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• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
[Major Oversight] Summerset Tutorial Missable Skillpoint Feedback
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BoloBoffin✭✭✭✭✭You are only ever going to be one skill point behind anyone because of this.
Characters created before Morrowind: Wailing Prison 1; Morrowind zero; Summerset: zero; Next Chapter tutorial: zero; and so on.
Characters created under Morrowind: WP 1, M 1, S zero, NC zero, and so on.
Characters created under Summerset: WP 1, M zero, S 1, NC zero, and so on.
Character created under next Chapter: WP 1, M zero, S zero, NC 1, and so on.
Yes, there is a level of inequity with newer characters having access to one extra skill point. But there is no falling further behind than that.
That inequity could be solved by ZOS giving every character created via the Wailing Prison tutorial (or who elected to skip it) a single skill point. If they do or they don't, though, that is the extent of the problem - one skill point.Been there, got the Molag Bal polymorph.1 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭so many bug fixes for the mind trap quest this week and none were regarding the skillpoint0 -
BoloBoffin✭✭✭✭✭BoloBoffin wrote: »You are only ever going to be one skill point behind anyone because of this.
Characters created before Morrowind: Wailing Prison 1; Morrowind zero; Summerset: zero; Next Chapter tutorial: zero; and so on.
Characters created under Morrowind: WP 1, M 1, S zero, NC zero, and so on.
Characters created under Summerset: WP 1, M zero, S 1, NC zero, and so on.
Character created under next Chapter: WP 1, M zero, S zero, NC 1, and so on.
Yes, there is a level of inequity with newer characters having access to one extra skill point. But there is no falling further behind than that.
That inequity could be solved by ZOS giving every character created via the Wailing Prison tutorial (or who elected to skip it) a single skill point. If they do or they don't, though, that is the extent of the problem - one skill point.
And as you can see from above, if any character is allowed to play through all the subsequent tutorials to get a skill point, then the older characters will be accumulating an ongoing gap in available skill points compared to newer players. That would be a solution worse than the problem it's meant to fix.
Edited: LOL, no, that's not right. Now my math is off. Granting access to all tutorials would make all characters even. However, allowing access to all tutorials means a rewrite of dialogue to match the later characters, a new recording session to get the new lines with the correct voice actors, and then coding the new tutorial runthroughs. I think a grant of a single skill point to WP tutorial characters is far more workable if anything needs to be done.Edited by BoloBoffin on April 23, 2018 6:21PMBeen there, got the Molag Bal polymorph.0 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭BoloBoffin wrote: »BoloBoffin wrote: »You are only ever going to be one skill point behind anyone because of this.
Characters created before Morrowind: Wailing Prison 1; Morrowind zero; Summerset: zero; Next Chapter tutorial: zero; and so on.
Characters created under Morrowind: WP 1, M 1, S zero, NC zero, and so on.
Characters created under Summerset: WP 1, M zero, S 1, NC zero, and so on.
Character created under next Chapter: WP 1, M zero, S zero, NC 1, and so on.
Yes, there is a level of inequity with newer characters having access to one extra skill point. But there is no falling further behind than that.
That inequity could be solved by ZOS giving every character created via the Wailing Prison tutorial (or who elected to skip it) a single skill point. If they do or they don't, though, that is the extent of the problem - one skill point.
And as you can see from above, if any character is allowed to play through all the subsequent tutorials to get a skill point, then the older characters will be accumulating an ongoing gap in available skill points compared to newer players. That would be a solution worse than the problem it's meant to fix.
As it appears they will possibly never give us the missing skillpoint from morrowind and it might prove technicly difficult to remove the extra skillpoint from morrowind created characters as you still got the extra skillpoint if you skipped the tutorial. The intended remedy in this solution is to give all characters an extra skillpoint that they might need for the two new skillines and to give characters access to the tutorial on a new character as it fits nicely with the flow of the story and so that they don't have to buy a new character slot to experience it if they have already filled them all out.Edited by Aliyavana on April 23, 2018 6:21PM0 -
Merenwen_812✭✭✭I don't know if it's a missed skill point.
No matter where you start you only get 1 tutorial.
So it you start with no soul, you get skill point and not one from tutorial of morrowind or summerset.
If you start in Morrowind 1 tutorial skill point none from original game or summerset
etc so on down the chapters.
No matter where you start you get the one point so not missing it.
edit to add ok I see after reading the thread I am not only one that sees this LOLEdited by Merenwen_812 on April 23, 2018 6:32PM0 -
BoloBoffin✭✭✭✭✭Merenwen_812 wrote: »I don't know if it's a missed skill point.
No matter where you start you only get 1 tutorial.
So it you start with no soul, you get skill point and not one from tutorial of morrowind or summerset.
If you start in Morrowind 1 tutorial skill point none from original game or summerset
etc so on down the chapters.
No matter where you start you get the one point so not missing it.
edit to add ok I see after reading the thread I am not only one that sees this LOL
No matter which skill-point-granting tutorial you play through, you get a skill point when you play through the Wailing Prison (now recast as an introduction into the Prophet main quest). That's an extra skill point for newer characters that characters created before Morrowind don't have the same kind of access to. I can see the issue. I just think it's a minor one since we have access to so many skill points in this game. If you can't get your character at peak performance with 516 current skill points, I don't see how one more is going to make or break it.Been there, got the Molag Bal polymorph.0 -
Merenwen_812✭✭✭BoloBoffin wrote: »Merenwen_812 wrote: »I don't know if it's a missed skill point.
No matter where you start you only get 1 tutorial.
So it you start with no soul, you get skill point and not one from tutorial of morrowind or summerset.
If you start in Morrowind 1 tutorial skill point none from original game or summerset
etc so on down the chapters.
No matter where you start you get the one point so not missing it.
edit to add ok I see after reading the thread I am not only one that sees this LOL
No matter which skill-point-granting tutorial you play through, you get a skill point when you play through the Wailing Prison (now recast as an introduction into the Prophet main quest). That's an extra skill point for newer characters that characters created before Morrowind don't have the same kind of access to. I can see the issue. I just think it's a minor one since we have access to so many skill points in this game. If you can't get your character at peak performance with 516 current skill points, I don't see how one more is going to make or break it.
yeah, I am seeing where the one comes in. still reading through pages of info here. I play a character created ions ago, so never even knew I was missing a skill point (granted I have some not used so it would simply be an unused extra point right now LOL)0 -
Ashnarug✭✭✭I don't understand this one.
Morrowind - if you skip the tutorial you start at level 3 - that is 1 skill point for level 2 and 1 skill point for level 3 = TOTAL TWO !!! Then why do you have THREE skills points to assign ? The extra skill point is available.
Same thing for Summerset !
Edited by Ashnarug on April 26, 2018 12:08AMDuring the afternoon of Loredas, 6 Sun’s Dawn 2e578 a big piece of Aetherius fell to Nirn. It was the first major piece of Aetherius to fall on Nirn in more than five hundred years. It scattered around the world as millions of shards. It was rapidly documented by Lady Cinnabar of Taneth in her pamphlet Aetherial Fragments that "... when three shards meet, they re-form into a silvery prism by unknown process and confer the power unlocked by the merger to a nearby being." The Order of the Black Worm, commonly known as the Worm Cult, reappeared in Tamriel shortly thereafter and some of its members are avidly searching said shards.
In the last week of First Seed 2e579, an arcane explosion occurred in the Imperial City — a night of storms, and trembling terrain. They named it the "Soulburst". That day Emperor Varen Aquilarios disappeared without a trace. His wife, Clivia Tharn, ascended to the Ruby Throne as Empress Regent under the guidance of the Necromancer Mannimarco. Ushering a time of increased instability within the Empire of Cyrodiil which finally grew into “The Three Banners War”.0 -
jluchau✭✭✭I don't understand this one.
Morrowind - if you skip the tutorial you start at level 3 - that is 1 skill point for level 2 and 1 skill point for level 3 = TOTAL TWO !!! Then why do you have THREE skills points to assign ? The extra skill point is available.
Same thing for Summerset !
They aren't upset that people who start morrowind or summerset have an extra skill point available... what upsets them is that after getting the extra skill point from starting in morrowind they can then go do the main quest tutorial and get the extra skill point from there. But people who started the game before these chapters ever came out can't take their character who experienced the main quest tutorial into morrowind or summerset and get the extra skill point their. So basically if you compare a character that started with morrowind or summerset with a character that started before those chapters were released the morrowind or summerset character will always be able to get 1 more skill point then the character who has been here from before the chapters.
I'm not a completionist so I don't really mind. But I understand why they are upset and it seems like such an easy fix. Just ad a skill point reward into the intro quest old players do to get into those chapters that is different from the new character tutorial quest. Then all characters no matter where or when they started can always have the same potential.1 -
Breetai_SDF1✭✭There is a quest in the Morrowind expansion only available to characters who have not done the Morrowind tutorial called Breaking Through the Fog, the quest starts in Seyda Neen and takes you to the island with the slavers on it, and is essentially the same quest as the tutorial.
I can't remember if you get a skill point for completing it though. If you do, then that makes up for the missing skill point from Morrowind, If you don't, then that's where ZOS should add it for us (won't help those who have already done that quest though).
If ZOS does the same sort of thing for Summerset, there won't be a skill point issue.- Downtime Defender -
“Conquering end-game content without really trying”0 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Breetai_SDF1 wrote: »There is a quest in the Morrowind expansion only available to characters who have not done the Morrowind tutorial called Breaking Through the Fog, the quest starts in Seyda Neen and takes you to the island with the slavers on it, and is essentially the same quest as the tutorial.
I can't remember if you get a skill point for completing it though. If you do, then that makes up for the missing skill point from Morrowind, If you don't, then that's where ZOS should add it for us (won't help those who have already done that quest though).
If ZOS does the same sort of thing for Summerset, there won't be a skill point issue.
it doesn't make it up as it doesn't grant it1 -
Breetai_SDF1✭✭Breetai_SDF1 wrote: »There is a quest in the Morrowind expansion only available to characters who have not done the Morrowind tutorial called Breaking Through the Fog, the quest starts in Seyda Neen and takes you to the island with the slavers on it, and is essentially the same quest as the tutorial.
I can't remember if you get a skill point for completing it though. If you do, then that makes up for the missing skill point from Morrowind, If you don't, then that's where ZOS should add it for us (won't help those who have already done that quest though).
If ZOS does the same sort of thing for Summerset, there won't be a skill point issue.
it doesn't make it up as it doesn't grant it
Like I said, it would make up for the missing point "if" it was rewarded.
ZOS should add a skill point as a reward to that particular quest as it is essentially the same as the tutorial. Then award characters who have already done the quest with a retroactive skill point.
Then do something similar for Summerset.- Downtime Defender -
“Conquering end-game content without really trying”0 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Breetai_SDF1 wrote: »Breetai_SDF1 wrote: »There is a quest in the Morrowind expansion only available to characters who have not done the Morrowind tutorial called Breaking Through the Fog, the quest starts in Seyda Neen and takes you to the island with the slavers on it, and is essentially the same quest as the tutorial.
I can't remember if you get a skill point for completing it though. If you do, then that makes up for the missing skill point from Morrowind, If you don't, then that's where ZOS should add it for us (won't help those who have already done that quest though).
If ZOS does the same sort of thing for Summerset, there won't be a skill point issue.
it doesn't make it up as it doesn't grant it
Like I said, it would make up for the missing point "if" it was rewarded.
ZOS should add a skill point as a reward to that particular quest as it is essentially the same as the tutorial. Then award characters who have already done the quest with a retroactive skill point.
Then do something similar for Summerset.
you also have the problem with characters who skipped morrowinds tutorial are still able to do that different quest so if that was the case theyd get yet another skillpoint0 -
Breetai_SDF1✭✭Breetai_SDF1 wrote: »Breetai_SDF1 wrote: »There is a quest in the Morrowind expansion only available to characters who have not done the Morrowind tutorial called Breaking Through the Fog, the quest starts in Seyda Neen and takes you to the island with the slavers on it, and is essentially the same quest as the tutorial.
I can't remember if you get a skill point for completing it though. If you do, then that makes up for the missing skill point from Morrowind, If you don't, then that's where ZOS should add it for us (won't help those who have already done that quest though).
If ZOS does the same sort of thing for Summerset, there won't be a skill point issue.
it doesn't make it up as it doesn't grant it
Like I said, it would make up for the missing point "if" it was rewarded.
ZOS should add a skill point as a reward to that particular quest as it is essentially the same as the tutorial. Then award characters who have already done the quest with a retroactive skill point.
Then do something similar for Summerset.
you also have the problem with characters who skipped morrowinds tutorial are still able to do that different quest so if that was the case theyd get yet another skillpoint
hmmmm... I didn't realise you could do that quest if you skipped the tutorial, never tried it because I always do the tutorial on a new character... that sucks. I would have thought they would treat a skipped tutorial like you had done it, oh well. I still agree that we should get the missing skill points somehow though.- Downtime Defender -
“Conquering end-game content without really trying”0 -
Thrawniel✭✭✭I do not really care about extra skill point (though I understand why others do, and it's a valid concern), but I just did the tutorial on new char and it's so visually impressive that I'm really sad I won't be able to do it on my main.
Also it would make more sense from narrative standpoint that powerful creatures are interested in trapping powerful hero, someone who ruined plans of Molag Bal, Clavicus Vile and Nocturnal instead of random nobody.
And that tutorial bit with old enemies... New char gets some random NPCs in prisoner clothing. Imagine how awesome it would be if there were actual old enemies from main/alliance storylines instead! I would not mind them to be even made boss-difficulty for extra oomf.
Like, I really feel cheated from story standpoint when new players have this awesome psychodelic trip sequence while existing players get lame 'take a boat to Summerset and talk to NPC' deal(((
How about we take the boat, and NPC we talk with is not the guy who sends us towards Raz, but some cultust that sends us into the ruins, and then existing players get to experience psychodelic trip as well?
Like, even Morrowind had the replacement of tutorial sequence (even if less interesting and without Naryu), but with Summerset we do not get even that?!5 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Suggestion for how to implement the tutorial as the starting quest for summerset:
Ok so the boat takes you to the docks in its current incarnation
How about a robed figure greats you and asks for help find his friend
He leads you to this ruin and then knocks you out and then the mind trap quest plays as the intro to the summerset main questEdited by Aliyavana on April 27, 2018 8:18AM3 -
Auldjohn✭✭✭✭Where is the starting point for the Summerset Tutorial? My new Template Character, clad only in underwear, was immediately propelled into finding Razam-dar.@Auldjohn • The Elder Sages' Guild • Master Sage & Co-Founder • facebook.com/groups/theeldersagesguild
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Moot Envoy • Tamriel Foundry Adept • Steam ID Auldjohn
YouTube auldjohnmastersage • Twitch AuldjohnPCGamer• Steam Group TESGs0 -
Thrawniel✭✭✭Suggestion for how to implement the tutorial as the starting quest for summerset:
Ok so the boat takes you to the docks in its current incarnation
How about a robed figure greats you and asks for help find his friend
He leads you to this ruin and then knocks you out and then the mind trap quest plays as the intro to the summerset main quest
Yep. That's pretty much what I was thinking! Should not be too hard to implement either.0 -
Enodoc✭✭✭✭✭
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Sounds good to me!Suggestion for how to implement the tutorial as the starting quest for summerset:
Ok so the boat takes you to the docks in its current incarnation
How about a robed figure greats you and asks for help find his friend
He leads you to this ruin and then knocks you out and then the mind trap quest plays as the intro to the summerset main questUESP: The Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages - A collaborative source for all knowledge on the Elder Scrolls series since 1995
Join us on Discord - discord.gg/uesp0 -
BoloBoffin✭✭✭✭✭
Its 1 skill point, I cannot understand why people are so angry
Honestly, I don't think it's people being angry, but completionist. I'm that way about motifs. I was worried about the Divine Prosecution set until I realized it was outfit only and I could never craft it and give it to others. So I skipped it. My other thing I advocate for sometimes is the other half of the Justice system which is never going to happen.
Aliyavana is just trying to gather some consensus for getting access to that last skillpoint. It's not bad to do that here and people shouldn't shame others for trying. If enough people want it, it will happen.Been there, got the Molag Bal polymorph.1 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
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Its 1 skill point, I cannot understand why people are so angry
I'm angry because another skillpoint might be lost despite beta feedback0
This discussion has been closed.