Khajiit No-CP
Dunmer No-CP
Khajiit CP
Dunmer CP with HP equalized
Dunmer CP with no HP equalization
Simplification
Khajiit No-CP - 4913 crit dmg
Dunmer No-CP - 4887 crit dmg
Khajiit CP - 6201 crit dmg
Dunmer CP with HP equalized - 6215 crit dmg
Dunmer CP with no HP equalized (already had 17k+ HP, so not needed) - 6776 crit dmg
@ZOS_Gilliam @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RobGarrett @Masel @Checkmath @Joy_Division
Please don't tell me this is intended!!! Dunmer/Orc/Altmer beating Khajiit in crit dmg means Khajiit is virtually useless. It will just get worse the higher critical dmg modifier I stack.
It is very similar to the condition of Shadow on live
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/366347/shadow-vs-warrior-apprentice-whats-the-point-of-shadow
You realize the point of showing this is that the dunmer racial bonus for weapon damage results in more crit damage than a khajiit that has a crit damage racial, those differences are the point.
You realize the point of showing this is that the dunmer racial bonus for weapon damage results in more crit damage than a khajiit that has a crit damage racial, those differences are the point.
You realize the point of showing this is that the dunmer racial bonus for weapon damage results in more crit damage than a khajiit that has a crit damage racial, those differences are the point.
Yes but thats logical. Thats only true to a certain extent though. Once you hit a certain amount of weapon dmg then adding on more weapon dmg will increase the dmg for less and less percentage wise. So at a certain point Crit dmg will become more effective than weapon dmg.
If he had 2k weap dmg then picks a dunmer over a kajit he will crit way harder as he adds buffed about 20% weapon dmg to his bas weapon dmg and thus his hits before crit harder and so also after crit hit harder as everyone has a base multiplayer of 50% anyways.
If he had 4k and picks a dunmer then that extra weap dmg he gets is comparative a much smaller percentage about 8% and thus he will crit harder if he picks kajit instead because he gets that flat 10%
As higher he goes in weapon dmg as better kajit is compared to dunmer and vise versa. Now we just need @Gilliamtherogue to tell us where these meet before and after cp is applied.
You realize the point of showing this is that the dunmer racial bonus for weapon damage results in more crit damage than a khajiit that has a crit damage racial, those differences are the point.
Yes but thats logical. Thats only true to a certain extent though. Once you hit a certain amount of weapon dmg then adding on more weapon dmg will increase the dmg for less and less percentage wise. So at a certain point Crit dmg will become more effective than weapon dmg.
If he had 2k weap dmg then picks a dunmer over a kajit he will crit way harder as he adds buffed about 20% weapon dmg to his bas weapon dmg and thus his hits before crit harder and so also after crit hit harder as everyone has a base multiplayer of 50% anyways.
If he had 4k and picks a dunmer then that extra weap dmg he gets is comparative a much smaller percentage about 8% and thus he will crit harder if he picks kajit instead because he gets that flat 10%
As higher he goes in weapon dmg as better kajit is compared to dunmer and vise versa. Now we just need @Gilliamtherogue to tell us where these meet before and after cp is applied.
That point is around 9.6k Effective Weapon/Spell dmg.
John_Falstaff wrote: »Bloody hell. It actually makes me think that ZOS doesn't do any meaningful balancing. They're just tossing random numbers around.
John_Falstaff wrote: »Bloody hell. It actually makes me think that ZOS doesn't do any meaningful balancing. They're just tossing random numbers around.
Well we still have the issue that Altmer has 125 more magic than Dunmer.MLGProPlayer wrote: »Weren't you trolling Altmer players after they got nerfed? Maybe this is some karmic justice.
Well I give credit for Orc tankingJohn_Falstaff wrote: »Bloody hell. It actually makes me think that ZOS doesn't do any meaningful balancing. They're just tossing random numbers around.
tbh like always, nothing new at all
at start of this pts patch was really nice while in every next patch other worse races still was adjusting but then again they used random hit on board with "unexpected *** changes needed to noone"
if something is going good with blanace changes at ZOS...it is to good, we should always be ready for unexpected *** change without any reason/aplaintation, just to bamboozle another group of players
Yes, and because Altmer tears flooded Craglorn, note that Orcs managed to tank trough even if serious OP as no campaign.@zaria yep
people started to cry over khajiits because theu started to be one of top 3 dps races for mag or stam and what we get? something about I was worry since 1st patch notes which I have seen...khajiit will be to op (even if not BiS race, just one of these top) and people will start cry for nerfs even if dps difference between races is now 200-1k depending which race to which other race we compare, not like now on live huge gap like I will guess good 3k if not more
LMAO a number of anti-Altmer advocates in this thread including the OP, but now that their kitty is doing a tiny bit less damage than a Dunmer we have this:
LiquidPony wrote: »Is today like Bad Theorycrafting Day or something? A new wonderful holiday I didn't know about?
I'm just going to copypasta my response from another thread, but for real y'all, do some in-depth testing, think about your results, think about how they might extrapolate with group buffs, crunch the numbers, and double-check your work. Don't ping a bunch of ZOS employees and class reps and create a big commotion unless you've done all that.
First, take off your Shock enchant. Minor Vulnerability is probably skewing your tests.
Second, this all depends on your starting Weapon Damage and Crit Damage modifier values.
Let me demonstrate.
Setup:
5 x Perfect Rele, 5 x Advancing Yokeda, 2 x Velidreth. All Divines. 1 x Infused, 2 x Bloodthirsty. Nirn mainhand, Infused offhand. Lover Mundus. All Weapon Damage glyphs. Poison mainhand, Absorb Stam offhand, Infused Berserker Maelstrom bow.
CP: 66 Precise Strikes, 64 Mighty, 44 Thaum, 21 Piercing, 72 Master-at-Arms, 3 Physical Weapon Expert
These are crit hit values for light attacks.
Orc Warden
Unbuffed: 6710
Buffed with Major Brutality: 7323
Buffed with Major Brutality & Minor Force: 7749
Buffed with Major Brutality & Minor Force & Berserker: 8412
Khajiit Warden
Unbuffed: 6629
Buffed with Major Brutality: 7222
Buffed with Major Brutality & Minor Force: 7619
Buffed with Major Brutality & Minor Force & Berserker: 8317
Orc Sorc
Unbuffed: 7420
Buffed with Major Brutality: 8030
Buffed with Major Brutality & Minor Force: 8525
Buffed with Major Brutality & Minor Force & Berserker: 9272
Khajiit Sorc
Unbuffed: 7346
Buffed with Major Brutality: 7892
Buffed with Major Brutality & Minor Force: 8331
Buffed with Major Brutality & Minor Force & Berserker: 9115
Now, I'll put on Veiled Heritance instead of Advancing Yokeda and proc it:
Orc Sorc
Veiled Heritance: 7839
Veiled Heritance & Major Brutality: 8468
Veiled Heritance & Major Brutality & Minor Force: 8966
Veiled Heritance & Major Brutality & Minor Force & Berserker: 9637
Khajiit Sorc
Veiled Heritance: 7876
Veiled Heritance & Major Brutality: 8499
Veiled Heritance & Major Brutality & Minor Force: 8971
Veiled Heritance & Major Brutality & Minor Force & Berserker: 9691
Note that in the final set of tests, the Khajiit does more damage. You need to have sufficiently high Weapon Damage to start with. This will become even more apparent if Minor Brutality is provided. Also keep in mind that the Khajiit crit bonus will buff enchant procs, whereas the Orc/Dunmer weapon damage bonus will not, so that narrows the actual DPS gap in the prior test cases.