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Remove Snipe from the game or remove the cast time
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Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/410499/shadow-thorn-stamina-nb-42k-dps-bow-bow-build-summerset#latest
If you´ve that attitude of yours you´re a scrub.....
42k On PTS is good to you? You realize some builds are pulling 70k correct? Like I stated previously, this is not calculus.
Those 70k DPS parses are 200% cheese and you know it. And I doubt the sets that are used in those parses will remain the same until live.
The bow build however is legit and contains little to no cheese (unless you think proc-sets are cheese)
42k single target on a target dummy is easily translated into a 50k+ parse in a raid. For a bow build that is pretty damn good.
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fierackas✭✭✭✭✭
Depends on context, I use it on single targets when soloing dungeons for efficiency, but rarely need it in vet dungeons where AoE's are more practical. Sadly there are too many know-nothings in the world who think they know better.1 -
Marto✭✭✭✭✭
✭Leave it as it is.
Since when is it mandatory for all abilities to be viable in the 2% hardest content in the game? Vet Trials are not the only way to play the game. Some people like dungeons, some people like questing, some people like arenas.
And furthermore, not all abilities and setups should be flawless. Every class, weapon type, set or bonus should have strengths and weaknesses. What brings build diversity to the game is people working around those weaknesses and building on top of the strengths.Edited by Marto on May 4, 2018 4:21PM"According to the calculations of the sages of the Cult of the Ancestor Moth, the batam guar is the cutest creature in all Tamriel"4 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammable
Depends on context, I use it on single targets when soloing dungeons for efficiency, but rarely need it in vet dungeons where AoE's are more practical. Sadly there are too many know-nothings in the world who think they know better.
kek.
Calling other people know nothings, then reading your post. No, snipe isn't needed, and you would be better with a dedicated bow spammable, though imbue might just do. Either way, snipe is Xv1 trash.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.0 -
Gallagher563✭✭✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammableI couldn't agree more. But if one of the morphs didn't have a cast time and was changed so you could apply constant pressure that would open up other options and it could be more viable in multiple situations. Not just gank builds.0
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zaria✭✭✭✭✭
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This, replacing snipe with an effective spamable would help pve. In some boss fights its not very practical to stay in melee all the time as its require to much movement.Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
lassitershawn✭✭✭✭✭
Snipe isn’t used in any good PvE builds. If I see someone using it I’m a dungeon I assume it is going to be a carry (haven’t been proven wrong yet).
William Thorne - EP Breton Sorcerer
Astrid Winterborn - EP Breton Warden
Erik Ironskin - EP Nord Dragonknight
Venasa Viri - EP Dunmer Nightblade
IR x8, GH x5, TTT x22 -
lassitershawn✭✭✭✭✭Anotherone773 wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
Eveey bow build except for maybe warden uses snipe. Maybe next patch some builds can replace snipe with crushing weapon, bit as it stands yes, snipe is used in pve
Not in any dungeon or trial I run. You will be removed so fast lol
We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.
Meanwhile snipe spammers aren’t completing any DLC dungeons or vet trials without being ridiculously hard-carried.William Thorne - EP Breton Sorcerer
Astrid Winterborn - EP Breton Warden
Erik Ironskin - EP Nord Dragonknight
Venasa Viri - EP Dunmer Nightblade
IR x8, GH x5, TTT x21 -
NyassaV✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammableIn it's current form it is not balanced at all. Especially when it can stun you from crouch. That is why there is no other category. Snipe is so powerful that I have it slotted rather than Grim Focus on my stamblade. It's not even something I use that often but it does too much damage from very far away and gives defile.Flawless Conqueror ~ Grand OverlordShe/Her ~ PC/NA | I record things for fun and for info0 -
JobooAGS✭✭✭✭✭
✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammablelassitershawn wrote: »Anotherone773 wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
Eveey bow build except for maybe warden uses snipe. Maybe next patch some builds can replace snipe with crushing weapon, bit as it stands yes, snipe is used in pve
Not in any dungeon or trial I run. You will be removed so fast lol
We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.
Meanwhile snipe spammers aren’t completing any DLC dungeons or vet trials without being ridiculously hard-carried.
Snipe using =/= snipe spammer
See https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/381498/everything-needed-to-know-about-bow-bow-in-pve/p11 -
RoyJade✭✭✭✭✭
✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammablelassitershawn wrote: »Anotherone773 wrote: »We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.
Meanwhile snipe spammers aren’t completing any DLC dungeons or vet trials without being ridiculously hard-carried.
And at the same time, those who try to do a proper build and weave snipe with other skill in a good rotation pull decent dps but are being bashed again and again by meta-locked players, even in normal dungeon.
"Not optimal = inexistent" is a curse for both the game and the community. Following this idea, stamina class should not even exist, since they were way under magicka at least twice on the lifetime of the game. But no, players tried again and again, asked for necessary buff and adjustment, and even if it's not perfect ZOS made them viable (and even meta). And for that, they need to not be stuck in a "this is meta and nothing else exist" mentality. Asking to remove the only bow spammable, which is actually useable and better than crushed weapons in most of the case, follow this bad mentality.2 -
JobooAGS✭✭✭✭✭
✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammableI'd rather see a proper bow spammable that would bring bow/bow builds into endgame content with ease without people either spamming kick or spamming leave when they see a bow/bow build without even seeing what they can do.2 -
NyassaV✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammablelassitershawn wrote: »Anotherone773 wrote: »We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.
Meanwhile snipe spammers aren’t completing any DLC dungeons or vet trials without being ridiculously hard-carried.
And at the same time, those who try to do a proper build and weave snipe with other skill in a good rotation pull decent dps but are being bashed again and again by meta-locked players, even in normal dungeon.
"Not optimal = inexistent" is a curse for both the game and the community. Following this idea, stamina class should not even exist, since they were way under magicka at least twice on the lifetime of the game. But no, players tried again and again, asked for necessary buff and adjustment, and even if it's not perfect ZOS made them viable (and even meta). And for that, they need to not be stuck in a "this is meta and nothing else exist" mentality. Asking to remove the only bow spammable, which is actually useable and better than crushed weapons in most of the case, follow this bad mentality.
It would be better to select option three if you actually care about game balance without destroying Bow/Bow DPS -_-
Seeing as that makes it a proper spammableFlawless Conqueror ~ Grand OverlordShe/Her ~ PC/NA | I record things for fun and for info0 -
RoyJade✭✭✭✭✭
✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammableIt would be better to select option three if you actually care about game balance without destroying Bow/Bow DPS -_-
Seeing as that makes it a proper spammable
That was I said on one of my first post on the topic. But you're right, I should have selected the pool option, my bad.0 -
templesus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Remove snipe (never going to happen)Anotherone773 wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
Eveey bow build except for maybe warden uses snipe. Maybe next patch some builds can replace snipe with crushing weapon, bit as it stands yes, snipe is used in pve
Not in any dungeon or trial I run. You will be removed so fast lol
We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.TequilaFire wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
As usual you are wrong, snipe is used quite a bit in PvE questing and dungeons on wait for it, bow builds.
Don't state it is a known fact when you can't back it up, or list a source.
Learn to read. I said legitimate PvE build, in reference to my previous statement about endgame. A level 20 questing build would not be warranted as a legitimate PvE build in endgame. As usual you try to refute my comments with no actual claims but rather opinions. I’m to the point of cutting off discussion with you until you pose anything meaningful.Edited by templesus on May 4, 2018 6:00PM0 -
TequilaFire✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Anotherone773 wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
Eveey bow build except for maybe warden uses snipe. Maybe next patch some builds can replace snipe with crushing weapon, bit as it stands yes, snipe is used in pve
Not in any dungeon or trial I run. You will be removed so fast lol
We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.TequilaFire wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
As usual you are wrong, snipe is used quite a bit in PvE questing and dungeons on wait for it, bow builds.
Don't state it is a known fact when you can't back it up, or list a source.
Learn to read. I said legitimate PvE build, in reference to my previous statement about endgame. A level 20 questing build would not be warranted as a legitimate PvE build in endgame. As usual you try to refute my comments with no actual data but rather opinions. I’m to the point of cutting off discussion with you until you pose anything meaningful.
Please do as everything you say revolves around 1vX whining which I have no sympathy at all for because when you choose that play style in a game not balanced for 1vX you assume the risk and L2P around it rather than constantly calling for removal of a counter for your play style.3 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭remove defile
Depends on context, I use it on single targets when soloing dungeons for efficiency, but rarely need it in vet dungeons where AoE's are more practical. Sadly there are too many know-nothings in the world who think they know better.
So it ruins PVE because u can use it to solo normal dungeons? And thats still not a good way to solo them and most definitely not efficient. The funny thing is that changing snipe to a normal spammable would actually make the task you use it for much easier and much more efficient. If anything, its actually a buff for PVE.0 -
templesus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Remove snipe (never going to happen)TequilaFire wrote: »Anotherone773 wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
Eveey bow build except for maybe warden uses snipe. Maybe next patch some builds can replace snipe with crushing weapon, bit as it stands yes, snipe is used in pve
Not in any dungeon or trial I run. You will be removed so fast lol
We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.TequilaFire wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
As usual you are wrong, snipe is used quite a bit in PvE questing and dungeons on wait for it, bow builds.
Don't state it is a known fact when you can't back it up, or list a source.
Learn to read. I said legitimate PvE build, in reference to my previous statement about endgame. A level 20 questing build would not be warranted as a legitimate PvE build in endgame. As usual you try to refute my comments with no actual data but rather opinions. I’m to the point of cutting off discussion with you until you pose anything meaningful.
Please do as everything you say revolves around 1vX whining which I have no sympathy at all for because when you choose that play style in a game not balanced for 1vX you assume the risk and L2P around it rather than constantly calling for removal of a counter for your play style.
And there you go, making assumptions for why I want it removed, which I never once stated. I want it removed for the sole purpose that the ability has been bugged since launch and the best option at this point would be to replace it with a survivability/buff skill (such as minor courage) to increase stamina dps in trials which is underperforming and do away with the bugged ability once and for all.
But it’s okay, people like you have a set negative way of thinking that completely irrationalizes anything anybody says that you don’t agree with. And for that reason I’m no longer responding.Edited by templesus on May 4, 2018 6:05PM0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Option 4: swap places of Rapid Fire (ultimate) and Snipe, adjust the skills accordingly.
I.e. bow gets a proper out of stealth spammable while still having access to the high burst necessary to actually get kills outside a Xv1 scenario.
It never ceases to amaze me how much hate the skill gets - for all the wrong reasons.
Major Defile doesn't matter outside a Xv1 scenario - a good bow build aims to one shot the opponent because that's the only chance it ever kills anything. Bow does not have sustained pressure to kill targets.
...not even with a spammable (especially if you remove snipe part of the burst) - you can find that out by trying out Crushing Weapon on a bow build.
The main problems with snipe are the desyncs & how it's spammed by some people in Xv1 situations (which doesn't make it strong, just easy to use and annoying).
I assume you mean the channel version of the ultimate? If so, that would be an interesting change and would use that morph.
I always found it weird that bow doesn't have a similar synergy with heavy attacks that fire/light/ice do. And with your change, we have the chance to promote a trap-style "spamable" skill that adds dmg while you are trying to fill in with light/heavy attacks. Then "snipe" can be the ranged version of incap; giving stamina builds access to a ranged option if they need it.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual1 -
lassitershawn✭✭✭✭✭lassitershawn wrote: »Anotherone773 wrote: »We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.
Meanwhile snipe spammers aren’t completing any DLC dungeons or vet trials without being ridiculously hard-carried.
And at the same time, those who try to do a proper build and weave snipe with other skill in a good rotation pull decent dps but are being bashed again and again by meta-locked players, even in normal dungeon.
"Not optimal = inexistent" is a curse for both the game and the community. Following this idea, stamina class should not even exist, since they were way under magicka at least twice on the lifetime of the game. But no, players tried again and again, asked for necessary buff and adjustment, and even if it's not perfect ZOS made them viable (and even meta). And for that, they need to not be stuck in a "this is meta and nothing else exist" mentality. Asking to remove the only bow spammable, which is actually useable and better than crushed weapons in most of the case, follow this bad mentality.
I didn’t say don’t buff bows in PvE. I said snipe sucks in PvE.William Thorne - EP Breton Sorcerer
Astrid Winterborn - EP Breton Warden
Erik Ironskin - EP Nord Dragonknight
Venasa Viri - EP Dunmer Nightblade
IR x8, GH x5, TTT x20 -
lassitershawn✭✭✭✭✭lassitershawn wrote: »Anotherone773 wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
Eveey bow build except for maybe warden uses snipe. Maybe next patch some builds can replace snipe with crushing weapon, bit as it stands yes, snipe is used in pve
Not in any dungeon or trial I run. You will be removed so fast lol
We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.
Meanwhile snipe spammers aren’t completing any DLC dungeons or vet trials without being ridiculously hard-carried.
Snipe using =/= snipe spammer
See https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/381498/everything-needed-to-know-about-bow-bow-in-pve/p1
Stopped reading that after the disclaimer saying not to use in vet trials. There is no good reason to be bow/bow on stamina because you sacrifice DPS compared to melee stamina without the added benefits of magicka survivability and utility.William Thorne - EP Breton Sorcerer
Astrid Winterborn - EP Breton Warden
Erik Ironskin - EP Nord Dragonknight
Venasa Viri - EP Dunmer Nightblade
IR x8, GH x5, TTT x20 -
fierackas✭✭✭✭✭Well how dumb do I feel, I was mixing snipe up with poison injection, that will teach me not to post when I've been drinking
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TheBonesXXX✭✭✭✭✭
✭In it's current form it is not balanced at all. Especially when it can stun you from crouch. That is why there is no other category. Snipe is so powerful that I have it slotted rather than Grim Focus on my stamblade. It's not even something I use that often but it does too much damage from very far away and gives defile.
It's not like you can even weave a light with it to maintain the buff, its only application is defile from ranged when a catch-me-you-can player is running around in circles being annoying; I'll choose to defile them before I get to them.
People can complain about Xv1 all day but most of them hug terrain and run in circles without doing anything but being a flashy distraction.
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DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Option 4: swap places of Rapid Fire (ultimate) and Snipe, adjust the skills accordingly.
I.e. bow gets a proper out of stealth spammable while still having access to the high burst necessary to actually get kills outside a Xv1 scenario.
It never ceases to amaze me how much hate the skill gets - for all the wrong reasons.
Major Defile doesn't matter outside a Xv1 scenario - a good bow build aims to one shot the opponent because that's the only chance it ever kills anything. Bow does not have sustained pressure to kill targets.
...not even with a spammable (especially if you remove snipe part of the burst) - you can find that out by trying out Crushing Weapon on a bow build.
The main problems with snipe are the desyncs & how it's spammed by some people in Xv1 situations (which doesn't make it strong, just easy to use and annoying).
I assume you mean the channel version of the ultimate? If so, that would be an interesting change and would use that morph.
I always found it weird that bow doesn't have a similar synergy with heavy attacks that fire/light/ice do. And with your change, we have the chance to promote a trap-style "spamable" skill that adds dmg while you are trying to fill in with light/heavy attacks. Then "snipe" can be the ranged version of incap; giving stamina builds access to a ranged option if they need it.
Yeah, exactly.
It's not the first time I've made that suggestion, but ZOS is pretty slow to consider/implement any bow changes.
Obviously if ZOS were to swap places of the ulti & Snipe they'd probably have to swap the Ballista morph for something else.
As for how Snipe would look as ultimate... they can't buff the damage too much (or it'd be even more deadly from stealth) but they could make it an AoE cone (i.e. hits multiple targets/through dodge roll/block) for example.Edited by DDuke on May 5, 2018 12:31AM1 -
JobooAGS✭✭✭✭✭
✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammablelassitershawn wrote: »lassitershawn wrote: »Anotherone773 wrote: »Who said anything about endgame? Learn to read then come back.
Your original statement implied that removing snipe would effect PvE. It is known FACT, that snipe is not used on any legitimate pve build. Just because you use it for a “niche” build, does not make that a pve build, nor does it mean that removing snipe henceforth effecting your build “ruins” pve.
Eveey bow build except for maybe warden uses snipe. Maybe next patch some builds can replace snipe with crushing weapon, bit as it stands yes, snipe is used in pve
Not in any dungeon or trial I run. You will be removed so fast lol
We know elitists dont use it, they cant complete content unless they are using gravy meta builds.
Meanwhile snipe spammers aren’t completing any DLC dungeons or vet trials without being ridiculously hard-carried.
Snipe using =/= snipe spammer
See https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/381498/everything-needed-to-know-about-bow-bow-in-pve/p1
Stopped reading that after the disclaimer saying not to use in vet trials. There is no good reason to be bow/bow on stamina because you sacrifice DPS compared to melee stamina without the added benefits of magicka survivability and utility.
Which is why they need a buff of a sort, but every suggestion to buff bows always ends up to people pointing out to snipe and/or that melee stam uses bows. Every other mmo has bow builds useful in endgame, why cant eso?2 -
usmcjdking✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭usmcjdking wrote: »None of the above.
Give snipe a cone like wrecking blow. Stepping out of the cone = cancelled snipe.
This would be so odd at that range. The cone could easily cover more than one person, what then?
The same reason you don't hit 6 people with dizzy swing when you use it amidst a zerg.
If your opponent does not stay in the cone then the skill self=cancels. The closer you get to the target the more unreliable the skill gets.0331
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NyassaV✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭remove the cast time and reduce damage so that way in PvP it is more balanced and should actually function as an actual spammableTheBonesXXX wrote: »In it's current form it is not balanced at all. Especially when it can stun you from crouch. That is why there is no other category. Snipe is so powerful that I have it slotted rather than Grim Focus on my stamblade. It's not even something I use that often but it does too much damage from very far away and gives defile.
It's not like you can even weave a light with it to maintain the buff, its only application is defile from ranged when a catch-me-you-can player is running around in circles being annoying; I'll choose to defile them before I get to them.
People can complain about Xv1 all day but most of them hug terrain and run in circles without doing anything but being a flashy distraction.
Then they aren't doing it rightFlawless Conqueror ~ Grand OverlordShe/Her ~ PC/NA | I record things for fun and for info1 -
usmcjdking✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭wtf is this trash about snipe is bad in PVE.
Snipe isn't bad in PVE - it's the 3rd hardest hitting spammable behind wrecking blow/jabbies.
Bow PRIMARY sucks in PVE because Bow doesn't complement Bow (nor does stam generally complement ranged) very well and you lose out on too many critical skills to be competitive.
Let's try to remain objective about the topic at hand instead of posting myopic "hurr durr I never did bow primary because I don't have the brain power to attempt to make a good go at it, but i'mma leave my comment in this thread here cuz I am entitled to do that".0331
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