Curragraigue wrote: »

If you look back through the PvP threads the guilds that swapped Alliances did so because they wanted to try and create some balance in campaigns. As Joy said there are a lot of people that don't want to take part in conduct that will ultimately kill campaigns (gating an under pop faction). Are there trolls and is there in fighting in factions? Yes but faction lock won't change that.

Until all the campaigns are busy people will always want to flock to the busy campaign and play with their friends. I PvP'd on AD in BwB to unlock skills on a stam character. Otherwise I only PvP on DC characters. So while I am loyal I have no problems with others faction swapping to play with friends or trying to balance factions.

The real problem for me is that if one faction gets ahead the fair weather friends will stack into the winning Alliance for rewards and to zerg. That problem is better addressed by devs making defence and offence stronger on keeps by under pop and weaker for over pop factions. If players won't balance the system/game needs to.

Turelus wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

I´ve never seen the problem with alliance swapping. It´s not like it´s ruining the overall PvP experience anyway.

Personally I felt Cyrodiil was a better place when it was locked. Yes there was a work around for it, but at least you didn't get rewards on every character and every faction.

People chose a side and battled for it, the issue of population balance was the number of campaigns and people claiming one for each faction, not the being unable to switch sides/characters.

Raudgrani wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Raudgrani wrote: »

I've told you what I dislike about the faction swapping possibility. Now I'd really like to hear what's so GREAT about it? What would ruin the whole game, if you could only participate within one alliance for every campaign over 30 days? Is the typical age of players too low for me to understand? Too used to getting what you want for free? I was raised to struggle for everything, I didn't expect any easy ways out - there were none. Your usual choice of alliance doesn't have a single keep today? Tough luck, go reclaim them, come back another day - or do something else and hope for better luck in the next campaign.

I´m 31 years old - definetly not in the younger age bracket of esos playerbase.
I have chars i like to play on 3 factions. There is only 1 campaign that´s interests me. Simple as that.

On top of that i like to have the option to hop on the weak faction and fight the dominant one whichever that might be (ad cough).

Being stuck to one faction would make the game worse not better because it would only aggravate problems with having one dominant alliance - as you´d have to wait until campaign end every time for a possibly (but unlikely) change.

Your view on mmos seems to be quite archaic to be honest. In a modern mmo people should come online and be able to have fun - not be confronted with a situation where their only option is to log out for the next 28 days.

I would agree with you, in all honesty. What you (and others) say makes perfect sense, but it doesn't work. You don't see people from a winning alliance suddenly switch to the complete underdog. They don't. They do the opposite. Just as I have given examples of.

And yeah, Vivec is the name of the game. But what if this change was implemented, wouldn't that bring life back to other campaigns? I don't know, but I guess it would.

Biggest problem however, is that the game doesn't work. Lag, crashes and disconnects are far bigger issues. I have seen a few really prominent EP players say they will probably quit the game, because of all this cheating and alliance switching - but I've seen or heard of far more who won't bother even trying to play anymore, before they fix these problems.

Last night, every death or keep jump resulted in like 5 minutes load screen on Xbox EU server. For a change, I actually RAN like a lunatic from the AD zerg, just to be able of pushing them back later - instead of dying and then respawning at the northern gate with all my friends 5 minutes later hahaha.... It ruins the game, of course.

Joy_Division wrote: »

Raudgrani wrote: »

I understand that there are people switching between alliances without malicious intentions (i.e cooperating with their buddies of other alliances). But quite a few use this possibility in the wrong way. Like the guys I mentioned earlier, just passively following EP's around doing nothing. I had respected them a lot more, if they actually played the game and did something to help their current color out. But they don't. That's the definition of a parasite to me, and of loser at that.

Some do help though, for good or ill. Those we might call turncoats, or as I say: Switch [snip]. I mean, today or yesterday (who remembers) I was swarmed and worn down quickly by like 6 DC guys; suddenly and out of nowhere - one of these DC arch enemies of mine (now on a red) that I have lost against so many times, jumps in and whacks them all, teabags me and then resurrects me. I had to give him a "laugh emote" and then we carry on towards Bleakers, together. I respect that way more, even if I think it's basically so wrong. The guy wants a chance to do other than getting "zerged down" , so he switches to the leading one - and actually does the best he can. FIne. But it's really, really not good for game balance, but he plays the game like it's meant to be played.

I can't see how it's good for any "game balance" either, if people can just switch alliance like he did. Here in my example, the DC lost a really strong player, making the currently strongest alliance even stronger.

@Joy_Division obviously have very strong feelings for this. But I fail to see why he feels so strongly for hopping between alliances, like it's essential for the game experience? Why? He also miserably fails to understand me, when he seems to think I encourage bullying - while I in reality actually suggest this solution, to counter bullying and harassment.
In addition to that, no I don't believe in mankind. I am a misanthrope. If there's an easy way out, and if there's a possibility to cheat/gain favors, far to many will take advantage of that. It's just the way people are.
He gives examples of complicated intrigues that I don't even fully understand, and this really just proves my point. People are cheaters. So, we should limit the possibilities to do it. "Competing warlords" etc. etc. within the same alliance is one thing, it's even a historical thing you know. But traitors that you can't even hurt, that's not historical or realistic in any way.

Also, he calls me a "fanatic". Yes, I might be. But it's just a game, remember? I can sort of see through all that.
To see that "grand swine" on the field of battle, you forget about everyone else and just charge them no matter the consequences, your own death is well worth just taking him/her down. I LOVE those guys! Those are what makes me come back for more. Killing randoms I've never seen before, it's just AP to me. The real arch enemies, if they leave the game is boring.
If you think you don't agree, really think of it. "Yeah the map is all red now, and Imperial City is all red... Now what...". Boring. If xx, xx and xx was gone tomorrow (usually the top players of course), and we had no one to accuse of using cheat engine over our group chat (because they are probably just a lot better than us!), and no one to suspect of working together with the third alliance - there wouldn't even be a reason to go to Cyrodiil, other than to get skyshards, lorebooks and general PVE related content/achievements. If you are competitive, you know what I speak of.

So no, I am no "fanatic" who can't tell fiction from reality, or who hate people over a video game. As I said, I love them (for their part in the game).

I've told you what I dislike about the faction swapping possibility. Now I'd really like to hear what's so GREAT about it? What would ruin the whole game, if you could only participate within one alliance for every campaign over 30 days? Is the typical age of players too low for me to understand? Too used to getting what you want for free? I was raised to struggle for everything, I didn't expect any easy ways out - there were none. Your usual choice of alliance doesn't have a single keep today? Tough luck, go reclaim them, come back another day - or do something else and hope for better luck in the next campaign.

I understand what you are saying. You're just making assumptions. You are providing no evidence and just blaming stuff on people who play the game differently than you think it ought to be played.

You said it yourself: "I am a misanthrope. If there's an easy way out, and if there's a possibility to cheat/gain favors, far to many will take advantage of that. It's just the way people are."

So in short, you are ignorant on this subject and yet you'll still fall back on your gut instincts to explain and blame thing you don't like.

You honestly think people and my friends like me have nothing better to do than to ride my horse to their group, then jump and shoot at where some random non name stealthed "ally" is? Can you take off the tinfoil hat please? I don't doubt it happened to you, but it happened to you because the person who did it doesn't like you. It was personal. And it would have happened even if alliance switching was permanently disabled..

You think that running scrolls to the enemy is collusion? Do you even have any clue how Alliance war scoring happens or the effect on AvAvA gameplay when one alliance has an enemy's scroll? No, you don't. Because you too busy interpreting such behavior as collusion and conspiracy. People who are actually dedicated to their alliance objective, and intelligent will purposely walk scrolls to the enemy because taking them draws aggro for both enemies. And some people just want to "farm" scrolls so they'll march it to an enemy just to get fights.

If EPs are following you around doing nothing and wasting their time, it is because of a personal issue, that has nothing to do with alliance switching. And being that you call people traitors, parasites, ***, and losers, I can see why some people will go out of their way to do that.

In short, you are interpreting negative experiences to you on something you hate (Alliance switching), when the causes are something else entirely (people not liking you, removing aggro from alliance, etc.)

If you don't understand why others and I would feel strongly about this issue, that's just proving how little you know about it and that have have zero clue or comprehension why we play multiple factions.

First off, let's get something straight: the emperor trading shenanigans that goes on happens because of low population servers. Period. Low population means manipulation is easy and Alliance War switching is not needed. This goes all the way back to Launch, when 99% of the player-base was single faction, just as you'd like, yet emperor trading was so rampant on 7 of the 10 servers ZoS originally had it lead them to close them down, institute other changes, and put into effect the very campaign locks you seek. And yet it still happened. Because it has nothing to do with alliance switching and everything to do with a low population that can be manipulated.

You and every other faction diehard are deluded that we'll follow the "easy" way and jump ship just when your alliance needs help. Give me the evidence. I talk with these players, I see what they write in guild chat, I hear what they have to say in Discord, I been with them for years. I know why they do what they do. You don't. You just look toward you own biases, people are misanthropes, people look for the "easy" way, and just makes assumptions and then slander us. Oh, that teabagger who rezzed you on the way to Beakers...how exactly is EP the "strongest" faction if Blue control Bleaks? Don't even bother telling me Red had keeps from Chalman to Glade because you'll just say that.

I hop alliances for the same reason I'll hop on a different team if I go to the YMCA to play basketball and we keep winning 11-3. Because it's supposed to be all about competition and it sucks to destroy fellow competitors such that they get so discouraged the very enjoyment they seek evaporates and they'll log off. But you don't quite see things that way, do you? No. To you, the glory of killing the "grand swine" on the field of battle is such that you forget about everyone else and just charge them no matter the consequences, your own death is well worth just taking him/her down.. And "Killing randoms I've never seen before, it's just AP to me.[/i].

They're just swine and AP. I guess you really are a misanthrope. Well, I'm not. The irony here is that you are blaming me for the ails of PvP when what I do for the game is more conducive to its health than you.

That's why I feel so strongly. Because you and every other person who have ZERO clue why people like me play on multiple factions do so, instead you slander us and lobby ZoS to institute a policy that already failed so utterly that they removed it, all based on ignorance.

And don't even try to downplay the bullying thing. What a joke. You wrote on these forums that is was maybe the rightful thing to do. I have played this game since launch on multiple factions and the vast majority of people I have come across with have been cool and cordial to me. Aside from two specific people are just jerks (both banned multiple time, one having told another player that they hoped their mother gets cancer), the only people who have been hostile are those such as yourself who believe that it was acceptable to bully me because I played on multiple faction. They don't know me and I've never done anything to them, no t-bagging, no whispers, no nothing, and yet they spew hatred, lies, along with various homophobic and misogynistic crap. Bullying is not acceptable and it is not ZoS's responsibility to completely change the way the game is played to prevent hateful people from doing it. The world does not change for bullies. No, it's the bullies who have to change or get punished for their miserable behavior.

Here's what would ruin the game about you one campaign proposal. Because the changes ZoS made with one Tamriel, ZoS has made it possible to group with players from other factions in the vast majority of gameplay. The only place you cant actively do this is PvP. Everywhere they have encouraged inter-faction gameplay. This was a clear reversal from Launch when factions were locked for PvE and even what happened in cyrodiil effect PvE trial raiding. All that is gone. And so many players have followed that signal and have characters that they care for on multiple factions.

Because I and many other players actually care about the characters we make, we want to be able to play them. It's pretty simple really. There is one single PvP campaign active. Your proposal would make it such that I'd have to go months without PvPing on a character we care about, characters we made because of the very changes Zos implemented in the main game.

And for what? We already know what happens with faction locks because they have already been in place. Emperor still gets traded. Jerks who don't like you will still reveal you're stealthed location. People who have friends on other alliances will still "spai" in Cyrodiil (much more so actually since you are aggravating them and preventing them from actually playing on an enemy alliance in the first place), and scrolls will still be carried to enemy borders rather than to your home keeps. All the crap will still happen and you will accomplish nothing but aggravating even more players now, as there are many more multi-faction players. We know this because we already tried it you way.

That is reason enough. But it's not just that. I and most other multi-faction players have zero desire to be stuck on a zerg-happy faction stacking mob that gate-camps the other alliances and renders the very competition we seek moot. Under your proposal, our only alternative is to log off the game entirely, so that means your proposal is a fail.

And spare me the whole "you kids these days" speech.

Is the typical age of players too low for me to understand? Too used to getting what you want for free? I was raised to struggle for everything, I didn't expect any easy ways out - there were none. Your usual choice of alliance doesn't have a single keep today? Tough luck, go reclaim them, come back another day - or do something else and hope for better luck in the next campaign.

No. It's typical of an older generation too stuck in its ways to appreciate, let alone understand, the changing world around them. Your generation raised kids these days, so if they are used to getting what they want for free, that's not the fault of the kids, but of the parents. You claim you don't expect an easy way out, yet your asking for one here. Because it's too hard for bullies to stop harassing folks like me, rather than undergo honest self-reflection and endeavor to improve themselves, you want ZoS to stop alliance switching to reign in their miserable behavior. It's apparently too hard for you to handle players playing different characters, so you just attribute them as jerks, ***, and cheaters, so you want ZoS to end it.

And the very last sentence still demonstrates you know little about our motivations. I am in two guilds with mutli-faction players. We pretty much all play the same way: we seek the hard way, we log onto to the outnumbered faction, we want good fights. Stop lying about us.

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

It is all becoming a moot point as ZOS is being successful in their master plan to slowly kill off PvP.
There can be no other explanation for what they have done with it.

Once they've killed PVP, they can repopulate Cyrodiil's keeps and highways with Imperial Legion NPCs and bosses and a few quests and voila, another new PVE zone!