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Shield Nerfs Are For Real This Time
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templesus✭✭✭✭✭
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I'm guessing its the same downside as the stam user wearing a SnB with hulking + bone pirate spamming absorb magic and rolling when they see a mag char until they get their ult up and explode on them. Bonus points if they are a DK, NB, or Warden, enjoying that HP% heal not touching their stam pool and because eventually they will win that encounter and if they don't it's definitely a player issue.
Also bonus bonus points if they are a stam templar with that setup and 30K+power of the light that strips damage shields instantly and sometimes insta-kills when you get DB + light on you. Omega points if they got bleeds with that and spam defile. No magic user will survive a templar like that unless they can roll or purge. Guess how many magic users can do that in Cyro without sacrificing a LOT of damage or heals and wear light armor? HINT: NONE
Lol absorb magicka? There are mag sorc skills that don't affect that - fury isnt, curse isnt. Also, that skill only reflects the next projectile cast at you, so you think a Stam character is going to just spam a 2.5k cost skill to reflect one projectile? The fact that most magplars and magdks aren't projectile based also means that barely any stamina characters run that skill. So your argument is invalid.
30k power of the light wtf lol are we still in HOTR or something? Stamplar is arguably one of the worst open world classes too so I'm not sure why you're bringing that up to help your case out."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
Honestly, I find playing medium armor builds easier. Esp. the ones with %HP heals. Also, no one forces you to use hulking and bone pirate, you want to and you pay the price for it. Just like if I wear 2x damage set on a light armor build and die in one db + executioner. It's called trade-offs and guess what? The trade-off for being in light is really getting hard to justify in PvP vs heavy in nearly every case.
Wrong, because I see light armour builds running with shackle + necropotence or necro + lich (no defensive sets whatsoever), with 50K max magicka and 2k+ recovery, and 20K+ shields due to their high max magicka pool. Let me know what the downside of the aforementioned setup is please. Also, I do have to run fortified brass/impreg on my stamina toons but that comes at the expense of a set that could give me better resources/damage."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
i think stams had there incompetence covered up by high resist, rolldodge and enough stam to cc break and block for 4 yrs looooool how bout you play in light on a mag toon without shields and then come talk to me about survivability cuz stams going pretty god damn good
Really? Do you think resistance means anything when bleeds are becoming so prevalent which go through resistance. Also unmitigateable cc's like rune cage/fossilise can stop you mid dodge-roll, subjecting the player to enough bursts to kill them.
And heavy armour stamina builds have to rely on higher health recovery, but guess what, defile significantly reduces health recovery and we've been in a defile meta for about 6 months now which I've said before.
ooh gee the stam got caught rolldodging i hope he has enough to break free instead of just sitting there getting hit. I hope his 40k stam will be enough
seriously if and stam is getting stun from cc's they suck. theres no excuse to not be able to break free from even fossilizes if stam is your main stat
thats as laughable as a mag complaining about using to much mag and not being able to spam a shield / heal
and guess what, defile meta is dead, stop complaining about it and again, there is heavy if they can tank out long enough to heal there doing something wrong
Erm, no I'm saying that your argument that roll is an amazing form of defence is nullified when you have CC's that go through dodge roll, leaving medium stamina character vulnerable in these situations. Stamina suffers more skills that they can't interact with than magicka.
Shieldbreaker might be your only argument for uninteractable sets/abilites but even then, which players with any dignity run shield breaker?
[1] Absorb magic doesn't reflect a projectile. In its current state it absorbs nearly every magic skill in the game, including soul assault, templar ray and even most elemental/magic proc sets including illambris, grothdarr, bahraha's curse, etc. and any light attack/heavy from any staff It basically shuts down any magic user. The best part is that absorb magic also heals you %HP in addition to negating damage from almost any magic/elemental skill/item set/passive in the game! Who cares if fury and curse are not absorbed when every other skill is and it heals your opponent? Anyone defending this skill in its form on live obviously has no clue how it works or has never been a magic user facing it. The alternative is that they are one of those "unkillable tanks" spamming it. Also don't forget their are other magic classes in the game other than sorc. You can really have a good laugh spamming absorb magic vs. a mag NB.
[2] "30K PotL wtf" really? Is that the best you can do?
[3] "One of the worse open world classes," yet still far superior to magplar, mag warden, superior to a mag NB if you have absorb magic slotted and don't mind wailing like an idiot to uncloak them (but if you have ritual of retribution this isn't hard, trust me I know because I do have 4 templars after all), and also superior to sorc if you wear SnB and, again, simply do exactly what I said in my previous post. I'm not talking air, I've done exactly what I've posted. How else do you think I know this?
Hold up, did you just say stamplar is a superior open world class to mag sorc?
You have to be joking right? Have you even played a stamplar before?5 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
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Aw, you poor presumptuous person... believing that not giving a crap about the meta or min maxing equates to beign naive.
Yes because not wanting your class to be turned into a pile of steaming crap is giving a crap about the meta and min maxing lol
That has never happened in the history of this game and there is little cause to suspect it will. Never have any changes been made that render a class unplayable, or a ‘steaming pile of crap’ ... unless one’s perspective revolves around meta and min maxing or being a competitive power gamer. That’s the only crowd that operates at the level where the changes are really noticeable. For the rest of us? Business as usual. Balance changes impact non-competitive, non meta chasing players very little, and this will be no different. The developers are not going to gut a class to the point is a ‘steaming pile of crap’ to this majority of the playerbase.
Yes, no class has ever been made unable to quest or do a normal trial.
However, even "base level raider" players like me, are affected by this.
I don't play for scores, I don't compete for world first kills, I don't play for "all hard mode trials completed". Yet, even at the "soft core" level of guilds able to complete vMOL / vCR (nothing special, really) you feel it.
If I am an established guild member, they won't really do me anything but tease (lol you are really attached to your sorcs).
But when I apply to new guilds, even at such mediocre trials level, they SHALL refuse the application as DPS magsorc.
This is actually getting worse, because in order to survive in vCR portals and kill crystals fast, NBs are IDEAL, while sorcs cannot apply immediate, solid damage. In order to "satisfy" vCR high trial leader standards, we have to resort to tricks like holding the ultimate and only use it on crystals, which means the whole team suffers a tangible loss.
"Tangible loss", "average DPS" and "happy to accept your application to our guild" don't fit in the same sentence.
And I repeat, this does NOT happen at top end level guilds, it's plenty tangible at average trial guilds.Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
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pattyLtd✭✭✭✭✭So we can now conclude that morrowind changes were a COMPLETE failure.
Having to make another “broad sustain changes” announcement so shortly after should be embarassing.
We all make mistakes.
I honestly hope they wont butcher shields completely because I honestly have no idea how to adept to such a change.
History tells me to brace for impact because its going to hurt.
I still miss my sorc of pre horrorwind not because i felt OP bit because i loved the playstyle of that, which is simply not working at all anymore. I came back after a long break and adepted slightly but never felt as fun anymore.
Please dont change shields at all for pve. If you think shields are OP then your a ***.
To anyone that still thinks sorcs can shield and streak for days its time to get with the recent times. It aint 2016 anymore.
Edited by pattyLtd on September 14, 2018 8:53AMEnglish is not my native language, no grammar police please, tyvm8 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »Wild guess: Shields will only absorb damage partially, letting some through. Some shields used to work that way at release IIRC. And it ties in with the ZOS statement about shields making heals useless.
That would be a good way of nerfing them considering shield users are straight up immune to burst and crits. Though numbers should be tuned carefully.
What a lot of nonsense. If my Mag Sorc is immune to crits, why do I need crit resistance of 4000 to survive against all the cheeseblades in the Imperial City? Because shields don't stay up all the time. Good players will CC you just when they expire.
EXACTLY and now we have yet more ways to *** with shields3 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
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I'm guessing its the same downside as the stam user wearing a SnB with hulking + bone pirate spamming absorb magic and rolling when they see a mag char until they get their ult up and explode on them. Bonus points if they are a DK, NB, or Warden, enjoying that HP% heal not touching their stam pool and because eventually they will win that encounter and if they don't it's definitely a player issue.
Also bonus bonus points if they are a stam templar with that setup and 30K+power of the light that strips damage shields instantly and sometimes insta-kills when you get DB + light on you. Omega points if they got bleeds with that and spam defile. No magic user will survive a templar like that unless they can roll or purge. Guess how many magic users can do that in Cyro without sacrificing a LOT of damage or heals and wear light armor? HINT: NONE
Lol absorb magicka? There are mag sorc skills that don't affect that - fury isnt, curse isnt. Also, that skill only reflects the next projectile cast at you, so you think a Stam character is going to just spam a 2.5k cost skill to reflect one projectile? The fact that most magplars and magdks aren't projectile based also means that barely any stamina characters run that skill. So your argument is invalid.
30k power of the light wtf lol are we still in HOTR or something? Stamplar is arguably one of the worst open world classes too so I'm not sure why you're bringing that up to help your case out."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
Honestly, I find playing medium armor builds easier. Esp. the ones with %HP heals. Also, no one forces you to use hulking and bone pirate, you want to and you pay the price for it. Just like if I wear 2x damage set on a light armor build and die in one db + executioner. It's called trade-offs and guess what? The trade-off for being in light is really getting hard to justify in PvP vs heavy in nearly every case.
Wrong, because I see light armour builds running with shackle + necropotence or necro + lich (no defensive sets whatsoever), with 50K max magicka and 2k+ recovery, and 20K+ shields due to their high max magicka pool. Let me know what the downside of the aforementioned setup is please. Also, I do have to run fortified brass/impreg on my stamina toons but that comes at the expense of a set that could give me better resources/damage."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
i think stams had there incompetence covered up by high resist, rolldodge and enough stam to cc break and block for 4 yrs looooool how bout you play in light on a mag toon without shields and then come talk to me about survivability cuz stams going pretty god damn good
Really? Do you think resistance means anything when bleeds are becoming so prevalent which go through resistance. Also unmitigateable cc's like rune cage/fossilise can stop you mid dodge-roll, subjecting the player to enough bursts to kill them.
And heavy armour stamina builds have to rely on higher health recovery, but guess what, defile significantly reduces health recovery and we've been in a defile meta for about 6 months now which I've said before.
ooh gee the stam got caught rolldodging i hope he has enough to break free instead of just sitting there getting hit. I hope his 40k stam will be enough
seriously if and stam is getting stun from cc's they suck. theres no excuse to not be able to break free from even fossilizes if stam is your main stat
thats as laughable as a mag complaining about using to much mag and not being able to spam a shield / heal
and guess what, defile meta is dead, stop complaining about it and again, there is heavy if they can tank out long enough to heal there doing something wrong
Erm, no I'm saying that your argument that roll is an amazing form of defence is nullified when you have CC's that go through dodge roll, leaving medium stamina character vulnerable in these situations. Stamina suffers more skills that they can't interact with than magicka.
Shieldbreaker might be your only argument for uninteractable sets/abilites but even then, which players with any dignity run shield breaker?
[1] Absorb magic doesn't reflect a projectile. In its current state it absorbs nearly every magic skill in the game, including soul assault, templar ray and even most elemental/magic proc sets including illambris, grothdarr, bahraha's curse, etc. and any light attack/heavy from any staff It basically shuts down any magic user. The best part is that absorb magic also heals you %HP in addition to negating damage from almost any magic/elemental skill/item set/passive in the game! Who cares if fury and curse are not absorbed when every other skill is and it heals your opponent? Anyone defending this skill in its form on live obviously has no clue how it works or has never been a magic user facing it. The alternative is that they are one of those "unkillable tanks" spamming it. Also don't forget their are other magic classes in the game other than sorc. You can really have a good laugh spamming absorb magic vs. a mag NB.
[2] "30K PotL wtf" really? Is that the best you can do?
[3] "One of the worse open world classes," yet still far superior to magplar, mag warden, superior to a mag NB if you have absorb magic slotted and don't mind wailing like an idiot to uncloak them (but if you have ritual of retribution this isn't hard, trust me I know because I do have 4 templars after all), and also superior to sorc if you wear SnB and, again, simply do exactly what I said in my previous post. I'm not talking air, I've done exactly what I've posted. How else do you think I know this?
Hold up, did you just say stamplar is a superior open world class to mag sorc?
You have to be joking right? Have you even played a stamplar before?
ya i have, there doing pretty good actually1 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭So we can now conclude that morrowind changes were a COMPLETE failure.
This happens when you butcher a whole MMO awesome gameplay flavour by putting someone like Wrobel in charge. Since he's in charge, ESO has only and exclusively become worse, classes have become boring and flavourless, "FOTMs" have become "FOTY" and so on.Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO10 -
sevomd69✭✭✭✭✭
✭SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »So much premature hysteria...
It clearly says "provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities."
Keyword: counterplay.
Counterplay occurs in PvP, not PvE. This suggests that whatever they're doing is a buff of some sort on the attacker side, not a nerf to shields themselves. They may add an ability that strips shields off a target. Or maybe they'll make weapon/spell penetration or crit (which PvE mobs don't have) increase damage against shields.
We don't know. So chill.
This^^^^
You can tell me to chill all you like, I play pvp in light armor. No I dont know what they have planned but I dont see any good outcomes where this isnt a massive nerf to mag users
Seriously what change can you even think of to shields that isnt a nerf? Ever Idea ive seen posted here on how this change will occur is still a nerf.
Make light attacks do oblivion dmg... great everyone has sb
Make shields only partially block dmg, that is a giant nerf
make it so bash drops shield also a giant nerf
make you needs to cast shields on a delay... every other skill with this is complete garbage...
Ummm...Well then...I guess...Goodbye?1 -
templesus✭✭✭✭✭
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I'm guessing its the same downside as the stam user wearing a SnB with hulking + bone pirate spamming absorb magic and rolling when they see a mag char until they get their ult up and explode on them. Bonus points if they are a DK, NB, or Warden, enjoying that HP% heal not touching their stam pool and because eventually they will win that encounter and if they don't it's definitely a player issue.
Also bonus bonus points if they are a stam templar with that setup and 30K+power of the light that strips damage shields instantly and sometimes insta-kills when you get DB + light on you. Omega points if they got bleeds with that and spam defile. No magic user will survive a templar like that unless they can roll or purge. Guess how many magic users can do that in Cyro without sacrificing a LOT of damage or heals and wear light armor? HINT: NONE
Lol absorb magicka? There are mag sorc skills that don't affect that - fury isnt, curse isnt. Also, that skill only reflects the next projectile cast at you, so you think a Stam character is going to just spam a 2.5k cost skill to reflect one projectile? The fact that most magplars and magdks aren't projectile based also means that barely any stamina characters run that skill. So your argument is invalid.
30k power of the light wtf lol are we still in HOTR or something? Stamplar is arguably one of the worst open world classes too so I'm not sure why you're bringing that up to help your case out."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
Honestly, I find playing medium armor builds easier. Esp. the ones with %HP heals. Also, no one forces you to use hulking and bone pirate, you want to and you pay the price for it. Just like if I wear 2x damage set on a light armor build and die in one db + executioner. It's called trade-offs and guess what? The trade-off for being in light is really getting hard to justify in PvP vs heavy in nearly every case.
Wrong, because I see light armour builds running with shackle + necropotence or necro + lich (no defensive sets whatsoever), with 50K max magicka and 2k+ recovery, and 20K+ shields due to their high max magicka pool. Let me know what the downside of the aforementioned setup is please. Also, I do have to run fortified brass/impreg on my stamina toons but that comes at the expense of a set that could give me better resources/damage."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
i think stams had there incompetence covered up by high resist, rolldodge and enough stam to cc break and block for 4 yrs looooool how bout you play in light on a mag toon without shields and then come talk to me about survivability cuz stams going pretty god damn good
Really? Do you think resistance means anything when bleeds are becoming so prevalent which go through resistance. Also unmitigateable cc's like rune cage/fossilise can stop you mid dodge-roll, subjecting the player to enough bursts to kill them.
And heavy armour stamina builds have to rely on higher health recovery, but guess what, defile significantly reduces health recovery and we've been in a defile meta for about 6 months now which I've said before.
ooh gee the stam got caught rolldodging i hope he has enough to break free instead of just sitting there getting hit. I hope his 40k stam will be enough
seriously if and stam is getting stun from cc's they suck. theres no excuse to not be able to break free from even fossilizes if stam is your main stat
thats as laughable as a mag complaining about using to much mag and not being able to spam a shield / heal
and guess what, defile meta is dead, stop complaining about it and again, there is heavy if they can tank out long enough to heal there doing something wrong
Erm, no I'm saying that your argument that roll is an amazing form of defence is nullified when you have CC's that go through dodge roll, leaving medium stamina character vulnerable in these situations. Stamina suffers more skills that they can't interact with than magicka.
Shieldbreaker might be your only argument for uninteractable sets/abilites but even then, which players with any dignity run shield breaker?
[1] Absorb magic doesn't reflect a projectile. In its current state it absorbs nearly every magic skill in the game, including soul assault, templar ray and even most elemental/magic proc sets including illambris, grothdarr, bahraha's curse, etc. and any light attack/heavy from any staff It basically shuts down any magic user. The best part is that absorb magic also heals you %HP in addition to negating damage from almost any magic/elemental skill/item set/passive in the game! Who cares if fury and curse are not absorbed when every other skill is and it heals your opponent? Anyone defending this skill in its form on live obviously has no clue how it works or has never been a magic user facing it. The alternative is that they are one of those "unkillable tanks" spamming it. Also don't forget their are other magic classes in the game other than sorc. You can really have a good laugh spamming absorb magic vs. a mag NB.
[2] "30K PotL wtf" really? Is that the best you can do?
[3] "One of the worse open world classes," yet still far superior to magplar, mag warden, superior to a mag NB if you have absorb magic slotted and don't mind wailing like an idiot to uncloak them (but if you have ritual of retribution this isn't hard, trust me I know because I do have 4 templars after all), and also superior to sorc if you wear SnB and, again, simply do exactly what I said in my previous post. I'm not talking air, I've done exactly what I've posted. How else do you think I know this?
Hold up, did you just say stamplar is a superior open world class to mag sorc?
You have to be joking right? Have you even played a stamplar before?
ya i have, there doing pretty good actually
LOL. Obvious troll is obvious.5 -
Beardimus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »jediodyn_ESO wrote: »Shields are broken and imbalanced mechanically. Stacking, no Crit, same survival pool as damage modifier and most of the healing tree with crazy efficiency: They needed a fix.
Don’t QQ till you at least see the new system.
News flash for the mathematically challenged: Resto heals and many class heals scale off damage stats like Magicka and Spell Damage.
Rekt!Xbox One | EU | EP
Beardimus : VR16 Dunmer MagSorc [RIP MagDW 2015-2018]
Emperor of Sotha Sil 02-2018 & Sheogorath 05-2019
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Archimus : Bosmer Thief / Archer / Werewolf
Orcimus : Fat drunk Orc battlefield 1st aider
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Fighting small scale with : The SAXON Guild
Fighting with [PvP] : The Undaunted Wolves
Trading Guilds : TradersOfNirn | FourSquareTraders
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Bëardimus : L43 Dunmer Magsorc / BG
Heals-With-Pets : VR16 Argonian Sorc PvP / BG Healer
Nordimus : VR16 Stamsorc
Beardimus le 13iem : L30 Dunmer Magsorc Icereach5 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
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I'm guessing its the same downside as the stam user wearing a SnB with hulking + bone pirate spamming absorb magic and rolling when they see a mag char until they get their ult up and explode on them. Bonus points if they are a DK, NB, or Warden, enjoying that HP% heal not touching their stam pool and because eventually they will win that encounter and if they don't it's definitely a player issue.
Also bonus bonus points if they are a stam templar with that setup and 30K+power of the light that strips damage shields instantly and sometimes insta-kills when you get DB + light on you. Omega points if they got bleeds with that and spam defile. No magic user will survive a templar like that unless they can roll or purge. Guess how many magic users can do that in Cyro without sacrificing a LOT of damage or heals and wear light armor? HINT: NONE
Lol absorb magicka? There are mag sorc skills that don't affect that - fury isnt, curse isnt. Also, that skill only reflects the next projectile cast at you, so you think a Stam character is going to just spam a 2.5k cost skill to reflect one projectile? The fact that most magplars and magdks aren't projectile based also means that barely any stamina characters run that skill. So your argument is invalid.
30k power of the light wtf lol are we still in HOTR or something? Stamplar is arguably one of the worst open world classes too so I'm not sure why you're bringing that up to help your case out."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
Honestly, I find playing medium armor builds easier. Esp. the ones with %HP heals. Also, no one forces you to use hulking and bone pirate, you want to and you pay the price for it. Just like if I wear 2x damage set on a light armor build and die in one db + executioner. It's called trade-offs and guess what? The trade-off for being in light is really getting hard to justify in PvP vs heavy in nearly every case.
Wrong, because I see light armour builds running with shackle + necropotence or necro + lich (no defensive sets whatsoever), with 50K max magicka and 2k+ recovery, and 20K+ shields due to their high max magicka pool. Let me know what the downside of the aforementioned setup is please. Also, I do have to run fortified brass/impreg on my stamina toons but that comes at the expense of a set that could give me better resources/damage."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
i think stams had there incompetence covered up by high resist, rolldodge and enough stam to cc break and block for 4 yrs looooool how bout you play in light on a mag toon without shields and then come talk to me about survivability cuz stams going pretty god damn good
Really? Do you think resistance means anything when bleeds are becoming so prevalent which go through resistance. Also unmitigateable cc's like rune cage/fossilise can stop you mid dodge-roll, subjecting the player to enough bursts to kill them.
And heavy armour stamina builds have to rely on higher health recovery, but guess what, defile significantly reduces health recovery and we've been in a defile meta for about 6 months now which I've said before.
ooh gee the stam got caught rolldodging i hope he has enough to break free instead of just sitting there getting hit. I hope his 40k stam will be enough
seriously if and stam is getting stun from cc's they suck. theres no excuse to not be able to break free from even fossilizes if stam is your main stat
thats as laughable as a mag complaining about using to much mag and not being able to spam a shield / heal
and guess what, defile meta is dead, stop complaining about it and again, there is heavy if they can tank out long enough to heal there doing something wrong
Erm, no I'm saying that your argument that roll is an amazing form of defence is nullified when you have CC's that go through dodge roll, leaving medium stamina character vulnerable in these situations. Stamina suffers more skills that they can't interact with than magicka.
Shieldbreaker might be your only argument for uninteractable sets/abilites but even then, which players with any dignity run shield breaker?
[1] Absorb magic doesn't reflect a projectile. In its current state it absorbs nearly every magic skill in the game, including soul assault, templar ray and even most elemental/magic proc sets including illambris, grothdarr, bahraha's curse, etc. and any light attack/heavy from any staff It basically shuts down any magic user. The best part is that absorb magic also heals you %HP in addition to negating damage from almost any magic/elemental skill/item set/passive in the game! Who cares if fury and curse are not absorbed when every other skill is and it heals your opponent? Anyone defending this skill in its form on live obviously has no clue how it works or has never been a magic user facing it. The alternative is that they are one of those "unkillable tanks" spamming it. Also don't forget their are other magic classes in the game other than sorc. You can really have a good laugh spamming absorb magic vs. a mag NB.
[2] "30K PotL wtf" really? Is that the best you can do?
[3] "One of the worse open world classes," yet still far superior to magplar, mag warden, superior to a mag NB if you have absorb magic slotted and don't mind wailing like an idiot to uncloak them (but if you have ritual of retribution this isn't hard, trust me I know because I do have 4 templars after all), and also superior to sorc if you wear SnB and, again, simply do exactly what I said in my previous post. I'm not talking air, I've done exactly what I've posted. How else do you think I know this?
Hold up, did you just say stamplar is a superior open world class to mag sorc?
You have to be joking right? Have you even played a stamplar before?
ya i have, there doing pretty good actually
LOL. Obvious troll is obvious.
not trolling at all, my friend and i both have stamplars and are doing great the last few patches in cyro1 -
templesus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Looking through these comments I am seeing a lot of strawmans and ad hominems, I kindly remind everyone that no discussions will go anywhere so long as people continuously drop fallacy after fallacy. Notably, I am seeing a lot of people posting things without any actual prior experience related to the subject (like the guy talking about stamplar above) and should remind you that by doing so, you just provoke other people into doing the same. All that ends up happening after the aforementioned is multiple people spewing nonsense about classes they've never played as if they gained them since launch.
Here's an example: Magicka Warden is the best 1vx class in the game. I've played one, I know.
See how this does absolutely nothing to contribute to intelligent discussion, but rather inhibits it?
Please. Just. Stop.Edited by templesus on September 14, 2018 7:28AM3 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@templesus
I‘m playing magSorc since launch, noCP exclusively, only 1 Shield, 2 heals on the bar. I’d be very surprised if the upcoming changes improve my gaming experience. Because, inevitably, having more counter play always means a nerf when it’s ZOS.
Edit: Also @ezio45 isn’t wrong - Stamplar burst is strong because PoTL. Yes, Jabs are a buggy mess, and sustain isn’t good, but Stamplar isn’t that bad.Edited by Feanor on September 14, 2018 7:31AMMain characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.3 -
templesus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@templesus
I‘m playing magSorc since launch, noCP exclusively, only 1 Shield, 2 heals on the bar. I’d be very surprised if the upcoming changes improve my gaming experience. Because, inevitably, having more counter play always means a nerf when it’s ZOS.
I cannot remember the last time any changes to Stamplar improved my gaming experience. I've grown accustomed to nerfs as we have got nothing but healing nerfs and sustain nerfs the past year.
I haven't even logged on the game for Wolfhunter yet because the class is underperforming so much 1vx wise. Didn't even matter to me that rune finally stays on me, it's not enough.
TL;DR - That is nothing new to every other class in the game. Nobody ever feels like anythings improved, because it isn't. Any buffs are accompanied by nerfs (ie radiant buff with solar barrage nerf), or just makes up for some nerf received the patch prior.Edited by templesus on September 14, 2018 7:35AM3 -
XxCaLxX✭✭✭✭✭Again what might be a good change for pvp could further ruin mg dps for pve. Not surprised though. I think these kind of changes are their ignorant way of trying to get ppl to play different classes/builds whatever. I guess they think it will keep ppl playing longer? Mag is good for 6 months the stam is good for 6 months. I guess it’s impossible to balance this game so idk why they use the term. I love eso and would never say it’s dying. It’s pretty obvious though that they are getting a little desperate with how they’re trying to get more players. A million new players this year? How many of that million is bot accounts? That big 100k daily reward at the end of months that everyone made 10 profiles to get it, what you think that was for? If 10,000 players made ten profiles each just to get that daily reward then look at all the new players that joined eso this year. Great job ZOS!2 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.6 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Could be as simple as you can now crit against shields. No pve impact at all.
Who cares about the PvE impact where you have a healer anyway (except vMA)?Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.3 -
Nyladreas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭weedgenius wrote: »"broad changes" "balance sustain" I'm scared...
This is ZOS we're talking about. They don't know any kind of change BUT broad changes.
Their whole method of balancing is "change everything, wait 3 months, and change everything again"
Is anyone here even aware that there are new designers working on the game now? People need to stop freaking out.
I can't wait to see what they changed.
I'm kind of expecting shields to become crittable. That would even the odds a bit.Edited by Nyladreas on September 14, 2018 8:08AM1 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
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ill even agree to that, zos has ripped out everything that made sorc feel special over the last 2 years.2 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
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ya i gotta second this, if this turns out to be all pve related ill be very relieved. The work counterplay makes me think that isnt the case. Im very worried about how this is gunna effect pvp sorcs and mag in general. There are already alot of draw backs to running light and alot of counterplay to shields already, some not specifically for that but they do a good job of it.0 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
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You’d need to buff shields for noCP extraordinarily then. It’s not uncommon that people crit for 6k+ on simple spammables, not to mention hard hitting abilities can crit for 12k+. A single shield is around 9k to 11k if you’re sitting around 40k mag, which is typical for noCP. So - if you crit the shield will be gone with 1 hit, and probably overflow into health even. So no, allowing crits isn’t a good idea.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.5 -
Zodiac_✭✭✭This thread is one of the ultimate proofs why mag sorcs users are considered the master-cry babies of this game....
Nothing has been announced yet and the crying is non stop....
Cant wait till Monday
4 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This thread is one of the ultimate proofs why mag sorcs users are considered the master-cry babies of this game....
Nothing has been announced yet and the crying is non stop....
Cant wait till Monday
It’s called experience with previous nerfs. Just look at the Rune Cage fiasco where I predicted on the PTS that the class will be worse after the inevitable nerfs. And I was right.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.11 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭weedgenius wrote: »"broad changes" "balance sustain" I'm scared...
This is ZOS we're talking about. They don't know any kind of change BUT broad changes.
Their whole method of balancing is "change everything, wait 3 months, and change everything again"
Is anyone here even aware that there are new designers working on the game now? People need to stop freaking out.
I can't wait to see what they changed.
I'm kind of expecting shields to become crittable. That would even the odds a bit.
unfortunately zos has precedents with this and as much as I like the new guy trust needs to be earned especially when you work for a company with a history of making terrible changes to their game
and the 3 month thing is whatever, until it comes to a classes core defense being screwed with. As angry as I am over this if mag is useless for 3 months ill be alot more upset1 -
Zodiac_✭✭✭This thread is one of the ultimate proofs why mag sorcs users are considered the master-cry babies of this game....
Nothing has been announced yet and the crying is non stop....
Cant wait till Monday
It’s called experience with previous nerfs. Just look at the Rune Cage fiasco where I predicted on the PTS that the class will be worse after the inevitable nerfs. And I was right.
The class is not worse by any means...Rune cage is still unavoidable in 90% of the encounters and tbh rune cage was never a, lets say, mag sorcs trade mark skill1 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭This thread is one of the ultimate proofs why mag sorcs users are considered the master-cry babies of this game....
Nothing has been announced yet and the crying is non stop....
Cant wait till Monday
It’s called experience with previous nerfs. Just look at the Rune Cage fiasco where I predicted on the PTS that the class will be worse after the inevitable nerfs. And I was right.
The class is not worse by any means...Rune cage is still unavoidable in 90% of the encounters and tbh rune cage was never a, lets say, mag sorcs trade mark skill
Yes thats fine but shields are very much a staple of sorcs and mag classes in general and when you expect it to be handled the same way runecage was handled you can see why this would be a problem.
Mag has problems on pst, they go head with the change and were stuck with mag having issues on live until 3 months from when murkimire hits live1 -
Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
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You’d need to buff shields for noCP extraordinarily then. It’s not uncommon that people crit for 6k+ on simple spammables, not to mention hard hitting abilities can crit for 12k+. A single shield is around 9k to 11k if you’re sitting around 40k mag, which is typical for noCP. So - if you crit the shield will be gone with 1 hit, and probably overflow into health even. So no, allowing crits isn’t a good idea.
So your complaintt with that, is that a massive hit might actually do some health damage?
Shields are not there to ensure you are invulnerable. They are there to stop xx damage.
That same massive hit would damn near kill anyone else and would not be removed with just 1 heal.
It’s clear that Sorcs are massive cry babies. It’s funny how anything about shields is clearly only aimed at sorcs lol.
Yeah this is just a case of scream as loud as we can before we know anything. Grow up.1 -
ezio45✭✭✭✭✭
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You’d need to buff shields for noCP extraordinarily then. It’s not uncommon that people crit for 6k+ on simple spammables, not to mention hard hitting abilities can crit for 12k+. A single shield is around 9k to 11k if you’re sitting around 40k mag, which is typical for noCP. So - if you crit the shield will be gone with 1 hit, and probably overflow into health even. So no, allowing crits isn’t a good idea.
So your complaintt with that, is that a massive hit might actually do some health damage?
Shields are not there to ensure you are invulnerable. They are there to stop xx damage.
That same massive hit would damn near kill anyone else and would not be removed with just 1 heal.
It’s clear that Sorcs are massive cry babies. It’s funny how anything about shields is clearly only aimed at sorcs lol.
Yeah this is just a case of scream as loud as we can before we know anything. Grow up.
I dont even have a rely for this. Alright fine, get ride of shield but then i want stam to have the EXACT same amount of resist as light users2 -
D0PAMINE✭✭✭✭✭
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I'm guessing its the same downside as the stam user wearing a SnB with hulking + bone pirate spamming absorb magic and rolling when they see a mag char until they get their ult up and explode on them. Bonus points if they are a DK, NB, or Warden, enjoying that HP% heal not touching their stam pool and because eventually they will win that encounter and if they don't it's definitely a player issue.
Also bonus bonus points if they are a stam templar with that setup and 30K+power of the light that strips damage shields instantly and sometimes insta-kills when you get DB + light on you. Omega points if they got bleeds with that and spam defile. No magic user will survive a templar like that unless they can roll or purge. Guess how many magic users can do that in Cyro without sacrificing a LOT of damage or heals and wear light armor? HINT: NONE
Lol absorb magicka? There are mag sorc skills that don't affect that - fury isnt, curse isnt. Also, that skill only reflects the next projectile cast at you, so you think a Stam character is going to just spam a 2.5k cost skill to reflect one projectile? The fact that most magplars and magdks aren't projectile based also means that barely any stamina characters run that skill. So your argument is invalid.
30k power of the light wtf lol are we still in HOTR or something? Stamplar is arguably one of the worst open world classes too so I'm not sure why you're bringing that up to help your case out."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
Honestly, I find playing medium armor builds easier. Esp. the ones with %HP heals. Also, no one forces you to use hulking and bone pirate, you want to and you pay the price for it. Just like if I wear 2x damage set on a light armor build and die in one db + executioner. It's called trade-offs and guess what? The trade-off for being in light is really getting hard to justify in PvP vs heavy in nearly every case.
Wrong, because I see light armour builds running with shackle + necropotence or necro + lich (no defensive sets whatsoever), with 50K max magicka and 2k+ recovery, and 20K+ shields due to their high max magicka pool. Let me know what the downside of the aforementioned setup is please. Also, I do have to run fortified brass/impreg on my stamina toons but that comes at the expense of a set that could give me better resources/damage."provide counterplay opportunities for Damage Shield Abilities" can mean a lot of different things. Hopefully the changes are not too bad because my squishy sorc needs his damage shields. Also says changes to light and medium passives so we shall see I guess.
LOL try playing a medium armour stam build in hulkings and bonepirate where a mistake actually means death. So many magicka players (mag sorcs particularly) have had their incompetence and mistakes disguised by 20k shields for about 4 years now.
i think stams had there incompetence covered up by high resist, rolldodge and enough stam to cc break and block for 4 yrs looooool how bout you play in light on a mag toon without shields and then come talk to me about survivability cuz stams going pretty god damn good
Really? Do you think resistance means anything when bleeds are becoming so prevalent which go through resistance. Also unmitigateable cc's like rune cage/fossilise can stop you mid dodge-roll, subjecting the player to enough bursts to kill them.
And heavy armour stamina builds have to rely on higher health recovery, but guess what, defile significantly reduces health recovery and we've been in a defile meta for about 6 months now which I've said before.
ooh gee the stam got caught rolldodging i hope he has enough to break free instead of just sitting there getting hit. I hope his 40k stam will be enough
seriously if and stam is getting stun from cc's they suck. theres no excuse to not be able to break free from even fossilizes if stam is your main stat
thats as laughable as a mag complaining about using to much mag and not being able to spam a shield / heal
and guess what, defile meta is dead, stop complaining about it and again, there is heavy if they can tank out long enough to heal there doing something wrong
Erm, no I'm saying that your argument that roll is an amazing form of defence is nullified when you have CC's that go through dodge roll, leaving medium stamina character vulnerable in these situations. Stamina suffers more skills that they can't interact with than magicka.
Shieldbreaker might be your only argument for uninteractable sets/abilites but even then, which players with any dignity run shield breaker?
[1] Absorb magic doesn't reflect a projectile. In its current state it absorbs nearly every magic skill in the game, including soul assault, templar ray and even most elemental/magic proc sets including illambris, grothdarr, bahraha's curse, etc. and any light attack/heavy from any staff It basically shuts down any magic user. The best part is that absorb magic also heals you %HP in addition to negating damage from almost any magic/elemental skill/item set/passive in the game! Who cares if fury and curse are not absorbed when every other skill is and it heals your opponent? Anyone defending this skill in its form on live obviously has no clue how it works or has never been a magic user facing it. The alternative is that they are one of those "unkillable tanks" spamming it. Also don't forget their are other magic classes in the game other than sorc. You can really have a good laugh spamming absorb magic vs. a mag NB.
[2] "30K PotL wtf" really? Is that the best you can do?
[3] "One of the worse open world classes," yet still far superior to magplar, mag warden, superior to a mag NB if you have absorb magic slotted and don't mind wailing like an idiot to uncloak them (but if you have ritual of retribution this isn't hard, trust me I know because I do have 4 templars after all), and also superior to sorc if you wear SnB and, again, simply do exactly what I said in my previous post. I'm not talking air, I've done exactly what I've posted. How else do you think I know this?
Hold up, did you just say stamplar is a superior open world class to mag sorc?
You have to be joking right? Have you even played a stamplar before?
ya i have, there doing pretty good actually
LOL. Obvious troll is obvious.
not trolling at all, my friend and i both have stamplars and are doing great the last few patches in cyro
I love my stamplar, but I just cannot sustain on him enough to stay alive at all.2
This discussion has been closed.