Daily Login Rewards for ESO+ members VS non subscribers

Blacknight841

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Me thinks the OP is much less aggrieved about the value of his subscription than he is upset that nonsubscribers get free stuff. It's a sad tale of human nature that the 'haves' resent it when the 'have-nots' receive anything. I won't insinuate the OP's political alignment, but I can guess.

It isn't just that. The value of ESO+ is the delta of what you get with ESO+ and what you get without. Players try to forecast the value they will get when they sign up for the ESO+ model, but when the amount of content you gain from it decreases, they see they have to reevaluate their expectations, but are also a bit in a bind due to their past commitment.

The situation is simple, start of the month, eso plus member has access to all the dlc in the game, while a non member does not. At the end of the month the eso plus member still has access to all the dlc, the non eso plus member has a free dlc. Both logged in the same amount. As long as that eso plus member stays an eso plus member, logging in this month has no effect on their current situation. Period.

If they would have given away 5 crown crates instead, both non eso plus members and eso plus members alike would have had 5 extra crown creates at the end of the month.

Blacknight841

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Sure it is not the most important aspect of their revenue, but it is a very important aspect for them observe as it shows the longtime players.

If you really do care about them not giving you a compensation for the free DLC then by all means cancel your subscription. See if that makes a difference. Sorry, but I'm not going to waste my time here any longer.

The funny thing about that is if I cancel my eso plus, then I am rewarded with a free dlc for doing so.

Salvas_Aren

Who cares?

ESO+ also offers no incentive to people who already own the DLCs.

What is free access to DLCs good for if you bought them? It's all about poor management of incentives.

Since I own all DLCs and chapters except for Murksedmire, I see little incentive to sub ESO+. They could take care of this issue, but they don't.

I don't want to offend you or cry about the poor me, but it is what it is: Poor management.

Zorgon_The_Revenged

Blacknight841 wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Sure it is not the most important aspect of their revenue, but it is a very important aspect for them observe as it shows the longtime players.

If you really do care about them not giving you a compensation for the free DLC then by all means cancel your subscription. See if that makes a difference. Sorry, but I'm not going to waste my time here any longer.

The funny thing about that is if I cancel my eso plus, then I am rewarded with a free dlc for doing so.

You might also have an inventory full of crafting mats, 10% less gold gained and be down a months worth of ESO+ crowns. Not to mention a month of no access to daily quests and dungeons in the DLC's. But at least you got that free DLC.....right?

DaveMoeDee

Blacknight841 wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Me thinks the OP is much less aggrieved about the value of his subscription than he is upset that nonsubscribers get free stuff. It's a sad tale of human nature that the 'haves' resent it when the 'have-nots' receive anything. I won't insinuate the OP's political alignment, but I can guess.

It isn't just that. The value of ESO+ is the delta of what you get with ESO+ and what you get without. Players try to forecast the value they will get when they sign up for the ESO+ model, but when the amount of content you gain from it decreases, they see they have to reevaluate their expectations, but are also a bit in a bind due to their past commitment.

The situation is simple, start of the month, eso plus member has access to all the dlc in the game, while a non member does not. At the end of the month the eso plus member still has access to all the dlc, the non eso plus member has a free dlc. Both logged in the same amount. As long as that eso plus member stays an eso plus member, logging in this month has no effect on their current situation. Period.

If they would have given away 5 crown crates instead, both non eso plus members and eso plus members alike would have had 5 extra crown creates at the end of the month.

You are a bit muddled there. Don't say "the non-eso plus member has a free dlc." They both got a free DLC. There is no difference there. Neither owned the DLC before, but they do after the freebie. So both gained something. Both gained ownership of the DLC. So logging in did matter for the sub.

If you want to make a mountain out of a molehill, you talk about temporary access, which is all the sub gets, and which the non-sub will also get for free by gaining ownership and which the sub was getting through sub.

I would be pretty annoyed if they didn't give me Murkmire because I am subbed through November. I would like to still have access while not subbed, which is usually my status most of the year due to the reduction in the amount of new content. annually.

idk

Blacknight841 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

OP is choosing to ignore all the perks of ESO+ and in effect focus on one aspect of what Zos does that happens to not be affected by ESO+. Take those blinders off.

This really borders on entitlement, that is expecting everything Zos does to be boosted by ESO+

This has nothing to with the other perks of eso plus. This is about the daily logins.

Clearly you need to read what you quoted again as I clearly state that is understood. This is a clear case of entitlement and it is sad.

Blacknight841 wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Sure it is not the most important aspect of their revenue, but it is a very important aspect for them observe as it shows the longtime players.

If you really do care about them not giving you a compensation for the free DLC then by all means cancel your subscription. See if that makes a difference. Sorry, but I'm not going to waste my time here any longer.

The funny thing about that is if I cancel my eso plus, then I am rewarded with a free dlc for doing so.

Then when you say this it becomes clear once again that you are ignoring the big picture, as I stated. Sad.

Blacknight841

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

Who cares?

ESO+ also offers no incentive to people who already own the DLCs.

What is free access to DLCs good for if you bought them? It's all about poor management of incentives.

Since I own all DLCs and chapters except for Murksedmire, I see little incentive to sub ESO+. They could take care of this issue, but they don't.

I don't want to offend you or cry about the poor me, but it is what it is: Poor management.

Agreed, what is free access

idk wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

OP is choosing to ignore all the perks of ESO+ and in effect focus on one aspect of what Zos does that happens to not be affected by ESO+. Take those blinders off.

This really borders on entitlement, that is expecting everything Zos does to be boosted by ESO+

This has nothing to with the other perks of eso plus. This is about the daily logins.

Clearly you need to read what you quoted again as I clearly state that is understood. This is a clear case of entitlement and it is sad.

Blacknight841 wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Sure it is not the most important aspect of their revenue, but it is a very important aspect for them observe as it shows the longtime players.

If you really do care about them not giving you a compensation for the free DLC then by all means cancel your subscription. See if that makes a difference. Sorry, but I'm not going to waste my time here any longer.

The funny thing about that is if I cancel my eso plus, then I am rewarded with a free dlc for doing so.

Then when you say this it becomes clear once again that you are ignoring the big picture, as I stated. Sad.

No, This is a clear case of rewarding non eso plus members with something that they can use, and rewarding eso plus members with something they cannot use as long as they have eso plus. Simple as that. All for the sake of getting more non-daily players to log in more often at the cost of sidelining the already subscribed members that will probably log in regardless of the reward this month. If you cannot understand that, then you missed the entire forum post. It is a once sided monthly reward, and that is that. I guarantee the forums would be in an uproar if next months login rewards was an eso plus exclusive reward, that non subscribers could get as soon as they subscribed. You May call it whatever you want, but if you don’t ever cancel your eso plus, you logged on this month for nothing. The other perks of eso plus members have nothing to do with the rewards for logging in this month. I made no statement about the lack of value in eso plus as an item in general. Plus this doesn and will continue to take away from the value of eso plus, if they continue to give away dlc as monthly rewards and subscribers just get months of logging in with nothing they can use until they cancel.

Sylvermynx

Sheesh. I log in every day anyway. *shrug* Subbing for six months makes it pretty cheap entertainment, and I think I get bunches of good out of ESO+.

kargen27

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Is there even a point for ESO plus members to log in and give ZOS the extra login counts all month long? They get nothing of value for supporting the game. For being the dedicated paying members that support this game, the reward is something useless to us. It’s like getting a free ticket to a football game when you already have a season pass, except you can’t even even give it away to a friend.

... Or is this a ploy to drive ESO plus members into getting the dlc by claiming rewards so that they can unsub from ESO plus?

If you log into the game every day you get to play the game every day. If that isn't enough maybe you are playing the wrong game.

linlilia

Not sure if you know this, but I know lots of ESO+ members that use their crowns to BUY the DLC's. Because the want to own them, because sometimes you cant pay when the sub is due or you go on an extended vacation from the game and when you come back you like having the DLCs to play to decide if you want to subscribe again.

As a plus member I am glad to get the DLC this month, it means I only need 1 to finish owning them all. So just think about the fact that SOME ESO+ members like to buy the DLCs.

Blacknight841

linlilia wrote: »

Not sure if you know this, but I know lots of ESO+ members that use their crowns to BUY the DLC's. Because the want to own them, because sometimes you cant pay when the sub is due or you go on an extended vacation from the game and when you come back you like having the DLCs to play to decide if you want to subscribe again.

As a plus member I am glad to get the DLC this month, it means I only need 1 to finish owning them all. So just think about the fact that SOME ESO+ members like to buy the DLCs.

I understand that, but not every eso plus member buys every dlc that comes out with their crowns. I would actually guess that the vast majority of them do not buy every dlc Pack that comes out. However that doesn’t change the fact that if the monthly login reward was a single lockpick, it would be more equally useful to all players as opposed to a dlc that not every eso plus member needs or wants to own.

Acrolas

The sad thing is, people are just going to be outraged by some other trivial matter by the time December 1 rolls around.

sno_flah_ke

That hpuse there is nifty... i want that house for free more than i want the dlc

jlb1705

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Access is value.

There is no value to owing a specific song if you have subscription service that provides you with all the songs in the database.
There is no value to owing a digital book if you have access to an entire digital library. There is not value in owning a movie if it is already on a subscription service you watch.

You are paying for all those subscription services in full. You do not get a prorated amount for the item you already own.

Ten years ago I owned a lot of movies. I also subscribed to Netflix, which had almost almost all of those movies available to stream. I got rid of a lot of the movies because it made seemingly little sense to keep the discs around when I had access to watch those movies through the service I was subscribing to. Before long, my subscription to Netflix cost 50% more and fewer than 10% of the movies I cared about were still available to watch, and I had relinquished ownership of the discs I used to have.

There is absolutely a difference in value between access and ownership, and it lies in who gets to make the decision about whether your access to that content continues. When you own a copy of a piece of content, YOU are always the person who makes that decision. When you subscribe for access, sometimes you decide, or sometimes it is decided for you.

Jayman1000

... VS Steam users that can't login a whole day

Acrolas

You're renting content regardless of whether you use ESO+ or purchase with crowns. You don't own any of the content. There are merely different leases for access.

Every movie, video game, and song album you ever purchased was an access lease. You only owned the physical media that the content was printed onto, and your access requires keeping that physical media in your possession and in good working order. Being authorized to buy/sell/trade a piece of physical media is in no way akin to actual ownership of that content. I don't know why the Copyright Act is such a foreign concept to so many people. But sometimes I wonder if those fundamental misunderstandings are the reasons why fandoms have boundary issues and why piracy will remain a persistent issue.

As a copyrighted work, ZOS can give complimentary access to Murkmire and any other DLC however they want and entirely on their terms. No compensation required if you already have access. It's merely redundant access so you keep the access you already have.

wenchmore420b14_ESO

Blacknight841 wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Sure it is not the most important aspect of their revenue, but it is a very important aspect for them observe as it shows the longtime players.

If you really do care about them not giving you a compensation for the free DLC then by all means cancel your subscription. See if that makes a difference. Sorry, but I'm not going to waste my time here any longer.

The funny thing about that is if I cancel my eso plus, then I am rewarded with a free dlc for doing so.

But if you do that, you will miss at the end of this month this....

MEMBERSHIP’S NEW BENEFITS
Starting on November 13, ESO Plus will include the following additional rewards for all platforms:

Even More Crowns

As an ESO Plus member, you will receive an additional 150 Crowns as part of your monthly stipend, bringing your total to 1650 per month. Note that if you are partly though a 3- or 6-month membership, you will be credited your bonus crowns by the end of November.

Exclusive Free Items

With this update, ESO Plus members will be able to acquire free collectibles from the in-game Crown Store. The free items will only be available to ESO Plus members and will be indicated in gold text labeled “Free” next to the Chalice icon. Free items will be added to the Crown Store only on rare occasions and for a very limited time.

One of the free ESO Plus member-exclusive items includes a unique collectible: the Priestess of Mara costume. Note that the new costume will not be available immediately, but will arrive in the Crown Store later in the year.

xclusive Crown Store Deals

With ESO Plus membership-exclusive deals, you’ll be able to acquire select Crown Store items at a special, discounted price. The discounted items will be in the Crown Store with gold text and a Chalice icon. The items available at a membership-exclusive discount can change often (and some might only be available as part of a limited-time offer), so be sure to check the Crown Store on occasion to see what is available.

Exclusive Crown Store Items

In additional to unique deals, ESO Plus members will also gain access to exclusive Crown Store items. These exclusive items may be available for sale for Crowns or even free (as mentioned above). These items can include collectibles such as costumes, pets, mounts, and more, and will be identified by the gold text and Chalice icon. Like the exclusive deals, these items can change often, so be sure to keep an eye out.

To help you keep track of what deals are currently available when new benefits arrive, you’ll be able to visit a new ESO Plus tab within the Crown Store UI. From there, you will be able to check your current benefits and review what Crown Store items are available on sale or exclusively to members. Note that it will not be possible to Gift an item acquired for free, purchased at a discount, or purchased exclusively due to your ESO Plus membership. However, you can still purchase items as Gifts at full price.

So at the end of Nov ESO+ stills gets LOTS that non Plus gets. Still don't see your point. It's just a DLC tat I would of bought anyway, now I get it for free and can use those crowns on something cool that "Available with ESO+ only".

Blacknight841

jlb1705 wrote: »

Blacknight841 wrote: »

Access is value.

There is no value to owing a specific song if you have subscription service that provides you with all the songs in the database.
There is no value to owing a digital book if you have access to an entire digital library. There is not value in owning a movie if it is already on a subscription service you watch.

You are paying for all those subscription services in full. You do not get a prorated amount for the item you already own.

Ten years ago I owned a lot of movies. I also subscribed to Netflix, which had almost almost all of those movies available to stream. I got rid of a lot of the movies because it made seemingly little sense to keep the discs around when I had access to watch those movies through the service I was subscribing to. Before long, my subscription to Netflix cost 50% more and fewer than 10% of the movies I cared about were still available to watch, and I had relinquished ownership of the discs I used to have.

There is absolutely a difference in value between access and ownership, and it lies in who gets to make the decision about whether your access to that content continues. When you own a copy of a piece of content, YOU are always the person who makes that decision. When you subscribe for access, sometimes you decide, or sometimes it is decided for you.

Even if you buy it, you don't own it, you bought permanent access to it. It is digital content and they can technically strip it from the game if they wish, or block off content as they wish, and when the servers go down, you will not have access to it. As far as netflix is concerned as a comparison, they change their library around regularly and that is part of the subscription you signed up for, ESO plus doesn't rotate random DLC that you have access to per month. Also zos could technically raise the cost of eso plus at any time, same way netflix did.

Taleof2Cities

I do agree with the OP on one thing:

They're still allowed to have their opinion even if most of the posts in the thread (including mine) disagree with it ...