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Should Cloak be broken by DoT's?
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Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think Nightblades should choose. One morph negates dots, the other grants a safe crit. Dot immunity should not be a baseline ability, in my opinion.
Others must use a 48CD consumable in order to get invisible once and it is broken by everything that ticks on you and flies in your general direction. I'm fine with one class having a more convenient tool (Cloak-Invis pot, DK chains-Swarm mother) but I believe that either, only one morph of cloak should dampen dots, or Invisibility potions get the same treatment and negate dots. Because frankly, a long Cooldown consumable should not be weaker than a spammable ability.Edited by Dracane on March 22, 2018 5:56AMAuri-El is my lord,
Trinimac my ward,
and Magnus my mind.1 -
Dojohoda✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...I'm going with NO. A strong NO for .... reasons. Good reasons, trust me.Fan of playing magblade since 2015. (PC NA)
Might be joking in comments.
-->(((Cyrodiil)))<--0 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...I think Nightblades should choose. One morph negates dots, the other grants a safe crit. Dot immunity should not be a baseline ability, in my opinion.
Others must use a 48CD consumable in order to get invisible once and it is broken by everything that ticks on you and flies in your general direction. I'm fine with one class having a more convenient tool (Cloak-Invis pot, DK chains-Swarm mother) but I believe that either, only one morph of cloak should dampen dots, or Invisibility potions get the same treatment and negate dots. Because frankly, a long Cooldown consumable should not be weaker than a spammable ability.
It use to be this way but the devs removed the purge from dark cloak as that was to op for other players . It's getting really tiring for night blades to constantly re L2P every time theirs an issue .
I have a better suggestion . Someone point out to me where in the patch notes night blade got an awesome buff and lets dissect that buff together . No one was complaining much at all during Marrowind update so let's look at current patch notes and pin point the change .1 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Rohamad_Ali wrote: »I think Nightblades should choose. One morph negates dots, the other grants a safe crit. Dot immunity should not be a baseline ability, in my opinion.
Others must use a 48CD consumable in order to get invisible once and it is broken by everything that ticks on you and flies in your general direction. I'm fine with one class having a more convenient tool (Cloak-Invis pot, DK chains-Swarm mother) but I believe that either, only one morph of cloak should dampen dots, or Invisibility potions get the same treatment and negate dots. Because frankly, a long Cooldown consumable should not be weaker than a spammable ability.
It use to be this way but the devs removed the purge from dark cloak as that was to op for other players . It's getting really tiring for night blades to constantly re L2P every time theirs an issue .
I have a better suggestion . Someone point out to me where in the patch notes night blade got an awesome buff and lets dissect that buff together . No one was complaining much at all during Marrowind update so let's look at current patch notes and pin point the change .
Sorcs have to L2P more than anyone else, as our class is constantly destroyed with each update.
But this is not the right place for this. I'm basically fine with cloak, but it's not fair at all compared to how bad invisbility potions are.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac my ward,
and Magnus my mind.1 -
NyassaV✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...Should not be broken nor should it suppress them. I'm talking about single target DoTs not AoE DoTs. Anyone who says anything else needs to L2P as this really shouldn't even be up for debate. Direct hits bring people out of cloak, a single target DoT is not a direct hit.Edited by NyassaV on March 22, 2018 6:12AMFlawless Conqueror ~ Grand OverlordShe/Her ~ PC/NA | I record things for fun and for info0 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...Rohamad_Ali wrote: »I think Nightblades should choose. One morph negates dots, the other grants a safe crit. Dot immunity should not be a baseline ability, in my opinion.
Others must use a 48CD consumable in order to get invisible once and it is broken by everything that ticks on you and flies in your general direction. I'm fine with one class having a more convenient tool (Cloak-Invis pot, DK chains-Swarm mother) but I believe that either, only one morph of cloak should dampen dots, or Invisibility potions get the same treatment and negate dots. Because frankly, a long Cooldown consumable should not be weaker than a spammable ability.
It use to be this way but the devs removed the purge from dark cloak as that was to op for other players . It's getting really tiring for night blades to constantly re L2P every time theirs an issue .
I have a better suggestion . Someone point out to me where in the patch notes night blade got an awesome buff and lets dissect that buff together . No one was complaining much at all during Marrowind update so let's look at current patch notes and pin point the change .
Sorcs have to L2P more than anyone else, as our class is constantly destroyed with each update.
But this is not the right place for this. I'm basically fine with cloak, but it's not fair at all compared to how bad invisbility potions are.
Sorcs have been through the ringer , not sure if more than every other class but whatever . Most notably nerfs to shield and broken streak for months on end .
But what does invis pots have to do nightblade at all ? I'm not understanding the complaint of a utility consumable in relation to a class .0 -
Kalante✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...snares, heavy attacking lightning staffs, hurricane, swallow soul, fear, talons, mage light, gap closers, power of the light, purifying light, radiant, soul assault, curse, detect pots, and these are just a couple of skills that take us out of cloak. If anything i wish there was less things to take us out of cloak but again NB hate is blind.
Also l2p.Edited by Kalante on March 22, 2018 6:27AM6 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Rohamad_Ali wrote: »Rohamad_Ali wrote: »I think Nightblades should choose. One morph negates dots, the other grants a safe crit. Dot immunity should not be a baseline ability, in my opinion.
Others must use a 48CD consumable in order to get invisible once and it is broken by everything that ticks on you and flies in your general direction. I'm fine with one class having a more convenient tool (Cloak-Invis pot, DK chains-Swarm mother) but I believe that either, only one morph of cloak should dampen dots, or Invisibility potions get the same treatment and negate dots. Because frankly, a long Cooldown consumable should not be weaker than a spammable ability.
It use to be this way but the devs removed the purge from dark cloak as that was to op for other players . It's getting really tiring for night blades to constantly re L2P every time theirs an issue .
I have a better suggestion . Someone point out to me where in the patch notes night blade got an awesome buff and lets dissect that buff together . No one was complaining much at all during Marrowind update so let's look at current patch notes and pin point the change .
Sorcs have to L2P more than anyone else, as our class is constantly destroyed with each update.
But this is not the right place for this. I'm basically fine with cloak, but it's not fair at all compared to how bad invisbility potions are.
Sorcs have been through the ringer , not sure if more than every other class but whatever . Most notably nerfs to shield and broken streak for months on end .
But what does invis pots have to do nightblade at all ? I'm not understanding the complaint of a utility consumable in relation to a class .
If you can't understand this, then I won't bother explaining it again,Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac my ward,
and Magnus my mind.2 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...Cloak should not be broken by DOTs, however it also should not reduce DOT damage to zero.
Become invisible? Yes. Ignore large amounts of damage as a side-effect? No.3 -
No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...Should take damage from DoT and -8% if they have the morph that gives reduction to taken damage.
But it should not break the cloak, if it did. I demand major cool down on damage shields or just like cloak would be pretty much removed from game, make that damage shields increase taken damage and gotta learn to dodge lul
Edited by Orange_fire_dragon on March 22, 2018 7:19AM0 -
red_emu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes, Cloak should be broken by Damage over Time abilities...This is a pointless poll, seeing how much of the community mains a nightblade. I agree though. Every other class has to purge or outheal the dot and we have to stay in the fight. We can't just turn invisible and run away. Nightblades not being anymore squishy than any other non tanking set up, since they have insane recovery doesn't make them vunerable at all.
I think cloak should last 6 seconds (to be on par with shields), but be either breakable by a dot or have increased cost when sppaming it (since it is more useful than a shield that doesn't turn you INVISIBLE )PC - EU:
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Falathren - AD StamSorc
Falathren Eryndaer - AD StamDen
Falathren Irimion - AD MagPlar
Talagan Falathren - AD StamDK
Falathren Infernis - AD MagDK
Your-Ex - AD MagBlade2 -
KingJ✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...
Your not toning down cloak your removing it from the game.It be that worthless no stam build can build the magic sustain and max magica to use purge and cloak.There enough dots to have them constantly be on you.Your never be able to cloak.TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Rohamad_Ali wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Rohamad_Ali wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »Cloak already doesn't cleanse a DoT. From what I understand it did once upon a time, but that was removed. Some sets, like The Vicecannon of Venom set is reported to be bugged where if you hit someone with, say, Reflective Scales up it does pull you out of cloak with each tick.
Maybe those sets do, but IMHO, all DoT's should pull you out of Cloak as you are constantly taking damage over time...
And no, Cloak doesn't cleanse the DoT, but you are able to ignore DoT damage and stay in stealth; this is all wrong as far as I can see and makes Cloak overtuned...
I believe DoT's should have to be cleansed or purged before someone can Cloak out and stay Cloaked and I also believe that the cost of Purge should be reduced so that its not too taxing on ones Magicka pool to get rid of DoT's...
Cloak is extremely brief, you know. I think tops is 2.9 seconds. And it uses up a lot of magicka. Stam builds will have a tough time keeping it up back to back. Maybe 3 or 4 times in a row. There are invisibility pots that last faaaaar longer.
Oh I agree; the duration is brief, but that said (in the right hands) Cloak is extremely powerful...
In the hands of someone that knows what they are doing, its a get out of jail free card and allows the Nightblade to reset the fight repeatedly until they win the resource battle against you and kill you...
As a result, its a bit overtuned...
In my minds eye, a major reason for this is its ability to allow the Nightblade to ignore DoT damage and successfully disengage with an opponent readily...
You gotta admit, being able to completely ignore DoT's is an extremely powerful feature...
You could theorectically have 10 DoT's on you and with a single press of the button, you have made yourself immune to all their damage and simultaneously hidden yourself from your opponents sight...
And you can now rapidly heal to full health in addition to all of this...
I repeat...
Cloak is overtuned...
Frankly, there's not much else they could do but get rid of it. Like myself and others have said, there are a multitude of things that break a NB out of stealth. If you make it so that everything does then it becomes useless. Or is that what you're really after?
Sure there are things they could do with lowering the cost of Purge being high on the list of possible balancing fixes for example...
So no, I do not want to make it useless, but I don't believe it should be as powerful as it currently is either...
Having an ability that allows you to completely ignore DoT's, readily disengage from an opponent(s), and rapidly heal is extremely powerful...
There is caltrops , lingering and scorching flare , several traps that can be placed that will immobilize an ambusher , poisons that can stop NB's from entering cloak , Mage light and inner light , detect pots ..... If you can't make a cloaking NB have a bad day in this game you really should try something besides pvp .
Oh don't come at me with that 'git guud' crap...
I know exactly how to play and how to counter Nightblades and the really good ones have a counter already prepared for the counters you listed...
Namely Major Expedition and Shuffle; they'll run from you (while staying just close enough to you so that you can't stealth out) and wait your detect pot out while shooting you with a bow...
They'll break LoS when needed and of course they will stealth out with Cloak and reset things until the fight goes their way...
And you still ignore the fact that having the ability to completely ignore DoT damage is extremely powerful (especially when combined with all the rest of its features)...
loTheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Rohamad_Ali wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Rohamad_Ali wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »Cloak already doesn't cleanse a DoT. From what I understand it did once upon a time, but that was removed. Some sets, like The Vicecannon of Venom set is reported to be bugged where if you hit someone with, say, Reflective Scales up it does pull you out of cloak with each tick.
Maybe those sets do, but IMHO, all DoT's should pull you out of Cloak as you are constantly taking damage over time...
And no, Cloak doesn't cleanse the DoT, but you are able to ignore DoT damage and stay in stealth; this is all wrong as far as I can see and makes Cloak overtuned...
I believe DoT's should have to be cleansed or purged before someone can Cloak out and stay Cloaked and I also believe that the cost of Purge should be reduced so that its not too taxing on ones Magicka pool to get rid of DoT's...
Cloak is extremely brief, you know. I think tops is 2.9 seconds. And it uses up a lot of magicka. Stam builds will have a tough time keeping it up back to back. Maybe 3 or 4 times in a row. There are invisibility pots that last faaaaar longer.
Oh I agree; the duration is brief, but that said (in the right hands) Cloak is extremely powerful...
In the hands of someone that knows what they are doing, its a get out of jail free card and allows the Nightblade to reset the fight repeatedly until they win the resource battle against you and kill you...
As a result, its a bit overtuned...
In my minds eye, a major reason for this is its ability to allow the Nightblade to ignore DoT damage and successfully disengage with an opponent readily...
You gotta admit, being able to completely ignore DoT's is an extremely powerful feature...
You could theorectically have 10 DoT's on you and with a single press of the button, you have made yourself immune to all their damage and simultaneously hidden yourself from your opponents sight...
And you can now rapidly heal to full health in addition to all of this...
I repeat...
Cloak is overtuned...
Frankly, there's not much else they could do but get rid of it. Like myself and others have said, there are a multitude of things that break a NB out of stealth. If you make it so that everything does then it becomes useless. Or is that what you're really after?
Sure there are things they could do with lowering the cost of Purge being high on the list of possible balancing fixes for example...
So no, I do not want to make it useless, but I don't believe it should be as powerful as it currently is either...
Having an ability that allows you to completely ignore DoT's, readily disengage from an opponent(s), and rapidly heal is extremely powerful...
There is caltrops , lingering and scorching flare , several traps that can be placed that will immobilize an ambusher , poisons that can stop NB's from entering cloak , Mage light and inner light , detect pots ..... If you can't make a cloaking NB have a bad day in this game you really should try something besides pvp .
Oh don't come at me with that 'git guud' crap...
I know exactly how to play and how to counter Nightblades and the really good ones have a counter already prepared for the counters you listed...
Namely Major Expedition and Shuffle; they'll run from you (while staying just close enough to you so that you can't stealth out) and wait your detect pot out while shooting you with a bow...
They'll break LoS when needed and of course they will stealth out with Cloak and reset things until the fight goes their way...
And you still ignore the fact that having the ability to completely ignore DoT damage is extremely powerful (especially when combined with all the rest of its features)...
LOL so it's just the really good players your having trouble with . K .
Thanks for once again dodging the fact that being able to ignore DoT damage and simutaneosly stealth out is a big reason why Cloak is overtuned...
That's not a fact , that's an opinion . I already said the class Passives are built around stealth and medium armors and disrupting the classes ability to cloak because of dots , which there are dozens in this game , would destroy the classes passive strengths . Which the designer Nick Konkle understood very well . Perhaps you can make your own game with your version of balance one day but today I'd prefer we stick with actual game designers .
We'll see about that...
Combat balancing is coming and Nightblades are in the crosshairs...
Would you rather Cloak get hit with the nerf bat or Incap?
My goal with this thread was to put an idea out there that keeps your damage potential intact while not completely crippling your class...
Nightblades will be toned down, and I promise you my idea is more tame than some of the other idea's out there...1 -
jaschacasadiob16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭As long as you take full damage, you can be invisible. Maybe if you have the bleed effect on, it would be nice to have some hint of your position."Yesterday while searching a barrel in vVoM I found a lemon. Best drop of the whole run."
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greylox✭✭✭✭✭Yes, Cloak should be broken by Damage over Time abilities...Surely they should otherwise someone can just keep cloaking , I've never played an mmo where damage doesn't get you out of cloak. PvP problems though so whatever...PC EU
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Maura_Neysa✭✭✭✭✭Okay can’t vote on this one because ITS NOT TRUE. Cloak does not remove DoTs, each time the DoT ticks you become visible again momentarily. Plus the damage (OR miss stays visible longer) This is some what hard to track of course, which I think it should be. I actually run a build that is extremely effective against NBs. I only need two skills to stay on top of a NB on the run. Destructive Touch (Frost) which keeps those damage numbers ticking for me to follow, and Arctic Blast, to pull them out of Stealth if I do loose them.
Personally I find this to be a very good balance. A NB with Cloak and effective use of the terrain can absolutely ghost. However Cloak alone isn't enough. Honestly, I find NB to be the least OP class in Cryodiil, with only Bomb blades having a chance, and only when in a coordinated group.Edited by Maura_Neysa on March 22, 2018 11:23PMMaiden Maura - Xbox NA
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Playing BiS isn't impressive, playing unique at BiS lvl, THAT's impressive.1 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Cloak is stupid OP if your not running direct counters to it, if it’s countered Cloak is completely useless.
Outside of Piercing Mark all the other Cloak counters are useless because they don’t bring anything else to the table except revealing Cloak...Radiant Light is more useless now since they took away the stealth damage reduction protection from it.
Expert Hunter is completely useless as a skill
So it’s either detect pots (that were also nerfed they used to be much better) or Piercing Mark.
Most of the counters to Nightblade were nerfed this this lead to strong indirect buffs to Nightblades. Of course Nightblade is the only real hard counter to Stam Warden so they will likely be the new overlords after the nerf train is finished with nightbladesRinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
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ccfeeling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...It will be great if Zos remove all pvp perspective skills from NB under massive pressure. im waiting new pve skills
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Kolzki✭✭✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...When does anyone not have a dot on them?1 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...Its nearly impossible to be in a PVP fight without having a dot on you. This change makes cloak literally the worst ability the game has ever seen. Not even dead. Its being removed from existence. Not even worth the skill point to level it up.0 -
IV_Deity✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »
No. It would render cloak useless as stated. It's literally part of their class to be able to cloak out of combat as they choose. Saying that they should "cleanse it" doesn't really offer an alternative. Who is really going to slot Purge? It's a magicka dump. I just say let them take 50 percent of a DoT's damage while cloaked or something. At least that's reasonable.
EDIT: Also, there's quite a few skills AND pots that prevent nightblades from entering stealth. You guys are just too lazy to even use them. No need to complain about cloak.
Edited by IV_Deity on March 22, 2018 11:40AMDeityTheNoble3 -
Violynne✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I took a break from the game right before Morrowind was released. Back then, Sorcs were OP.TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »There have been a lot of threads created lately about how OP Nightblades are...
"Nerf this!", "Nerf that!", cried those who couldn't take down sorcs.
Now NBs are OP?
I'd like to know what patch gave NBs their super powers which dropped sorcs from the top of the food chain.
Good thing my new character is a NB.
1 -
KeiruNicrom✭✭✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...Take the damage yes. Be broken no. At best i would like to submit the idea of a bar like the WW timer one that drains each time you take a tick of damage from a DOT while invisible. Base ticks capable 5 increases to 10 scaling with max health or health recovery (for no other reason except few things scale with health and doing so would make longer cloak more of a tank ability than a dps one)0 -
Silver_Strider✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Silver_Strider wrote: »No it shouldn't be broken by DoTs.
Cloak's entire purpose is to be an escape/repositioning tool for a NB to better situate themselves. Since they lack the heals of Templar and Wardens, the Shields of Sorcs or the natural bulkiness of DKs, cloak is literally the only defensive tool NB have as a means of survival and it's the easiest countered method as well as there are a literal plethora of skills that can take a NB out of Cloak. You snare a NB before they can cloak and they're essentially dead because Cloak does not remove the snare and it's easy to find them at that point as they're moving at a snails pace from where they disappeared from that you'll easily locate them again in no time at all.
Another thing to consider is that, Cloak doesn't remove the DoTs that are placed on a NB. In order for the NB to remain unaffected by the DoTs, they need to repeatedly use Cloak, using up more and more resources just to get to a safe position to get back their resources and try to put pressure on their target again. Is it annoying that your target got away? Sure, but they failed to kill you and that's much more important than just getting a random kill off of a scrub that couldn't kill you in the first place.
Yes, cloak has some nice bonuses to it, like guaranteed crit heals on HoTs, but again, with no alternative method of defense, what do you propose the NB do instead? Stand there and wait to die? Would you given the option? Of course not, no sane person would.
If you make it so that Cloak gets broken by DoTs, you might as well remove it entirely as no one will ever slot it again.
I'm ok with the purpose of Cloak as an escape/repositioning tool; it's fine in that regard...
What's not fine is being able to ignore continuous damage and stealth out with such an effect on your characters person...
If you want to Cloak while Dotted, then fine...but unless you want that Cloak to be immediately broken, then it should be purged 1st..
So, while every class has an option of defense within their class to deal with taking damage, a NB would need both an out of class option and Cloak to get the same result. Sounds totally fair, right? While we're at it, lets remove purge from Templars since all other classes need to slot a separate skill to do the same.
It's ludicrous, plain and simple.Edited by Silver_Strider on March 22, 2018 12:38PMArgonian forever2 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Thunderknuckles wrote: »Ragnarock41 wrote: »dots shouldn't break cloak, but still do damage. thats how it should be.
That's how it is. Unless the NB is using Purge as well. That takes up a valuable slot that most NB's use for something else.
That is not how it is, stop spreading bad info. You take no dot damage when inside cloak.
I can clearly see the ''miss'' ticks out of my dots when the nb uses cloak after getting tagged with claws,noxious etc.Edited by Ragnarock41 on March 22, 2018 12:10PM1 -
TequilaFire✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Rohamad_Ali wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Rohamad_Ali wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »Cloak already doesn't cleanse a DoT. From what I understand it did once upon a time, but that was removed. Some sets, like The Vicecannon of Venom set is reported to be bugged where if you hit someone with, say, Reflective Scales up it does pull you out of cloak with each tick.
Maybe those sets do, but IMHO, all DoT's should pull you out of Cloak as you are constantly taking damage over time...
And no, Cloak doesn't cleanse the DoT, but you are able to ignore DoT damage and stay in stealth; this is all wrong as far as I can see and makes Cloak overtuned...
I believe DoT's should have to be cleansed or purged before someone can Cloak out and stay Cloaked and I also believe that the cost of Purge should be reduced so that its not too taxing on ones Magicka pool to get rid of DoT's...
Cloak is extremely brief, you know. I think tops is 2.9 seconds. And it uses up a lot of magicka. Stam builds will have a tough time keeping it up back to back. Maybe 3 or 4 times in a row. There are invisibility pots that last faaaaar longer.
Oh I agree; the duration is brief, but that said (in the right hands) Cloak is extremely powerful...
In the hands of someone that knows what they are doing, its a get out of jail free card and allows the Nightblade to reset the fight repeatedly until they win the resource battle against you and kill you...
As a result, its a bit overtuned...
In my minds eye, a major reason for this is its ability to allow the Nightblade to ignore DoT damage and successfully disengage with an opponent readily...
You gotta admit, being able to completely ignore DoT's is an extremely powerful feature...
You could theorectically have 10 DoT's on you and with a single press of the button, you have made yourself immune to all their damage and simultaneously hidden yourself from your opponents sight...
And you can now rapidly heal to full health in addition to all of this...
I repeat...
Cloak is overtuned...
Frankly, there's not much else they could do but get rid of it. Like myself and others have said, there are a multitude of things that break a NB out of stealth. If you make it so that everything does then it becomes useless. Or is that what you're really after?
Sure there are things they could do with lowering the cost of Purge being high on the list of possible balancing fixes for example...
So no, I do not want to make it useless, but I don't believe it should be as powerful as it currently is either...
Having an ability that allows you to completely ignore DoT's, readily disengage from an opponent(s), and rapidly heal is extremely powerful...
There is caltrops , lingering and scorching flare , several traps that can be placed that will immobilize an ambusher , poisons that can stop NB's from entering cloak , Mage light and inner light , detect pots ..... If you can't make a cloaking NB have a bad day in this game you really should try something besides pvp .
Oh don't come at me with that 'git guud' crap...
I know exactly how to play and how to counter Nightblades and the really good ones have a counter already prepared for the counters you listed...
Namely Major Expedition and Shuffle; they'll run from you (while staying just close enough to you so that you can't stealth out) and wait your detect pot out while shooting you with a bow...
They'll break LoS when needed and of course they will stealth out with Cloak and reset things until the fight goes their way...
And you still ignore the fact that having the ability to completely ignore DoT damage is extremely powerful (especially when combined with all the rest of its features)...
loTheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Rohamad_Ali wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Rohamad_Ali wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »Thunderknuckles wrote: »Cloak already doesn't cleanse a DoT. From what I understand it did once upon a time, but that was removed. Some sets, like The Vicecannon of Venom set is reported to be bugged where if you hit someone with, say, Reflective Scales up it does pull you out of cloak with each tick.
Maybe those sets do, but IMHO, all DoT's should pull you out of Cloak as you are constantly taking damage over time...
And no, Cloak doesn't cleanse the DoT, but you are able to ignore DoT damage and stay in stealth; this is all wrong as far as I can see and makes Cloak overtuned...
I believe DoT's should have to be cleansed or purged before someone can Cloak out and stay Cloaked and I also believe that the cost of Purge should be reduced so that its not too taxing on ones Magicka pool to get rid of DoT's...
Cloak is extremely brief, you know. I think tops is 2.9 seconds. And it uses up a lot of magicka. Stam builds will have a tough time keeping it up back to back. Maybe 3 or 4 times in a row. There are invisibility pots that last faaaaar longer.
Oh I agree; the duration is brief, but that said (in the right hands) Cloak is extremely powerful...
In the hands of someone that knows what they are doing, its a get out of jail free card and allows the Nightblade to reset the fight repeatedly until they win the resource battle against you and kill you...
As a result, its a bit overtuned...
In my minds eye, a major reason for this is its ability to allow the Nightblade to ignore DoT damage and successfully disengage with an opponent readily...
You gotta admit, being able to completely ignore DoT's is an extremely powerful feature...
You could theorectically have 10 DoT's on you and with a single press of the button, you have made yourself immune to all their damage and simultaneously hidden yourself from your opponents sight...
And you can now rapidly heal to full health in addition to all of this...
I repeat...
Cloak is overtuned...
Frankly, there's not much else they could do but get rid of it. Like myself and others have said, there are a multitude of things that break a NB out of stealth. If you make it so that everything does then it becomes useless. Or is that what you're really after?
Sure there are things they could do with lowering the cost of Purge being high on the list of possible balancing fixes for example...
So no, I do not want to make it useless, but I don't believe it should be as powerful as it currently is either...
Having an ability that allows you to completely ignore DoT's, readily disengage from an opponent(s), and rapidly heal is extremely powerful...
There is caltrops , lingering and scorching flare , several traps that can be placed that will immobilize an ambusher , poisons that can stop NB's from entering cloak , Mage light and inner light , detect pots ..... If you can't make a cloaking NB have a bad day in this game you really should try something besides pvp .
Oh don't come at me with that 'git guud' crap...
I know exactly how to play and how to counter Nightblades and the really good ones have a counter already prepared for the counters you listed...
Namely Major Expedition and Shuffle; they'll run from you (while staying just close enough to you so that you can't stealth out) and wait your detect pot out while shooting you with a bow...
They'll break LoS when needed and of course they will stealth out with Cloak and reset things until the fight goes their way...
And you still ignore the fact that having the ability to completely ignore DoT damage is extremely powerful (especially when combined with all the rest of its features)...
LOL so it's just the really good players your having trouble with . K .
Thanks for once again dodging the fact that being able to ignore DoT damage and simutaneosly stealth out is a big reason why Cloak is overtuned...
That's not a fact , that's an opinion . I already said the class Passives are built around stealth and medium armors and disrupting the classes ability to cloak because of dots , which there are dozens in this game , would destroy the classes passive strengths . Which the designer Nick Konkle understood very well . Perhaps you can make your own game with your version of balance one day but today I'd prefer we stick with actual game designers .
We'll see about that...
Combat balancing is coming and Nightblades are in the crosshairs...
Would you rather Cloak get hit with the nerf bat or Incap?
My goal with this thread was to put an idea out there that keeps your damage potential intact while not completely crippling your class...
Nightblades will be toned down, and I promise you my idea is more tame than some of the other idea's out there...
And where do you get this info from a dev? Just because the nerf NB Illuminati has been posting multiple threads with the agenda of trying to badger the devs into destroying nightblades because they have trouble not getting spanked by them doesn't make it fact. I would be more worried about whatever nerf is going to be made against what ever class you play than to be continually attacking other classes. The class re-balance is going to be painful for everyone just wait.Edited by TequilaFire on March 22, 2018 12:15PM0 -
Maryal✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...Cloak used to include purge. After many complaints about the unfairness of NBs cloak giving them a 'free purge' when most others had to spend a lot of resources to use the alliance war purge, ZOS removed purge from cloak and replaced it with a purge-like-effect which required NBs to spam cloak for the duration of the DOT (to suppress DOTs). That raised the resource cost to NBs and the complainers were happy ... complainers all across Cyrodiil sang, rejoiced and drank lots of skooma. NBs could only watch from a distance ... they weren't invited to the party (they wouldn't have gone even if they were invited).
Cloak is fine the way it is.Edited by Maryal on March 22, 2018 1:12PM2 -
teiselaise✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...Let's make healing unusable if you or anyone close damaged, oh and we could also remove some of sorcs skill, you see, crystal frags killed me yesterday. It's so *** incredibly overpowered lmao haaahahaa OMG I hate sorcs. I'm so good.Argonian masterrace0 -
shinikaze✭✭✭No, Cloak should not be broken by Damage over Time abilities...I don't mind taking dot damage while on cloak but dot breaking cloak is a a total NO
Also i've always said this poison, desease, burn, bleed dot should not be blocked/shielded/negated by cloak0 -
notyuu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes, Cloak should be broken by Damage over Time abilities...cuz you gotta have something to counter the cloak/take it out of action while in a fight
and due to the ability to purge dots you could pop that then cloak if you truly wish to disengage0
