Daily Login Rewards for ESO+ members VS non subscribers

Anotherone773 · November 2018

People will literally find anything to complain about.

Abigail · November 2018

Me thinks the OP is much less aggrieved about the value of his subscription than he is upset that nonsubscribers get free stuff. It's a sad tale of human nature that the 'haves' resent it when the 'have-nots' receive anything. I won't insinuate the OP's political alignment, but I can guess.

yodased · November 2018

@abigail it shows more age than political affiliation and I think its more of a misunderstanding of access vs ownership

DaveMoeDee · November 2018

If you don't think you are getting value from the sub, stop subbing. If you are bitter and can no longer enjoy the game, find another game.

And stop playing Murkmire until they give it away for free.

People need to stop looking around them, trying to make sure no one is getting a better deal than they are. Btw, you are getting the same thing as everyone else OP. We are all having Murkmire added to our account. I may already have access due to my sub, but I don't own it yet. No one is not getting that benefit.

If this messes up your calculus for the value of your sub, reconsider your calculus. DLC adds very little value as there is very little DLC released and 2 DLC are very inexpensive dungeons. And there is no guarantee of any particular schedule of DLC releases in the future. They can change that at any point. They can skip a month, which has been done before. They can decide to do 2 chapters a year and 2 dungeon DLCs. If you aren't in love with the inventory buffs, don't sub.

Blacknight841 · November 2018

yodased wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

yodased wrote: »

carlos424 wrote: »

yodased wrote: »

Maybe its the other 4 DLCs you get access to.

Maybe its the double limit housing.

Maybe its the 10% more gold and EXP.

Maybe its the unlimited storage craft bag.

Maybe its the 1,500 (SOON TO BE 1,650) crowns you get every month.

So, because other people are getting a very small part of a large connected sum you pay, that somehow negates everything else?

If you log in and cancel your ESO+ out of indignation, guess what you still have Murkmire.

So you would rather have different and/or better free things on top of the free things you are getting because 1/30 of those free things you already have access to.

I think the whole point is that eso+ members already get murkmire, so it is basically not worth anything to us as a daily reward. I can understand this. Would be nice to get a crown crate or two in its place. Oh, and all those things you mentioned as “free things” arent really free are they? At $15/month for 12 months, those “free things” really cost $180 a year.

Nowhere did I say or insinuate that ESO+ was free or anything that I said was free.

The point remains that everyone is being given this for logging in. When you have eso+, you do not own the DLC.

Now, if you login for 24 days, you will own it.

With ESO+ you are renting the DLC access, they are giving it to you.

Just because you have access with eso+ doesn't take the "value" away from actually owning the DLC.

Its actually more interesting that people would be upset that other people can benefit even if it is a perceived loss to them, so what, now everyone can have a better time, it actually cost you nothing and you do benefit in the end.

You are not losing anything, no one is getting anything you also don't get.

^^^

“You are not gaining anything, no one is getting anything you also don't already have and pay for.”

Again, you don't have it. You have access to it.

Whether you want to argue semantics or not, there is no logical argument to refute that statement.

You do not own the DLC as a subscriber, you will after they give it to you.

Access is value.

There is no value to owing a specific song if you have subscription service that provides you with all the songs in the database.
There is no value to owing a digital book if you have access to an entire digital library. There is not value in owning a movie if it is already on a subscription service you watch.

You are paying for all those subscription services in full. You do not get a prorated amount for the item you already own.

Taleof2Cities · November 2018

As an ESO+ member who hasn’t actually bought any of the DLCs ... I think the Murkmire daily reward is a pretty good reward.

Tandor · November 2018

Blacknight841 wrote: »

yodased wrote: »

They get a lot of things.

You have no idea the reasoning why ZOS is offering these items, you can guess like we all can but presenting information that is your opinion as fact is not cool.

They reward paying subscribers with the subscription benefit, which is irrelevant to the daily log in rewards.

You are simply self-centered.

Either you are not reading what I am saying, or you are not comprehending. There’s is no point to eso plus members logging in every day of the month to get something they already have access to. I don’t have to guess why ZOS wants daily logins, the same way a teacher a calls for attendance in class. They want to see how many people are there each day. This is fact. It is also fact that they have opted to cater towards those members that are not ESO plus members this month, and hope they can get more logins from non daily players, by offering them a free DLC.

My point is that it would have been a lot more practical for them to offer two different rewards instead of just one. For instance. Non Eso plus members get a free dlc for logging in every day, while ESO plus members get the free DLC, but instead get the collectors version of it, that comes with a pet and whatever else. This would give benefits to both non subscribers and subscribers alike for logging in every day.

I fully understand the point you're making, but I disagree with it. Although subscribers get access to DLC content while they are subscribing, a lot of subscribers also buy each DLC - often with their subscription Crowns - so that they will still have free access if and when they suspend or cancel the subscription for whatever reason. With this month's daily login rewards they will get permanent access to Murkmire and will no longer have to spend Crowns buying it in the event of them suspending or cancelling their subscription. As a result they can use those subscription Crowns for other things. That's a benefit from logging in daily in my book.

Colecovision · November 2018

.

idk · November 2018

It seems OP is nit picking. ESO+ does get something for logging in each day. Especialy considering the loyalty rewards that are about to start I do not think it is reasonable to expect more for every single thing Zos does.

yodased · November 2018

no, access to a specific thing is not the value of the service allowing access. You can not assign value to intangible things within a subscription service. The entire service is the value, not the individual items within in.

To use your flawed example, you could own the record/tape/8track/cd/dvd/blu-ray of a song and that song could also be available to you streaming, because you have access to that song does not deplete the value of the one you own.

Conversely, if you have access to a song on a streaming network and then you buy the CD because whatever reason, the value of the subscription is not diminished.

The point is at this current time, you don't feel you are getting what you 'deserve' for free rewards, which in itself is a major logic flaw.

Blacknight841 · November 2018

Abigail wrote: »

Me thinks the OP is much less aggrieved about the value of his subscription than he is upset that nonsubscribers get free stuff. It's a sad tale of human nature that the 'haves' resent it when the 'have-nots' receive anything. I won't insinuate the OP's political alignment, but I can guess.

I have no issue with non subscribers getting free stuff, I do have an an issue with zenimax giving one sided rewards that do not have the same value to subscribers. It would be the exact same thing (but probably with more complaints). If it were reversed. I guarantee the non subscriber community would be in an uproar if they made a month where eso plus members got something and they didn’t get anything they can’t use until they subscribed. My point is if you do a daily login reward, it should benefit both subscribers and non subscribers at all times. Both sides logged in just the same, but only half of them get to actually use what they get.

yodased · November 2018

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Me thinks the OP is much less aggrieved about the value of his subscription than he is upset that nonsubscribers get free stuff. It's a sad tale of human nature that the 'haves' resent it when the 'have-nots' receive anything. I won't insinuate the OP's political alignment, but I can guess.

I have no issue with non subscribers getting free stuff, I do have an an issue with zenimax giving one sided rewards that do not have the same value to subscribers. It would be the exact same thing (but probably with more complaints). If it were reversed. I guarantee the non subscriber community would be in an uproar if they made a month where eso plus members got something and they didn’t get anything they can’t use until they subscribed. My point is if you do a daily login reward, it should benefit both subscribers and non subscribers at all times. Both sides logged in just the same, but only half of them get to actually use what they get.

Your point is not valid or logical because you are getting something for logging in, you just don't seem to want to accept that and apparently you are going to be subscribed to eso+ until the day the servers shut down.

wenchmore420b14_ESO · November 2018

Well, if the point is the lack of "free" stuff of daily rewards vs ESO Pus, wait till Nov 13.
ESO Pus will get lots of new "perks" not available to non subs.
Doesn't that count?

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/54825

menathradiel · November 2018

Blacknight841 wrote: »

However, if they were to give away the collectors edition of the dlc for eso plus members

ESO+ members are not losing out on anything by being given Murkmire as a daily reward, since they will be able to continue using it should they ever stop subscribing.

I have ESO+ and bought the Murkmire bundle for the horse and swamp jelly pet. It doesn't bother me in the slightest that I'll be "missing" a day's reward due to this purchase. It seems to me that you simply want to be given for free something that I and others have paid for.

Blacknight841 · November 2018

yodased wrote: »

no, access to a specific thing is not the value of the service allowing access. You can not assign value to intangible things within a subscription service. The entire service is the value, not the individual items within in.

To use your flawed example, you could own the record/tape/8track/cd/dvd/blu-ray of a song and that song could also be available to you streaming, because you have access to that song does not deplete the value of the one you own.

Conversely, if you have access to a song on a streaming network and then you buy the CD because whatever reason, the value of the subscription is not diminished.

The point is at this current time, you don't feel you are getting what you 'deserve' for free rewards, which in itself is a major logic flaw.

If you own 90% of the songs in that subscription service, you only get value from 10% of the service. Same thing applies if you own 10% of the songs, then you get 90% of the value from the subscription service. The items in that service are the value.

Let’s say they make the next monthly login reward, ALL DLC CONTENT. Would you still feel that you are getting the same VALUE from your eso plus membership?

Blacknight841 · November 2018

menathradiel wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

However, if they were to give away the collectors edition of the dlc for eso plus members

ESO+ members are not losing out on anything by being given Murkmire as a daily reward, since they will be able to continue using it should they ever stop subscribing.

I have ESO+ and bought the Murkmire bundle for the horse and swamp jelly pet. It doesn't bother me in the slightest that I'll be "missing" a day's reward due to this purchase. It seems to me that you simply want to be given for free something that I and others have paid for.

That is not what I am saying. I am saying that if would have been equally beneficial to you to log in every day this month if you got the colllectors bundle for logging in as an eso plus member, vs the standard bundle for logging in as a non member. You could have spent the crowns on something else that could have made your gaming experience more enjoyable.

Technically if you log in every day to get the dlc for free you paid only for the mount and pet in that bundle VS let’s say the clockwork bundle( if you bought that) where you paid for the dlc, pet and mount. That bundle just lost 1/3 of the value , but the cost remained the same.

This is no different then them giving away the free crown crates to eso plus members during the free eso plus weekends. They give the free crown crates to eso plus members because they essentially take 3 days worth of value away from eso plus members. I’m sure very few complain about the 3 days, but technically 1/10 of the monthly subsription cost was paid for the 3 free crates and not for the subscription time.

yodased · November 2018

Yes because i am getting the same value as is everyone else.

Right now as eso+ a benefit is not having to purchase the dlc content to play it. I enjoy this dlc, but i may not enjoy or agree with choices made in the future, which would without these rewards require me to purchase said dlc.

With all dlc awarded for login, that problem is mitigated. Eso+ non eso+ i have access to all content.

This is a circular conversation, my determination of value is different than yours, so we will just have to accept each others opinion and move on.

Hippie4927 · November 2018

Daily login rewards and ESO+ are entirely separate things. One has nothing to do with the other. Everyone, regardless of + or no +, get exactly the same thing. If a reward has no value to you, it doesn't matter because you didn't pay for it.....it was free.....nothing gained, nothing lost.

Blacknight841 · November 2018

Hippie4927 wrote: »

Daily login rewards and ESO+ are entirely separate things. One has nothing to do with the other. Everyone, regardless of + or no +, get exactly the same thing. If a reward has no value to you, it doesn't matter because you didn't pay for it.....it was free.....nothing gained, nothing lost.

But you DO pay for it as a plus member.

Would you feel the same way if the daily login reward was a free month of ESO plus for the next month. However, if you are already an eso plus member you don’t get the free month unless you cancel your eso plus. Would you just keep the membership and pay for the month just because it’s nothing gained.

Hippie4927 · November 2018

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Hippie4927 wrote: »

Daily login rewards and ESO+ are entirely separate things. One has nothing to do with the other. Everyone, regardless of + or no +, get exactly the same thing. If a reward has no value to you, it doesn't matter because you didn't pay for it.....it was free.....nothing gained, nothing lost.

But you DO pay for it as a plus member.

Would you feel the same way if the daily login reward was a free month of ESO plus for the next month. However, if you are already an eso plus member you don’t get the free month unless you cancel your eso plus. Would you just keep the membership and pay for the month just because it’s nothing gained.

Yes, and I would be happy for those that got the free month.

yodased · November 2018

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Hippie4927 wrote: »

Daily login rewards and ESO+ are entirely separate things. One has nothing to do with the other. Everyone, regardless of + or no +, get exactly the same thing. If a reward has no value to you, it doesn't matter because you didn't pay for it.....it was free.....nothing gained, nothing lost.

But you DO pay for it as a plus member.

Would you feel the same way if the daily login reward was a free month of ESO plus for the next month. However, if you are already an eso plus member you don’t get the free month unless you cancel your eso plus. Would you just keep the membership and pay for the month just because it’s nothing gained.

I would because it's something that I'm already doing and planned on doing for that month. Just because people may get 1/12 of my subscription cost for free does not affect my decision making.

In this example, if you feel cheated somehow, you cancel the account for that month and buy it again afterwards.

Equity does not mean equality, and by giving non eso players a small taste of what ESO+ offers, I very well can benefit in the end. More players coming onto sub after a free month is a very real possibility.

More ESO+ is more revenue for the company, more than likely would contribute to the longevity and popularity of the game, which then gives me more time to do something I enjoy.

The issue here is you feel you are being cheated out of something that you already have and other's will get what you have for free, while you paid for it.

The flaw in that logic, and why this is a circular conversation is because you actually don't have and are not paying for the DLC. You are paying for a service that allows you to pretend like you own the DLC and access its content, this is not the same thing as owning it outright.

Blacknight841 · November 2018

go

Hippie4927 wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Hippie4927 wrote: »

Daily login rewards and ESO+ are entirely separate things. One has nothing to do with the other. Everyone, regardless of + or no +, get exactly the same thing. If a reward has no value to you, it doesn't matter because you didn't pay for it.....it was free.....nothing gained, nothing lost.

But you DO pay for it as a plus member.

Would you feel the same way if the daily login reward was a free month of ESO plus for the next month. However, if you are already an eso plus member you don’t get the free month unless you cancel your eso plus. Would you just keep the membership and pay for the month just because it’s nothing gained.

Yes, and I would be happy for those that got the free month.

Sure maybe you are fine wasting a months worth of subscription, I probably wouldn’t be bothered by a month of wasted eso plus either But would you keep paying that subscription every month, If the daily login reward was a free month of eso plus, every month you successfully login on for all the rewards. Would you just still be happy for them and thrilled to pay the 180$ annually to get something you already have because you are logging in every day.

Kryptonite_Kent · November 2018

This is whats wrong with the world, peoples brains dont work so good no more... sure you have access to it now, so getting it for free is "useless" to you, but you could also one day decide you dont want to pay a sub fee for this game and then you wont have access to it at all if you didnt get it for free, or use crowns to buy it. On the other hand if you are subbed for a long time and save up a lot of crowns, you could purchase all the DLC and get the login for Murkmire for free, then if you ever unsub you still have full access to all the DLC... but I'm guessing you are really not as dense as that and your actual problem is with people getting something for free who may not be paying a sub fee, in which case I offer you a QQ.

drkfrontiers · November 2018

My subscription has paid for any DLC & content ESO has provided X4 already. With the accumulative value of my sub I could have bought dozens of AAA games.

... but I do have a craft bag.

menathradiel · November 2018

Blacknight841 wrote: »

menathradiel wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

However, if they were to give away the collectors edition of the dlc for eso plus members

ESO+ members are not losing out on anything by being given Murkmire as a daily reward, since they will be able to continue using it should they ever stop subscribing.

I have ESO+ and bought the Murkmire bundle for the horse and swamp jelly pet. It doesn't bother me in the slightest that I'll be "missing" a day's reward due to this purchase. It seems to me that you simply want to be given for free something that I and others have paid for.

That is not what I am saying. I am saying that if would have been equally beneficial to you to log in every day this month if you got the colllectors bundle for logging in as an eso plus member, vs the standard bundle for logging in as a non member. You could have spent the crowns on something else that could have made your gaming experience more enjoyable.

Technically if you log in every day to get the dlc for free you paid only for the mount and pet in that bundle VS let’s say the clockwork bundle( if you bought that) where you paid for the dlc, pet and mount. That bundle just lost 1/3 of the value , but the cost remained the same.

This is no different then them giving away the free crown crates to eso plus members during the free eso plus weekends. They give the free crown crates to eso plus members because they essentially take 3 days worth of value away from eso plus members. I’m sure very few complain about the 3 days, but technically 1/10 of the monthly subsription cost was paid for the 3 free crates and not for the subscription time.

As an ESO+ member I get access to the DLC for free - if I ever stop subscribing I would continue to have access to it because it was given as a reward. Adding the horse and pet would give extra benefits, not equal.

The reduction in value of the bundle because later this month I will be given a thing I already purchased is your perception, not mine. I knew full well that I would get the DLC as a reward; I chose to buy it anyway. In the end it all comes down to that simple perception: You feel that the reward takes something away from you and therefore want additional compensation for this perceived loss - I do not.

ZarkingFrued · November 2018

I'll admit it wouldn't be a bad idea for them to give us a crate instead of murkmire if were plus. But still, even if you cancel you still get murkmire, so we are getting something the same. And it's free, so, idk, no big deal?

Hippie4927 · November 2018

Blacknight841 wrote: »

The value of the eso plus membership grows with each dlc, this month it did not go

Hippie4927 wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Hippie4927 wrote: »

Daily login rewards and ESO+ are entirely separate things. One has nothing to do with the other. Everyone, regardless of + or no +, get exactly the same thing. If a reward has no value to you, it doesn't matter because you didn't pay for it.....it was free.....nothing gained, nothing lost.

But you DO pay for it as a plus member.

Would you feel the same way if the daily login reward was a free month of ESO plus for the next month. However, if you are already an eso plus member you don’t get the free month unless you cancel your eso plus. Would you just keep the membership and pay for the month just because it’s nothing gained.

Yes, and I would be happy for those that got the free month.

Sure maybe you are fine wasting a months worth of subscription, I probably wouldn’t be bothered by a month of wasted eso plus either But would you keep paying that subscription every month, If the daily login reward was a free month of eso plus, every month you successfully login on for all the rewards. Would you just still be happy for them and thrilled to pay the 180$ annually to get something you already have because you are logging in every day.

You DO know that they do occasionally offer free trials of ESO+? Do you think I should feel cheated because I can't get the free trial unless I cancel my +? Because, I don't feel cheated. It doesn't bother me if someone else gets something that I'm not getting. I AM happy for them and I continue to enjoy my game. Don't sweat the small stuff!

Ruckly · November 2018

The OP is very tunnel vision in the content and structure of the post. I assume you mean players get Murkmire for logging in as a daily reward whereas ESO+ members get Murkmire for logging in as a daily reward and as long as they remain subscribers it has little to no value. And Murkmire is the big thing in this iteration so ESO+ subscribers have little to look forward to as regards a big thing in daily rewards. All ESO+ members get is socks and underwear.

If you asked me why murkmire is a daily reward I couldn't even guess. The content isn't really inclusive to boost a population here or there e.g. IC. To quest you have to remove your CP and sets and craft a basic green set otherwise it is a one way bulldozer. The upside to Murkmire to a non-subscriber is access to Blackrose Prison. And the upside to Blackrose Prison is Spectral Cloak, Razor Shot, Wild Impulse for cyrodill. However a non-subscriber likely wouldn't even be up to snuff to take it on if it is of equal or greater difficulty than a DLC dungeon. So really overall Murkmire to a non-subscriber may very well collect dust. When I unlock it I won't be rushing into murkmire doing this or that. I am both probably over geared and undergeared/under cp at the same time. I don't even do dragonstar arena.

Abigail · November 2018

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't actual ownership of the Summerset DLC a requirement for receiving the free house, horse, and pet during the recent event?

I'll wager that should ZOS do a similarly configured event for Murkmire all those disparaging the Murkmire giveaway will be grateful they received it for free.

Blacknight841 · November 2018

yodased wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Hippie4927 wrote: »

Daily login rewards and ESO+ are entirely separate things. One has nothing to do with the other. Everyone, regardless of + or no +, get exactly the same thing. If a reward has no value to you, it doesn't matter because you didn't pay for it.....it was free.....nothing gained, nothing lost.

But you DO pay for it as a plus member.

Would you feel the same way if the daily login reward was a free month of ESO plus for the next month. However, if you are already an eso plus member you don’t get the free month unless you cancel your eso plus. Would you just keep the membership and pay for the month just because it’s nothing gained.

I would because it's something that I'm already doing and planned on doing for that month. Just because people may get 1/12 of my subscription cost for free does not affect my decision making.

In this example, if you feel cheated somehow, you cancel the account for that month and buy it again afterwards.

Equity does not mean equality, and by giving non eso players a small taste of what ESO+ offers, I very well can benefit in the end. More players coming onto sub after a free month is a very real possibility.

More ESO+ is more revenue for the company, more than likely would contribute to the longevity and popularity of the game, which then gives me more time to do something I enjoy.

The issue here is you feel you are being cheated out of something that you already have and other's will get what you have for free, while you paid for it.

The flaw in that logic, and why this is a circular conversation is because you actually don't have and are not paying for the DLC. You are paying for a service that allows you to pretend like you own the DLC and access its content, this is not the same thing as owning it outright.

All I am saying is that a monthly login reward should be just as beneficial to a paying subscriber as it should be for a non eso plus subscriber, at all times. Not with the contingency that you will benefit if you cancel. That’s why my point of the collectors bundle vs the non collectors bundle is very logical. Both parties recieve the dlc, but if you are a subscriber you get access to the mount and pet while you have your subscription active. Very simple. This means that an eso plus member gets a reward that is not standard on their eso plus membership for supporting the game and logging in during that month, and the non eso plus members get the dlc and have a reason to be an eso plus member. But as it currently stands, with your eso plus membership active, logging in this month has no effect on them. As you say the only time this benefits eso plus members is if they cancel, when it should be something that benefits alll players, without any contingencies.