Jerkling wrote: »

Dymence wrote: »

You have no idea how the game works.

The color of the damage has nothing to do with any of this. Orange damage indicates a single target DoT on the target, but that doesn't mean white damage cannot be a DoT.

Things like wall of elements, liquid lightning, twisting path, caltrops, endless hail and so on, will all show white damage numbers, and yet they are AOE DoTs. They scale with Thaumaturge CP, and they do not proc any set that requires direct damage.

orange indicates a DoT and a DoT is a DoT, there is no different kinds of DoTs and it does mean white damage can not be a DoT. you just don't understand how damage works, it's as simple as that.



there is no such thing as AoE DoTs (the idea is rediculous!) and AoE abilites do not scale with Thaumaturge, they scale with Master-at-Arms, therefor it's direct damage. don't believe me? go and test it for yourself and feel foolish.

Destruent wrote: »

^This and nothing else....

laugh all you want, you are the fool here.

You must be really new to the game or really bad at testing things if You belive all what You said above is true. If what You said would be true then for example Skoria wouldnt proc from over half of the abilities that currently are proccing it.

Also yes there are different type of DoTs that belongs to certain criterias like : single target , AoEs applied on activation , ground based AoEs , Dots applied as primary effect , Dots applied as secondary effects , chanelled abilities etc. Sometimes multiple criteria are connected together in 1 ability. Dots have even different behaviours based on the type they are like for example AoE Dots have 1% chance to apply status effect per tick when single target DoTs have 3% chance for that.

If You really belive indicators then You really need to have more time together with zenimax in their game until you'll start to take part in conversations about game mechanics. There is lot of DoTs that have white indicators and beliving in indicator colors is childlish.

Edited : Since I assume You're one of those who'll defend their imaginary theorie until they wont see real proff here You have it Blockade of Storms and Ilambris which are both ground based AoEs and have white indicators for dmg

with 0 CP into thaumaturge



with 52 CP into thaumaturge

Jerkling wrote: »

Dymence wrote: »

Oh fancy that, you didn't actually test anything. Who would've thought?

The game has functioned like this since launch. Which has been said time and time again. Still don't know why you are so stuck on the idea that damage over time cannot expire when someone walks out of the AOE. What does it even matter? It's damage over time. This is how the game works. And ZOS has been balancing PVE encounters and sets around this fact.

ya, i did. the tooltips are as good an indicator as any, just in this case it was actually not.

i doubt it has been said time and time again since if it had, this would have been fixed already. that you think AoE is damage over time shows you don't understand the concept of AoE at all. and it's not how the game works, AoE still deals direct damage, this damage just happens to scale with Thaumaturge and procs Valkyn Skoria.
but it's technicly impossible that AoEs deal damage over time and if you get behind the concept of AoEs you'll see why. you're hung up on the idea that these kinds of AoE deal damage within a timeframe, but unlike DoTs they don't deal an overall amount over a period, they deal their damage again and again and again. like a spike trap on the group, if you stand on/in it when it comes up you get damaged, if not you don't. and that's not damage over time, that's recurring damage.

Still don't know why you are so stuck on the idea that damage over time cannot expire when someone walks out of the AOE. What does it even matter?

because then it's not damage over time anymore. when you step into the AoE you get hit once. it's not sticking with you and ticking down on you. that's direct damage. the tooltips of actual DoTs like Cripple and AoEs like Wall of Elements make this distincting in their tooltips and exactly this distinction makes the on being damage over time (X damage over Z seconds) and the other being direct damage (X damage each Y seconds). the one is a punch in the face every time you come to close, the other is you being on fire and burning up.

Destruent wrote: »

@Jerkling have you ever thought about tooltips being bugged?

no, why would i think the tooltip would be bugged? things like this shouldn't happen (for long) in a multimillion dollar game like this. but i'm sure you haven't thought about this either.

Juhasow wrote: »

You must be really new to the game or really bad at testing things if You belive all what You said above is true.

you are like 3 days to late to this discussion, nothing you say hasn't been said already and some of it is even false. and thank you for the lecture, but i really don't need you to explain the game to me. also yes, i do believe that it's true, it's factual true.

Juhasow wrote: »

There is lot of DoTs that have white indicators and beliving in indicator colors is childlish.

no, there aren't. and really? what else is "childish", crossing the street? saying hello to a neighbor? drinking a glass of water?

Oh so now we're redifining meaning of DoTs and creating new category of "recurring damage" ? Why there is no "recurring damage" category in the screen You've posted ? Can You show which indicators are reserved for "reccuring damage" and give atleast 1 example where zenimax actually mention about it and calls it "recurring damage"?

Looks like You know better what is what then zenimax. Things like Ilambris , twisting path , liquid lightning etc are buffed by CP passive that buffs damage over time they procs sets in the game that requires damage over time , they are not affected by passive that buffs direct dmg and also do not proc sets that requires direct dmg to proc but for You those are still not damage over time effects ? There is no "recurring damage" category in CP. Why ?

Also since by Your meaning Dots cannot be AoE can You please explain me for example what Pillar of the Nirn set is ? It explodes with initial 2k dmg and then applies bleed damage on every enemie that was in the range of the circle and that bleed damage stays on everyone. Is that bleed dmg DoT or reccuring dmg and since there is no posibility for AoE Dots why this bleed is applied on multiple targets at once ? What new definition of dmg You have for that ?

Can You explain why on website that is basicly designed to dig through game code and find informations there when it comes to status effects we have chart where there is clearly mentioning of AoE Dots and their chance to apply status effects plus skills You would consider "reccuring" or direct dmg like Elemental Blockade , Liquid Lightning , Ilambris etc are actually following that rule and have 1% chance to apply status effect on every tick ? Shouldnt those abilites have chance of direct dmg AoEs ?



Also I have nice quiz for You. Twisting path according to You is a direct dmg and recurring dmg but not damage over time. This skill for quite some time was actually doing direct dmg and guess what developers did with that when they realized it. Here is a little note for You from Horns of the Reach patch notes :

Nightblade
Shadow
Twisting Path (Path of Darkness morph): Fixed an issue where this morph was not being considered a damage over time effect.

Guess what color Twisting Path indicator have ? Yes white. So even developers says this skill is damage over time and when it wasnt it was a bug but You still know better even better then people that created this game and rules for it ?

Have You ever considered a fact that there can be more then 1 version of DoTs in this game and orange indicators may be reserved only for 1 of them but that doesnt mean it's the only one ?

Juhasow wrote: »

Oh so now we're redifining meaning of DoTs and creating new category of "recurring damage" ? Why there is no "recurring damage" category in the screen You've posted ? Can You show which indicators are reserved for "reccuring damage" and give atleast 1 example where zenimax actually mention about it and calls it "recurring damage"?

i guess you don't understand the word "recurring" or you don't understand what recurring means. it's like when i keep stabbing you with a dagger - i deal direct damage with each hit but i keep stabbing you multiple times.

Juhasow wrote: »

Looks like You know better what is what then zenimax. Things like Ilambris , twisting path , liquid lightning etc are buffed by CP passive that buffs damage over time they procs sets in the game that requires damage over time , they are not affected by passive that buffs direct dmg and also do not proc sets that requires direct dmg to proc but for You those are still not damage over time effects ? There is no "recurring damage" category in CP. Why ?

like i said before, you are like 3 days late to this discussing and all of that has already been said, even by me.

Juhasow wrote: »

Also since by Your meaning Dots cannot be AoE can You please explain me for example what Pillar of the Nirn set is ? It explodes with initial 2k dmg and then applies bleed damage on every enemie that was in the range of the circle and that bleed damage stays on everyone. Is that bleed dmg DoT or reccuring dmg and since there is no posibility for AoE Dots why this bleed is applied on multiple targets at once ? What new definition of dmg You have for that ?

well, sure. first it deals an initial AoE direct damage burst and then it spreads a DoT to any target initially hit. but since this is pretty self-explaining i'd say you don't actually understand the argument, because this isn't the type of AoE we are talking about, even tho this set has an AoE part (which is also direct damage as you surely can agree on).

Juhasow wrote: »

Can You explain why on website that is basicly designed to dig through game code and find informations there when it comes to status effects we have chart where there is clearly mentioning of AoE Dots and their chance to apply status effects plus skills You would consider "reccuring" or direct dmg like Elemental Blockade , Liquid Lightning , Ilambris etc are actually following that rule and have 1% chance to apply status effect on every tick ? Shouldnt those abilites have chance of direct dmg AoEs ?



Also I have nice quiz for You. Twisting path according to You is a direct dmg and recurring dmg but not damage over time. This skill for quite some time was actually doing direct dmg and guess what developers did with that when they realized it. Here is a little note for You from Horns of the Reach patch notes :

Nightblade
Shadow
Twisting Path (Path of Darkness morph): Fixed an issue where this morph was not being considered a damage over time effect.

Guess what color Twisting Path indicator have ? Yes white. So even developers says this skill is damage over time and when it wasnt it was a bug but You still know better even better then people that created this game and rules for it ?

Have You ever considered a fact that there can be more then 1 version of DoTs in this game and orange indicators may be reserved only for 1 of them but that doesnt mean it's the only one ?

as we have already established, yes, abilities like Twisting Path scale with Thaumaturge and they do proc the Skoria set. the fact still remains that these abilities deal direct damage. and here is the last time i'm trying to explain why, even tho i've done that roughly 5 times already, even in my previous post.

if you step into an AoE like Twisting Path you get damaged, right? does this damage stick to you, like let's say the damage of Cripple? no, it doesn't. it just dealt the damage for this one tick. if you step out of the AoE nothing else will happen, right?
that's like the spike traps on the floor, right? they stab you each time they come up, just like if someone would stab you with a dagger. would you say the floor has a DoT on him? probably not, wouldn't even makes sense since the floor doesn't take damage (or maybe it does, who knows!).
anyhow, this fact is even agknowledged in the tooltips of these abilities. X damage each Y seconds for AoEs like Twisting Path ("each Y seconds", that's the recurring part, fyi, the damage recurs every Y seconds). DoTs on the other hand deal X damage over Z seconds. they apply a pool of damage to you that ticks down (the overall damage is broken down for each tick).

so let's do a little thought experiment here. let's say we have a DoT like Cripple that deals 10k damage over 10 seconds. and we have a AoE ability like Twisting Path that deals 1000 damage each 1 second. what would happen if we move the time for the duration of the effect towards infinity?
the damage of Cripple would move towards 0 since it has to spread the 10k damage over infinit seconds. and what would happen to the damage of Twisting Path, you ask? well, actually nothing, it would still deal 1000 damage each 1 second, because that's just how its damage is defined.

i don't know better than ZOS, but it's not a matter of knowing better, it's a matter of creative freedom and balancing tons of abilities. if ZOS decides they want this kind of AoE abilities to be DoT damage then that's their prerogative. and if they decide that trees can talk then that too.
it doesn't change the fact that my argument is reasonable and sound and it doesn't change the fact that these abilities in fact deal direct damage to you on every tick (a technical inevitability) either.
so make of that what you wish, i stand by my oppinion whether you like it or not.

Jerkling wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Oh so now we're redifining meaning of DoTs and creating new category of "recurring damage" ? Why there is no "recurring damage" category in the screen You've posted ? Can You show which indicators are reserved for "reccuring damage" and give atleast 1 example where zenimax actually mention about it and calls it "recurring damage"?

i guess you don't understand the word "recurring" or you don't understand what recurring means. it's like when i keep stabbing you with a dagger - i deal direct damage with each hit but i keep stabbing you multiple times.

Juhasow wrote: »

Looks like You know better what is what then zenimax. Things like Ilambris , twisting path , liquid lightning etc are buffed by CP passive that buffs damage over time they procs sets in the game that requires damage over time , they are not affected by passive that buffs direct dmg and also do not proc sets that requires direct dmg to proc but for You those are still not damage over time effects ? There is no "recurring damage" category in CP. Why ?

like i said before, you are like 3 days late to this discussing and all of that has already been said, even by me.

Juhasow wrote: »

Also since by Your meaning Dots cannot be AoE can You please explain me for example what Pillar of the Nirn set is ? It explodes with initial 2k dmg and then applies bleed damage on every enemie that was in the range of the circle and that bleed damage stays on everyone. Is that bleed dmg DoT or reccuring dmg and since there is no posibility for AoE Dots why this bleed is applied on multiple targets at once ? What new definition of dmg You have for that ?

well, sure. first it deals an initial AoE direct damage burst and then it spreads a DoT to any target initially hit. but since this is pretty self-explaining i'd say you don't actually understand the argument, because this isn't the type of AoE we are talking about, even tho this set has an AoE part (which is also direct damage as you surely can agree on).

Juhasow wrote: »

Can You explain why on website that is basicly designed to dig through game code and find informations there when it comes to status effects we have chart where there is clearly mentioning of AoE Dots and their chance to apply status effects plus skills You would consider "reccuring" or direct dmg like Elemental Blockade , Liquid Lightning , Ilambris etc are actually following that rule and have 1% chance to apply status effect on every tick ? Shouldnt those abilites have chance of direct dmg AoEs ?



Also I have nice quiz for You. Twisting path according to You is a direct dmg and recurring dmg but not damage over time. This skill for quite some time was actually doing direct dmg and guess what developers did with that when they realized it. Here is a little note for You from Horns of the Reach patch notes :

Nightblade
Shadow
Twisting Path (Path of Darkness morph): Fixed an issue where this morph was not being considered a damage over time effect.

Guess what color Twisting Path indicator have ? Yes white. So even developers says this skill is damage over time and when it wasnt it was a bug but You still know better even better then people that created this game and rules for it ?

Have You ever considered a fact that there can be more then 1 version of DoTs in this game and orange indicators may be reserved only for 1 of them but that doesnt mean it's the only one ?

as we have already established, yes, abilities like Twisting Path scale with Thaumaturge and they do proc the Skoria set. the fact still remains that these abilities deal direct damage. and here is the last time i'm trying to explain why, even tho i've done that roughly 5 times already, even in my previous post.

if you step into an AoE like Twisting Path you get damaged, right? does this damage stick to you, like let's say the damage of Cripple? no, it doesn't. it just dealt the damage for this one tick. if you step out of the AoE nothing else will happen, right?
that's like the spike traps on the floor, right? they stab you each time they come up, just like if someone would stab you with a dagger. would you say the floor has a DoT on him? probably not, wouldn't even makes sense since the floor doesn't take damage (or maybe it does, who knows!).
anyhow, this fact is even agknowledged in the tooltips of these abilities. X damage each Y seconds for AoEs like Twisting Path ("each Y seconds", that's the recurring part, fyi, the damage recurs every Y seconds). DoTs on the other hand deal X damage over Z seconds. they apply a pool of damage to you that ticks down (the overall damage is broken down for each tick).

so let's do a little thought experiment here. let's say we have a DoT like Cripple that deals 10k damage over 10 seconds. and we have a AoE ability like Twisting Path that deals 1000 damage each 1 second. what would happen if we move the time for the duration of the effect towards infinity?
the damage of Cripple would move towards 0 since it has to spread the 10k damage over infinit seconds. and what would happen to the damage of Twisting Path, you ask? well, actually nothing, it would still deal 1000 damage each 1 second, because that's just how its damage is defined.

i don't know better than ZOS, but it's not a matter of knowing better, it's a matter of creative freedom and balancing tons of abilities. if ZOS decides they want this kind of AoE abilities to be DoT damage then that's their prerogative. and if they decide that trees can talk then that too.
it doesn't change the fact that my argument is reasonable and sound and it doesn't change the fact that these abilities in fact deal direct damage to you on every tick (a technical inevitability) either.
so make of that what you wish, i stand by my oppinion whether you like it or not.

Mate You have some kind of delusions. It's like looking at red color and saying it's green when everyone tells You it's red and when finally ophthalmologist says You You're colour-blind calling him stupid.

How can someone be so disconnected from reality that when ability works with every set that proc from DoT dmg works with every buff that buffs DoT dmg , doesnt work with any set that procs off direct dmg and with any buff that buffs direct dmg to call it direct dmg only because colors indicators are not properly updated and for him color indicators are biggesr prove for something then actual state of the things in real fights.

Recurring dmg is just Your own maked up sentence to prove Your theory. In reality Your "recurring dmg" are just DoT dmg that are not sticking to the targets and nowhere definition of DoT says that it has to be directly applied to target and stay with it. You havnt answered on so many of my quiestion and arguments and simple bypassed and ignored them that this is just laughable.

You have some need to feel special and "know better" or what ?

Btw flurry from dual wield which is I think the "stabbing" from dual wield You mentioned is actually a DoT and have orange indicators despite of doing X ticks of dmg for Y dmg each one and enemie can walk away from it's range. Radiant destruction whcih deal X amount of dmg over Y seconds of time have white indiocators. By Your concept Daedric Curse is a DoT and Noxious Breath or Strom Atronach arent. There is so many abilities that doesnt match Your concept that it's almost laughable.