that drop from there and having perfected versions drop or non-Hardmode seems kinda dumb as it removes part of the drive for players to push themselves to do the hardmodes.

Titles like Godslayer aren't enough for you? It's the right decision. The top groups capable of clearing HM aren't driven to do so by the promise of gear. They do it for the prestige, titles, achievements, scores, and competition. The power gap between the top groups and everyone else is already so high that adding gear power to further widen that gap would be indefensibly irresponsible.

Sorath · April 2019

code65536 wrote: »

Sorath wrote: »

- feedback/maybe bug? currently you can get perfected gear from just normal vet? not sure if this is intentional or not but i hope it isn't, there are several very good sets that drop from there and having perfected versions drop or non-Hardmode seems kinda dumb as it removes part of the drive for players to push themselves to do the hardmodes.

Titles like Godslayer aren't enough for you? It's the right decision. The top groups capable of clearing HM aren't driven to do so by the promise of gear. They do it for the prestige, titles, achievements, scores, and competition. The power gap between the top groups and everyone else is already so high that adding gear power to further widen that gap would be indefensibly irresponsible.

i mean i kinda see your point maybe its just the the difficulty of the normal vet version at the moment doesn't reflect my ideas of the difficulty that it should be to acquire BiS gear, i think it would be fine if it only dropped body pieces of perfected or something in normal vet and they you had to go into the hardmodes for weapons and jewels, or some similar system to that. But as it is at the moment you can get perfected golden jewels from the last boss on normal vet and that doesn't seem right to me

code65536 · April 2019

Sorath wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

Sorath wrote: »

- feedback/maybe bug? currently you can get perfected gear from just normal vet? not sure if this is intentional or not but i hope it isn't, there are several very good sets that drop from there and having perfected versions drop or non-Hardmode seems kinda dumb as it removes part of the drive for players to push themselves to do the hardmodes.

Titles like Godslayer aren't enough for you? It's the right decision. The top groups capable of clearing HM aren't driven to do so by the promise of gear. They do it for the prestige, titles, achievements, scores, and competition. The power gap between the top groups and everyone else is already so high that adding gear power to further widen that gap would be indefensibly irresponsible.

i mean i kinda see your point maybe its just the the difficulty of the normal vet version at the moment doesn't reflect my ideas of the difficulty that it should be to acquire BiS gear, i think it would be fine if it only dropped body pieces of perfected or something in normal vet and they you had to go into the hardmodes for weapons and jewels, or some similar system to that. But as it is at the moment you can get perfected golden jewels from the last boss on normal vet and that doesn't seem right to me

First, ESO has never been about gear like other MMOs. Mother's Sorrow is BiS, and that's overland BoE. Advancing Yokeda is BiS, and you have a better chance of getting it in nHRC than in vHRC.

Second, while I do see the merit in having Perfected gear be an enticement to do harder content, the notion that the line should be drawn at HM is severely lacking in perspective. Most people don't even run DLC trials on vet. Enticing people to make that jump from normal to vet is far more important for the health of raiding in ESO than enticing a much, much smaller number of people to make the jump from non-HM to HM.

Tasear · April 2019

Wish trial was only live so we can feel a real rush to compete.

taiyoukei · April 2019

I've noticed that the fire AOE telegraphs from the fire atronachs while fighting Yolnahkriin don't seem to share the same enemy AOE damage indication brightness. It's like the brightness for them is at default while everything else is at max brightness in my settings.

LiquidPony · May 2019

Feedback for the v5.0.2 update ...

Why on earth did you buff Yolo's health? It was already the highest HP boss in the game at 137m HP. Now it has 161.7m HP? Wut. That's ridiculous.

code65536 · May 2019

LiquidPony wrote: »

Feedback for the v5.0.2 update ...

Why on earth did you buff Yolo's health? It was already the highest HP boss in the game at 137m HP. Now it has 161.7m HP? Wut. That's ridiculous.

Probably because people were complaining here about how easy it is.

The difficulty increase comes in the form the offtank having to deal with more iron atronachs and the group as a whole having to deal with more lava pools because the time between each Cataclysm is increased. The problem is that for groups with top-tier DPS, I expect that they'll see only two iron atronachs per cycle and probably only two waves of flame atronachs (so only 4 pools), so the difficulty increase for them would be negligible. While for everyone else, they'll be looking at probably three or more irons per cycle and enough lava pools that there probably won't be able space left.

It's a difficulty increase will be most acutely felt by more mainstream groups.

Time-based mechanics also don't scale well with power increases over time. E.g., look at the world-record runs of vAS where the strategy is to just ignore Felms. Maybe one day the power will increase to a point where groups will see just one iron atronach per cycle. What then?

If the goal is to challenge the tanks with holding three iron atronachs and challenge groups with the area of denial from six lava pools, then make them spawn at health percentages such that those are the number you'll get per cycle, regardless of how high or low your DPS is, regardless of whether or not DPS levels double in another two years. High DPS will still shorten the fight and make things easier that way. But exposing people to substantially different mechanics--and yes, dealing with 4 lava pools while holding two irons is substantially different than dealing with 6 or 8 and holding three irons--based on DPS levels is just bad design.

Masel · May 2019

code65536 wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

Feedback for the v5.0.2 update ...

Why on earth did you buff Yolo's health? It was already the highest HP boss in the game at 137m HP. Now it has 161.7m HP? Wut. That's ridiculous.

Probably because people were complaining here about how easy it is.

The difficulty increase comes in the form the offtank having to deal with more iron atronachs and the group has a whole having to deal with more lava pools because the time between each Cataclysm is increased. The problem is that for groups with top-tier DPS, I expect that they'll see only two iron atronachs per cycle and probably only two waves of flame atronachs (so only 4 pools), so the difficulty increase for them would be negligible. While for everyone else, they'll be looking at probably three or more irons per cycle and enough lava pools that there probably won't be able space left.

It's a difficulty increase will be most acutely felt by more mainstream groups.

Time-based mechanics also don't scale well with power increases over time. E.g., look at the world-record runs of vAS where the strategy is to just ignore Felms. Maybe one day the power will increase to a point where groups will see just one iron atronach per cycle. What then?

If the goal is to challenge the tanks with holding three iron atronachs and challenge groups with the area of denial from six lava pools, then make them spawn at health percentages such that those are the number you'll get per cycle, regardless of how high or low your DPS is, regardless of whether or not DPS levels double in another two years. High DPS will still shorten the fight and make things easier that way. But exposing people to substantially different mechanics--and yes, dealing with 4 lava pools while holding two irons is substantially different than dealing with 6 or 8 and holding three irons--based on DPS levels is just bad design.

Agreed. Having that amount of health will just lead to dps being the ultimate decision maker for success or failure in that fight and put high pressure on the offtank.

Sanguinor2 · May 2019

I´d like to ask other tanks here About the Dragon hitboxes, I´ve offtanked yesterday so I was only in the face of the last boss but his hitboxes have been Pretty weird for me, if you engulf into his face he gets the debuff but if you place Blockade with crusher on his face he wont get the crusher, if you place Blockade at his wing instead he will get crusher but if you try to engulf it he wont get the debuff, anyone having similar experiences?

Sanguinor2 · May 2019

Moved to the Sunspire bug report thread (oops)

Qbiken · May 2019

delete