Werewolf Theorycrafting (PvP)

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

Exodium wrote: »

Chrlynsch wrote: »

Exodium wrote: »

Would you guys say automaton or Hulking (when paired with heavy shackle) for an Orc Stam sorc? I'm kind of leaning towards hulking cause of the max stam % bonuses from being werewolf and orc...But yeah what you guys reckon?

Hulking is slightly worse than auto in terms of damage output. But will give you more resources to work with and more healing from stam abilites in human form.

Yeah I tried out Hulking with Shackle in BGs and loved it. My damage was really really nice and I don't think I'd trade it for automaton.

But now I have 2 other concerns

1) I'm currently using dual wield on werewolf bar but do you guys think snb is better? I do feel a little squishy sometimes and I don't really understand why considering I have like 26k resistances...Would snb be better? Would I lose too much damage from not having dual wield and therefore have crappy pressure?

2) I'm a bit meh about Troll King. Even with Tri pots + being orc I don't feel like its saving me in most situations where Im under pressure. I feel like the heal from Hiricine's rage comes in more clutch than troll king...What other monster sets could I experiment with?? I was tossing up between another resistance based set, or maybe even engine guardian. Has anyone used that? Either of the Engine Guardian procs could benefit a WW a lot cause all resource pools are important for them.

Are you on console @Exodium?? If yes your resistances are bugged, it shows 26k but you really only have 16k.(savage strength bugged) I've been complaining about it for 2. 5 months, aperrently ZOS doesn't want to fix it for us, PC got their fix almost 1month ago, but hey I guess console players don't matter... And again another week no ww fix for console surprise surprise...
Other sets I can recommend are= Mighty Chudan, earth gore, zaan is also very hilarious in duels, engine guardian nice but unreliable,

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

Exodium wrote: »

Feannag wrote: »

For monster sets, i have been experimenting with 1 piece pirate and 1 piece warden to give me a static boost to resistance. Not glamorous, but it gives a bit more survivability.

And do you use 1h+shield or dual wield? Which one's better in your opinion?

I was looking at the 1h/shield passives and the 5% flat weapon damage increase actually looks appealing, compared to the dual wield one that increases wep damage by a % of the off-hand weapon.

Also I can tri-stat a shield giving me marginally more damage and healing right? So I'm thinking of ditching dual wield, even if it gives a little bit more damage.

Dual wield I way better 2 enchants more wd (weapon passives don't work in ww Form)

Qbiken · October 2018

Exodium wrote: »

Feannag wrote: »

For monster sets, i have been experimenting with 1 piece pirate and 1 piece warden to give me a static boost to resistance. Not glamorous, but it gives a bit more survivability.

And do you use 1h+shield or dual wield? Which one's better in your opinion?

I was looking at the 1h/shield passives and the 5% flat weapon damage increase actually looks appealing, compared to the dual wield one that increases wep damage by a % of the off-hand weapon.

Also I can tri-stat a shield giving me marginally more damage and healing right? So I'm thinking of ditching dual wield, even if it gives a little bit more damage.

The passives doesn´t carry over in Werewolf form. The trade-off you make by running 1h&S compared to dual-wield is that you trade damage for a bit more survivability (more resistance basically)

In terms of damage dual-wield will be vastly superior in Murkmire. I would highly recommend running 2x infused dual-wield on your werewolf bar. Your bleed and DoT-effect from Infectious Claws (with morphs) can now proc your enchants in addition to your direct damage components (mainly light attacks). Unless ZOS makes any bigger changes to the infused trait I´m crafting myself a set of Torug´s Pact when patch is released.

Feannag wrote: »

For monster sets, i have been experimenting with 1 piece pirate and 1 piece warden to give me a static boost to resistance. Not glamorous, but it gives a bit more survivability.

I´ve used this a lot and is by far my favourite combo when it comes to monster helmets.

Exodium · October 2018

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

Exodium wrote: »

Chrlynsch wrote: »

Exodium wrote: »

Would you guys say automaton or Hulking (when paired with heavy shackle) for an Orc Stam sorc? I'm kind of leaning towards hulking cause of the max stam % bonuses from being werewolf and orc...But yeah what you guys reckon?

Hulking is slightly worse than auto in terms of damage output. But will give you more resources to work with and more healing from stam abilites in human form.

Yeah I tried out Hulking with Shackle in BGs and loved it. My damage was really really nice and I don't think I'd trade it for automaton.

But now I have 2 other concerns

1) I'm currently using dual wield on werewolf bar but do you guys think snb is better? I do feel a little squishy sometimes and I don't really understand why considering I have like 26k resistances...Would snb be better? Would I lose too much damage from not having dual wield and therefore have crappy pressure?

2) I'm a bit meh about Troll King. Even with Tri pots + being orc I don't feel like its saving me in most situations where Im under pressure. I feel like the heal from Hiricine's rage comes in more clutch than troll king...What other monster sets could I experiment with?? I was tossing up between another resistance based set, or maybe even engine guardian. Has anyone used that? Either of the Engine Guardian procs could benefit a WW a lot cause all resource pools are important for them.

Are you on console @Exodium?? If yes your resistances are bugged, it shows 26k but you really only have 16k.(savage strength bugged) I've been complaining about it for 2. 5 months, aperrently ZOS doesn't want to fix it for us, PC got their fix almost 1month ago, but hey I guess console players don't matter... And again another week no ww fix for console surprise surprise...
Other sets I can recommend are= Mighty Chudan, earth gore, zaan is also very hilarious in duels, engine guardian nice but unreliable,

Ok that makes a lot of sense cause yes I am on console and was getting hit way harder than I figured I would, compared to when I'm not in WW form.

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

@Qbiken yeah I was thinking 2x infused aswell but I'm going with Fasallas guile as a group utility set, in human groups I usually am the "defiler" and its handy vs the massive amounts of healers & tanks we've having here. What glyphs do you think? I was thinking of using poison & oblivion damage since Ive already got major and minor defile...
As a secondary set I'm playing around with bone pirate but I think I'll stay with salvation

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

Or maby poison+stamina drain(since it does physical damage and proccs my implosion)

Qbiken · October 2018

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

@Qbiken yeah I was thinking 2x infused aswell but I'm going with Fasallas guile as a group utility set, in human groups I usually am the "defiler" and its handy vs the massive amounts of healers & tanks we've having here. What glyphs do you think? I was thinking of using poison & oblivion damage since Ive already got major and minor defile...
As a secondary set I'm playing around with bone pirate but I think I'll stay with salvation

In terms of what enchants to use it´s really up to personal preferences, and if you can have weapons with different enchants available for different occasions that would be optimal.

Berserker, weakening, absorb stamina, oblivion, disease, poison, prismatic (I use this mainly for IC) are the ones I play around with at the moment.

Exodium · October 2018

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

Or maby poison+stamina drain(since it does physical damage and proccs my implosion)

Don't the stamina drain glyphs do magic damage? Or am I thinking of different ones?

Qbiken · October 2018

Exodium wrote: »

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

Or maby poison+stamina drain(since it does physical damage and proccs my implosion)

Don't the stamina drain glyphs do magic damage? Or am I thinking of different ones?

It will deal physical damage in Murkmire

Exodium · October 2018

And what do you guys think about malubeth or blood spawn for a werewolf? I know there's better resistance set combinations but the124 stam recovery with bloodspawn looks appealing in no-cp.

And then malubeth looks good too. 30% increased healing on hiricine could make for same fat heals.

But yeah feel free to challenge me I'm pretty new to werewolf so best to get people with experience's view on the items and stuff.

Aznox · October 2018

Malubeth works but there are better health sustain options (like Troll King) and better burst protection options (like Chudan), imho.

Blood Spawn bonus would be wasted while transformed, but it would work for a medium armor StamDK using Werewolf as a burst tool.

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

Bloodspawn=useless in ww Form the extra stamina Regen you can get of other sets actually benefiting you like (swarm mother for example)
Malubeth is nice problem is the limited range and people breaking the beam faster then you can say "Fix Savage Strength already Zenimax"
Its nice but, you'll have to play pretty aggressive and time your heals. Not for inexperienced wws imo

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

Aznox wrote: »

Malubeth works but there are better health sustain options (like Troll King) and better burst protection options (like Chudan), imho.

Blood Spawn bonus would be wasted while transformed, but it would work for a medium armor StamDK using Werewolf as a burst tool.

@Aznox and even then if prefer Balrogh if I'd only use it as a burst tool

Exodium · October 2018

Aznox wrote: »

Malubeth works but there are better health sustain options (like Troll King) and better burst protection options (like Chudan), imho.

Blood Spawn bonus would be wasted while transformed, but it would work for a medium armor StamDK using Werewolf as a burst tool.

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

Bloodspawn=useless in ww Form the extra stamina Regen you can get of other sets actually benefiting you like (swarm mother for example)
Malubeth is nice problem is the limited range and people breaking the beam faster then you can say "Fix Savage Strength already Zenimax"
Its nice but, you'll have to play pretty aggressive and time your heals. Not for inexperienced wws imo

Wait so I don't get the 6k resistance from bloodspawn in werewolf form?

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

Yes you do but it has a pretty low proc chance, and if yo manage to keep it up all the time unless your running with a healbot behind you your dead anyway... Ww isn't very good at taking high amounts of constant damage we have a decent burst heal but our hoTs suck bigtime

Exodium · October 2018

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

Yes you do but it has a pretty low proc chance, and if yo manage to keep it up all the time unless your running with a healbot behind you your dead anyway... Ww isn't very good at taking high amounts of constant damage we have a decent burst heal but our hoTs suck bigtime

OK you know what I'm sticking to troll king then haha probably best option. I just felt it was a bit lacklustre compared to when I use it on my open world non-ww build but I don't know need to give it more time.

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

My advice=don't use ww in pvp u till its fixed with the resistance bug your basically a ap piniatta... Once it's fixed(in 2 weeks I doubt they will fix it before like on PC) play it again and fiddle around. After I realize that the resistance was broken and I calculated tat I would have to wear 3tank sets to achieve the previous survivability I gave up on ww till its fixed

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

When I'm soo I prefer trollking when I'm running with a small group with loads of Stam characters I prefer mighty chudan for burst protection tbh

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

@Qbiken Bone pirate vs salvation as a secondary set on stamsorc what would be your pick? I'm uncertain at this point an I can't test it myself. Damage wise sustain wise I never have any problems

Aznox · October 2018

Exodium wrote: »

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

Yes you do but it has a pretty low proc chance, and if yo manage to keep it up all the time unless your running with a healbot behind you your dead anyway... Ww isn't very good at taking high amounts of constant damage we have a decent burst heal but our hoTs suck bigtime

OK you know what I'm sticking to troll king then haha probably best option. I just felt it was a bit lacklustre compared to when I use it on my open world non-ww build but I don't know need to give it more time.

The general rule is that if you are unleashing werewolf's fury on someone 1v1, they will have a very hard time to overcome Troll King's sustained healing.

However if two or more players of similar skill are focusing you with any kind of burst, the fight will be too quick (often <5 sec in BG) for Troll King to shine. Goal is to avoid this situation but if you can't (against a BG premade) you are better with e-HP (Chudan) or more damage (Selene, Zaan, etc...)

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

@Qbiken Bone pirate vs salvation as a secondary set on stamsorc what would be your pick? I'm uncertain at this point an I can't test it myself. Damage wise sustain wise I never have any problems

Bump

Qbiken · October 2018

If we could have ultimate regen in WW-form then I would definitely use Bloodspawn on my werewolf. But here´s the thing:

* If you´re after resistance you´re better of running something like 1-piece Chudan + 1 Piece Lord Warden. Your peak resistance will be lower compared to Bloodspawn, but your average resistance will be significantly higher with the other option. I can´t deny that the feature of looking like a werewolf statue is a big +

And if you feel you lack stamina regen, running an absorb stamina enchant on an infused weapon in Murkmire will give you a lot of sustain (it will basically proc on cooldown as long as you´ve your bleed on an enemy).

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

@Qbiken Bone pirate vs salvation as a secondary set on stamsorc what would be your pick? I'm uncertain at this point an I can't test it myself. Damage wise sustain wise I never have any problems

I really dislike Salvation. Looks good on paper and it says "werewolf" in the description but that´s about it. Sure if you are after to transform more often and don´t plan to stay in WW-form for longer durations it´s a decent set. But my view on the set is that I´ve little to no use of the 5 piece bonus once I´ve transformed. For me it´s more important to use gear that I´ve good use of 100% of the time (or close to 100% of the time) since I have more of a "permawolf" approach.

Exodium · October 2018

Qbiken wrote: »

If we could have ultimate regen in WW-form then I would definitely use Bloodspawn on my werewolf. But here´s the thing:

* If you´re after resistance you´re better of running something like 1-piece Chudan + 1 Piece Lord Warden. Your peak resistance will be lower compared to Bloodspawn, but your average resistance will be significantly higher with the other option. I can´t deny that the feature of looking like a werewolf statue is a big +

And if you feel you lack stamina regen, running an absorb stamina enchant on an infused weapon in Murkmire will give you a lot of sustain (it will basically proc on cooldown as long as you´ve your bleed on an enemy).

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

@Qbiken Bone pirate vs salvation as a secondary set on stamsorc what would be your pick? I'm uncertain at this point an I can't test it myself. Damage wise sustain wise I never have any problems

I really dislike Salvation. Looks good on paper and it says "werewolf" in the description but that´s about it. Sure if you are after to transform more often and don´t plan to stay in WW-form for longer durations it´s a decent set. But my view on the set is that I´ve little to no use of the 5 piece bonus once I´ve transformed. For me it´s more important to use gear that I´ve good use of 100% of the time (or close to 100% of the time) since I have more of a "permawolf" approach.

Thanks dude you've raised a lot of really good points especially with the double infused stamina absorb thing. Will definitely try that out with murkmire. I guess it's just hoping the werewolf resistance thing gets fixed now I think thats why Im feeling squishy and therefore underrating troll-king

IlCanis_LupuslI · October 2018

Qbiken wrote: »

If we could have ultimate regen in WW-form then I would definitely use Bloodspawn on my werewolf. But here´s the thing:

* If you´re after resistance you´re better of running something like 1-piece Chudan + 1 Piece Lord Warden. Your peak resistance will be lower compared to Bloodspawn, but your average resistance will be significantly higher with the other option. I can´t deny that the feature of looking like a werewolf statue is a big +

And if you feel you lack stamina regen, running an absorb stamina enchant on an infused weapon in Murkmire will give you a lot of sustain (it will basically proc on cooldown as long as you´ve your bleed on an enemy).

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

@Qbiken Bone pirate vs salvation as a secondary set on stamsorc what would be your pick? I'm uncertain at this point an I can't test it myself. Damage wise sustain wise I never have any problems

I really dislike Salvation. Looks good on paper and it says "werewolf" in the description but that´s about it. Sure if you are after to transform more often and don´t plan to stay in WW-form for longer durations it´s a decent set. But my view on the set is that I´ve little to no use of the 5 piece bonus once I´ve transformed. For me it´s more important to use gear that I´ve good use of 100% of the time (or close to 100% of the time) since I have more of a "permawolf" approach.

Fair point I actually really liked it but I'm more and more tending towards bone pirate expecially since as I changed from nb main to stamsorc main I have a ulti reduction passive anyway. I was testing it for a short while before they messed up ww and I came to realize that I don't really need it on stamsorc (on nb another story) since I had such fond memories on it previously I wanted to ask thou what other wws think

Wuuffyy · October 2018

Qbiken wrote: »

If we could have ultimate regen in WW-form then I would definitely use Bloodspawn on my werewolf. But here´s the thing:

* If you´re after resistance you´re better of running something like 1-piece Chudan + 1 Piece Lord Warden. Your peak resistance will be lower compared to Bloodspawn, but your average resistance will be significantly higher with the other option. I can´t deny that the feature of looking like a werewolf statue is a big +

And if you feel you lack stamina regen, running an absorb stamina enchant on an infused weapon in Murkmire will give you a lot of sustain (it will basically proc on cooldown as long as you´ve your bleed on an enemy).

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

@Qbiken Bone pirate vs salvation as a secondary set on stamsorc what would be your pick? I'm uncertain at this point an I can't test it myself. Damage wise sustain wise I never have any problems

I really dislike Salvation. Looks good on paper and it says "werewolf" in the description but that´s about it. Sure if you are after to transform more often and don´t plan to stay in WW-form for longer durations it´s a decent set. But my view on the set is that I´ve little to no use of the 5 piece bonus once I´ve transformed. For me it´s more important to use gear that I´ve good use of 100% of the time (or close to 100% of the time) since I have more of a "permawolf" approach.

Uh... I can tell you that you've been caught up in the bleeds op BS that the forum warriors are on about. Ww dots WILL NOT proc weapon enchants. Only weapon abilities (& their dots apparently), & lights & heavies. Check the patch notes.

Chrlynsch · October 2018

Wolf_Watching wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

If we could have ultimate regen in WW-form then I would definitely use Bloodspawn on my werewolf. But here´s the thing:

* If you´re after resistance you´re better of running something like 1-piece Chudan + 1 Piece Lord Warden. Your peak resistance will be lower compared to Bloodspawn, but your average resistance will be significantly higher with the other option. I can´t deny that the feature of looking like a werewolf statue is a big +

And if you feel you lack stamina regen, running an absorb stamina enchant on an infused weapon in Murkmire will give you a lot of sustain (it will basically proc on cooldown as long as you´ve your bleed on an enemy).

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

@Qbiken Bone pirate vs salvation as a secondary set on stamsorc what would be your pick? I'm uncertain at this point an I can't test it myself. Damage wise sustain wise I never have any problems

I really dislike Salvation. Looks good on paper and it says "werewolf" in the description but that´s about it. Sure if you are after to transform more often and don´t plan to stay in WW-form for longer durations it´s a decent set. But my view on the set is that I´ve little to no use of the 5 piece bonus once I´ve transformed. For me it´s more important to use gear that I´ve good use of 100% of the time (or close to 100% of the time) since I have more of a "permawolf" approach.

Uh... I can tell you that you've been caught up in the bleeds op BS that the forum warriors are on about. Ww dots WILL NOT proc weapon enchants. Only weapon abilities (& their dots apparently), & lights & heavies. Check the patch notes.

Check the game...

ScardyFox · October 2018

Check yourself... before you wreck yourself.

Aznox · October 2018

I wasn't expecting it but we must have a wolf bro in the dev team that categorized our bleed as weapon ability ...

Qbiken · October 2018

Wolf_Watching wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

If we could have ultimate regen in WW-form then I would definitely use Bloodspawn on my werewolf. But here´s the thing:

* If you´re after resistance you´re better of running something like 1-piece Chudan + 1 Piece Lord Warden. Your peak resistance will be lower compared to Bloodspawn, but your average resistance will be significantly higher with the other option. I can´t deny that the feature of looking like a werewolf statue is a big +

And if you feel you lack stamina regen, running an absorb stamina enchant on an infused weapon in Murkmire will give you a lot of sustain (it will basically proc on cooldown as long as you´ve your bleed on an enemy).

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

@Qbiken Bone pirate vs salvation as a secondary set on stamsorc what would be your pick? I'm uncertain at this point an I can't test it myself. Damage wise sustain wise I never have any problems

I really dislike Salvation. Looks good on paper and it says "werewolf" in the description but that´s about it. Sure if you are after to transform more often and don´t plan to stay in WW-form for longer durations it´s a decent set. But my view on the set is that I´ve little to no use of the 5 piece bonus once I´ve transformed. For me it´s more important to use gear that I´ve good use of 100% of the time (or close to 100% of the time) since I have more of a "permawolf" approach.

Uh... I can tell you that you've been caught up in the bleeds op BS that the forum warriors are on about. Ww dots WILL NOT proc weapon enchants. Only weapon abilities (& their dots apparently), & lights & heavies. Check the patch notes.

I tested it like 3 hours ago. The bleeds proc both enchants while using dual-wield in WW form. Can provide screenshot of it if you like.

Aznox · October 2018

Qbiken wrote: »

Wolf_Watching wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

If we could have ultimate regen in WW-form then I would definitely use Bloodspawn on my werewolf. But here´s the thing:

* If you´re after resistance you´re better of running something like 1-piece Chudan + 1 Piece Lord Warden. Your peak resistance will be lower compared to Bloodspawn, but your average resistance will be significantly higher with the other option. I can´t deny that the feature of looking like a werewolf statue is a big +

And if you feel you lack stamina regen, running an absorb stamina enchant on an infused weapon in Murkmire will give you a lot of sustain (it will basically proc on cooldown as long as you´ve your bleed on an enemy).

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

@Qbiken Bone pirate vs salvation as a secondary set on stamsorc what would be your pick? I'm uncertain at this point an I can't test it myself. Damage wise sustain wise I never have any problems

I really dislike Salvation. Looks good on paper and it says "werewolf" in the description but that´s about it. Sure if you are after to transform more often and don´t plan to stay in WW-form for longer durations it´s a decent set. But my view on the set is that I´ve little to no use of the 5 piece bonus once I´ve transformed. For me it´s more important to use gear that I´ve good use of 100% of the time (or close to 100% of the time) since I have more of a "permawolf" approach.

Uh... I can tell you that you've been caught up in the bleeds op BS that the forum warriors are on about. Ww dots WILL NOT proc weapon enchants. Only weapon abilities (& their dots apparently), & lights & heavies. Check the patch notes.

I tested it like 3 hours ago. The bleeds proc both enchants while using dual-wield in WW form. Can provide screenshot of it if you like.

can confirm.