Nightblade Still Over Performing

Kulvar · February 2019

chris211 wrote: »

here is my 2 cents something needs to be done to cloak with out gutting the class and incap either needs the extra damage removed or the major defile removed im good with either

What do you want cloak to stop doing ? Guaranteed crit ? Invisibility ? Increase physical & magical resistance ?

max_only · February 2019

Remember the good old days when everyone and their grandma was a Sorc? Trials were 10 deep with Sorcs?

What goes around, comes around again. Instead of nerfing anyone, why not buff Templar instead?

Murador178 · February 2019

Overperforming in which area of the game? I can only speak for PvP:

U want to play solo/duo/trio ---> take a stamblade or msorc --> those are great for farming potatoes
U want to play in bigger groups or zergs ---> play a mwarden/ mplar or some tanky stam specs
U want to play duels --> pet sorc, stam tanks, mag specs - medium armor 2h/bow is okay at duels but for sure not great
U want to play battlegrounds --> some tanky group with a magplar, magwarden
Ur getting rekt by stamblades in openworld PvP ---> get some impen and detect pots or some aoe like steeltornado

People will never stop to make nerf nightblade or nerf sorcs threads because these 2 classes especel excel at stomping bad players and 90% cyro are bad players making 1vX possible. U wont kill 1v3 if the 3 players are halfway decent doesnt matter which classes they play. Since nightblade 2h/bow isnt exceling in a 1v1 even u can imagine which kind of potato light attack spamming guys are getting 1vXed.

Incap assasinswill combo is the most telegraphed combo in the game with the new changes there is a long CD on it now. If u get hit by both u just need to improve or the lag is killing u and not the nb.

Shiredo · February 2019

Nerf needed.

Murador178 wrote: »

Overperforming in which area of the game? I can only speak for PvP:

U want to play solo/duo/trio ---> take a stamblade or msorc --> those are great for farming potatoes
U want to play in bigger groups or zergs ---> play a mwarden/ mplar or some tanky stam specs
U want to play duels --> pet sorc, stam tanks, mag specs - medium armor 2h/bow is okay at duels but for sure not great
U want to play battlegrounds --> some tanky group with a magplar, magwarden
Ur getting rekt by stamblades in openworld PvP ---> get some impen and detect pots or some aoe like steeltornado

People will never stop to make nerf nightblade or nerf sorcs threads because these 2 classes especel excel at stomping bad players and 90% cyro are bad players making 1vX possible. U wont kill 1v3 if the 3 players are halfway decent doesnt matter which classes they play. Since nightblade 2h/bow isnt exceling in a 1v1 even u can imagine which kind of potato light attack spamming guys are getting 1vXed.

Why do only 2 classes "especel" excel against killing bad players? Every class should be able to do it just as easily.
I guess you main either a Stamblade or a Magsorc yourself. Trying to pretend you're good by using a class that will compensate for your bad skills. Gotta be fun.
A good player will be a good player even if their character gets slightly nerfed.
I guess you'll join the train of people making QQ threads and threatening to quit when the nerf does happen.

On topic though, stamblade: Stealth, all kinds of self buffs, all kinds of debuffs, all types of CC, decent heals, decent sustain, OP damage and 1st hit.
To kill a stamblade you either gang it or make a stamblade yourself. You shouldn't be forced to make a character just because the developers mess up the balancing. Not like anyone would want to make a new character with all the lag EU server's getting anyway.

Murador178 · February 2019

Shiredo wrote: »

Nerf needed.

Murador178 wrote: »

Overperforming in which area of the game? I can only speak for PvP:

U want to play solo/duo/trio ---> take a stamblade or msorc --> those are great for farming potatoes
U want to play in bigger groups or zergs ---> play a mwarden/ mplar or some tanky stam specs
U want to play duels --> pet sorc, stam tanks, mag specs - medium armor 2h/bow is okay at duels but for sure not great
U want to play battlegrounds --> some tanky group with a magplar, magwarden
Ur getting rekt by stamblades in openworld PvP ---> get some impen and detect pots or some aoe like steeltornado

People will never stop to make nerf nightblade or nerf sorcs threads because these 2 classes especel excel at stomping bad players and 90% cyro are bad players making 1vX possible. U wont kill 1v3 if the 3 players are halfway decent doesnt matter which classes they play. Since nightblade 2h/bow isnt exceling in a 1v1 even u can imagine which kind of potato light attack spamming guys are getting 1vXed.

Why do only 2 classes "especel" excel against killing bad players? Every class should be able to do it just as easily.
I guess you main either a Stamblade or a Magsorc yourself. Trying to pretend you're good by using a class that will compensate for your bad skills. Gotta be fun.
A good player will be a good player even if their character gets slightly nerfed.
I guess you'll join the train of people making QQ threads and threatening to quit when the nerf does happen.

On topic though, stamblade: Stealth, all kinds of self buffs, all kinds of debuffs, all types of CC, decent heals, decent sustain, OP damage and 1st hit.
To kill a stamblade you either gang it or make a stamblade yourself. You shouldn't be forced to make a character just because the developers mess up the balancing. Not like anyone would want to make a new character with all the lag EU server's getting anyway.

Stamblade and mag sorc both got an easy to avoid high burst dmg combo scewing over chars without impen and not using defensive measures resulting on easy kills on bad players. ---> awesome to kill bad players.

Yes I got a mag sorc and a stamblade and I mainly play them since Im mostly playing solo even so Im fairly inactive because of the lag... .
So in group play these classes arent considered good e.g.. If u nerf them they will be complete useless in these areas.
I also got a stamplar(imo the most worthless class in the game), mag dk(group play), a mag nb and a stam dk to answer ur question.

ATomiX96 · February 2019

Give invisibilty cloak the same treatment as you did with streak, its too easily sustainable for stamblades these days, just run shackle or 1 magicka recovery on jewelry and you can cloak 4-5 times in a row, combined with shadow image you can just juke out anyone without too much effort.

Heavy Bleedblades are a different story for another time.

MLGProPlayer · February 2019

Morgul667 wrote: »

StamBlade are strong but MagBlade do not feel like they are strong at the moment

Magblade is still the strongest PvE DPS class. Templar has caught up to them though, and it's also a much easier class to play (you can hit the same DPS numbers with your eyes closed on templar), which might contribute to NB feeling a bit less rewarding. But they're certainly not underpowered in any way. If you want underpowered, try magden. It has one of the toughest rotations while DPS doesn't even sniff magblade levels.

Qbiken · February 2019

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Morgul667 wrote: »

StamBlade are strong but MagBlade do not feel like they are strong at the moment

Magblade is still the strongest PvE DPS class. Templar has caught up to them though, and it's also a much easier class to play (you can hit the same DPS numbers with your eyes closed on templar), which might contribute to NB feeling a bit less rewarding. But they're certainly not underpowered in any way. If you want underpowered, try magden. It has one of the togheet rotations while DPS doesn't even sniff magblade levels.

Think he´s speaking from a PvP point of view. Magblade isn´t even close to perform on the same level as stamblade in PvP. Medium armor stamblade could almost be considered cheese due to how good it is.

DarkPicture · February 2019

Maybe stop nerfing nightblade and buff other class e.g. sustain for dk and sorc? Nightblade overall is balanced, the problem is other classes got many nerfs and it makes them worse. Now they starts buffing templar and actually its a good way

juhislihis19 · February 2019

I would rather buff StamDKs and StamSorcs than nerf StamBlades.

Its ridiculously easy to build a stamblade with infinite sustain, high damage and resources, 75-95% crit damage and relatively easy to slot skills. No room for buffs? No matter, free Ward and Resolve from the best spammable skill and slot Mirage for Minor buffs+Evasion, no need for Shuffle.

That being said, I don't think StamBlades are OP. I'd rather say ie. StamDK is just lagging sooo far behind Blades and Stamdens.

But when's the last time ZOS actually buffed one class instead of nerfing another? Just give our StamDKs the 2 fixes we urgently need and I have no problem with Stamblades!

Witar · February 2019

darkblue5 wrote: »

In PVE Nightblades need a nerf. Sure the rotation is hard but the dps is still too high. (The more intricate rotation is its own reward for some people.) That said for years nightblade had a tougher rotation and pretty low damage and besides pvp you rarely saw them. Nerfed into a good utility spot (eg stamplar) would be a fine result. My currently mained PVE nightblades would see less play but they've had mag sorc level dominance recently XD

In PVP for years they were soundly, soundly, soundly the best spec, rarely eclipsed by the likes of stamplars and Mag DKs. Now, honestly they are in a very strange place in PVP. The Devs have recognized the miserable play pattern of Cloak as it is. Cloak right now is overpowered to play against without counters and nigh useless to use against counters.
At the same time Cloak is already pretty useless in the current tanky ball group meta. There are reasons few nightblades are high MMR in battlegrounds, and why so few ball groups Need a nightblade to function. Nightblades are still the best at a form of play that is declining which is solo play. Except Magblades who are really in a pretty iffy spot with ever more of their attack and defense nerfed between PVE based Strife nerf, defile Death Stroke nerf,and the Grim Focus arrow nerf....

Essentially in PVP nightblades are already facing a hostile AOE meta, and while Cloak needs a nerf it rather needs it so that nightblade won't be as poorly situated and increasingly incentivized to only fight the softest targets who generally are the fresh faced new-to-PVP people that PVP needs to attract and keep.

Honestly though once you're wearing impen you're much more likely to be killed by a Rapids spamming, Negate spamming, Time stop spamming, unkillable healbot with proxy det spamming, Dawnbreaker of smiting spamming, Eye of the Storm spamming, and Spin to Winning ball group. Been/am a part of several and it is as busted as ganking or bombing USED to feel.

Or even more likely be repeatedly disconnected by a 60+ person zerg/guild/faction for 20 minutes only to find out when you
finally are able to log back on that your side lost two keeps in that time.

Good stamblade has over 5k wpd and able to one-twoshot bad players and chew through my 20k shields with softcapped resists and 2500 crit resists quite fast. I dunno what can actually be done to rectify that without either destroying nice stamina sets or nerfing stamblades to the ground.

FrankonPC · February 2019

Stamblade absolutely needs some adjustments. Cloak either goes from completely broken and useless to ridiculously strong. Right now it's in the strong category where they can somehow just cloak with hurricane on top of them.

Incap is still one of the strongest ults in the game, it just does too much. Get rid of the knockdown, defile or 20% more damage and it's in a pretty good spot imo. probably getting rid of the increased damage would help for balance in PVE and PVP.

With that being said, I disagree that surprise attack damage should be nerfed. If anything, heroic slash and ransack need to be brought more in line with this skill. There's no reason ransack should do roughly half the damage on the same spec. A lot of single target abilities in this game feel very weak in pvp and need to be reworked considering the healing and survivability that classes currently have. Of course you could address the tanky meta itself, but that involves adjusting so many things the quicker rework would be to boost this damage. Allow sword and board builds to not have to run imbue or dizzy and give them a good dps spammable.

In my opinion those adjustments would bring nightblade more in line with other classes, nerf their biggest crutch(cloak) and also adjust one of the strongest ultimates in the game for PVE and PVP.

On top of that, mag dk dps from a pvp perspective could use a rework, as well as a few other classes getting buffs as well. Wardens could use an adjustment as well, like nightblades.

if those things happen the game is in a pretty good spot.

Chilly-McFreeze · February 2019

Browart wrote: »

Maybe stop nerfing nightblade and buff other class e.g. sustain for dk and sorc? Nightblade overall is balanced, the problem is other classes got many nerfs and it makes them worse. Now they starts buffing templar and actually its a good way

While I don't disagree with the gist of your comment but the bolded part is an issue. Speaking on Stam NB: They are not balanced. They are the poster child of what a class should look like. Fun, unique, powerful. Only thing they lack is group support. But compared to what other stam classes can pull, stamNB is far ahead of them, hence they are not balanced. But you're right, they should rather work on all the other classes to bring them to the power- and fun-level of StamBlades.

TequilaFire · February 2019

Sorcs won't be happy till there are only sorcs in the game.
Then they can call for nerfs on each other!

technohic · February 2019

I don't think NBs are that bad but you know there is an issue when you go through more detect pots than your regular pots in a given night. There's so many stealthed waiting to snipe and so few actually fighting while magblades are in a pretty bad spot. Tells me too much of their strength is in the sneak attack and not enough in the class magicka abilities.

Rehdaun · February 2019

Shhh, don't bring up balancing. Might give Zos an idea to "balance" classes next patch like they did for races. We could see this..

I’m guessing many of you will be interested to know more about the racial class balance changes. While we aren’t ready to share specific details yet, here’s a peek at the goals driving the team’s effort:

When selecting a race class, players should have multiple effective options for any given gameplay role.
The combat power provided by each race class should be more equalized.
Players should feel a stronger sense of power progression through racial class passives as they level up.
The unique feeling and flavor each race class provides should be retained and enhanced where possible, and remain faithful to established lore.

Reference

After which they will completely gut each class and totally ignore over half of the play base.

Deuce · February 2019

I don’t like nerfs but I think the strongest feature is the major defile debuff incap provides in PvP.

Since incap also gives a dmg boost, it is sooo hard to counter that boost to a strong skill like merciless bow and SA spamming combo AND the major defile, very hard to recover and lack of counterplay there imo.

Even though reducing the dmg boost from incap would make it more pvp balanced, it would likely hurt pve dps too much.

I would suggest incap be moved to minor defile all things considered. Still very strong but allows a bit more cointerplay!

Stx · February 2019

One issue I see is that nightblade doesn't offer any group support or utility. I mean literally what do they have? Refreshing path?

I tank on my nightblade but I do t play him anymore because he doesn't boost the group in any way other than his gear sets.

I dont think it's good that NB has higher damage than other classes but they have no good tools for other roles so you dont want them to suck across the board.

As for pvp I don't have much experience but nightblades dont bother me much on average as a stamplar. I usually die to mag sorcs or dks but I'm a noob.

CavalryPK · February 2019

Please change the title to "stamblade"

Vapirko · February 2019

darkblue5 wrote: »

In PVE Nightblades need a nerf. Sure the rotation is hard but the dps is still too high. (The more intricate rotation is its own reward for some people.) That said for years nightblade had a tougher rotation and pretty low damage and besides pvp you rarely saw them. Nerfed into a good utility spot (eg stamplar) would be a fine result. My currently mained PVE nightblades would see less play but they've had mag sorc level dominance recently XD

In PVP for years they were soundly, soundly, soundly the best spec, rarely eclipsed by the likes of stamplars and Mag DKs. Now, honestly they are in a very strange place in PVP. The Devs have recognized the miserable play pattern of Cloak as it is. Cloak right now is overpowered to play against without counters and nigh useless to use against counters.
At the same time Cloak is already pretty useless in the current tanky ball group meta. There are reasons few nightblades are high MMR in battlegrounds, and why so few ball groups Need a nightblade to function. Nightblades are still the best at a form of play that is declining which is solo play. Except Magblades who are really in a pretty iffy spot with ever more of their attack and defense nerfed between PVE based Strife nerf, defile Death Stroke nerf,and the Grim Focus arrow nerf....

Essentially in PVP nightblades are already facing a hostile AOE meta, and while Cloak needs a nerf it rather needs it so that nightblade won't be as poorly situated and increasingly incentivized to only fight the softest targets who generally are the fresh faced new-to-PVP people that PVP needs to attract and keep.

Honestly though once you're wearing impen you're much more likely to be killed by a Rapids spamming, Negate spamming, Time stop spamming, unkillable healbot with proxy det spamming, Dawnbreaker of smiting spamming, Eye of the Storm spamming, and Spin to Winning ball group. Been/am a part of several and it is as busted as ganking or bombing USED to feel.

Or even more likely be repeatedly disconnected by a 60+ person zerg/guild/faction for 20 minutes only to find out when you
finally are able to log back on that your side lost two keeps in that time.

Cloak doesn’t need a nerf. The raw stats you can achieve with a stamblade though are insane. Not to mention all the buffs and debuffs, it overshadows every other stamina class except maybe warden. The only thing that holds them back a little is that their resolve/ward buff is short and weird either being tied to cloak or that weird heal.

Haashhtaag · February 2019

lower damage of spectral bow for both specs

Remove the major defile from incap, keep the damage increase for pve sake

Make it so when cloaking HoTs are suppressed just like DoTs are.

Make surprise attack minor fracture instead of major fracture, this would help in pvp and doesn’t really have much effect in pve.

John_Falstaff · February 2019

@Haashhtaag , they'd make almost the only class without proper Major Fracture in rotation, that would be stupid. And spectral bow isn't any sort of offender, I think, last year they made its projectile so loudly advertised and so slow (even at point blank range) that a turtle can dodge it.

Haashhtaag · February 2019

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Haashhtaag , they'd make almost the only class without proper Major Fracture in rotation, that would be stupid. And spectral bow isn't any sort of offender, I think, last year they made its projectile so loudly advertised and so slow (even at point blank range) that a turtle can dodge it.

Off the top of my head only classes with class based major fracture via passives and skills are NB, warden, and DK.

Only skill comparable would be sub assault which imo should also be minor fracture, keep in mind my main toon is a stamden.

The noxious breath ability is so bad and unreliable it doesn’t need to be changed imo.

Don’t defend spectral bow with the travel time nerf as it needed that but it still does way too much damage for an ability. It took tips higher than most ults.

Arkangeloski · February 2019

1.I call bull... first off any class is strong with an adept player steering it why? Because they know their strengths and limitations...
2. 50% nb on bg's where do you get this info? I play bg's all the time and all I see is ice wardens premade groups spamming immobilizers, snares and massive aoe damage...if you ask anyone that is suicide for a melee stamblade lol, maybe you see a lot of useless snipers stealing kills not any better than a sorcerer spamming execute from a mile away and scoring 30kills with 100k dmg lol.
3. And last show a clip of you killing a 50k health tank with 4 blows lol that will be interesting, because even if you had the damage ''highly doubt it'' the person had to be afk not moving not healing not blocking or cc breaking.
4. Good day and please stop spreading lies and unverified information (50% nb on bg's) lol!!!! You probably have super low mmr and you fight potatoes all day.

Arkangeloski · February 2019

Gnozo wrote: »

Stamblades are crazy OP in pvp.

Running just 2 sustain sets: Bone Pirate + Shackle

More then 2.4k stam recovery and easy 4k weapon damage.

Surprise attack gets a 13k tooltip with this setup and also applies major fracture increasing the damage even more.

Incap with a stun at 120 ult, major defile and another damage boost.

Assassin's Will has a higher tooltip then any instant damage ultimate in the game and comes with 2 really strong buffs on top of it (minor endurance, minor beserk? These 8 % more damage)

And when this is not enough, they also have cloak wich is one of the best defensive and offensive skills in the game wich also passively grants major armor buffs and opens a skill slot for another skill.

Compared to a Stamsorc or StamDK running ransack as their spammable its a joke. Ransack tooltip will be like 8k. Really great Balance.

Try to catch me on my magplar using bright throat and shackle lol.

John_Falstaff · February 2019

@Haashhtaag , let's start with nerfing stamden then, why not? And I'm not sure why move the way of nerfs instead of fixing the (admittedly bad and unreliable) Noxious Breath. People are asking to do something with Noxious for long time now, but there's always someone who wants everything to be equally broken.

As for spectral bow, the loud telegraph and huge delay is what's supposed to make it balanced. See LIko's parses above. Nerf the bow, and you'll nerf stamblades below the level of other classes in PvE, which is again stupid considering there's a steeper learning curve for it. Would have to bump overall damage for other NB abilities to compensate for the nerf.

D0RID0RI240 · February 2019

Go play a nightblade in a small pvp group, and see how useful it is. Hint: It isn't. Everyone winges on about nerfing *** it this game and most of it is straight L2P. Nightblade gankers destroy indivuduals, and yet any pug can pick up thier warden and have a shake and bake "Get wrecked" group build and just walk around with a ult that destroys groups and gives major protection.

Hmmm

starlizard70ub17_ESO · February 2019

Remember, we still need to nerf Sorcs,.... but after all's said and done, I'm betting that Templars will get nerfed yet again.

Lylith · February 2019

Nightblade Still Over Performing

wish i could say i'm surprised.

Kaysha · February 2019

universal_wrath wrote: »

I'm not sure why nightblade class in general has not recieved a proper nerft. I play for pvp and pve, and I can say that this class does not compare to other classes in any way ahape or form, no matter what race you choose to play with. In PVP, I killed numerous people just by crit incap ulti, and manage to kill lots of 50k+ hp player in 4-5hits, with great sustain and surviavbility. Almost never run out of magicka/ stamina for both pvp & pve, and when about to die, just cloak ouy my way in pvp. Alway has problems sustaining on both my dragonknight and sorcerer. Currently when I play BG, 50% of the players are NB, 50% other classes. It's simply not right to equip a class with high dmg abilities/buffs/debuff/crowd control, for such a low cost. Suprise attack is spamble and high dmg and still gives major fracture. Veild blade make you moove 25% faster in cloak to run away, cheap minor beserk with high dmg bonus and either snare or minor endurance. Stun from fear and minor maim, also minor mai from ghosts, cheap major facture and breach for ganking from mark cheap ulti for stun/ulti regen/major defiler. Or a bit costy ulti for massive heal and major vitality/ high dmg and stun. Also, there is the unreasonable 10% crit dmg, like it was not doing high dmg already. This class should be reworked for nerfs big time. If I missed something and made a mistake, please let me know

lol
2/10