Magicka Warden PvP - strong, weak, balanced?

Waffennacht · April 2018

Ron_Burgundy_79 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

This is what I was referring to

Btw @mojo-powerpuffgirl I don't cherry pick, I'm always like that

@Ron_Burgundy_79 there all night tonight didn't see you at all either

Haven't been on since they announced this horrible change. Prefer to spend my time playing pubgs on pc. They listened to their community and made some great changes to the new map.

Xbox max recording time is 5 minutes.

I've beaten him before Waff and hes beaten me. Names don't carry much weight to me in ESO. 90% of the community hasn't heard of some of the best players.

Edit: hopefully someone can explain to him why every single PvP leaderboard is a bad reference to use when determine whether you're good or not.

5 you say? Well next time I do open world I'll make sure to have it set up correctly.

But seeing as you're not playing, I don't think it really matters either way.

Find it odd you wouldn't wait till the final PTS before making a decision though. I mean, I thought birds was safe last PTS 1 and boy was I wrong.

I'm quite confident that what we know now is only a fraction of what will happen.

And just about pics etc. I'll take on any requirement or request you guys can think of. I'm very confident that there is nothing in this game I cannot accomplish, so whatever you're doing that makes you feel that you are good (not just you Ron, anyone) please tell me, I'd love to do it

Mojomonkeyman · April 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

I wish Xbox didn't have only a 2 min recording time

Btw I use to say I wasn't the best, then @zParallaxz showed me what good really is and I have learned oh so much from him.

Edit: I am good, if not one of the best console PvP players. I personally know 20% of all leader board PvP players and not a single one is beyond my skill level.

Again though time will prove me correct again. They didn't believe me the first 5 times before (panacea, shield wall, proc sets, balance, spell symmetry etc)

Oh man that last sentence. Another one of those "I-told-you-so"-guys. It's ok, genius. People just don't understand your on the next level...

Torbschka · April 2018

@Waffennacht

Before this gets out of hand, for me all those pictures/whatever doesnt really matter for me - this is a DISCUSSION forum. Ill still post a BG match this evening, since I barely play it but when I did, I almost everytime sitting around 20+ kills and 1 mil. dmg, this is not something special for me at all (coming from an openworld cyro Player).

Although u seem to behave in a "enlightend" behaviour here. It seems like a lot of people see this change as a nerf, yet u still argue against that (which is fine) while using fixed circumstances/scenarious (BG's, and even specfic BG situations) which doesnt matter for us at all, since cyro and bg's totally different.

All I want to see is, what ur arguements really are? I see u posting and posting again, but no arguements in at all. My first post where I mentioned u had several points in it:

- no stun for frost staff if no Vamp
- u lose 1 skill for slotting a different stun (whatever it might be); losing inner light / bird e.g.
- Ur burst Combo isnt anymore; Fissure - DMG Skill - DMG Skill - Ulti but Fissure, DMG skill, CC, ULTI -> less dmg/more GCD
- Fissure CC is way more reliable than for example destructive reach IMO, since it goes through dodge roll
- Advanced Points I'm not sure many are aware of, but fighting outnumbered in the heat of battle many people didnt recognize u activated fissure, so u will land and UNEXPTED stun through dodge roll with dmg, this is a huge factor IMO

+ we get spell Penetration, i would rather have fissure stun + elemental drain as other cc + fissure Penetration.

So, what im asking now is, besides ur "Scenarios" in BG's, what are ur real arguements for seeing that as an Advantage for what we KNOW so far. U speak about there is more coming, I cant see anything more right now (Source: Alcast), so how do U really know? U speak like u are miles ahead of us and the "old build" doesnt work, yet all u do is speaking about BG's and doing kills, Im at home 7pm CET, I guarentee it will at least took me 2 BG's to kill 20 people in BG's with dying less than 5, np.

In every objective way, I cant see how any1 playing this calss openworld as a 1vXer can see this as an Advantage, its the same as the Crystal frag lose, just even worse since magicka sorc >>>> magicka warden.

Torbschka · April 2018

http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=86555d-1522944638.jpg

@Waffennacht Well, yeah, I stopped after doing 3 BG's cuz I didnt even feel my skills as much tested as in open world cyro envirorement - but it is fun from time to time.

I used the build described here.

Hutch679 · April 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

Torbschka wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Torbschka wrote: »

They cant do, I cant agree with every1 who says the loss of the stun has any advantage.

E.g., Ifu like to play Frost Staffel in pvp, u wohnt have a *** stun anymore, unless u go Vamp and slot drain....

Who is magicka warden rwpresentative? For real...

That's exactly what you do. Accelerated drain is a superior stun to fissure. You can cast pre fissure to land it, or post fissure to kill.

If there was an execute (non bear related) or a powerful spam ability, the loss of the stun Would be important, but Magden doesn't have these, therefore THE ONLY follow up to the stun is Force. If a follow up Force after a stun is what allowed you to kill, you won't experience any difference. That's like a 4k dmg ability.... That's pathetic for damage.

The loss of undodgeable birds IS a Nerf, that actually made a HUGE difference, this will not - except help Magden be better in groups and PvE

Cant believe u are really arguing for that change. Are u really going to tell me, that the need to slot drain and the lose to fissure stun is a "buff"?

I know fissure will get penetration, cool, I could have has that before with elemental drain + infinite sustain.

So, u ae arguing for:

- its good that u have to be Vamp if playing with frost Staff
-its good that we need 1 more skill on our bar and lose inner light or whatever
- its good that we can stun now after our burst, not with it

Are u seriöus @Waffennacht ?

With ur points, that its better to stun after burst, every1 should be happy that they removed the stun of crystal frag (ask sorcs lol) or that it would be cool to remove the stun of incap or dawnbreaker.

I see what u are TRYING to say, but IMO its garbage. I dont see the benefit of needing 1 more skill on bar + 1 more global CD to stun. Fissure, dmg skill, dmg skill, ulti is no longer possible.

I also cant agree on what u saying, fissure is an 100% reliable stun for me (u are on console right, might be aiming issue?)

Also ur arguing here is super " cheap" - " u can cast fissure for/after the stun" lol. And the benefit of that is what? Casting it after 3 drain my burst comes 3 sec after I did stun my target....great, lol. Stunning it to land my fissure is 1 more CD where I cant do DMG for the same effect as before. Fissure stun was good vs dodge roll, so is drain, no benefit either.

After the nerf of birds which sucked but at least " understandable" we r gonna lose the classic skill warden is known for and its just the same as the stamina morph, how innovative.

Are u our "representative"...?

And what do u mean by " showing" numbers? Want me to post my 20+ kills bg's lol?

I just hope that every magden player will argue against that crap...

I am not the representative, if I were I doubt I'd be allowed to talk about it because there's a lot more changes coming.

I would love to see your BG scores and the corresponding build

Again, there's a major aiming difference between console and PC.

It's fine you guys disagree, wouldn't be the first time, time will tell

I'm on console. I completely disagree with this nonsense. Removing the stun from fissure is gonna wreck mag wardens. And to say you can use invig drain instead... LMAO what??? Where you gonna fit that on your bar? What are you gonna give up too have to slot another skill? What a joke lol

Hutch679 · April 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

I wish Xbox didn't have only a 2 min recording time

Btw I use to say I wasn't the best, then @zParallaxz showed me what good really is and I have learned oh so much from him.

Edit: I am good, if not one of the best console PvP players. I personally know 20% of all leader board PvP players and not a single one is beyond my skill level.

Again though time will prove me correct again. They didn't believe me the first 5 times before (panacea, shield wall, proc sets, balance, spell symmetry etc)

Lmao you are not one of the best bro. I've seen you get WAXED in bgs.

Subversus · April 2018

This drama is so good

RouDeR · April 2018

Guys don't worry , about AIDS dens , mr Wrobel and mr Lembart decided to double the Selfheal for the Arctic blast with the next patch , so stay quiet and enjoy the Health Warden domination in Summerset

Hutch679 · April 2018

RouDeR wrote: »

Guys don't worry , about AIDS dens , mr Wrobel and mr Lembart decided to double the Selfheal for the Arctic blast with the next patch , so stay quiet and enjoy the Health Warden domination in Summerset

Right? Lol what a joke... how about the make cliff racer worth using again? Or better yet, bursting vines morph... yeah I'll totally use that now. Sike! It doesn't even heal yourself! Not to mention it's garbage in solo play... can't even use it. But stamina wardens lost the major breach from sub assault... *rolls eyes*... They nerf mag warden yet stamina still remains godly. Ohhh boy. And mag DKs are still crying about not getting enough buffs. Hahahaha

Subversus · April 2018

Hutch679 wrote: »

RouDeR wrote: »

Guys don't worry , about AIDS dens , mr Wrobel and mr Lembart decided to double the Selfheal for the Arctic blast with the next patch , so stay quiet and enjoy the Health Warden domination in Summerset

Right? Lol what a joke... how about the make cliff racer worth using again? Or better yet, bursting vines morph... yeah I'll totally use that now. Sike! It doesn't even heal yourself! Not to mention it's garbage in solo play... can't even use it. But stamina wardens lost the major breach from sub assault... *rolls eyes*... They nerf mag warden yet stamina still remains godly. Ohhh boy. And mag DKs are still crying about not getting enough buffs. Hahahaha

Magdks won’t stop crying until they are the strongest class in the game once again. Even when they’re in a good spot, they cry about other classes lol.

Waffennacht · April 2018

@Torbschka nice job! And ty for your participation

@Hutch679 when you say get waxed do you mean my team got wrecked or me personally (cuz I'll gladly go 0 kills 100 deaths if it means I win the match) - then there's times I'll get pretty pissed at my team and just end it lmfao, but I am one of the best players in game - the best? Hell no (I don't dare believe that!)

There's always more changes - every single time. And if you guys bring this enthusiasm to the hopefully Open PTS you will be heard.

I do not think the stun being tied to fissure is a good thing - do I think no stun is good? No, why would I?

I want it off of fissure and would love something akin to Sorc's stun (so not OP) or maybe tied to bird.

I run resto backbar with drain slotted there, for the swap cancel.

The only class that doesn't get compensated thus far seems to be Templars, sorc did lose frag stun but gained the unblockable stun.

Riddle me this gents - if you got a stun somewhere else - would you prefer that or it be apart of Fissure?

ThorinWolfgang · April 2018

Do not worry guys. They won't do nothing cos the dodge roll is the everything in this game and all your birds are going to stay nothing. Magwarden was a good timespend during latest patches but in the future it will be a garbage. I recomend you to level a new rollerblades or another cancerous dodge classes if you wanna be a successfull pvp player.

Skander · April 2018

It's kinda sad that the only thing that makes magWarden do some kind of dmg, it's bugs

Waffennacht · April 2018

I say @Skander 's ice javelin idea is not only awesome, but makes perfect sense.

Torbschka · April 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Torbschka nice job! And ty for your participation

@Hutch679 when you say get waxed do you mean my team got wrecked or me personally (cuz I'll gladly go 0 kills 100 deaths if it means I win the match) - then there's times I'll get pretty pissed at my team and just end it lmfao, but I am one of the best players in game - the best? Hell no (I don't dare believe that!)

There's always more changes - every single time. And if you guys bring this enthusiasm to the hopefully Open PTS you will be heard.

I do not think the stun being tied to fissure is a good thing - do I think no stun is good? No, why would I?

I want it off of fissure and would love something akin to Sorc's stun (so not OP) or maybe tied to bird.

I run resto backbar with drain slotted there, for the swap cancel.

The only class that doesn't get compensated thus far seems to be Templars, sorc did lose frag stun but gained the unblockable stun.

Riddle me this gents - if you got a stun somewhere else - would you prefer that or it be apart of Fissure?

Thank you, as I said, it is fun from time to time, but I prefer the more "sandbox" feeling of cyro.

So u dont know about any further changes and "just" expect them - I can agree on that, I'm pretty sure there will come another few changes, but all of that is super speculative. From what I see now we will get a nerf (haha, I wont list up the arguements why again^^).

Regarding ur question whether if I would prefer another stun or not... it depends, it highly depends on what this skill is going to offer.

See it this way, deep fissure STUN is for me:

+ a skillshot stun (this is an advantage from me, my differ if on console)
+ delayed (so is able to pre cast behind / rocks etc.)
+ combined with a huge aoe dmg skill
+ stuns/doing dmg through dodge roll
+ fits in very well in the magicka warden bar, so u will use thise MOSTLY anyway -> more bar space (<3 INNER LIGHT)
+ very often UNEXPTED in the heat of battle
+ stuns targets EVEN IF U ARE STUNNED (not many people think about that, i so often stuned a nb while they incaped me and wanted to burst me)

- sometimes clunky and u wont be able to stun the target u want, since its hiding behind people
- "might get at least decent aiming/movement mechanics"?

So yes, I'm OPEN for another stun, If it is any good compared to those advantages FOR ME. Ice shard might be intersting, but if its just a stun with ice dmg - no. Furthermore, u still going to lose barspace if its a skill u dont use anyway on ur bar.

So, would I call it nerf if they add a stun to birds - probably not. Would I call it nerf if we get ice copy of javelin - 100%. Would I call it nerf if we get something else with a new fantastic, comparable stun - well, I would still lose bar space, but if the stun is good with some UNIQUE mechanic, no, I wouldnt.

Right now we lose a very unique stun/skill mechanic (how many delayed, ground aoe dmg bases single target stuns u know in this game?) and get more % healing on that ICE skill i dont even know the name about.................... wow^^.

Well, all those advantages are totally MY OPINION what I see for advantages about the fissure stun, u mentioned U dont like it at all, may I ask why exactly? Is it the "clunky to aim correct person" thing? because yes, this happens, but the benefits most of the time overweight here heavily imo.

Waffennacht · April 2018

@Torbschka I don't like it on fissure because when I used the classic warden build that tried to utilize the stun, against DKs, NBs and Sorc's, they control the out come. (Just for reference the DK would be parallax, the NB Lexxy sorc ... I can't remember his name) or players of at least their skill, fissure's stun is rendered useless.

The DK tanky specs block the stun because it's so telegraphed - or allow themselves to be stunned when they can CC break and recover (say after casting panacea, shield wall, what have you...)

The NB type specs, with birds being dodgeable can kite, Cloak, shade port, etc to render fissue's stun. A ranged albeit dodgeable stun would be far more effective

Shield stacking Sorc's, ... Depending on their play, they may not be able to kill you, but a lot of builds will recover very easily by pre - empting your fissure. They can pre stack or just streak at the 2 sec mark. An independent stun would allow for your fissure combo to land when Shields expire rather than your burst getting absorbed by shield and only landing a pulse or so in.

While I absolutely agree the stun combo etc is effective against the majority, it's only really effective against players that just don't know it - at which point any combo will kill them regardless of a stun or not.

I don't Want to run accelerated drain because it's far more reliable and controllable over Fissure, it just is. I would much prefer a far more Active and Immediate CC

Brutusmax1mus · April 2018

Lol my friend literally 1 shots ppl every 3 seconds. If he doesn't, i kill it. His boss dummy 1s burst WITHOUT an ultimate hit 66k dmg. Great having him on my team lol.

Waffennacht · April 2018

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Lol my friend literally 1 shots ppl every 3 seconds. If he doesn't, i kill it. His boss dummy 1s burst WITHOUT an ultimate hit 66k dmg. Great having him on my team lol.

Let me guess... Around 14k bird tool tip, 16k fissure and... I'm leaning towards a Master's Reach? What... 10k ish tool tip?

Maybe a bit higher numbers but ball parked? Add in crits and you get there right?

@Brutusmax1mus

wheem_ESO · April 2018

It's absolutely true that many good players can frequently avoid the Shalk stun: blocking, proper timing of a dodge roll (at an angle that moves them out of the path, or straight through you), or pretty much any form of CC whatsoever. 'Course, the stun portion becomes immaterial if the ability doesn't land, but the same can be said of any other debuff component. If we're going to lose the stun on the shalks, Magicka Wardens better be getting something else (besides a resist debuff on the same ability) to make up for it.

Since its inception, the Mag Warden has, to me, felt more or less like a gimpy Magicka Sorcerer or Nightblade when in an offensive role. I have both of those other classes, and while I think I'm pretty mediocre at each, they still typically feel stronger than my Warden does, at least when going up against good players. Mag Warden has no good way to escape, no good way to deal with cloak spam, and the most avoidable burst out there.

I've tried the "Ice Mage" style a bit lately, though admittedly with a sub-optimal gear setup, and it just isn't that strong against someone that decides they don't want to die to it. The non HP-focused setup I used also had quite low survivability; going with the super-tank style would certainly help that, but I can't see the killing power going anywhere but down. And I don't want to be rude to certain posters here, but battleground scoreboard damage isn't necessarily "effective" damage. Racking up big numbers through a lot of "small" AOE ticks doesn't matter nearly as much as actually being able to land kills when it becomes important, especially vs groups with good healers.

Personally, I'd really like Wardens to have the ability to be an Ice Mage in the same way that DKs can be considered Fire Mages - it'd open up something fairly unique, and potentially pretty interesting. But I just don't see that happening with the current toolkit; ground based AOE just has a lot of weaknesses, especially vs decent Stamina players.

Brutusmax1mus · April 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Lol my friend literally 1 shots ppl every 3 seconds. If he doesn't, i kill it. His boss dummy 1s burst WITHOUT an ultimate hit 66k dmg. Great having him on my team lol.

Let me guess... Around 14k bird tool tip, 16k fissure and... I'm leaning towards a Master's Reach? What... 10k ish tool tip?

Maybe a bit higher numbers but ball parked? Add in crits and you get there right?

@Brutusmax1mus

@Waffennacht I'll ask what his tips are but I'm sure you're in the right ballpark based on my magden.

Brutusmax1mus · April 2018

@Waffennacht also, he shalks casts 2 birds and light attack force pulse (for dumny since it didn't add a dot and skew the burst calc) the 2 birds hit with in 1 second (.01s to 1s) duration so it's not all hitting at once, but within 1 seconds.

Waffennacht · April 2018

wheem_ESO wrote: »

It's absolutely true that many good players can frequently avoid the Shalk stun: blocking, proper timing of a dodge roll (at an angle that moves them out of the path, or straight through you), or pretty much any form of CC whatsoever. 'Course, the stun portion becomes immaterial if the ability doesn't land, but the same can be said of any other debuff component. If we're going to lose the stun on the shalks, Magicka Wardens better be getting something else (besides a resist debuff on the same ability) to make up for it.

Since its inception, the Mag Warden has, to me, felt more or less like a gimpy Magicka Sorcerer or Nightblade when in an offensive role. I have both of those other classes, and while I think I'm pretty mediocre at each, they still typically feel stronger than my Warden does, at least when going up against good players. Mag Warden has no good way to escape, no good way to deal with cloak spam, and the most avoidable burst out there.

I've tried the "Ice Mage" style a bit lately, though admittedly with a sub-optimal gear setup, and it just isn't that strong against someone that decides they don't want to die to it. The non HP-focused setup I used also had quite low survivability; going with the super-tank style would certainly help that, but I can't see the killing power going anywhere but down. And I don't want to be rude to certain posters here, but battleground scoreboard damage isn't necessarily "effective" damage. Racking up big numbers through a lot of "small" AOE ticks doesn't matter nearly as much as actually being able to land kills when it becomes important, especially vs groups with good healers.

Personally, I'd really like Wardens to have the ability to be an Ice Mage in the same way that DKs can be considered Fire Mages - it'd open up something fairly unique, and potentially pretty interesting. But I just don't see that happening with the current toolkit; ground based AOE just has a lot of weaknesses, especially vs decent Stamina players.

Depending on the build, the AoEs are just for triggers and CCs, the damage primarily comes from Proc sets.

Iirc tool tips are like 2k per sec on Blockade, and Reach isn't hitting hard either. But the CCs is where that shines.

Skoria Winterborn Caluurion are usual sets. I personally run skoria and winterborn ATM. Zaan is on my Templar.

Fissure is used of course, but no bird or pulse, Master's staff makes it even more potent.

Waffennacht · April 2018

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

@Waffennacht also, he shalks casts 2 birds and light attack force pulse (for dumny since it didn't add a dot and skew the burst calc) the 2 birds hit with in 1 second (.01s to 1s) duration so it's not all hitting at once, but within 1 seconds.

Nice, gonna guess necro Domi + really anything lol (I used axiom, though SPC is stronger for group play)

It's a good build, never beat lexy's NB with it tho, and GD parallax....

wheem_ESO · April 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

wheem_ESO wrote: »

It's absolutely true that many good players can frequently avoid the Shalk stun: blocking, proper timing of a dodge roll (at an angle that moves them out of the path, or straight through you), or pretty much any form of CC whatsoever. 'Course, the stun portion becomes immaterial if the ability doesn't land, but the same can be said of any other debuff component. If we're going to lose the stun on the shalks, Magicka Wardens better be getting something else (besides a resist debuff on the same ability) to make up for it.

Since its inception, the Mag Warden has, to me, felt more or less like a gimpy Magicka Sorcerer or Nightblade when in an offensive role. I have both of those other classes, and while I think I'm pretty mediocre at each, they still typically feel stronger than my Warden does, at least when going up against good players. Mag Warden has no good way to escape, no good way to deal with cloak spam, and the most avoidable burst out there.

I've tried the "Ice Mage" style a bit lately, though admittedly with a sub-optimal gear setup, and it just isn't that strong against someone that decides they don't want to die to it. The non HP-focused setup I used also had quite low survivability; going with the super-tank style would certainly help that, but I can't see the killing power going anywhere but down. And I don't want to be rude to certain posters here, but battleground scoreboard damage isn't necessarily "effective" damage. Racking up big numbers through a lot of "small" AOE ticks doesn't matter nearly as much as actually being able to land kills when it becomes important, especially vs groups with good healers.

Personally, I'd really like Wardens to have the ability to be an Ice Mage in the same way that DKs can be considered Fire Mages - it'd open up something fairly unique, and potentially pretty interesting. But I just don't see that happening with the current toolkit; ground based AOE just has a lot of weaknesses, especially vs decent Stamina players.

Depending on the build, the AoEs are just for triggers and CCs, the damage primarily comes from Proc sets.

Iirc tool tips are like 2k per sec on Blockade, and Reach isn't hitting hard either. But the CCs is where that shines.

Skoria Winterborn Caluurion are usual sets. I personally run skoria and winterborn ATM. Zaan is on my Templar.

Fissure is used of course, but no bird or pulse, Master's staff makes it even more potent.

I've run Skoria + Winterborn, but don't have Caluurion (I was using Wizard's Riposte, active on back bar only, and don't have Master's Ice Staff). Sure double procs can happen, and the damage can spike quite a lot then, but against a Stamina player with high burst who dodges roots (and/or uses Immovability Potions, which some people drink like it's going out of style), the build just straight up sucked. The only way I could think of where you might have enough survivability vs that, is to have most everything in Sturdy, and hold block while you hope for procs/DOT damage to do their thing.

The time(s) that roots truly worked as CC, was vs Magicka targets who can't afford dodge roll spam, or Stamina targets in drawn out group fights where they're not targeting you. And even then, I think it's often more annoying than it is effective (unless of course it's against another Magicka Warden /troll-face). There are very few Magicka Wardens in PC-NA Battlegrounds, but there are several who run the Ice Mage styled setups, and I've never had a particular problem with any of them. Since Battlegrounds very first came out, Magicka Wardens have been one of the least threatening things to me, on any class I play. Sure, the "old school" setup can blow you up really fast if you're caught off guard, but so can pretty much any other class; but those other classes are generally more difficult to deal with when you're not caught off guard.

Valencer · April 2018

Magicka warden is pretty potent imo. It has its' quirks, but it's hard to argue that a spec with access to things like Shimmering Shield and almost every important buff in the game can be considered weak.

Hutch679 · April 2018

For battlegrounds, ice staff > flame staff. Frost Reach is too valuable. In no CP, roots are.. well... The "root" of all evil. They force mag users to sit and take tons of damage, they blow through stam users resource pool, hold a flag carrier in place when they are trying to run away and cap, prevent players off flags in domination from capturing the point, and help cc players off your teammates in deathmatch. Hard to pass all that up .... now, without a stun from deep fissure frost staff loses its interest entirely. You have to run a flame staff for flame reach. You cant fit another skill on your bar. Fissure, birds or pulse, harness or dampen magicka, inner light (a must), and then what? Invig drain? Wtf. You aren't killing anyone with that lol. Not to mention shimmering now costs more, so either you aren't running it or of you do you need another magicka recovery glyph to sustain. They need to keep the stun on deep fissure or put it on birds to make it actually worth slotting. Atm force pulse is a better skill to use that cliff racer because it's 3 attacks, any of them can crit, applies status effects, instant hit, and easily weaved with light attacks. The bird has a delay that is telegraphed, easily dodged now (thanks ZOS), and hits for garbage unless you stack massively towards max magicka AND spell damage. Even if you stack mass damage players see the hideous bird flying from 20 yards away and either block, dodge, cloak, or shimmering shield it. Where magden currently stands is in a mediocre sport for pvp damage.

Yet stamina warden remains super strong. The increase in mag cost won't matter, they can just run shacklebreaker and easily cast it when they please, or run hakeijos. Removed spell resist debuff from shalks? Good gravy mashed potatoes what a hit with the nerf bat, whatever will they do!

Torbschka · April 2018

Hutch679 wrote: »

For battlegrounds, ice staff > flame staff. Frost Reach is too valuable. In no CP, roots are.. well... The "root" of all evil. They force mag users to sit and take tons of damage, they blow through stam users resource pool, hold a flag carrier in place when they are trying to run away and cap, prevent players off flags in domination from capturing the point, and help cc players off your teammates in deathmatch. Hard to pass all that up .... now, without a stun from deep fissure frost staff loses its interest entirely. You have to run a flame staff for flame reach. You cant fit another skill on your bar. Fissure, birds or pulse, harness or dampen magicka, inner light (a must), and then what? Invig drain? Wtf. You aren't killing anyone with that lol. Not to mention shimmering now costs more, so either you aren't running it or of you do you need another magicka recovery glyph to sustain. They need to keep the stun on deep fissure or put it on birds to make it actually worth slotting. Atm force pulse is a better skill to use that cliff racer because it's 3 attacks, any of them can crit, applies status effects, instant hit, and easily weaved with light attacks. The bird has a delay that is telegraphed, easily dodged now (thanks ZOS), and hits for garbage unless you stack massively towards max magicka AND spell damage. Even if you stack mass damage players see the hideous bird flying from 20 yards away and either block, dodge, cloak, or shimmering shield it. Where magden currently stands is in a mediocre sport for pvp damage.

Yet stamina warden remains super strong. The increase in mag cost won't matter, they can just run shacklebreaker and easily cast it when they please, or run hakeijos. Removed spell resist debuff from shalks? Good gravy mashed potatoes what a hit with the nerf bat, whatever will they do!

I can agree on this, includes a lot of my concerns aswell !

Hutch679 · April 2018

Torbschka wrote: »

Hutch679 wrote: »

For battlegrounds, ice staff > flame staff. Frost Reach is too valuable. In no CP, roots are.. well... The "root" of all evil. They force mag users to sit and take tons of damage, they blow through stam users resource pool, hold a flag carrier in place when they are trying to run away and cap, prevent players off flags in domination from capturing the point, and help cc players off your teammates in deathmatch. Hard to pass all that up .... now, without a stun from deep fissure frost staff loses its interest entirely. You have to run a flame staff for flame reach. You cant fit another skill on your bar. Fissure, birds or pulse, harness or dampen magicka, inner light (a must), and then what? Invig drain? Wtf. You aren't killing anyone with that lol. Not to mention shimmering now costs more, so either you aren't running it or of you do you need another magicka recovery glyph to sustain. They need to keep the stun on deep fissure or put it on birds to make it actually worth slotting. Atm force pulse is a better skill to use that cliff racer because it's 3 attacks, any of them can crit, applies status effects, instant hit, and easily weaved with light attacks. The bird has a delay that is telegraphed, easily dodged now (thanks ZOS), and hits for garbage unless you stack massively towards max magicka AND spell damage. Even if you stack mass damage players see the hideous bird flying from 20 yards away and either block, dodge, cloak, or shimmering shield it. Where magden currently stands is in a mediocre sport for pvp damage.

Yet stamina warden remains super strong. The increase in mag cost won't matter, they can just run shacklebreaker and easily cast it when they please, or run hakeijos. Removed spell resist debuff from shalks? Good gravy mashed potatoes what a hit with the nerf bat, whatever will they do!

I can agree on this, includes a lot of my concerns aswell !

Or how about no one will use bursting vines because it doesn't heal yourself, and is hard to target people with in pve? I use nature's embrace, but only because the heal is on myself as well. Bursting vines, regardless of the ulti buff, remains useless.

Waffennacht · April 2018

Meh @ innerlight

Hutch679 · April 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

Meh @ innerlight

7% max magicka, 3% magicka recovery, ~5% crit chance... pretty much a guarenteed slot considering magicka wardens typically stack max magicka. If you use necropotence and don't slot this ability, I question your knowledge about the class.