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This is why YOU get kicked for being low CP or bad at DPS/Heals/Tank
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witchdoctor✭✭✭✭✭
✭... and that's why I keep bringing up the relevance of the dark triad
No, its not relevant.
No offence, but you are like the 1st year law student whose answer to everything is, 'but duty of care!'Edited by witchdoctor on July 8, 2018 1:22AM11 -
LeagueTroll✭✭✭✭✭There's an undercurrent here that's actually disturbing. I don't like it. Has anyone else spotted it?
It goes beyond an entitlement to treat anyone who isn't of the perceived "hardcore," or "meta," or what have you. It's so much more insidious than that, and that's why I keep bringing up the relevance of the dark triad to conversations like these. It's in how there's pride in mistreating people. It started off as just being unnerving but like a creeping vine it's grown into a dark cloud of fridge horror. Not a fan.
"I'm proud I'm badarse!", "I'm also proud I'm badarse!", "Let's be proud together, brother, and lord it over these plebs!"
There's just something truly problematic about it that reminds me of the attitudes of ableist and/or rich people. As though the other players were lesser human beings for not being able to pull enough DPS. And therefore they should be excluded. The thing is, though, is that if the more sociopathic quotient continues to exclude them, then they'd never have the chance to learn. I'm beginning to wonder if that's the point.
"Our content! Ours! OURS! No casualses! Precioussss~!"
Sigh.
This is a truly disturbing thread to read.
I can link terminology too. A potatoes dd who is below the lower quartile in term of performance feel he is very important, doesn’t give a crap about other ppl’s time, seek approve so bad and get salty after others refuse to carry them. Has some psychological issue that’s even more concerning. They have no less ego than the true elites. They want to do end game content rather than just happy to be a casual doing normal dungeon. They take advantage of capable players who happen to be too nice to kick them. This is called NPD.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder14 -
Conduit0✭✭✭✭✭
✭AbysmalGhul wrote: »Personally I'm good, I didn't need a lesson. I'm just saying most people still can't do 30k
You mean most people don't hit 30k, rather than can't hit 30k. Anyone can hit 30k, but most do not because they don't know how to perform a proper rotation or light attack weave.0 -
Conduit0✭✭✭✭✭
✭Posts like OP. its what made me don't what to play anymore, and only look back in from time to time.
Its people like that ruin the game for a lot.
I know right? How dare the OP complain about people not pulling their own weight, he should just shut up and carry you like a good little pack mule.3 -
Sophocles1✭✭✭Blackleopardex wrote: »IF you are gonna use the dungeon finder and have issues with low dps; go DD if you're alone or make sure to just take 1 DD you know with you... Problem solved.
On a side-note tho; It's not required to be a elitist to make sure you can actually do your part in a dungeon run, neither does it require a spreadsheet, calculations or 8000 play hours. I mean come on people, you don't join a game of football without knowing how to kick the ball... It takes 5 min to check and slot the decent skills to do your role... If everyone gave a *** nobody would have had fungal grotto completed. Don't expect to get carried... It's rude and disrespectful to the rest of the group.Blackleopardex wrote: »IF you are gonna use the dungeon finder and have issues with low dps; go DD if you're alone or make sure to just take 1 DD you know with you... Problem solved.
I was very good in football but not so much in this game. It’s not as intuitive as some of you think. We are really trying even if we’re not as good as you. In football, I still would’ve let you play.Edited by Sophocles1 on July 8, 2018 2:12AM0 -
Luckily I always roll with a buddy, and we usually kick anybody who is so gimped that they try to kick people who don't deserve it.
I don't care about your backstory for why you're a primadonna. If you can't handle pugs, you should form your own group, period.4 -
wolfie1.0.✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Smasherx74 wrote: »So past few days I decided to start going on my healer toon, trying to get as many crystals as I possibly can to finish my PVE DPS build. I've came to the realization that most peoples DPS is damn near non-existent. As a DPS even a low cp20 dps without any AOE can manage to be pulled through on my back, I mean it's not like every dungeon requires 4 people to complete on vet, at least not the vanilla ones. So I never had an issue with people, I would never vote kick people out unless they were intentionally stupid. However now my minds changed, I'm absolutely fed up with it.
For the third day in a row on my healer, I get put into a veteran group with terrible DPS. One day despite maintaining minor berserk, minor and major resolve/ward, and keeping major breach applied all damn near 24/7, I was told I'm useless. The DPS was absolutely terrible despite me doing my best to keep their resources up, and keep the buffs/debuffs up, all while healing these people. The tank is doing absolutely nothing but standing there occasionally applying taunt, the DPS is spamming light attacks, and I'm told I'm useless. I don't have to say, I left that group I wasn't going to be criticized by a bunch of casuals who have little to no understanding of how the game work, I even went out of my way to explain to the DPS they needed an AOE ability, tried to explain to the Tank he had to aggro ads, did my absolute best to keep group alive yet I'm useless because "they didn't need heals".
Now today, another terrible group. DPS does literally no AOE, most likely pulling under 10k single target, they appear to have no rotation, they're not maintaining DoTs or buffs/debuffs. I'm sitting here watching these people play and just hoping to god they'll figure it out and pull in more DPS. They were both above cp160 this time, in fact one was near max level. Yet the DPS was still terrible, even if one DPS was somewhat competent at their role it would have been much faster, yet it wasn't. It was like the DPS were two brand new players with no idea what they're doing, they're struggling to cut down trash mobs, and on the final boss of banished cells they aren't listening to me about the bubbles, they keep killing the ads and when they dont kill the ads they let too many pile up, the tank is bringing the ads near the boss and letting a few run off. The DPS is so minuscule I as a WARDEN HEALER am the one having to destroy the orbs because their DPS is so *** low they couldn't even prevent the boss from healing.
It's an ABSOLUTE NIGHTMARE to roll as anything BUT a DPS now in days. Now I've always been the guy to go after whoever was slandering the baggage in the group. In fact as my main DPS the other day I had a cp20 dps with me who was doing no DPS at all, and he ended up getting locked out the final boss so I completed it myself with the tank and healer. They wanted to kick the guy for not knowing what hes doing and having low dps, but I defended him and gave him a basic rundown. But now, I'm tired of it. No more Mr. NicePUG. The past three days I've been put into a group with a bad DPS on my healer. And I'm not having it anymore, I understand 100% why people vote low levels and low DPS bad roles. It's because of the people I've been having to deal with these past few days. I'm aware there are low CP DPS that are actually competent and can pull out as much DPS as their gear will allow them to. But guess what? I'm not risking ti anymore, I'm not going to waste 30mins to an hour on a group that struggled to cut down trash mobs or follow basic mechanics.
So now, if you're a low CP, or just bad at the game in general and we're que'd together, I'm kicking you. If the group doesn't want to kick you then I'm finding a new one. If the entire group is bad/low CP, then I'm finding a new one. I'll wait my 15 minutes for a reque because YOU'LL still be on the first trash mob within that time frame. If people want to come onto the forums and *** and complain about being kicked from a group because they're a khajiit mage, low CP. or bad at the game then how about getting good, leveling up, and not using a *** build? It's really not hard, you can pull a bare minimum of 20k DPS with any class at any level. The only excuse is incompetence, there are plenty of public builds to base on one. There is plenty of information on how to pull more DPS. A tank or healer, they don't even have to help the group to finish a dungeon, sure it's extremely helpful to contribute resources and keep buffs/debuffs, but is it really needed? No. A DPS however, guess what if you can't do AOE damage it's not going to work. If you can pull a minuscule 20k single target dps, it's not going to work. Go role as a Healer or a Tank and get good at that, you'll get a group faster and you'll save people like me from having our time wasted on you not knowing how to play your role properly. The DPS in this game is the hardest role, a healer/tank can run through a dungeon just as quickly as a really good healer/tank, but a bad DPS cannot even compete with a good DPS. So please, if you're one of these people and reading this, LEARN TO DPS, get a build that you can at least pull 20k. You can even go around grabbing random sets and you'll manage to be a tolerable DPS. Just for the love of god stop this low DPS arguably FAKE DPS *** in ques.
When I'm the person of all people saying this, you know there's a problem.
Whats your in game @name? I will save you the trouble and just boot you from any group i am in....9 -
Sibenice✭✭✭✭central_scrutinizer wrote: »Luckily I always roll with a buddy, and we usually kick anybody who is so gimped that they try to kick people who don't deserve it.
I don't care about your backstory for why you're a primadonna. If you can't handle pugs, you should form your own group, period.
It's not about being a prima donna or about not being able to handle pugs. It's about groups that cannot finish the content because of lack of ability. Normal dungeons you can run with anyone in any build. Vet dungeons you cannot. There is a minimum required damage and healing output as well as a minimum amount of damage tanks can tank to be able to do the dungeons. If that's not being met then the most reasonable thing for the good of the group is to remove the weakest link and try to get someone better.
I agree that kicking people who don't deserve it is extremely rude. Especially if those people are dps because of queue times. But, that is not what is being discussed here. If someone cannot pull their weight in Vet dungeons to the point that the group is not being able to progress then they are being a hindrance to three other people and need to reevaluate.5 -
JasmineMcCoy✭✭JasmineMcCoy wrote: »As somebody who struggles to even get above 10k in the field, it's truly disheartening to read that, apparently, now a everybody and their dog can easily do 30k+ dps.
I'd say the majority of people can't do 30k dps. The majority of people also don't step into content that needs that.
As far as yours specifically. Why don't you break down what you're wearing, what you're using.... class, race, skills, CP number and allocation, and what you think you're struggling with and I'm sure we can help you as with others in this thread who have brought up their specifics.
DK, DE, alcast dual wield + bow sta build excluding caltrops (don't have the skill yet), 380 CP, 5x hunding rage, 4x night mother (purple, divines, nirn+precise/nirn), vampire for improved mag/sta regen, dubious camoran and weapon power buffs.
I know it's far from min-maxed, but I don't need more than 20k dps just yet on this char (I plan to change the de to magdk and pass all the gear to the redguard stablade I'm levelling). It seems like golding my weapons will help (I was told the difference was negligible, so never did).
One of the issues is sustain. Once I run out of stamina, my rotation goes out of the window. I also have issues with animation cancelling, I'm praticing but I don't want to spend all my gaming time in front of the dummy, so it's a slow progress. The third problem is that while I'm able to keep the rotation with a dummy, I have trouble to do it in a dungeon or trial, where I have to worry about boss moving, boss aoe, positioning, etc. My dps on a dummy is 15-17k, inside a trial it sometimes goes even below 10.2 -
kongkim✭✭✭✭✭Posts like OP. its what made me don't what to play anymore, and only look back in from time to time.
Its people like that ruin the game for a lot.
I know right? How dare the OP complain about people not pulling their own weight, he should just shut up and carry you like a good little pack mule.
Maybe the elite should try not being A-holes to people trying to learn it and not force people to use builds they like and call meta.
Veterans are not THAT hard, and most of the time it's just the elite whining about using 5min more of their time.3 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Smasherx74 wrote: »Lots of words
The problem you describe is real, but there is a fine line between wanting a group commiserate with your level of play and being an elitist swine. Most of the time you will never know when you cross it.
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rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »The elitist echo chamber thread still going strong, huh?
Eh, you can't say there isn't *some* merit in what he said.
If you have ever used the matchmaking system and been the only solid player and experience the sheer pain of it, well then you know.
Or queued as a dps and watched the other dps using snipe and no aoe and running around with 11k health.3 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »The elitist echo chamber thread still going strong, huh?
People say crap like this where they like to name call, but I made sure I was ready before burdening others with my gameplay in vet dungeons. I suffer through not-yet-ready groups and am very supportive of people who don't know what they are doing when in a vet dungeon, but I have more ability to do that as a tank.
Thing is, there is the Internet out there and people can try to figure out what they are doing if they are having a hard time in group play if they give a crap about the other 3 people. Wishing others gave a crap is not elitism.4 -
Seri✭✭✭✭
Gold armor is pretty negligible but weapons is generally a good idea to gold out.JasmineMcCoy wrote: »I know it's far from min-maxed, but I don't need more than 20k dps just yet on this char (I plan to change the de to magdk and pass all the gear to the redguard stablade I'm levelling). It seems like golding my weapons will help (I was told the difference was negligible, so never did).
Plenty of people here have agreed that forcing certain what might be called a 'meta' build is excessive, and people kicking 'just because', without seeing what early pulls, etc, are like are being rude. You don't need meta at all to complete all the vanilla dungeons (unless you call mag DD wearing light armor and stam DD wearing medium the meta).Posts like OP. its what made me don't what to play anymore, and only look back in from time to time.
Its people like that ruin the game for a lot.
I know right? How dare the OP complain about people not pulling their own weight, he should just shut up and carry you like a good little pack mule.
Maybe the elite should try not being A-holes to people trying to learn it and not force people to use builds they like and call meta.
Veterans are not THAT hard, and most of the time it's just the elite whining about using 5min more of their time.
The main issues in this thread (and the OP to a degree) are about when CP500+ DPS queue in and then the group dps total might be 20k single target - ie, less than 10k per person.EP CP160+ Templar, Sorc, NB
DC CP160+ Templar, Sorc, DK1 -
Sophocles1✭✭✭One kind of funny thing is a lot of these excellent players also complain content is too easy. So this is a solution for you! We make it a challenge for you to heroically carry us thru dungeons you are doing by rote otherwise6
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Aebaradath✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I'm hard-pressed to believe that considering the majority of posts of elitist ilk in this thread is just of the typical "you're wrong, I'm right" mentality that doesn't help anyone. The only thing I (partially) agree with is that a DPS should be able to hold his own and contribute to the group, but not that they need to use a specific set or need to pull the laughably stupid 50k minimum DPS that's being passed around in this thread.rfennell_ESO wrote: »PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »The elitist echo chamber thread still going strong, huh?
Eh, you can't say there isn't *some* merit in what he said.
If you have ever used the matchmaking system and been the only solid player and experience the sheer pain of it, well then you know.
Or queued as a dps and watched the other dps using snipe and no aoe and running around with 11k health.4 -
Aurielle✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »
I'm hard-pressed to believe that considering the majority of posts of elitist ilk in this thread is just of the typical "you're wrong, I'm right" mentality that doesn't help anyone. The only thing I (partially) agree with is that a DPS should be able to hold his own and contribute to the group, but not that they need to use a specific set or need to pull the laughably stupid 50k minimum DPS that's being passed around in this thread.rfennell_ESO wrote: »PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »The elitist echo chamber thread still going strong, huh?
Eh, you can't say there isn't *some* merit in what he said.
If you have ever used the matchmaking system and been the only solid player and experience the sheer pain of it, well then you know.
Or queued as a dps and watched the other dps using snipe and no aoe and running around with 11k health.
I don’t think anyone here is asking for 50k DPS minimum... I’ve tanked vet dungeons where I’ve done more DPS than any individual damage dealer. My tank does 10k DPS on the Precursor. You can’t complete dungeons like vet CoA II when the tank who does 10k DPS is dealing the most damage in the group...
20-25k DPS is an achievable goal for ANYONE who is committed to improving their DPS.
3 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
Gold armor is pretty negligible but weapons is generally a good idea to gold out.JasmineMcCoy wrote: »I know it's far from min-maxed, but I don't need more than 20k dps just yet on this char (I plan to change the de to magdk and pass all the gear to the redguard stablade I'm levelling). It seems like golding my weapons will help (I was told the difference was negligible, so never did).
Plenty of people here have agreed that forcing certain what might be called a 'meta' build is excessive, and people kicking 'just because', without seeing what early pulls, etc, are like are being rude. You don't need meta at all to complete all the vanilla dungeons (unless you call mag DD wearing light armor and stam DD wearing medium the meta).Posts like OP. its what made me don't what to play anymore, and only look back in from time to time.
Its people like that ruin the game for a lot.
I know right? How dare the OP complain about people not pulling their own weight, he should just shut up and carry you like a good little pack mule.
Maybe the elite should try not being A-holes to people trying to learn it and not force people to use builds they like and call meta.
Veterans are not THAT hard, and most of the time it's just the elite whining about using 5min more of their time.
The main issues in this thread (and the OP to a degree) are about when CP500+ DPS queue in and then the group dps total might be 20k single target - ie, less than 10k per person.
I've suffered through 2 DPS with ~7k dps. They have ~150CP and we completed hard mode. It took forever, but I rarely kick and almost never bail.
That being said, I wouldn't judge anyone who chose to bail. And I don't see the problem with people leaving a group they don't enjoy. So long as they don't make rude comments, what is the big deal? Sure, it inconveniences those left. But the person who left was inconvenienced by group members who don't bother to learn what they need to do to not be a burden on others. I don't see why that individual needs to take one for the team when others didn't. So long as they leave out petty parting shots.5 -
What_In_Tarnation✭✭✭✭"Have you ever been so elitist that you're telling everyone need to carry low dps in veteran dungeons, otherwise you're elitist."
Maybe not everyone can pulling double weights, because most of people can only pull their own wieght. Have you ever think about it? Nah, cause you're so elitist.
The one more ironic thing in this thread is, a-holes tell people don't use group finder if you don't wanna get bad dps in dguneons, even though that system is meant for everyone. Even OP got fed up so much, he didn't even tell low dps stop using group finder in this thread. Who's more a-hole here?
Once again.
Edited by What_In_Tarnation on July 8, 2018 4:17PM3 -
kringled_1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
I don’t think anyone here is asking for 50k DPS minimum... I’ve tanked vet dungeons where I’ve done more DPS than any individual damage dealer. My tank does 10k DPS on the Precursor. You can’t complete dungeons like vet CoA II when the tank who does 10k DPS is dealing the most damage in the group...
20-25k DPS is an achievable goal for ANYONE who is committed to improving their DPS.
I would agree that 20-25K dps is very achievable, and I find it's sufficient for just about every base-game vet dungeon, and almost every normal trial. I can't currently do higher; I think odds are near certain that my rotation is messy and weaving is imperfect and could use practice. I don't currently try to do vet DLC dungeons or vet trials.
There's definitely a few posts in this thread though, that are along the lines of 'if you don't pull 30k you don't belong in vet content' which I think is overkill, and the 'I can do 30k with blockade and spamming light attacks' which if it's not BS implies vMA destro and probably Siroria, which is not exactly a beginner's setup.
I do think it would be useful to give people some official guidance on where they should be to do particular kinds of content and easier access to a dummy for beginners; it would at least keep people who want to pull their own weight in the range of content they're ready for.4 -
LadyNalcarya✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »
I'm hard-pressed to believe that considering the majority of posts of elitist ilk in this thread is just of the typical "you're wrong, I'm right" mentality that doesn't help anyone. The only thing I (partially) agree with is that a DPS should be able to hold his own and contribute to the group, but not that they need to use a specific set or need to pull the laughably stupid 50k minimum DPS that's being passed around in this thread.rfennell_ESO wrote: »PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »The elitist echo chamber thread still going strong, huh?
Eh, you can't say there isn't *some* merit in what he said.
If you have ever used the matchmaking system and been the only solid player and experience the sheer pain of it, well then you know.
Or queued as a dps and watched the other dps using snipe and no aoe and running around with 11k health.
Please quote any "elitist" from this thread who claims that you can't do vet dungeons if you do less than 50k. Seriously, try to find at least one.
Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason
PC/EU4 -
What_In_Tarnation✭✭✭✭kringled_1 wrote: »
I don’t think anyone here is asking for 50k DPS minimum... I’ve tanked vet dungeons where I’ve done more DPS than any individual damage dealer. My tank does 10k DPS on the Precursor. You can’t complete dungeons like vet CoA II when the tank who does 10k DPS is dealing the most damage in the group...
20-25k DPS is an achievable goal for ANYONE who is committed to improving their DPS.
I would agree that 20-25K dps is very achievable, and I find it's sufficient for just about every base-game vet dungeon, and almost every normal trial. I can't currently do higher; I think odds are near certain that my rotation is messy and weaving is imperfect and could use practice. I don't currently try to do vet DLC dungeons or vet trials.
There's definitely a few posts in this thread though, that are along the lines of 'if you don't pull 30k you don't belong in vet content' which I think is overkill, and the 'I can do 30k with blockade and spamming light attacks' which if it's not BS implies vMA destro and probably Siroria, which is not exactly a beginner's setup.
I do think it would be useful to give people some official guidance on where they should be to do particular kinds of content and easier access to a dummy for beginners; it would at least keep people who want to pull their own weight in the range of content they're ready for.
Not sure how many cp you have, but I can give you my own experience before I get my vMA staff/bow.
I had a breton magicka nightblade without any trial/dungeon sets (but have monster set), she only wear juliano + spinner + grothdarr. Not really a fancy setup at all. The best I can do on 3m dummy is 35k+, but on 6m dummy it will drop to 32k+ dps. And I'm not even good at magicka nightblade rotations, but I'll try to keep up all of DoTs.
And I think you know what's your issue exactly and you've said it by yourself. It's mostly because of rotations and weaving.
I do believe most of players who suffer of low DPs can't really keep up their DoTs. If you have combat metrics on, you can simply check which abilities contribute better DPS in your rotations. So, try to keep up the ones that actually hit hard.2 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »
I'm hard-pressed to believe that considering the majority of posts of elitist ilk in this thread is just of the typical "you're wrong, I'm right" mentality that doesn't help anyone. The only thing I (partially) agree with is that a DPS should be able to hold his own and contribute to the group, but not that they need to use a specific set or need to pull the laughably stupid 50k minimum DPS that's being passed around in this thread.rfennell_ESO wrote: »PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »The elitist echo chamber thread still going strong, huh?
Eh, you can't say there isn't *some* merit in what he said.
If you have ever used the matchmaking system and been the only solid player and experience the sheer pain of it, well then you know.
Or queued as a dps and watched the other dps using snipe and no aoe and running around with 11k health.
Oh absolutely.
Game has been rife with the elitist "you must be this height to enter" types since launch.
I couldn't tell you what dps I achieve as I turn that crap off as I don't care and don't have a desire for "raiding".
Even so, you can tell when someone is contributing in a dungeon. It's plainly obvious and oftimes it's pretty damned annoying if you are doing some of the non-vanilla dungeons.
The unsaid issue is people that queue with characters they *know* will not be contributing and are just a carry. Those people will always be on the "u r elitist, ZOS plz ban" mentality.
Most "raiding" guilds have a dps test requirement and they aren't bringing along unless you are "certified" (yes, there are always exceptions... but the vast majority of guilds that raid and want it not to turn into a debacle engage in dps tests on target dummies for members).
Point being, what's the criteria for someone just hobbling you because they want to be carried?1 -
smacky✭✭✭kringled_1 wrote: »
I don’t think anyone here is asking for 50k DPS minimum... I’ve tanked vet dungeons where I’ve done more DPS than any individual damage dealer. My tank does 10k DPS on the Precursor. You can’t complete dungeons like vet CoA II when the tank who does 10k DPS is dealing the most damage in the group...
20-25k DPS is an achievable goal for ANYONE who is committed to improving their DPS.
I would agree that 20-25K dps is very achievable, and I find it's sufficient for just about every base-game vet dungeon, and almost every normal trial. I can't currently do higher; I think odds are near certain that my rotation is messy and weaving is imperfect and could use practice. I don't currently try to do vet DLC dungeons or vet trials.
There's definitely a few posts in this thread though, that are along the lines of 'if you don't pull 30k you don't belong in vet content' which I think is overkill, and the 'I can do 30k with blockade and spamming light attacks' which if it's not BS implies vMA destro and probably Siroria, which is not exactly a beginner's setup.
I do think it would be useful to give people some official guidance on where they should be to do particular kinds of content and easier access to a dummy for beginners; it would at least keep people who want to pull their own weight in the range of content they're ready for.
If you can 25k DPS on a target dummy (3 mi or higher) then you are good enough for Vet Trials.
At 35K+ you are good enought for Vet HM trials.
The person on Page 1 suggesting everyone has to pull 40-50k is ridiculous. Not everyone plays BiS and you don;t need to play BiS or Meta to pull these numbers.
You can run Mad Tinkerers with Siroria's and Ilambris and pull 35k DPS. - (NO vMA staff required)
That said, Animation Cancelling is not avaiable to those of us with a 300+ ping constantly. We can successfully AC 10% of the time, and that is off a number of decent players in a trials guild testing it.
I avg 18-25k on a 3 mil dummy and comfortable held my own in a vSCP which we completed in less than 2 hours.
I am running Mad Tinkerers and Infallable Aether with Illambris and an Asylum Lightning staff front bar.
My mad tinkerer's is great for crowd control, and I am a magsorc throwing AoE's and DoT's down while shielding myself and getting revives constantly. (You can;t DPS / Heal or Tank if you are dead).
There are so many options you can run in this game, and the only way someone discovers a new "meta" is by trying new setups.
I personally take greater affront to people queuing as tanks and healers when they are dps.Edited by smacky on July 8, 2018 6:08PM2 -
xirub17_ESO✭✭rfennell_ESO wrote: »Point being, what's the criteria for someone just hobbling you because they want to be carried?
Help them before you carry them, or don't. What if the set they need are in the dungeon they queue'd for?
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Asardes✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭JasmineMcCoy wrote: »JasmineMcCoy wrote: »As somebody who struggles to even get above 10k in the field, it's truly disheartening to read that, apparently, now a everybody and their dog can easily do 30k+ dps.
I'd say the majority of people can't do 30k dps. The majority of people also don't step into content that needs that.
As far as yours specifically. Why don't you break down what you're wearing, what you're using.... class, race, skills, CP number and allocation, and what you think you're struggling with and I'm sure we can help you as with others in this thread who have brought up their specifics.
DK, DE, alcast dual wield + bow sta build excluding caltrops (don't have the skill yet), 380 CP, 5x hunding rage, 4x night mother (purple, divines, nirn+precise/nirn), vampire for improved mag/sta regen, dubious camoran and weapon power buffs.
I know it's far from min-maxed, but I don't need more than 20k dps just yet on this char (I plan to change the de to magdk and pass all the gear to the redguard stablade I'm levelling). It seems like golding my weapons will help (I was told the difference was negligible, so never did).
One of the issues is sustain. Once I run out of stamina, my rotation goes out of the window. I also have issues with animation cancelling, I'm praticing but I don't want to spend all my gaming time in front of the dummy, so it's a slow progress. The third problem is that while I'm able to keep the rotation with a dummy, I have trouble to do it in a dungeon or trial, where I have to worry about boss moving, boss aoe, positioning, etc. My dps on a dummy is 15-17k, inside a trial it sometimes goes even below 10.
Have you tried doing HA (Heavy Attack) with every skill on front bar? That way you'll never run out of resources. The way to do it is to wait till about half way trough the HA animation and then press the skill button: Ex.
Buff with Molten Armaments, drink Essence of Weapon Power, swap bar
HA->Noxious Breath->HA->Venomous Claw->HA->Rending Slashes->HA*->Deadly Cloak->HA*->Rearming Trap->swap->LA->Flames of Oblivion->LA->Eldless Hail->LA->Poison Injection->LA->Razor Caltrops;
recast Molten Armaments every 2nd rotation to keep Minor Brutality up, drink potion when it's off cooldown.
*you can also do LA here instead in one or both cases if you are getting enough stamina back from the other 3 HA to speed the rotation up by about 0.6s
Make sure to have Alchemy: Medicinal Use 3/3, as otherwise it's impossible to keep 100% up time on Major Brutality & Savagery.
This kind of rotation will easily do 27-30K and has infinite sustain. Also HA rotations are not as vulnerable to lag or low FPS. LA only rotations on stamina characters are only achievable if you're Redguard, have full group support and you are very experienced with mechanics, so you don't have to burn extra resources blocking or breaking free from some mechanics you failed.Edited by Asardes on July 8, 2018 6:44PMBeta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
vMA (The Flawless Conqueror) | vVH (Spirit Slayer & of the Undying Song) | vDSA | vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMoL | vAS+1 | Emperor
PC-EU CP 3000+
41,000+ Achievement Points before High IsleMember of:
Pact Veteran Trade: Exemplary
Traders of the Covenant: God of Sales
Tamriels Emporium: God of Sales
Valinor Overflow: Trader
The Traveling Merchant: Silver
Characters:
Asardes | 50 Nord Dragonknight | EP AR 50 | Master Crafter: all traits & recipes, all styles released before High Isle
Alxaril Nelcarion | 50 High Elf Sorcerer | AD AR 20 |
Dro'Bear Three-paws | 50 Khajiit Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
Veronique Nicole | 50 Breton Templar | DC AR 20 |
Sabina Flavia Cosades | 50 Imperial Warden | EP AR 20 |
Ervesa Neloren | 50 Dark Elf Dragonknight | EP AR 20 |
Fendar Khodwin | 50 Redguard Sorcerer | DC AR 20 |
Surilanwe of Lillandril | 50 High Elf Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
Joleen the Swift | 50 Redguard Templar | DC AR 20 |
Draynor Telvanni | 50 Dark Elf Warden | EP AR 20 |
Claudius Tharn | 50 Necromancer | DC AR 20 |
Nazura-la the Bonedancer | 50 Necromancer | AD AR 20 |
Tharkul gro-Shug | 50 Orc Dragonknight | DC AR 4 |
Ushruka gra-Lhurgash | 50 Orc Sorcerer | AD AR 4 |
Cienwen ferch Llywelyn | 50 Breton Nightblade | DC AR 4 |
Plays-with-Sunray | 50 Argonian Templar | EP AR 4 |
Milariel | 50 Wood Elf Warden | AD AR 4 |
Scheei-Jul | 50 Necromancer | EP AR 4 |
PC-NA CP 1800+
30,000+ Achievement Points before High IsleMember of:
Savage Blade: Majestic Machette
Characters:
Asardes the Exile | 50 Nord Dragonknight | EP AR 30 |3 -
Ghanima_Atreides✭✭✭✭✭
✭I know this is a bit off topic, but as someone who has only PUG'd twice in her life, I wondered:
On NORMAL difficulty:
If you end up in a dungeon you haven't done before and don't know the mechanics, is it considered wise to say so and ask for explanations? Or, since it's normal mode, just wing it? Is the very admission that you don't know the mechanics grounds for being kicked? I'm thinking especially of later DLC dungeons with more complicated/difficult mechanics.[The Beauty of Tamriel] My collection of ESO screenshots
Show me a completely smooth operation and I'll show you someone who's covering mistakes. Real boats rock.0 -
xirub17_ESO✭✭Ghanima_Atreides wrote: »I know this is a bit off topic, but as someone who has only PUG'd twice in her life, I wondered:
On NORMAL difficulty:
If you end up in a dungeon you haven't done before and don't know the mechanics, is it considered wise to say so and ask for explanations? Or, since it's normal mode, just wing it? Is the very admission that you don't know the mechanics grounds for being kicked? I'm thinking especially of later DLC dungeons with more complicated/difficult mechanics.
Or in the same measure, maybe your trying out tanking for the first time, and also trying to learn how, plus the mechanics?
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