Rampant cheating in PvP, what is being done about it ZOS?

Yamakaziing · December 2017

There are most certainly big problems with how things work in pvp. but I would just like to know what sets those op stam dks are using that spam their two handed abilities and keep you at 10% health the whole time Rendering you useless. Is it Fassalas and fury?

Derra · December 2017

op stam dks...
oh boy.

Sharee · December 2017

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

here is what happens when we try to prove it

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4728796#Comment_4728796

heres the deal, people are cheating and use hax. it is almost a daily event that people come here to the forums to talk about it.
when we do we are met with alot of anger and word twisting and just plain refusal to even accept that it is happening.

no matter what we say or screen shot or video we are allways the bad guy and considered Stupid and liars. this thread and the thread i linked to is proof of that.
it has been this way for many years.

I strongly suspect that you are correct in that assessment. I just pointed out that the particular example you used (someone coming straight at you while you are in cloak) does not necessarily mean the guy is cheating.

kaithuzar · December 2017

I'm not denying it does occur but 9/10 you guys don't understand the game is just broken or it's L2P.
I've seen people come out of cloak for a split second, not cloak fast enough before I saw them, of I'll even use a detect pot & still get accused of cheating! Dude, you popped a heal or dodge rolled, or hit ability xyz that pulled you out of cloak. If I see you I'm popping a detect pot & coming for you. If you have a complaint then cry to Zeni about their game not me!

You know some of you guys still report me because you haven't learned when meteor shows up on your death recap twice it's because the first one is the initial damage hit & the second is the ground dot you took because you stood in it!

Honestly people need to start thinking & discussing before submitting tickets.

Cuthceol · December 2017

Turelus wrote: »

Normally people aren't cheating and are just playing well with knowledge of meta and mechanics.

The problem is everyone blames everything they don't understand or don't like an exploit or cheat and we end up with everything thinking literally everyone cheats.

I still remember literally everyone on forums says you cannot cheat in eso before that particular meteor shower in cyrodiil, funny how quickly people go back into denial

Malamar1229 · December 2017

Waffennacht wrote: »

Imo for console:

Elite controllers are not "cheating" but sure af not "fair"

Do you have one? I ended up buying the paddles that go on the back of the normal controller. What's the difference between the elite set up versus what I did for ESO specifically? I mean, why is there an unfair advantage.
I ask because the controller is expensive and I heard they break alot.

Malamar1229 · December 2017

On macros- I hear a lot of players claiming they would be a bad choice in PvP and actually hurt the user. I get that in certain scenarios, but as a magicka sorc i absolutely see a benefit in my G1 key being able to swap to my resto bar and apply hard ward and harness with the push of 1 button. Do i believe that happens now in Cyrodiil? Yes I do. I use a 5 button Razer hex mouse and am pretty quick, but I see certain sorcs who seemingly are applying 2 or 3 shields instantly and I can't help but wonder how in the hell they can do it that fast. I have been ani cancelling for years too.

On cheats- I own multiple accounts across all 3 platforms. I can say with confidence the players on console are substantially easier to kill in general than on PC. I think add-ons play a huge part in that. There are also a dozen stamina players on PC who are seemingly impossible to kill and I get they can build for that. But these players also have that "WTF just hit me" combo. IMO a balanced game means sacrifices with choices you make. In other words, tanky and high defensive builds should come at a cost like less than average damage output. I get ESO is not balanced nor a perfect candidate for comparison, but this is also something I don't see on console.

Since "Cheat Gate", I have also been privy to several screenshots from some of your guild Facebook pages because you have members too afraid to speak out in fear of getting booted. Some of these screenshots feature streamers who were not as "big/popular" back then freely talking about who else in their clique got banned and who didn't get caught yet. One of those players is still streaming, or at least I think she is but haven't seen her around in a while.

Whether these things are true or not is not my job to determine. But I do know the same names are always brought up, and it's easier to just accept guilt by association. Personally if I found out my buds were doing some shady stuff, I'd not want to be associated with them. Same reason I left a certain DC zerg guild that left for BDO, (before i became strictly 1vX) when their GM asked everyone in guild to abuse trap beast to farm WGT.

I've lost a lot of passion for this game as it's become more an aggrevation (between the rng, lag, and toxicity of the PvP community). I make decent money, and this time last year i would have put up a $5000 bounty for hard proof that some of these better known players are cheating. I bet that fear of retaliation would disappear then lol. I just don't care anymore.

A_G_G_R_O · December 2017

Thogard wrote: »

Proof of cheating hasn't been shown in over a year. Cheat engine hasn't worked in over a year.

It's all in your head. That and some good old fashioned server lag.

Love it. The amount of cheat engine accusations is sad. It’s also community damaging. I don’t know anyone playing at the top level today in PC/NA cheating. They aren’t just Really good at the game and those unable to compete with them just are not. Falsely spreading conspiracy about cheaters is honestly damaging to the community.... please stop.

DHale · December 2017

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better. If they only had that one weapon or armor set or undaunted... then they will be competitive or have the best stuff. It is always something. If I had more gold, if I had people to run VDSA, if I has VO gold jewelry. If I had max cp.

It is always people in TS talking about this person cheats or that person cheats rather than I can get better, I will get better. You can only control yourself. I just got an e mail from Saturday about how I was a cheater. I was so happy I called my wife over to read it and we had a good laugh. Just because you run Kodi’s build or Sypher’s build does not mean you are going to be any good at it, in fact the chances are you won’t be.

ZOS is not going to waste their time checking out all the people who get reported for cheating unless it is coming from a lot of people or compelling video evidence.

Sharee · December 2017

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

ShadowProc · December 2017

Malamar1229 wrote: »

On macros- I hear a lot of players claiming they would be a bad choice in PvP and actually hurt the user. I get that in certain scenarios, but as a magicka sorc i absolutely see a benefit in my G1 key being able to swap to my resto bar and apply hard ward and harness with the push of 1 button. Do i believe that happens now in Cyrodiil? Yes I do. I use a 5 button Razer hex mouse and am pretty quick, but I see certain sorcs who seemingly are applying 2 or 3 shields instantly and I can't help but wonder how in the hell they can do it that fast. I have been ani cancelling for years too.

On cheats- I own multiple accounts across all 3 platforms. I can say with confidence the players on console are substantially easier to kill in general than on PC. I think add-ons play a huge part in that. There are also a dozen stamina players on PC who are seemingly impossible to kill and I get they can build for that. But these players also have that "WTF just hit me" combo. IMO a balanced game means sacrifices with choices you make. In other words, tanky and high defensive builds should come at a cost like less than average damage output. I get ESO is not balanced nor a perfect candidate for comparison, but this is also something I don't see on console.

Since "Cheat Gate", I have also been privy to several screenshots from some of your guild Facebook pages because you have members too afraid to speak out in fear of getting booted. Some of these screenshots feature streamers who were not as "big/popular" back then freely talking about who else in their clique got banned and who didn't get caught yet. One of those players is still streaming, or at least I think she is but haven't seen her around in a while.

Whether these things are true or not is not my job to determine. But I do know the same names are always brought up, and it's easier to just accept guilt by association. Personally if I found out my buds were doing some shady stuff, I'd not want to be associated with them. Same reason I left a certain DC zerg guild that left for BDO, (before i became strictly 1vX) when their GM asked everyone in guild to abuse trap beast to farm WGT.

I've lost a lot of passion for this game as it's become more an aggrevation (between the rng, lag, and toxicity of the PvP community). I make decent money, and this time last year i would have put up a $5000 bounty for hard proof that some of these better known players are cheating. I bet that fear of retaliation would disappear then lol. I just don't care anymore.

Did one of the stamina players recently have a crash to desktop moment? Lol.

rfennell_ESO · December 2017

Time to face reality and realize that ZOS is in total denial and the cheaters have won.

Their prize? a dead game. Grats.

Thogard · December 2017

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

They switched everything to the server side because of that. That switch is also why everything has been so god damn laggy since then. Cheaters are the cause of the high pings and server lag, since ZOS had to stop letting clients store data due to cheaters. But regardless, only one thing is now stored client-side...

The only thing that is still stored client side is your location. Thats why when a player is lagging they can "teleport" around.

Do I think there's a few people taking advantage of this? yes. "Cable pulling" has been an exploit for a while in many, many MMOs.,

But thats also why the game will boot you if you disconnect, even if just for a few seconds rather than let you recover from a really bad lag spike.

There are also in game "speed limits" that will auto-boot you if you go past them. Hop on a mag warden and spiderman around town and see if you can get an auto-kick.

Sharee · December 2017

Thogard wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

They switched everything to the server side because of that. That switch is also why everything has been so god damn laggy since then. Cheaters are the cause of the high pings and server lag, since ZOS had to stop letting clients store data due to cheaters. But regardless, only one thing is now stored client-side...

While i hope you are right - unless you work at ZOS, you have no more idea what they did (or whether they did anything) than me, or anyone else. The fact its "laggy" may or may not be related to this supposed change - that's no proof.

Thogard · December 2017

Sharee wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

They switched everything to the server side because of that. That switch is also why everything has been so god damn laggy since then. Cheaters are the cause of the high pings and server lag, since ZOS had to stop letting clients store data due to cheaters. But regardless, only one thing is now stored client-side...

While i hope you are right - unless you work at ZOS, you have no more idea what they did (or whether they did anything) than me, or anyone else. The fact its "laggy" may or may not be related to this supposed change - that's no proof.

This stuff is public knowledge.

Next time your connection goes out, pay attention to your resources. You’re “in game” but everything freezes. Will you get a regen tic? Nope.

Also if you google the phrase “ESO, cheat engine” you can find the official CE message boards where people talk about how CE doesn’t work with ESO anymore because everything is server side now. Not going to link it for obvious reasons, but it’s really easy to find.

But that’s all anecdotal. I know everything is server side because rich lambert told me it was at twitch con when I asked. Again, it’s not exactly a secret.

Sharee · December 2017

[nevermind]

Datthaw · December 2017

I don't think cheating is nearly as rampant at people think. But, it does exist.

The other day at bruma I ran into a player i feel was a cheater. Somehow this snb stamdk was able to keep landing light attacks on me while I was bailing out in mist form so far away and out of los for an attack it was comical.

Not to mention what put me on the run was a sketchy like 15m uppercut at a 45° angle. But tbh I get hit by a lot of upercuts I don't block because I think there is no way I'm in range

I go right back after I die because I couldn't believe what I saw. So I get back the guy recognizes me after I attack and just runs, odd thing to do after you just killed the same person. Made me wonder if he thought I might be running some recording program

FearlessOne_2014 · December 2017

geonsocal wrote: »

Chronicburn wrote: »

I used to die in dark fall a ton to people who used keyboard macros ... never considered them cheating, just figured they cared a hell of a lot more about winning then I did ...

I mean seriously - if you ain't cheating - are you even really trying...

This is why I wish ZOS would just abolish their anti-macro policy. So all can be on a leveled playing field as those who do. Without having to worry about losing their account. they've spent Thousands of USDs on.

A policy like this just creates a artificial gap between the playbase. True ZOS are banning some of the macro users. However these guys mainly have nothing to lose on their accounts. So they just recycle email addresses and spam accounts. Because it's not like they've invested thousands of USDs on them. More then likely they've mass brought those account during a huge sale.

A anti macro policy in this day and age. Hurts no one but the supporters of the game. It's just equivalent to gun control in US. Players (People) who are criminals are going to continue to use outlawed tactics to push their will on others. Those are not the ones affected by policies as such. It's the honest hardworking productive players (people) who who loses out.

TL/DR : ZOS should just modernize it's viewpoints, and abolish it's anti-macro policy for all. To provide a fair gaming experience for those who've invested in ESO.

OdinForge · December 2017

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

You still seeing people floating around dropping endless meteors? I haven't seen that since the big CE weekend, if it still worked people would still do it. The evidence that it doesn't exist comes in the form of not seeing it resurface, there were detailed videos about CE working well before that weekend, just no one knew about it or cared and people that did were not allowed to talk about it. Once it became public enough knowledge and people actually started using it in-game, many videos inevitably came out and something was done.

It's one thing to keep an open mind that cheating in anything is possible, versus the kinds of people here in ESO that will just accuse anyone that beats them, without any basis. I'm hoping that when Monster Hunter World comes out on PC, that Capcom has already done their due diligence and taken things like CE into consideration, so they don't end up like FromSoftware with a modern PC game being highly susceptible to memory hacking. The only difference between ZOS and FromSoftware is that ZOS did something about CE in their game, it wasn't worth it for FromSoftware.

The most hated kind of players are like the ones that jump into a thread, spouting unverified BS about hacking, because it's easy. Kind of like the threads I saw yesterday where a Sorc was casting DK petrify, and some people were trying to proclaim it to be the work of CE, when in reality it's just another ESO bug where the display is incorrect, and the Sorc was just using rune prison.

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better. If they only had that one weapon or armor set or undaunted... then they will be competitive or have the best stuff. It is always something. If I had more gold, if I had people to run VDSA, if I has VO gold jewelry. If I had max cp.

It is always people in TS talking about this person cheats or that person cheats rather than I can get better, I will get better. You can only control yourself. I just got an e mail from Saturday about how I was a cheater. I was so happy I called my wife over to read it and we had a good laugh. Just because you run Kodi’s build or Sypher’s build does not mean you are going to be any good at it, in fact the chances are you won’t be.

ZOS is not going to waste their time checking out all the people who get reported for cheating unless it is coming from a lot of people or compelling video evidence.

To add to this I know of three specific players that post to this forum constantly complaining about, accusing streamers, or attempting to perpetuate "out of control cheating" that in-game are actually beyond terrible and always rely on zerg surfing. Names of which shall remain anonymous as to not anger the mods. It's funny when you kill a player in-game, get whispered about how much of a cheater you are, then see that same player on the forums whining about ZOS protecting "out of control streamer cheaters".

Sharee · December 2017

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

You still seeing people floating around dropping endless meteors? I haven't seen that since the big CE weekend, if it still worked people would still do it. The evidence that it doesn't exist comes in the form of not seeing it resurface

You realize the only reason why the meteors were caught on the video in the firstplace was the fact the guy dropping them wanted the cheating exposed for everyone to see? It has been going on long before that, and nobody noticed.

Saying that "it cannot possibly be still happening because i do not see it" is sticking your head in the sand. How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't.

The only real proof that CE cheating is no longer possible would be an official statement saying so. It shouldn't be too hard, assuming what was posted above is true(Rich Lambert personally telling people everything is serverside now). Yet - no official statement has been made, despite the existence of an official thread discussing the very topic...

OdinForge · December 2017

Sharee wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

You still seeing people floating around dropping endless meteors? I haven't seen that since the big CE weekend, if it still worked people would still do it. The evidence that it doesn't exist comes in the form of not seeing it resurface

You realize the only reason why the meteors were caught on the video in the firstplace was the fact the guy dropping them wanted the cheating exposed for everyone to see? It has been going on long before that, and nobody noticed.

Saying that "it cannot possibly be still happening because i do not see it" is sticking your head in the sand. How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't.

The only real proof that CE cheating is no longer possible would be an official statement saying so. It shouldn't be too hard, assuming what was posted above is true(Rich Lambert personally telling people everything is serverside now). Yet - no official statement has been made, despite the existence of an official thread discussing the very topic...

How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't because this was never possible. You should start your journey as the other player here mentioned, by reading up about CE on the public forums to understand what was and wasn't possible. Players resorted to floating around dropping meteors, because it was the only thing you could do to insta-kill players.

Sharee · December 2017

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

You still seeing people floating around dropping endless meteors? I haven't seen that since the big CE weekend, if it still worked people would still do it. The evidence that it doesn't exist comes in the form of not seeing it resurface

You realize the only reason why the meteors were caught on the video in the firstplace was the fact the guy dropping them wanted the cheating exposed for everyone to see? It has been going on long before that, and nobody noticed.

Saying that "it cannot possibly be still happening because i do not see it" is sticking your head in the sand. How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't.

The only real proof that CE cheating is no longer possible would be an official statement saying so. It shouldn't be too hard, assuming what was posted above is true(Rich Lambert personally telling people everything is serverside now). Yet - no official statement has been made, despite the existence of an official thread discussing the very topic...

How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't because this was never possible.

So, such a critical information like whether you have enough ultimate to cast one or not was kept on the client, but the information whether you have enough stamina to cast a regular ability or not wasn't. Somehow it find that hard to believe.

OdinForge wrote: »

You should start your journey as the other player here mentioned, by reading up about CE on the public forums to understand what was and wasn't possible.

Yeah, because anonymous publicly available forums are such a reliable source of information. No thank you.

OdinForge · December 2017

Sharee wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

You still seeing people floating around dropping endless meteors? I haven't seen that since the big CE weekend, if it still worked people would still do it. The evidence that it doesn't exist comes in the form of not seeing it resurface

You realize the only reason why the meteors were caught on the video in the firstplace was the fact the guy dropping them wanted the cheating exposed for everyone to see? It has been going on long before that, and nobody noticed.

Saying that "it cannot possibly be still happening because i do not see it" is sticking your head in the sand. How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't.

The only real proof that CE cheating is no longer possible would be an official statement saying so. It shouldn't be too hard, assuming what was posted above is true(Rich Lambert personally telling people everything is serverside now). Yet - no official statement has been made, despite the existence of an official thread discussing the very topic...

How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't because this was never possible.

So, such a critical information like whether you have enough ultimate to cast one or not was kept on the client, but the information whether you have enough stamina to cast a regular ability or not wasn't. Somehow it find that hard to believe.

OdinForge wrote: »

You should start your journey as the other player here mentioned, by reading up about CE on the public forums to understand what was and wasn't possible.

Yeah, because anonymous publicly available forums are such a reliable source of information. No thank you.

So, such a critical information like whether you have enough ultimate to cast one or not was kept on the client, but the information whether you have enough stamina to cast a regular ability or not wasn't. Somehow it find that hard to believe.

That's exactly the case but seeing as you refuse to read about the capabilities, you'll inevitably find a lot of things hard to believe.

You had access to things like no clip, speed hacking and could have infinite ultimate. So the types of things you saw in PvP were people occasionally speed hacking (seen in many videos) or people floating around and using ultimate's back to back. Things you didn't see were people probably using these hacks to grind CP in instanced dungeons (think how people breached 1500-2000 CP before the end of 1.6).

What you couldn't do was alter your stats. You couldn't modify your attributes beyond simply what your character sheet displays, you couldn't modify how much gold you were carrying. These types of things are very easy to do in many single player games, but they do not work in online MMOs.

Yeah, because anonymous publicly available forums are such a reliable source of information. No thank you.

The information is out there for all to learn, and any informed player would want to learn. The fact that you willingly choose to not take advantage of that information shows where you stand. You'd rather remain troubled by your lack of knowledge and speculate on the continued existence of critical hacking.

Which is fine as long as you don't walk around blindly accusing people of cheating, like some people here.

Sharee · December 2017

OdinForge wrote: »

That's exactly the case but seeing as you refuse to read about the capabilities, you'll inevitably find a lot of things hard to believe.

I would gladly read about it if there was a reliable source. There isn't. I have no more reason to believe what was written on some shady forum than what was written on this one. You don't know either, you just chose to believe. Which is fine, no skin off my back.

OdinForge · December 2017

Sharee wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

That's exactly the case but seeing as you refuse to read about the capabilities, you'll inevitably find a lot of things hard to believe.

I would gladly read about it if there was a reliable source. There isn't. I have no more reason to believe what was written on some shady forum than what was written on this one. You don't know either, you just chose to believe. Which is fine, no skin off my back.

Maybe if you're lucky Fox or CNN may cover the story, both are more likely than ZOS releasing any additional coverage on it. It's in the best interest of ZOS to speak about what happened as little as possible, for many reasons. So until either ZOS or some major publication speaks to the matter, I'll trust the source over speculation as the source was involved first hand.

Thogard · December 2017

This thread reminds me a lot of atheist vs creationist debates. The atheists (people who don’t think hack programs are out there) can’t convince the creationists (hackers are everywhere but we have no proof!) of anything because the burden of proof keeps shifting back and forth.

Sharee · December 2017

Thogard wrote: »

This thread reminds me a lot of atheist vs creationist debates. The atheists (people who don’t think hack programs are out there) can’t convince the creationists (hackers are everywhere but we have no proof!) of anything because the burden of proof keeps shifting back and forth.

I would say, the other way around. We have proof that hacks were once possible, but no proof that they aren't anymore. So the atheists would be the ones believing in hacks(because there is a proof of their existence), and the creationists the ones believing no hacks exist anymore, even tho they have no proof(how do you prove something does not exist?).

OdinForge · December 2017

Thogard wrote: »

This thread reminds me a lot of atheist vs creationist debates. The atheists (people who don’t think hack programs are out there) can’t convince the creationists (hackers are everywhere but we have no proof!) of anything because the burden of proof keeps shifting back and forth.

Sharee wrote: »

I would say, the other way around. We have proof that hacks were once possible, but no proof that they aren't anymore. So the atheists would be the ones believing in hacks(because there is a proof of their existence), and the creationists the ones believing no hacks exist anymore, even tho they have no proof(how do you prove something does not exist?).

I would say you're both not on the point actually.

The problem with the burden of proof is that it's impossible for both sides. The people who vehemently believe hacking in ESO is possible, are unable to provide proof for a number of reasons. One is that it is no longer is possible therefor there are no new videos surfacing. Two is that these types of players would never take testing into their own hands, to find out for themselves.

The people who know that ZOS ended CE are unable to provide proof for a number of reasons. One is that it would simply lead to a ban (either forum ban or in-game ban or both). And two there is no compelling reason for anyone to tackle the concept of memory hacking in ESO, and make an informative video about it.

In other words the people who are familiar with CE will not make a video in fear of being banned, proving that it no longer works with ESO. So everyone can calm down and just enjoy the game. And the people who believe it works have no way of proving it, so it's a vicious cycle.

rfennell_ESO · December 2017

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

You still seeing people floating around dropping endless meteors? I haven't seen that since the big CE weekend, if it still worked people would still do it. The evidence that it doesn't exist comes in the form of not seeing it resurface

You realize the only reason why the meteors were caught on the video in the firstplace was the fact the guy dropping them wanted the cheating exposed for everyone to see? It has been going on long before that, and nobody noticed.

Saying that "it cannot possibly be still happening because i do not see it" is sticking your head in the sand. How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't.

The only real proof that CE cheating is no longer possible would be an official statement saying so. It shouldn't be too hard, assuming what was posted above is true(Rich Lambert personally telling people everything is serverside now). Yet - no official statement has been made, despite the existence of an official thread discussing the very topic...

How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't because this was never possible. You should start your journey as the other player here mentioned, by reading up about CE on the public forums to understand what was and wasn't possible. Players resorted to floating around dropping meteors, because it was the only thing you could do to insta-kill players.

That begs the question of "if CE doesn't work, why did a well known streamer recently crash to desktop with CE running in the background"?

Everyone that claims to have seen it is lying?

That's preposterous.

OdinForge · December 2017

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

People that spend a lot of time worrying about cheats and exploits and cheaters use it as the excuse as to why they are not better at the game or use it as a crutch to not get better.

Right. That does not mean cheats don't exist tho.

I used to think cheating in ESO isn't possible right up to the point when i saw that famous meteor shower video. That told me ZOS is keeping critical data on the client, which enables cheating.

I have seen no evidence since then that this is no longer the case.

You still seeing people floating around dropping endless meteors? I haven't seen that since the big CE weekend, if it still worked people would still do it. The evidence that it doesn't exist comes in the form of not seeing it resurface

You realize the only reason why the meteors were caught on the video in the firstplace was the fact the guy dropping them wanted the cheating exposed for everyone to see? It has been going on long before that, and nobody noticed.

Saying that "it cannot possibly be still happening because i do not see it" is sticking your head in the sand. How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't.

The only real proof that CE cheating is no longer possible would be an official statement saying so. It shouldn't be too hard, assuming what was posted above is true(Rich Lambert personally telling people everything is serverside now). Yet - no official statement has been made, despite the existence of an official thread discussing the very topic...

How do you spot someone who gave himself perfectly legit top weapon damage, perfectly legit top mitigation and perfectly legit top regen - just in an impossible combination of all three at the same time?

You don't because this was never possible. You should start your journey as the other player here mentioned, by reading up about CE on the public forums to understand what was and wasn't possible. Players resorted to floating around dropping meteors, because it was the only thing you could do to insta-kill players.

That begs the question of "if CE doesn't work, why did a well known streamer recently crash to desktop with CE running in the background"?

Everyone that claims to have seen it is lying?

That's preposterous.

Are you just making stuff up about streamers again, we all know how much you hate streamers.