PTS Update 17 - Feedback Thread for Synergy Improvements

ZOS_GinaBruno · January 2018

This is the official feedback thread for the Synergy changes and improvements. After you have a chance to try out different combat scenarios, let us know what you think of the current balance.

Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:
Did you find the synergies were easier to use?
Were there any instances where you thought you could use a synergy, but couldn’t?
Was it clear when you could or could not use a synergy?
Some synergies got a fairly significant overhaul. As such, feedback on individual synergies would be appreciated.
Do you have any other general feedback?

Reorx_Holybeard · January 2018

Can you clarify this from the patch notes:

Synergies will now grant the synergy prompt to the three closest allies to the center of the synergy, up from only one ally.

Does it look for the "3 closest allies" or the "3 closest allies that don't have the synergy currently in cooldown"? Hopefully it is the latter.

Haven't tested things yet but from the patch notes this already looks like a greatly improved system!

Joy_Division · January 2018

I am looking forward to these changes, but that 30 second cooldown is a killjoy.

20 seconds is more than enough; as it is I can only synergize a single DK talons for every five that is cast.

You made some welcome changes, let us actually use this nice system. I'm not worried about being the target of synergy spam in PvP. Every 20 seconds is not spam and having people use coordination to kill me is a heck of a lot more satisfying than just getting spammed by Surprise Attack, Cliff racers, and Jesus Beam. That's the real spam. Not synergies.

Tasear · January 2018

With the cool down I hope it

"3 closest allies"

Means it doesn't matter if these people are on cooldown be or so I hope.

Tasear · January 2018

Bone shield changes are really nice... but a bit scary that's a 17k shield for most.>.> But what am I saying it's a buff to my favorite healer and tank.

Blood altar .. just is wonderful change at least on paper. I love zos so much for that. I can't wait to test this.

Thraben · January 2018

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for the Synergy changes and improvements. After you have a chance to try out different combat scenarios, let us know what you think of the current balance.
Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

Did you find the synergies were easier to use?

Were there any instances where you thought you could use a synergy, but couldn’t?

Was it clear when you could or could not use a synergy?
[x] Some synergies got a fairly significant overhaul. As such, feedback on individual synergies would be appreciated.
[Y] Do you have any other general feedback?

All from the PvP "ball group counter" view:

x)Bone Wall: I still find it too hard to use in chaotic fights - needs a larger activation radius
Impale: Doesn´t work against good player groups (who aren´t trapped by the talons)
Radiate: should do fire damage
Black Widows: the spiders are too slow: give them the NPC clannfear´s charge skill which forces synergized targets to break out

y) Damaging Synergies should do extra damage, or extra effects against players so players actually use them.

Greydir · January 2018

Since Orbs and Spearshards still have a Shared Cooldown the 30 Second cooldown is another nerf to sustainability via backdoor. Thats really quite harsh.

Tasear · January 2018

Blanked to avoid confusion

Tasear · January 2018

Same as above

Morgul667 · January 2018

The key issue is whether this will kill sorc healers wearing twilight remedy which would be a shame

Tasear · January 2018

lets define synergy for a second.

the interaction or cooperation of two or more organizations, substances, or other agents to produce a combined effect greater than the sum of their separate effects.

Storm attonach synergy should include nearby allies or a least one in it's usage. It's not good for group play in the slightest.

Tasear · January 2018

disregard commments excpet storm annotach.... I thought you had synergy cooldowwn for 30 secs instead 1 sec between unquie synergyies... that was on me, but would consider different wording on the live notes. I can't be only one who would be confused.

Tasear · January 2018

The undaunted mettle or was command.. need a buff as it's dependency on synergies.

Tasear · January 2018

Now back on point with synergy sets... lunar bastion is now( 10 + 1 sec (cooldown between unquiue syneries)) 11 secs and 10k shield. While on other hand bone shield is a 17k shield which is spammable with addition effect. Not to mention the dk skill giving at it's lowest way more of that amount. It's not a decent set espcially for a trial and well to be given from dlc content.

Tasear · January 2018

Greydir wrote: »

Since Orbs and Spearshards still have a Shared Cooldown the 30 Second cooldown is another nerf to sustainability via backdoor. Thats really quite harsh.

First 30 secs is a bit much. Unless you planning to add more synergies to game. Most classes only have 1 or 2. But considering this change undaunted mettle or command which ever one goes with syneries needs some love to respect this upcoming change. The resouce return should be buffed.

Tasear · January 2018

Blood atlar I don't see boundry for this set. Looks coolers this way... but too confusing for allies. How do they know where to stand.

frankwchenzo · January 2018

Summery: Please DON'T FORGET all 4 trial sets in Maw of Lorkai when INPROVING or nerf? synergy

When the improvment of synergy is putting on agenda, these 4 sets were the first thing coming out of my mind. But with all these changes in 3.3.0, all these changes or improvments have become an unnecessary NERF for all these sets.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

General
Removed Synergies from the global cooldown, and they can now be activated while using other abilities.
Synergies now have a shared one second cooldown with other synergies.
Developer Comment:
As synergies are now off the global cooldown, this change was necessary to prevent “synergy bombs” where players could activate multiple synergies in the same second.
Increased the cooldown for each individual synergy to 30 seconds from 20 seconds.

The increasement of every individual synergy is quite suprising. I'm trying to understand why this change is necessary but still can't figure out now. A nerf for substain, while you guys are buffing substain by encouraging players doing HA on Off Balance enermies.WTF?

As for Moondancer/Alkosh/Twilight Remedy, in current servers, if you're in a decent group and running some trials like AA, the uptime of all these buffs/debuffs is still considerable since the buffs/debuffs lasts 30s and the CD is just 20s. But with these changes in UPDATE17 this situation may be banished, like one of the "Diagram: Dwarven Pipeline Cap, Sealed", to the darkness forever more, never to be seen again. :'(

My suggestion, reconsider the individual cooldown, which is nearly impossible for you ZOS or, increase the duration of all these sets' 5 pieces bouns to, like 35s, 36s or even 40s to make it avaliable again in trials, which is just a convenience change and will not cause any balancing issues, for now.

A forsaken class, magPlar DD and his friend, off-balance slave magSorc are begging you and write these words down.

Thraben · January 2018

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for the Synergy changes and improvements. After you have a chance to try out different combat scenarios, let us know what you think of the current balance.
Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

Did you find the synergies were easier to use?

Were there any instances where you thought you could use a synergy, but couldn’t?

Was it clear when you could or could not use a synergy?

Some synergies got a fairly significant overhaul. As such, feedback on individual synergies would be appreciated.

Do you have any other general feedback?

Specifically the Webs:

The poison explosion should be triggered by the synergy, and should take place around the target instead of the web.

Tasear · January 2018

So was enjoying an ironic discussion about twlight remedy. It will only be useful or well potent option for sorc healers now.

I know... right...had it all wrong.

But on a real note twlight remedy needs a balance update to 15 secs duration or will really become exclusive to sorc healers for most part. I accept that if that the plan

. As the base heal over 30 secs will be too low and minor force vs trapped best time was never good. P.S buff minor force uptime pls

The other synergy sets my be fine though. Moondancer I would think works better. Lunar bastion is still very bad choice.

Beardimus · January 2018

I think the changes are good. I never knew only 1 Random was offered it before

Tasear · January 2018

With all game changes, I do wonder maybe it would be good to mention something in game to tell people they are useable again. A tutorial or like crown store announcement, maybe even a newsletter.

Tasear · January 2018

@paulsimonps @MissBizz have you guys had a chance to see synergy changes?

Juhasow · January 2018

30 seconds synergies colldown ? So orbs/shards synergies are getting 50% nerf in effectivness because they can be casted without sharing cooldown with abilities ? I dont think this deal is adding up.

Zer0oo · January 2018

The 30 sec cooldown to orbs and shards makes me worried since it is another sustain nerf and i really do not want to heavy attack even more. (Or reroll mag nb since they can still use light attack rotation and do more damage than any other range class) Also i am not sure there are enough synergies now to proc certain sets in a reasonable time. For most raid setups only 2 synergies are there quite often. (Liquid lightning and orbs)

jbjondeaueb17_ESO · January 2018

If you intend to keep a 30s cooldown, remove the shared synergy timer for shards/orbs. It's totally unfair.
What would you think if Atronach and Nova were sharing a cooldown because they're both Ultimates ? You'd find that ridiculous and that's most templars think since this system was added.

MissBizz · January 2018

Tasear wrote: »

@paulsimonps @MissBizz have you guys had a chance to see synergy changes?

I read them, I haven't tested them. From reading.. IMO synergies were really broken and reading all these fixes really brought that to light, but it's disappointing that the cooldown is 30 seconds. I want to actually use them if they work! I'll need to round a crew up for some dungeons though

paulsimonps · January 2018

Tasear wrote: »

@paulsimonps @MissBizz have you guys had a chance to see synergy changes?

@Tasear
Have been out of the country so not been able to test yet. Give me about 48hs and you will have my feedback on stuff. But from reading notes, not happy at all about the 30s cooldown change, it could be another nail in the coffin for Alkosh but we will have to see how DPS builds themselves now and if we will get other synergies more reliably.

IxSTALKERxI · January 2018

As far as the cooldown change goes - think of it like earthgore.

Earthgore has a 30s cooldown but to get around this you slot it on every person in group.

Same goes for synergies. If everyone slots bone shield you can keep using a different persons bone shield every second - I havn't been able to get more than 2 people testing though but that's how it works with 2 people anyway.

(bone shield is OP btw, just sayin)

kojou · January 2018

I need to do more testing with synergies in general, but right off I feel like 30 seconds is too long. Even so it is better than what we currently have, but I think 20 seconds is plenty of cool down.

paulsimonps · January 2018

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

As far as the cooldown change goes - think of it like earthgore.

Earthgore has a 30s cooldown but to get around this you slot it on every person in group.

Same goes for synergies. If everyone slots bone shield you can keep using a different persons bone shield every second - I havn't been able to get more than 2 people testing though but that's how it works with 2 people anyway.

(bone shield is OP btw, just sayin)

To clarifiy the scenario, you meant one person used the abiltiy, another used the synergy and after recasting it a third person affected by the first synergy was able to use it straight away?

That would be a bug according to the patch notes, the notes said that anyone hit by the bone shield synergy shield would be put on the bone shields synergy cooldown with the person that activated the synergy.

IxSTALKERxI · January 2018

paulsimonps wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

As far as the cooldown change goes - think of it like earthgore.

Earthgore has a 30s cooldown but to get around this you slot it on every person in group.

Same goes for synergies. If everyone slots bone shield you can keep using a different persons bone shield every second - I havn't been able to get more than 2 people testing though but that's how it works with 2 people anyway.

(bone shield is OP btw, just sayin)

To clarifiy the scenario, you meant one person used the abiltiy, another used the synergy and after recasting it a third person affected by the first synergy was able to use it straight away?

That would be a bug according to the patch notes, the notes said that anyone hit by the bone shield synergy shield would be put on the bone shields synergy cooldown with the person that activated the synergy.

Nah

Player 1 has bone shield slotted and casts bone shield... Player 2 uses synergy.
Player 2 also has bone shield slotted and casts bone shield... Player 1 uses synergy.

It would take up a slot on everyone's build and everyone add it to their rotation once every 30 seconds.

I haven't been able to test with 3 people yet.