DanielWinterborn wrote: »Why are there animations if they can be cancelled? This is ridiculous and very easy to exploit and I'm going to tell you how.
You don't need a super macro for it or anything, you cancel animation by blocking, pressing your right mouse button or swapping weapons. But why go to all that trouble when you can do it in a very simple way?
I keep wondering how some people can get 5+attacks in under 1 second which is too much if you ask me and I think I got it figured out.
The way this works (I think) is that people that abuse the system are using a simple macro like this :
Skill 1 "Javelin" , macro key 1 to do : 1+right click
Skill 2 "Vampire Bane" , macro key 2 to do : 2+right click
etc
If you press right click, just tap it, you will notice that the block animation is very short compared to the skill animation itself so basically all they do is smash 3 buttons and perform 6 actions in the time it takes to perform just 1.
How will ZOS ever fix this? They won't because there are too many leet players and streamers (God's of ZOS) that do the same thing. They way to go here would be that during casting, like channeled casting, if you block before the animation is done the skill is cancelled. Or they could easy make it so that while casting you can't block or swap weapons.
That's how I see a fair playing field, of course this concerns PvP.
I'm not saying this because somebody killed me and I'm angry, I do very well in BG's, 90% of the time I'm nr 1 or 2 in my team. I'm saying it because I know people who quit because of this, they like the pvp idea and how it flows but when it comes to ESO pvp it's something else. You don't need in game skill that much as long as you can macro or mash the keyboard like a pro.
I see a lot of new level 50 players that can't hold a torch against the animation cancelling guys. I myself often die to them, that's why instead of having a melee build that's going in for the kill I prefer a ranged build with sustain and defense that does mediocre damage.
I know this will get brushed to the side but there's my two cents about it.
The_Outsider wrote: »animation cancel is fake. The only thing that actually cancels are light attacks, and that is light attack weaving and is part of a skillful rotation. Even if you cancel the animation of abilities or not, you will attack exactly in the same way. If i cast javelin and while it shoots i cast vampire bane, those will hit in the exact same time like i would block between them. The only win you can get here is casting a light attack between them, which as i said above is weaving and is perfectly acceptable and recommended.
Well you can also cancel the animations of abilities by blocking, bashing, weapon swapping, or rolling.
I'm not quite sure what you mean? Are you saying that cancelling light attacks is different from cancelling abilities? If so, that's not the case. You can completely cancel the animations of both a light attack and an ability and still get the damage from both. Example: light attack, surprise attack, weapon swap. Both do damage, but you didn't see the animation for either the LA or the SA.The_Outsider wrote: »animation cancel is fake. The only thing that actually cancels are light attacks, and that is light attack weaving and is part of a skillful rotation. Even if you cancel the animation of abilities or not, you will attack exactly in the same way. If i cast javelin and while it shoots i cast vampire bane, those will hit in the exact same time like i would block between them. The only win you can get here is casting a light attack between them, which as i said above is weaving and is perfectly acceptable and recommended.
Well you can also cancel the animations of abilities by blocking, bashing, weapon swapping, or rolling.
the point was that the only thing that is actually canceled, not just visually. Only light attacks are actually canceled with the effect being kept, the abilities get only their visual effect canceled, but not any benefit from it, unlike the light attacks which benefits you for skipping the animation time and still firing the hit
DanielWinterborn wrote: »Why are there animations if they can be cancelled? This is ridiculous and very easy to exploit and I'm going to tell you how.
You don't need a super macro for it or anything, you cancel animation by blocking, pressing your right mouse button or swapping weapons. But why go to all that trouble when you can do it in a very simple way?
I keep wondering how some people can get 5+attacks in under 1 second which is too much if you ask me and I think I got it figured out.
The way this works (I think) is that people that abuse the system are using a simple macro like this :
Skill 1 "Javelin" , macro key 1 to do : 1+right click
Skill 2 "Vampire Bane" , macro key 2 to do : 2+right click
etc
If you press right click, just tap it, you will notice that the block animation is very short compared to the skill animation itself so basically all they do is smash 3 buttons and perform 6 actions in the time it takes to perform just 1.
How will ZOS ever fix this? They won't because there are too many leet players and streamers (God's of ZOS) that do the same thing. They way to go here would be that during casting, like channeled casting, if you block before the animation is done the skill is cancelled. Or they could easy make it so that while casting you can't block or swap weapons.
That's how I see a fair playing field, of course this concerns PvP.
I'm not saying this because somebody killed me and I'm angry, I do very well in BG's, 90% of the time I'm nr 1 or 2 in my team. I'm saying it because I know people who quit because of this, they like the pvp idea and how it flows but when it comes to ESO pvp it's something else. You don't need in game skill that much as long as you can macro or mash the keyboard like a pro.
I see a lot of new level 50 players that can't hold a torch against the animation cancelling guys. I myself often die to them, that's why instead of having a melee build that's going in for the kill I prefer a ranged build with sustain and defense that does mediocre damage.
I know this will get brushed to the side but there's my two cents about it.
not everything is on the 1 second cool-down.
Light/heavy attack isn't and ultimate isn't.
so any programmable device that lets you add a light attack and ultimate (when up, some classes have very cheap ultimates)to the firing sequence gives you a technological advantage. Aka "Burst"
the only real weakness of this game as all you need is a little lag and your hit 5+ times in a second and whether you agree or not the players "perception" is that there is something unfair going on.
so if your getting the wall of abilities its fair to believe the other guy has something you don't have. Not that you cant do the same thing, its just less efficient manually.
not so much cheating as a bad , poisonous design consider the overwhelming complaint about this game is bad dps.
they should just level the playing field and add basic macros to the base game to at least allow a light attack to be bound to ability buttons.
The_Outsider wrote: »I'm not quite sure what you mean? Are you saying that cancelling light attacks is different from cancelling abilities? If so, that's not the case. You can completely cancel the animations of both a light attack and an ability and still get the damage from both. Example: light attack, surprise attack, weapon swap. Both do damage, but you didn't see the animation for either the LA or the SA.The_Outsider wrote: »animation cancel is fake. The only thing that actually cancels are light attacks, and that is light attack weaving and is part of a skillful rotation. Even if you cancel the animation of abilities or not, you will attack exactly in the same way. If i cast javelin and while it shoots i cast vampire bane, those will hit in the exact same time like i would block between them. The only win you can get here is casting a light attack between them, which as i said above is weaving and is perfectly acceptable and recommended.
Well you can also cancel the animations of abilities by blocking, bashing, weapon swapping, or rolling.
the point was that the only thing that is actually canceled, not just visually. Only light attacks are actually canceled with the effect being kept, the abilities get only their visual effect canceled, but not any benefit from it, unlike the light attacks which benefits you for skipping the animation time and still firing the hit
even if you cancel an ability animation or not, you will only cast 2 abilities in two seconds.
Shadowmaster wrote: »even if you cancel an ability animation or not, you will only cast 2 abilities in two seconds.
again its not 1s gcd, please stop posting misinfo
also I can get 1LA, 1skill and 1ult in an amazingly quick amount of time, we are splitting hairs over "skill" "ultimate" "light attack", they are all damage causing abilities.
The_Outsider wrote: »I'm not quite sure what you mean? Are you saying that cancelling light attacks is different from cancelling abilities? If so, that's not the case. You can completely cancel the animations of both a light attack and an ability and still get the damage from both. Example: light attack, surprise attack, weapon swap. Both do damage, but you didn't see the animation for either the LA or the SA.The_Outsider wrote: »animation cancel is fake. The only thing that actually cancels are light attacks, and that is light attack weaving and is part of a skillful rotation. Even if you cancel the animation of abilities or not, you will attack exactly in the same way. If i cast javelin and while it shoots i cast vampire bane, those will hit in the exact same time like i would block between them. The only win you can get here is casting a light attack between them, which as i said above is weaving and is perfectly acceptable and recommended.
Well you can also cancel the animations of abilities by blocking, bashing, weapon swapping, or rolling.
the point was that the only thing that is actually canceled, not just visually. Only light attacks are actually canceled with the effect being kept, the abilities get only their visual effect canceled, but not any benefit from it, unlike the light attacks which benefits you for skipping the animation time and still firing the hit
even if you cancel an ability animation or not, you will only cast 2 abilities in two seconds. If you cancel the animation of a light attack, in those two seconds u`ll do more damage because the light attack still hit even if canceled. The ability hits if canceled, but it doesn't provide any benefit, it's only visually, which in the light attack case, it provides benefit, it doesn't cancel the animation only visually, the light attack timer also overlaps with abilities timer
Shadowmaster wrote: »@LadyNalcarya post your own vids, I have better things to do than prove you wrong on something I am 100% sure of.
BTW I didnt say I could bypass gcd, I just said its not 1s
The_Outsider wrote: »The_Outsider wrote: »I'm not quite sure what you mean? Are you saying that cancelling light attacks is different from cancelling abilities? If so, that's not the case. You can completely cancel the animations of both a light attack and an ability and still get the damage from both. Example: light attack, surprise attack, weapon swap. Both do damage, but you didn't see the animation for either the LA or the SA.The_Outsider wrote: »animation cancel is fake. The only thing that actually cancels are light attacks, and that is light attack weaving and is part of a skillful rotation. Even if you cancel the animation of abilities or not, you will attack exactly in the same way. If i cast javelin and while it shoots i cast vampire bane, those will hit in the exact same time like i would block between them. The only win you can get here is casting a light attack between them, which as i said above is weaving and is perfectly acceptable and recommended.
Well you can also cancel the animations of abilities by blocking, bashing, weapon swapping, or rolling.
the point was that the only thing that is actually canceled, not just visually. Only light attacks are actually canceled with the effect being kept, the abilities get only their visual effect canceled, but not any benefit from it, unlike the light attacks which benefits you for skipping the animation time and still firing the hit
even if you cancel an ability animation or not, you will only cast 2 abilities in two seconds. If you cancel the animation of a light attack, in those two seconds u`ll do more damage because the light attack still hit even if canceled. The ability hits if canceled, but it doesn't provide any benefit, it's only visually, which in the light attack case, it provides benefit, it doesn't cancel the animation only visually, the light attack timer also overlaps with abilities timer
Okay, I think I see what you're saying: that there's no benefit to cancelling abilities? That is the point I disagree with. I would lose tons of time over the course of a boss fight if I didn't cancel my last ability on each bar with a barswap. It would be a massive DPS loss if I waited for the ability animation to finish instead of cancelling it-- this is part of a proper "weave."
Also any PVPer that still bash cancels executes or 1h/shield builds that weave bashes for damage know that cancelling abilities can have a great deal of benefit.
DanielWinterborn wrote: »Is this actually a serious post?
This can't be right?
ESO has a 1 second global cooldown between skill casts.
After you use a skill, you can't use another skill no matter if you block cancelled the animation until another second has passed.
It's actually very serious, with that 1 second cool down you are talking about, it should take 5-6 seconds to kill someone decent in PvP, enough time to swap bars and heal or go into mist form, fight back, etc. But it happens in BG's all the time, damage from the same player (mostly nb). One second you're full life going to the fight and then 5+ skills on you out of nowhere and you're dead. There are instances where I fight 4 players when I'm alone and I have enough time to purge + mistform and get out of there in time, other times dead in one second.
I'll keep saying it until someone listens. You should be able to cancel animation, but cancelling the animation should cancel the action. There is no reason for the ability to still fire off if the animation didn't finish, that's just bad design.
The_Outsider wrote: »I'm not quite sure what you mean? Are you saying that cancelling light attacks is different from cancelling abilities? If so, that's not the case. You can completely cancel the animations of both a light attack and an ability and still get the damage from both. Example: light attack, surprise attack, weapon swap. Both do damage, but you didn't see the animation for either the LA or the SA.The_Outsider wrote: »animation cancel is fake. The only thing that actually cancels are light attacks, and that is light attack weaving and is part of a skillful rotation. Even if you cancel the animation of abilities or not, you will attack exactly in the same way. If i cast javelin and while it shoots i cast vampire bane, those will hit in the exact same time like i would block between them. The only win you can get here is casting a light attack between them, which as i said above is weaving and is perfectly acceptable and recommended.
Well you can also cancel the animations of abilities by blocking, bashing, weapon swapping, or rolling.
the point was that the only thing that is actually canceled, not just visually. Only light attacks are actually canceled with the effect being kept, the abilities get only their visual effect canceled, but not any benefit from it, unlike the light attacks which benefits you for skipping the animation time and still firing the hit
MaleAmazon wrote: »I'll keep saying it until someone listens. You should be able to cancel animation, but cancelling the animation should cancel the action. There is no reason for the ability to still fire off if the animation didn't finish, that's just bad design.
Again:
The damage is added AS SOON AS YOU PUSH THE BUTTON. Not when the animation "finishes". Except for some cast time skills, which DON´T get the damage if aborted.
EDIT: That is the TECHNICAL reason. The GAMEPLAY reason is that if you didn´t get the damage when ani cancelling combat would be either pointlessly clunky and without any skill (yes, it takes at least some skill to ani cancel), or a pure spamfest.
DanielWinterborn wrote: »Why are there animations if they can be cancelled? This is ridiculous and very easy to exploit and I'm going to tell you how.
You don't need a super macro for it or anything, you cancel animation by blocking, pressing your right mouse button or swapping weapons. But why go to all that trouble when you can do it in a very simple way?
I keep wondering how some people can get 5+attacks in under 1 second which is too much if you ask me and I think I got it figured out.
The way this works (I think) is that people that abuse the system are using a simple macro like this :
Skill 1 "Javelin" , macro key 1 to do : 1+right click
Skill 2 "Vampire Bane" , macro key 2 to do : 2+right click
etc
If you press right click, just tap it, you will notice that the block animation is very short compared to the skill animation itself so basically all they do is smash 3 buttons and perform 6 actions in the time it takes to perform just 1.
How will ZOS ever fix this? They won't because there are too many leet players and streamers (God's of ZOS) that do the same thing. They way to go here would be that during casting, like channeled casting, if you block before the animation is done the skill is cancelled. Or they could easy make it so that while casting you can't block or swap weapons.
That's how I see a fair playing field, of course this concerns PvP.
I'm not saying this because somebody killed me and I'm angry, I do very well in BG's, 90% of the time I'm nr 1 or 2 in my team. I'm saying it because I know people who quit because of this, they like the pvp idea and how it flows but when it comes to ESO pvp it's something else. You don't need in game skill that much as long as you can macro or mash the keyboard like a pro.
I see a lot of new level 50 players that can't hold a torch against the animation cancelling guys. I myself often die to them, that's why instead of having a melee build that's going in for the kill I prefer a ranged build with sustain and defense that does mediocre damage.
I know this will get brushed to the side but there's my two cents about it.