Near immortal tanks - introduced update 19

RobZha · August 2018

Saw a few of these the other night/early morning from EP on vivec. Tried killing them with a few others then realised nothing could be done and left laughing. If they decide to nerf something to tone it down a bit fair enough, but I think that players should be able to tank and troll others if they want to. If the players attacking them can't beat them and get all wound up and start going on about cheating, that's their issue I guess.

Just leave them and move on if it's bugging you so much. Part of me has always wanted to try some type of tank build out in pvp just to troll from time to time too, so maybe I'm a bit biased on this one, I thought it looked fun.

Vrany69 · August 2018

LOL effects of Wrobbler are in effect, and he was probably a templar, why?? because *** heals why, now they even reduced the debuffs on healing and hp recovery ofc you will find these kind of builds now, they were even like this pre heal debuff nerfs as well

Wreuntzylla · August 2018

Actually_Goku wrote: »

Tanks and healers have ruined the PVP experience for a long time now. Nothing new. Play BG’s.

I agree. There is no place for anything other than DPS in an FPS like ESO.

Biro123 · August 2018

Vrany69 wrote: »

LOL effects of Wrobbler are in effect, and he was probably a templar, why?? because *** heals why, now they even reduced the debuffs on healing and hp recovery ofc you will find these kind of builds now, they were even like this pre heal debuff nerfs as well

Poor chap..
Wasn't long ago he was accused of playing NB
Patch before that he was a Sorc..

visionality · August 2018

There is only one good use for troll tanks - light attack them to load your ultis and then move on to meaningful targets. Also, their whole playstyle evolves around ppl being distracted by them so you are basically catering their own desires if you start seriously attacking them. Once you regard them as what they really are - ulti generation nodes - they are a harmless curiosity.

Dr_Rektar · August 2018

usualy when i play tank, i am not getting any damn light attack on me.. 3 shootings stars and a fear? zerg of snipers, choo choo potato train? all of this i am getting instead(

Kalante · August 2018

Guppet wrote: »

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

Tanks are OP in pvp.

My stam nb with spriggans and bone pirate has been unable to kill tanks for months. Last night i fought a tank for almost 10 minutes, throwing everything I could. The most I could do was take him to 10%, at which time he pops a heal and the cycle repeats itself. I walked away bored.

You do realise you survived for 10 mins also, so he couldn’t kill you either. If you gear for max survival, you kill nothing. The enemy are thick if they beat on you.

LOL wut since when spriggans and bone pirate are considered sets for survival.

Universe · August 2018

Alcast wrote: »

Surprised it took so long

Yes I'm surprised too

Vivecc wrote: »

Investigating such an exploit is not easy,

You should not call it exploit as you have no proof that it is actually an exploit

Proof ?
I can call it however I want, it doesn't change what it is.
This tanking anomaly isn't normal/balanced and it's safe to say that it's either an exploit or unintended buff to certain tanking builds, like the change to defile(or both of those probable causes).

Jaraal · August 2018

RexyCat wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

I don't really see the problem. One guy standing around absorbing damage isn't going to be taking resources or keeps, or killing enemy players. There's no "advantage" here, and the only exploit is exploiting the stubbornness of a bunch of players who would be better serving their alliance by moving on to something that earns AP.

Can't a tank use siege weapon to do damage (replacing its own lack for it)? Destroying tents and doing other stuff that you don't need to be able to do your own damage as long as you can survive?

Siege weapon used by a tank can be destroyed just as fast as any other, and anybody can destroy a forward camp, too. Tank is no longer unkillable if he's running around looking for those things rather than blocking, anyway.

Jaraal · August 2018

Vrany69 wrote: »

LOL effects of Wrobbler are in effect, and he was probably a templar, why?? because *** heals why, now they even reduced the debuffs on healing and hp recovery ofc you will find these kind of builds now, they were even like this pre heal debuff nerfs as well

Exactly! They nerfed defile/debuff, and didn't expect survivability to increase? This is a byproduct of ZOS's idea of balance, so why do people act surprised?

RaddlemanNumber7 · August 2018

Valencer wrote: »

It's literally just the new Dark Cloak HoT + high max health, with stacked healing bonuses from multiple sources (CP, argonian, etc).
Dark Cloak into Meditate gives you Minor + Major Protection and if you have CC immunity it's uninterruptable because brilliant game developers. Stack that with high resistances in general to minimize incoming burst damage.

Why you keep suggesting theyre exploiting is beyond me. Seems to be the default response to anything in this game's community

This fits what I saw.

Joy_Division · August 2018

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

Tanks are OP in pvp.

My stam nb with spriggans and bone pirate has been unable to kill tanks for months. Last night i fought a tank for almost 10 minutes, throwing everything I could. The most I could do was take him to 10%, at which time he pops a heal and the cycle repeats itself. I walked away bored.

If a "tank" can not survive Vs. one single player while devoting so much into defense that it was incapable of killing a glass cannon, then the entire concept of being a "tank" is bankrupt and non-existent.

xeNNNNN · August 2018

if alls they are doing is tanking and not having insane damage at the same time I dont really see a problem here.

Gronk · August 2018

Biro123 wrote: »

Vrany69 wrote: »

LOL effects of Wrobbler are in effect, and he was probably a templar, why?? because *** heals why, now they even reduced the debuffs on healing and hp recovery ofc you will find these kind of builds now, they were even like this pre heal debuff nerfs as well

Poor chap..
Wasn't long ago he was accused of playing NB
Patch before that he was a Sorc..

Lord Wrobel mains a Slaughterfish.K/D ratio over 9001:1:2 with two ties Blinxey and Bishop.

Malamar1229 · August 2018

imredneckson wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

I bet he hit like a truck too...

They didn't kill anyone that I saw. Seemed satisfied to be getting everyone's attention.

That's pretty much it. Tanks love to get a ton of players to attack them and then its just a game to see who lasts longer the tanks HP or the enemy's want to kill them. If the players leave the tank, tank wins. If the tank dies then he just lasted a long time against overwhelming odds and wasted the time of the enemies that were fighting them. This can be used to occupy enemies while a keep is under attack and give the keep enough time to get some back up. Even just one player distracting enemies at a resources can give their faction enough time to attack a keep and take it before they kill the tank. Tanks can be useful and are fun to play.

That was my point...super tanky players arent doing any dmg....so you saddle up and ignore them...not come to forums asking for nerfs.

ImO it's not issue until you have super tanks that are 1 shotting ppl

Sandman929 · August 2018

If you struggle to kill a PvP tank for so long, solo or in a group, and become frustrated that you have to complain about a pest that you could have walked away from, the tank has done it's job.

umagon · August 2018

Malamar1229 wrote: »

imredneckson wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

I bet he hit like a truck too...

They didn't kill anyone that I saw. Seemed satisfied to be getting everyone's attention.

That's pretty much it. Tanks love to get a ton of players to attack them and then its just a game to see who lasts longer the tanks HP or the enemy's want to kill them. If the players leave the tank, tank wins. If the tank dies then he just lasted a long time against overwhelming odds and wasted the time of the enemies that were fighting them. This can be used to occupy enemies while a keep is under attack and give the keep enough time to get some back up. Even just one player distracting enemies at a resources can give their faction enough time to attack a keep and take it before they kill the tank. Tanks can be useful and are fun to play.

That was my point...super tanky players arent doing any dmg....so you saddle up and ignore them...not come to forums asking for nerfs.

ImO it's not issue until you have super tanks that are 1 shotting ppl

I have a build that has 40k health, 40k stam, 2.3k crit resistance, 35k phy/spell resistance, and just over 2k weapon damage. The stam recovery is kind of low but it works. The build doesn’t one shot people but it can kill players while being tanky. The only problem is I don’t have one of the sets on the live server to run it. Hopefully the golden vendor brings me what I need some day.

GoodFella146 · August 2018

Great job as usual......

IT'S PVP, PLAYERS ARE SUPPOSED TO ******* DIE!!!!!!!!

Maybe consider that the next time you're crying about stuns and damage.

Sophocles1 · August 2018

I tried to make an immortal tank. Y tank is basically immortal in pve. But in pvp 3 good chars can kill me in moments. Tanks are weeeeeaaakkk in pvp. And I love being a tank.

jaws343 · August 2018

SilverWF wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

SilverWF wrote: »

There is a set that reduces incoming damage by 15% while you are casting or channelling - Light of Cyrodiil.
Add here Psijic passive, that reduces inc. damage by 30% while casting or channeling Psijic skills
So this is a rough 45% incoming damage reduction while meditating, not even counting armor, resists or other damage reduction passives (like Nord's 6% racial or Psijic ult 8% while slotted)

From other side, WHAT this troll-tank can do against you? Just ignore him

That's not how mitigation works.

It's multiplicative

Well, it's still a lot

Other option for unkillable tank is Health regen, I mean huge health regen, paired with huge mitigation
Orgnum's Scales + Armor Master (or Beekeeper's Gear or Green Pact or Warrior-Poet or Mark of the Pariah) + Troll King

Never tried this, but always want to

I run a PVP warden max health tank Orc with Orgnums and Beekeeper with Troll King. When everything procs, I hit around 7-8K health regen. It's pretty ridiculous. And with Permafrost and gripping shards, i can lock down an entire group of players.

DuskMarine · August 2018

umagon wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

imredneckson wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

I bet he hit like a truck too...

They didn't kill anyone that I saw. Seemed satisfied to be getting everyone's attention.

That's pretty much it. Tanks love to get a ton of players to attack them and then its just a game to see who lasts longer the tanks HP or the enemy's want to kill them. If the players leave the tank, tank wins. If the tank dies then he just lasted a long time against overwhelming odds and wasted the time of the enemies that were fighting them. This can be used to occupy enemies while a keep is under attack and give the keep enough time to get some back up. Even just one player distracting enemies at a resources can give their faction enough time to attack a keep and take it before they kill the tank. Tanks can be useful and are fun to play.

That was my point...super tanky players arent doing any dmg....so you saddle up and ignore them...not come to forums asking for nerfs.

ImO it's not issue until you have super tanks that are 1 shotting ppl

I have a build that has 40k health, 40k stam, 2.3k crit resistance, 35k phy/spell resistance, and just over 2k weapon damage. The stam recovery is kind of low but it works. The build doesn’t one shot people but it can kill players while being tanky. The only problem is I don’t have one of the sets on the live server to run it. Hopefully the golden vendor brings me what I need some day.

what is said setup cause no way you have those kind of stats without emp

WaltherCarraway · August 2018

this thread is already a nerf magicka dragonknight thread. how amazing!

Mintaka5 · August 2018

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

The most I could do was take him to 10%, at which time he pops a heal and the cycle repeats itself. I walked away bored.

Yup. Bored and move on, is what I do most of the time. Immortal builds are very much a sign that the PvP aspect of this game needs a real overhaul.

EvilAutoTech · August 2018

My main, a Templar tank, was a sergeant before ever getting a kill in PVP. I am often killed, but it usually takes a group to do it. In BGs, I often have seven or eight enemies concentrated on little ol' me. Great fun unless it's TDM.

Waffennacht · August 2018

umagon wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Sure it's not just the new heal is that good?

The new nightblade heal has little to do with it. The counter to the healing/health regen is what got drastically reduced. On the build I use I make so players are always doing normal damage. I pushed the crit reduction high. I am not going into the value and why because it’s lengthily. But there is a point where in pvp the only way to get past the crit reduction is to make a build that will get most players killed because it is a pve build. There is kind of two ways of doing this but again it’s lengthily one is high crit resistance or high block up time.

Because 99% of players will be doing normal damage all the burst damage can be thrown out the window so to speak. Once that is done all the dps calculations for just about every popular build are easy to do. Then just calculate how much damage reduction is need to put the incoming damage lower than the self healing rate. There is a point where it’s better to push more healing if increases skill or ultimate output values.

Defile while yes it was over preforming against builds that had little or no healing, the devs drastically reduced the uptime. People seem to not understand how much defile got nerfed, I called these situations in the pts forms, along with other people. And the devs did it anyway; so here we are.

umagon wrote: »

When the patch is deployed on live, players will be complaining about healers, tanks, and organized groups of players who will almost never die.

Oh, tldr: it's a l2p issue

Most_Awesome · August 2018

Seeing as I come across a blatant CE user yesterday on PC EU Sotha anything is possible in Cyro

Mintaka5 · August 2018

WaltherCarraway wrote: »

this thread is already a nerf magicka dragonknight thread. how amazing!

It couldn't happen soon enough.

templesus · August 2018

L2P issue

Universe · August 2018

WaltherCarraway wrote: »

this thread is already a nerf magicka dragonknight thread. how amazing!

No, magicka dragonknight can rejoice, this discussion is about near immortal tanks

templesus wrote: »

L2P issue

I wish it was.
Sadly, there is a balance issue and/or exploit and some tanking builds are over performing.
It is always easy to classify an issue as L2P, but it's not always right to do so

templesus · August 2018

Universe wrote: »

WaltherCarraway wrote: »

this thread is already a nerf magicka dragonknight thread. how amazing!

No, magicka dragonknight can rejoice, this discussion is about near immortal tanks

templesus wrote: »

L2P issue

I wish it was.
Sadly, there is a balance issue and/or exploit and some tanking builds are over performing.
It is always easy to classify an issue as L2P, but it's not always right to do so

No, it’s definately a L2P issue. Could tell the moment you mentioned siege.