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The exploit ban is too harsh.
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sudaki_eso✭✭✭✭✭The ban is justified in my opinion. I dont mind if you cheat or use exploits at all if you are doing it in a single player game. Cheating and exploiting in a multiplayer game is another story and should be punished.PS4 EU - StamDK4 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm usually of the "let them be, let them brag, it's only a game" kind of person, but in this case it's very, very hard to defend the players.
If they had put so much love, time and energy into the game, they should have thought twice before jeopardizing it.
And from ZOS position, in many cases it's hard to punish because it's hard to prove. In this case, it's crystal clear to prove that people cheated, and an easy, straightforward way to prove they care.
So really, it's hard to disagree with the permabans.
Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on November 13, 2017 10:40AM7 -
Cherryblossom✭✭✭✭✭
✭Do I think cheaters should be banned, yes.
However, is this proportional to other ZOS punishments! Anyone who's been here for any time knows it's not, this is the problem with ZOS there is no consistency, we had and have people still using the cheat engine in the game, not one perm ban!
Players that exploited Temper Duplication, many of them even kept the duped items, not one ban I'm aware of....
This is once again a situation of ZOS failing to communicate with the community. Take a look at the stickied thread on cheating and exploiting, not one post from ZOS since February, how many exploits so far this year and not a dickie bird from ZOS.....Why would people care if it seems ZOS doesn't...2 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think zos did the right thing. It's very easy to play by the rules. I wish they would permaban botters as well.
What makes you think they don't perma-ban botters? Ever seen a botter with 690 CP? Of course not. They are always low level toons because they are constantly starting new accounts to replace the ones that were banned.
Edited by Emma_Overload on November 13, 2017 5:20PM#CAREBEARMASTERRACE2 -
badmojo✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think zos did the right thing. It's very easy to play by the rules. I wish they would permaban botters as well.
I was thinking about this the other day. As long as ZOS knows about a bot, banning the bot right away might not be the best strategy in the long run. If they wait and let the bot level up for dozens of hours before banning, that wastes more of the bot farmers time. Also, if the bot is also gold farming for gold sellers, it might be good for ZOS to simply watch the account and see where and how the gold gets transferred. It could potentially lead them to a gold buyer or a gold seller mule, guild, etc.
Its like when cops know drug dealers are working a certain area, they might watch them hoping for leads to the bigger fish. Because only busting a street dealer is like playing wack a mole, another one is there to take their place almost instantly.
I just report the bots, maybe post about it here and forget about it. Theres no way for us to know how they handle bots, because then the botters would know how to get around it.[DC/NA]3 -
vovus69✭✭✭✭can someone point me to the post with exploit description?
I agree with some of the comments that zos looks like they have no control and monitor of their own game. Whatever you can do in the game is allowed by the game mechanics. It is not the user issue to figure out whether he is using this mechanics right or wrong. Remember the first time when zos and users discovered that there is no global cooldown on skills? This was a bug originally. I don't remember any bans. So, looks like it is up to zos to decide whether some arbitrary action is a cheat or not. In this case I would really recommend users to open the ticket and post immediately exploit on non-zos forum where it will not be deleted. So anybody can use it until zos will fix it. This way you can get zos attention much faster.
-vovus"If I'll need your opinion, I'll give one to you" - Rivenspire0 -
Pwnyridah✭✭✭I would 1 month ban for first time offenders, lifetime ban for those that have had a previous ban. If someone is banned once already then this is a pattern of behavior and we don't need them in the community.0
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ookami007✭✭✭✭✭
✭Permanent ban all the devs... They made the exploit. Besides... In this game of continuos changes, bugs and issues... How can one REALLY know what is not intended?1 -
Mazbt✭✭✭✭Is it true that more accounts got banned? So after the warnings that you will get banned if you do this during the weekend after the first wave then I guess people just didn't care.Mazari the Resurrected (AD)- PVP stamplar main
Maz the Druid - PVP group stam warden
- many others
____________
Fantasia3 -
Wreuntzylla✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭If they stay perma-banned, I'll know ZoS is serious about banning cheaters, and that prior soft hands were more about issues of proof.3 -
Danksta✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Well, I agree with one thing the OP says. Those players must be dedicated to hunt for a glitch like that.BawKinTackWarDs PS4/NA0 -
smacx250✭✭✭✭✭
I wonder when the perma-bans for using multi-craft, lazy writ, potion maker, fish filet, etc. will be handed out? They are directly against the TOS you know - as confirmed by ZOS. So no complaints then, right?starkerealm wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »To bad they werent streamers driving more players to the game. They would be allowed to blatantly break the TOS, admit it on their streams and then be invited to the test the next "chapter" before anyone else.
Some of you seem to think there is a universal code or some gauge by which your banned or your not. Im guessing those people havent been here for a while, ZOS has allowed exploits and exploiters for YEARS.
Thats a fact, and most of you know it.
Stop *** footing around, this is on ZOS 100%. You break the TOS you get banned, period.
Not here, not now, not then, not ever.
The punishment was arbitrary and vengeful. No customer deserves to be treated like that on a first offense with no warning.
ZOS clearly needs to examine carefully what a customer-business relationship is supposed to look like.
It appears they have power-mad megalomaniacs in their midst.
Except that more than a few of the users perma-banned WERE NOT FIRST TIME OFFENDERS. If anyone gets a temporary suspension, no one but ZOS and the user knows why and for how long. How many people got suspensions and claimed "I was super busy with work." "I had a lot of family stuff going on" or any other excuse.
Hopefully ZOS forwards this to MS or Sony and they can block their consoles from accessing ESO in perpetuity.
I agree that if they had been previously warned or suspended for exploiting and informed a ban could follow, then they did it anyway, a ban can be justified.
However like you said we can’t know, can we.
Although the TOS says you can’t do it, it also doesn’t say “we’re gonna kick you out and keep your money the first time you go out with some buddies you think are cool and have some fun messing with one of ZOS’s mistakes”
Oh jeez, so when you agreed to the ToS and agreed to behave regardless of ZOS' failures, you dont think people should suffer the consequences of breaking the ToS.
The punishment in this case does not fit the crime.
ZOS is guilty of abusing their power.
Grossly and intentionally exploiting a Trial to get achievement, skin, bragging rights, weapons and jewelry, and further seeling runs using exploit to gain gold (possibly even real money), iunno, perma-ban seems appropriate.
It’s all pixels. Get a life. Bragging rights? Are you seven?
Im the last person that cares about e-peen measurement. Others do, good for them. If its all pixels, why do you care about what happens to other people's accounts?
Because that’s their rl time and $$ they put into the game.
Plus if it happened to them it could happen to anyone ... wrong place wrong time. I guess maybe you are just the holy saint of eso though ... sorry
Then, maybe, they should have been a bit more circumspect about choosing to violate the terms of service.
I know, some kids did that before, and weren't punished. That doesn't mystically make it okay.
1 -
kargen27✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Is it true that more accounts got banned? So after the warnings that you will get banned if you do this during the weekend after the first wave then I guess people just didn't care.
The vast majority of players do not read these forums. Was there a warning outside of the forums?
Not that it matters, they had to know what they were doing was not intended...and then the parrot said, "must be the water mines green too."1 -
JasonSilverSpring✭✭✭✭✭
I wonder when the perma-bans for using multi-craft, lazy writ, potion maker, fish filet, etc. will be handed out? They are directly against the TOS you know - as confirmed by ZOS. So no complaints then, right?starkerealm wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »To bad they werent streamers driving more players to the game. They would be allowed to blatantly break the TOS, admit it on their streams and then be invited to the test the next "chapter" before anyone else.
Some of you seem to think there is a universal code or some gauge by which your banned or your not. Im guessing those people havent been here for a while, ZOS has allowed exploits and exploiters for YEARS.
Thats a fact, and most of you know it.
Stop *** footing around, this is on ZOS 100%. You break the TOS you get banned, period.
Not here, not now, not then, not ever.
The punishment was arbitrary and vengeful. No customer deserves to be treated like that on a first offense with no warning.
ZOS clearly needs to examine carefully what a customer-business relationship is supposed to look like.
It appears they have power-mad megalomaniacs in their midst.
Except that more than a few of the users perma-banned WERE NOT FIRST TIME OFFENDERS. If anyone gets a temporary suspension, no one but ZOS and the user knows why and for how long. How many people got suspensions and claimed "I was super busy with work." "I had a lot of family stuff going on" or any other excuse.
Hopefully ZOS forwards this to MS or Sony and they can block their consoles from accessing ESO in perpetuity.
I agree that if they had been previously warned or suspended for exploiting and informed a ban could follow, then they did it anyway, a ban can be justified.
However like you said we can’t know, can we.
Although the TOS says you can’t do it, it also doesn’t say “we’re gonna kick you out and keep your money the first time you go out with some buddies you think are cool and have some fun messing with one of ZOS’s mistakes”
Oh jeez, so when you agreed to the ToS and agreed to behave regardless of ZOS' failures, you dont think people should suffer the consequences of breaking the ToS.
The punishment in this case does not fit the crime.
ZOS is guilty of abusing their power.
Grossly and intentionally exploiting a Trial to get achievement, skin, bragging rights, weapons and jewelry, and further seeling runs using exploit to gain gold (possibly even real money), iunno, perma-ban seems appropriate.
It’s all pixels. Get a life. Bragging rights? Are you seven?
Im the last person that cares about e-peen measurement. Others do, good for them. If its all pixels, why do you care about what happens to other people's accounts?
Because that’s their rl time and $$ they put into the game.
Plus if it happened to them it could happen to anyone ... wrong place wrong time. I guess maybe you are just the holy saint of eso though ... sorry
Then, maybe, they should have been a bit more circumspect about choosing to violate the terms of service.
I know, some kids did that before, and weren't punished. That doesn't mystically make it okay.
Those are not exploits nor are they macros. They are using the API provided by ZOS. If ZOS ever decides to restrict that via the API the add-ons would stop working.
Until then it is clear that ZOS is ok with add-ons like these that offer no competitive advantage.3 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
I wonder when the perma-bans for using multi-craft, lazy writ, potion maker, fish filet, etc. will be handed out? They are directly against the TOS you know - as confirmed by ZOS. So no complaints then, right?starkerealm wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »To bad they werent streamers driving more players to the game. They would be allowed to blatantly break the TOS, admit it on their streams and then be invited to the test the next "chapter" before anyone else.
Some of you seem to think there is a universal code or some gauge by which your banned or your not. Im guessing those people havent been here for a while, ZOS has allowed exploits and exploiters for YEARS.
Thats a fact, and most of you know it.
Stop *** footing around, this is on ZOS 100%. You break the TOS you get banned, period.
Not here, not now, not then, not ever.
The punishment was arbitrary and vengeful. No customer deserves to be treated like that on a first offense with no warning.
ZOS clearly needs to examine carefully what a customer-business relationship is supposed to look like.
It appears they have power-mad megalomaniacs in their midst.
Except that more than a few of the users perma-banned WERE NOT FIRST TIME OFFENDERS. If anyone gets a temporary suspension, no one but ZOS and the user knows why and for how long. How many people got suspensions and claimed "I was super busy with work." "I had a lot of family stuff going on" or any other excuse.
Hopefully ZOS forwards this to MS or Sony and they can block their consoles from accessing ESO in perpetuity.
I agree that if they had been previously warned or suspended for exploiting and informed a ban could follow, then they did it anyway, a ban can be justified.
However like you said we can’t know, can we.
Although the TOS says you can’t do it, it also doesn’t say “we’re gonna kick you out and keep your money the first time you go out with some buddies you think are cool and have some fun messing with one of ZOS’s mistakes”
Oh jeez, so when you agreed to the ToS and agreed to behave regardless of ZOS' failures, you dont think people should suffer the consequences of breaking the ToS.
The punishment in this case does not fit the crime.
ZOS is guilty of abusing their power.
Grossly and intentionally exploiting a Trial to get achievement, skin, bragging rights, weapons and jewelry, and further seeling runs using exploit to gain gold (possibly even real money), iunno, perma-ban seems appropriate.
It’s all pixels. Get a life. Bragging rights? Are you seven?
Im the last person that cares about e-peen measurement. Others do, good for them. If its all pixels, why do you care about what happens to other people's accounts?
Because that’s their rl time and $$ they put into the game.
Plus if it happened to them it could happen to anyone ... wrong place wrong time. I guess maybe you are just the holy saint of eso though ... sorry
Then, maybe, they should have been a bit more circumspect about choosing to violate the terms of service.
I know, some kids did that before, and weren't punished. That doesn't mystically make it okay.
You want to link that confirmation?0 -
smacx250✭✭✭✭✭
I think that you may not have a complete understanding of how the ESO UI works, what the APIs are, how the addons use them, what the TOS says, and what specifically ZOS has said regarding these addons and the TOS. Namely, just because one *can* do something doesn't mean it's *permitted* for one to do something.JasonSilverSpring wrote: »
I wonder when the perma-bans for using multi-craft, lazy writ, potion maker, fish filet, etc. will be handed out? They are directly against the TOS you know - as confirmed by ZOS. So no complaints then, right?starkerealm wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »To bad they werent streamers driving more players to the game. They would be allowed to blatantly break the TOS, admit it on their streams and then be invited to the test the next "chapter" before anyone else.
Some of you seem to think there is a universal code or some gauge by which your banned or your not. Im guessing those people havent been here for a while, ZOS has allowed exploits and exploiters for YEARS.
Thats a fact, and most of you know it.
Stop *** footing around, this is on ZOS 100%. You break the TOS you get banned, period.
Not here, not now, not then, not ever.
The punishment was arbitrary and vengeful. No customer deserves to be treated like that on a first offense with no warning.
ZOS clearly needs to examine carefully what a customer-business relationship is supposed to look like.
It appears they have power-mad megalomaniacs in their midst.
Except that more than a few of the users perma-banned WERE NOT FIRST TIME OFFENDERS. If anyone gets a temporary suspension, no one but ZOS and the user knows why and for how long. How many people got suspensions and claimed "I was super busy with work." "I had a lot of family stuff going on" or any other excuse.
Hopefully ZOS forwards this to MS or Sony and they can block their consoles from accessing ESO in perpetuity.
I agree that if they had been previously warned or suspended for exploiting and informed a ban could follow, then they did it anyway, a ban can be justified.
However like you said we can’t know, can we.
Although the TOS says you can’t do it, it also doesn’t say “we’re gonna kick you out and keep your money the first time you go out with some buddies you think are cool and have some fun messing with one of ZOS’s mistakes”
Oh jeez, so when you agreed to the ToS and agreed to behave regardless of ZOS' failures, you dont think people should suffer the consequences of breaking the ToS.
The punishment in this case does not fit the crime.
ZOS is guilty of abusing their power.
Grossly and intentionally exploiting a Trial to get achievement, skin, bragging rights, weapons and jewelry, and further seeling runs using exploit to gain gold (possibly even real money), iunno, perma-ban seems appropriate.
It’s all pixels. Get a life. Bragging rights? Are you seven?
Im the last person that cares about e-peen measurement. Others do, good for them. If its all pixels, why do you care about what happens to other people's accounts?
Because that’s their rl time and $$ they put into the game.
Plus if it happened to them it could happen to anyone ... wrong place wrong time. I guess maybe you are just the holy saint of eso though ... sorry
Then, maybe, they should have been a bit more circumspect about choosing to violate the terms of service.
I know, some kids did that before, and weren't punished. That doesn't mystically make it okay.
Those are not exploits nor are they macros. They are using the API provided by ZOS. If ZOS ever decides to restrict that via the API the add-ons would stop working.
Until then it is clear that ZOS is ok with add-ons like these that offer no competitive advantage.
But that really wasn't my point - which was that simply being against the TOS isn't a good defense of a perma-ban. I think I'm actually with you here, in that even with use of these addons being in technical violation of the TOS, it would be reasonable to complain about perma-bans suddenly being handed out for their use. Yes, a completely different issue than being discussed here - other than the posts in defense of the perma-ban pointing to the TOS and saying "hey, you violated the TOS, you get what you get". I don't think that is a reasonable position, hence my example of these addons.
Regarding background on TOS issues for these addons - here ZOS repeatetly says they are against the TOS, but also says nothing about if they will or will not take action against their use: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2089721/#Comment_2089721
0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well, given that Dolgubon's Lazy Writ Crafter has been downloaded half a million times...0 -
smacx250✭✭✭✭✭
Hey - only about 100 of those was me so I don't know what you're implying!!!starkerealm wrote: »Well, given that Dolgubon's Lazy Writ Crafter has been downloaded half a million times...
0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭While ZOS could turn around and ban players for Lazy Writ Crafter, intent does seem to be a major consideration on what gets the hammer.
If they intend to blacklist Dolgubon's LWC, I'd expect them to make an announcement, first, rather than simply waxing the better part of half a million players. That kind of a ban wave could, legitimately, kill the game, especially on something that's been perceived as acceptable.
Now, in contrast, letting people cheese endgame content, especially this soon after it launched? That makes more sense. Especially given (I suspect) the exploiter's intent was to get enough players through, quickly enough, that they could make a wholesale ban wave unpalatable. Ban 12 players? Cool, fine. Ban 1200? That's a lot of people to lose. To be fair, they may have simply been greedy, and were trying to rake in the cash before the exploit was fixed, without any greater strategic thought. That's equally likely.2 -
JasonSilverSpring✭✭✭✭✭
I think that you may not have a complete understanding of how the ESO UI works, what the APIs are, how the addons use them, what the TOS says, and what specifically ZOS has said regarding these addons and the TOS. Namely, just because one *can* do something doesn't mean it's *permitted* for one to do something.JasonSilverSpring wrote: »
I wonder when the perma-bans for using multi-craft, lazy writ, potion maker, fish filet, etc. will be handed out? They are directly against the TOS you know - as confirmed by ZOS. So no complaints then, right?starkerealm wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »To bad they werent streamers driving more players to the game. They would be allowed to blatantly break the TOS, admit it on their streams and then be invited to the test the next "chapter" before anyone else.
Some of you seem to think there is a universal code or some gauge by which your banned or your not. Im guessing those people havent been here for a while, ZOS has allowed exploits and exploiters for YEARS.
Thats a fact, and most of you know it.
Stop *** footing around, this is on ZOS 100%. You break the TOS you get banned, period.
Not here, not now, not then, not ever.
The punishment was arbitrary and vengeful. No customer deserves to be treated like that on a first offense with no warning.
ZOS clearly needs to examine carefully what a customer-business relationship is supposed to look like.
It appears they have power-mad megalomaniacs in their midst.
Except that more than a few of the users perma-banned WERE NOT FIRST TIME OFFENDERS. If anyone gets a temporary suspension, no one but ZOS and the user knows why and for how long. How many people got suspensions and claimed "I was super busy with work." "I had a lot of family stuff going on" or any other excuse.
Hopefully ZOS forwards this to MS or Sony and they can block their consoles from accessing ESO in perpetuity.
I agree that if they had been previously warned or suspended for exploiting and informed a ban could follow, then they did it anyway, a ban can be justified.
However like you said we can’t know, can we.
Although the TOS says you can’t do it, it also doesn’t say “we’re gonna kick you out and keep your money the first time you go out with some buddies you think are cool and have some fun messing with one of ZOS’s mistakes”
Oh jeez, so when you agreed to the ToS and agreed to behave regardless of ZOS' failures, you dont think people should suffer the consequences of breaking the ToS.
The punishment in this case does not fit the crime.
ZOS is guilty of abusing their power.
Grossly and intentionally exploiting a Trial to get achievement, skin, bragging rights, weapons and jewelry, and further seeling runs using exploit to gain gold (possibly even real money), iunno, perma-ban seems appropriate.
It’s all pixels. Get a life. Bragging rights? Are you seven?
Im the last person that cares about e-peen measurement. Others do, good for them. If its all pixels, why do you care about what happens to other people's accounts?
Because that’s their rl time and $$ they put into the game.
Plus if it happened to them it could happen to anyone ... wrong place wrong time. I guess maybe you are just the holy saint of eso though ... sorry
Then, maybe, they should have been a bit more circumspect about choosing to violate the terms of service.
I know, some kids did that before, and weren't punished. That doesn't mystically make it okay.
Those are not exploits nor are they macros. They are using the API provided by ZOS. If ZOS ever decides to restrict that via the API the add-ons would stop working.
Until then it is clear that ZOS is ok with add-ons like these that offer no competitive advantage.
But that really wasn't my point - which was that simply being against the TOS isn't a good defense of a perma-ban. I think I'm actually with you here, in that even with use of these addons being in technical violation of the TOS, it would be reasonable to complain about perma-bans suddenly being handed out for their use. Yes, a completely different issue than being discussed here - other than the posts in defense of the perma-ban pointing to the TOS and saying "hey, you violated the TOS, you get what you get". I don't think that is a reasonable position, hence my example of these addons.
Regarding background on TOS issues for these addons - here ZOS repeatetly says they are against the TOS, but also says nothing about if they will or will not take action against their use: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2089721/#Comment_2089721
People keep quoting that comment from a forum mod. She is not part of the dev team so I doubt we should take her comment as gospel. If Gina or Jessica had posted that I would have a different view.
The TOS is clearly designed to give ZOS room to handle grey areas. Based on what I have read about this exploit it was clear the actions were not intended to work that way.
Downloading a very popular add-on that merely simplifies a boring redundant crafting task is clearly different. It is not automating anything that benefits combat. There are some add-ons that are in grey areas though.
And as another posted if ZOS did decide to not allow it they would surely announce it and change the API.1 -
Johngo0036✭✭✭✭✭Its about time that zenni took a firm stance against people using exploits to gain things.
I DO NOT exploit as it is morally wrong yet others have no morals it would appear and shamelessly exploit and then brag about it later..
Good for Zenni.
NOW STICK BY YOUR DECISION!!PC EU Megaserver
@Johngo0036
CP900+
Altmer Magicka Sorcerer |The-Irritable-Witch(DC)
Orc Stamina Dragonknight | Gru-Bolar(DC)
Dunmer Magicka Nightblade | Chewbucca(DC)
Khajit Stamina Nightblade | Gleaming Daggers(DC)
Altmer Magicka Nightblade | Miss Chewbucca(EP)
Argonian Magicka Templar | Walks-With-Friends(EP)
Argonian Templar Healer | Dr Toxic(EP)
Orc Stamina Sorc | Lady Streaks-Alot(DC)
Dunmer Magicka DK | Whips-n-Chains(DC)
Nord Warden | Demi Tank(DC)
Dunmer Magicka Warden | Crafter-O-Crafts(DC)
Bosmer Stamplar | Forest-Plump(DC)
Argonian Hybrid Nb | Men-O-Paws(DC)
Bosmer Stamblade | 'Maui(AD)
Altmer Magicka Sorcerer | Mid-Life-Crisis(AD)1 -
SHADOW2KK✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
I wonder when the perma-bans for using multi-craft, lazy writ, potion maker, fish filet, etc. will be handed out? They are directly against the TOS you know - as confirmed by ZOS. So no complaints then, right?starkerealm wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »ManwithBeard9 wrote: »Chronicburn wrote: »To bad they werent streamers driving more players to the game. They would be allowed to blatantly break the TOS, admit it on their streams and then be invited to the test the next "chapter" before anyone else.
Some of you seem to think there is a universal code or some gauge by which your banned or your not. Im guessing those people havent been here for a while, ZOS has allowed exploits and exploiters for YEARS.
Thats a fact, and most of you know it.
Stop *** footing around, this is on ZOS 100%. You break the TOS you get banned, period.
Not here, not now, not then, not ever.
The punishment was arbitrary and vengeful. No customer deserves to be treated like that on a first offense with no warning.
ZOS clearly needs to examine carefully what a customer-business relationship is supposed to look like.
It appears they have power-mad megalomaniacs in their midst.
Except that more than a few of the users perma-banned WERE NOT FIRST TIME OFFENDERS. If anyone gets a temporary suspension, no one but ZOS and the user knows why and for how long. How many people got suspensions and claimed "I was super busy with work." "I had a lot of family stuff going on" or any other excuse.
Hopefully ZOS forwards this to MS or Sony and they can block their consoles from accessing ESO in perpetuity.
I agree that if they had been previously warned or suspended for exploiting and informed a ban could follow, then they did it anyway, a ban can be justified.
However like you said we can’t know, can we.
Although the TOS says you can’t do it, it also doesn’t say “we’re gonna kick you out and keep your money the first time you go out with some buddies you think are cool and have some fun messing with one of ZOS’s mistakes”
Oh jeez, so when you agreed to the ToS and agreed to behave regardless of ZOS' failures, you dont think people should suffer the consequences of breaking the ToS.
The punishment in this case does not fit the crime.
ZOS is guilty of abusing their power.
Grossly and intentionally exploiting a Trial to get achievement, skin, bragging rights, weapons and jewelry, and further seeling runs using exploit to gain gold (possibly even real money), iunno, perma-ban seems appropriate.
It’s all pixels. Get a life. Bragging rights? Are you seven?
Im the last person that cares about e-peen measurement. Others do, good for them. If its all pixels, why do you care about what happens to other people's accounts?
Because that’s their rl time and $$ they put into the game.
Plus if it happened to them it could happen to anyone ... wrong place wrong time. I guess maybe you are just the holy saint of eso though ... sorry
Then, maybe, they should have been a bit more circumspect about choosing to violate the terms of service.
I know, some kids did that before, and weren't punished. That doesn't mystically make it okay.
? and how exactly are any of the addons you mentioned against ToS? none of them give advantages over other players or are exploits, they are, in essence QoL improvements that should have been in the game from day one, but due to ZoS in its infinite wisdom, they had to be player created.
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Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
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If it doesn't seem intended, submit a ticket and ask them.Permanent ban all the devs... They made the exploit. Besides... In this game of continuos changes, bugs and issues... How can one REALLY know what is not intended?
Also most exploits which people are punished for are not the kind of things you do accidentally. Once again, this current exploit in question took actual effort and setting up, those banned didn't accidentally just walk into this.
Additionally if they were players with integrity they would have realised it wasn't working as intended (boss can't attack you, but you can attack it) and then stopped, reported the issue and reset the instance.
However they chose to repeat it for gains.
@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
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Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭can someone point me to the post with exploit description?
I agree with some of the comments that zos looks like they have no control and monitor of their own game. Whatever you can do in the game is allowed by the game mechanics. It is not the user issue to figure out whether he is using this mechanics right or wrong. Remember the first time when zos and users discovered that there is no global cooldown on skills? This was a bug originally. I don't remember any bans. So, looks like it is up to zos to decide whether some arbitrary action is a cheat or not. In this case I would really recommend users to open the ticket and post immediately exploit on non-zos forum where it will not be deleted. So anybody can use it until zos will fix it. This way you can get zos attention much faster.
-vovus
Just run down through Dev Tracker. You'll see the original announcement a few days ago reporting the exploit and action taken, and the more recent post by Jessica explaining that a number of specific actions had to be deliberately taken to trigger the bug such that there's no way somebody could have stumbled across the exploit accidentally - which is why the bans in this case were permanent and final. I suspect your views will then change from what you said in the second paragraph.1
This discussion has been closed.