When U queue a random dungeon, and you get a fake tank/healer, what are you going to do?

VinyParsley2016 · October 2017

When U queue a random dungeon, and you get a fake tank/healer, what are you going to do?
Let me share 1 story 1st. Several days ago, I queued vCOS, got a CP70 tank, he is real tank, not fake, but still got kicked cuz low CP. I was going to say something to make him feel better, but I heard "OK, thank U. Fxxk U, U, and U". Then, I felt I did right thing.

Nestor · October 2017

I would not have kicked him until the first boss and they showed me they can't tank.

This is why I never que for Random Vet Dungeons anymore. All I get are the absolute hardest ones. Ones I do with my guild and friends, not with Pugs. There are other dungeons in the game besides DLC and vCoA II.

SirAndy · October 2017

So what is your actual question?
Title says fake tank but then you say he was a tank, just lower CP than you apparently deem worthy.

So you want people to tell you you did the right thing because you sort of feel bad for kicking someone? Or ...?

eso_nya · October 2017

Talking to or running with dumb ppl will be a waste of your time. Not smart enough to tick right role-icon? -> kick

VinyParsley2016 · October 2017

Nestor wrote: »

I would not have kicked him until the first boss and they showed me they can't tank.

This is why I never que for Random Vet Dungeons anymore. All I get are the absolute hardest ones. Ones I do with my guild and friends, not with Pugs. There are other dungeons in the game besides DLC and vCoA II.

In some dungeons, some boss don't need tank, like 1st and 2nd boss in COS, but with a real tank, the fight will be easier, saving my potions and repairing gold.
And besides, PPL don't like join the group halfway CUZ they need to kill 1st boss for pledge. So, if you want to kick someone, kick before the fight.

VinyParsley2016 · October 2017

SirAndy wrote: »

So what is your actual question?
Title says fake tank but then you say he was a tank, just lower CP than you apparently deem worthy.

So you want people to tell you you did the right thing because you sort of feel bad for kicking someone? Or ...?

I just shared a story, irrelevant to my question. But low CP tank = fake tank.

zaria · October 2017

SirAndy wrote: »

So what is your actual question?
Title says fake tank but then you say he was a tank, just lower CP than you apparently deem worthy.

So you want people to tell you you did the right thing because you sort of feel bad for kicking someone? Or ...?

You have fake tanks, this is DD with no taunt and no damage migration.
You have weak tanks either low level players or pseudo tank with inner fire and self heal / shield.
This is ok in easy dungeons not vet dlc.
An CP70 should not do random vet anyway, either he was an fool or he wanted to do random normal and forgot to change from vet.

Riejael · October 2017

VinyParsley2016 wrote: »

When U queue a random dungeon, and you get a fake tank/healer, what are you going to do?
Let me share 1 story 1st. Several days ago, I queued vCOS, got a CP70 tank, he is real tank, not fake, but still got kicked cuz low CP. I was going to say something to make him feel better, but I heard "OK, thank U. Fxxk U, U, and U". Then, I felt I did right thing.

I get the feeling this story is a bit fake.

You need 3 players to boot someone. The one being booted has no clue a vote is going on (unless someone tells them) until they are booted.

You claim you would have said something but you voted yes. What difference does it make what you said, you still clicked yes. I'm not saying you weren't justified (I think 50 through CP159 shouldn't have the option of veteran due to the way gear scales poorly for them). But to say you wanted to be nice is just rubbing insult to injury

SirAndy · October 2017

VinyParsley2016 wrote: »

But low CP tank = fake tank.

I've pugged many vet dungeons with low CP players just fine. Low CP does not make for a fake tank.
As long as the tank can taunt and hold aggro, what difference does low CP make?

You're pugging a dungeon, not running for a trial leaderboard spot.

Horowonnoe · October 2017

VinyParsley2016 wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

So what is your actual question?
Title says fake tank but then you say he was a tank, just lower CP than you apparently deem worthy.

So you want people to tell you you did the right thing because you sort of feel bad for kicking someone? Or ...?

I just shared a story, irrelevant to my question. But low CP tank = fake tank.

um no? Fake tank is a healer Qing as a tank, or a DPS Qing as a tank.
All you are showing here is that you are not a nice player by kicking a low CP without even giving them a chance, even tho they were a real tank. That player you kicked had to wait 15 more minutes in the Q without even a chance of proving themselves. How can you know, it could have been someones alt account. Also for tanks, CP doesn't matter quite as much as it does for DPS.

thedude33 · October 2017

I think the Cheeto has started a new fad inspiring people to use the word 'fake' over and over

Bad !

Megabear · October 2017

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/375572/fake-tank-kick-chat-screenshots#latest

inthecoconut · October 2017

I tank so I don't have this problem. I also have luckily not been on the receiving end of these "too-low-CP" shenanigans so far, but I imagine I'd be pretty peeved if someone booted me for that reason. If the game puts me in the dungeon then by the design and intentions of ZOS, I should be fine to do the dungeon. If you want to place your own restrictions/requirements on what level someone needs to be by YOUR own standards, then the answer is simple.

Don't queue for pugs/randoms. If you want to have a specific CP level then YOU need to take the time to put YOUR OWN party together. Don't put that burden/expectation on the random people who just want to have fun and learn the game.

Oh, and CP is not a good indicator that you are good at the game or even know what you are doing.

AlnilamE · October 2017

VinyParsley2016 wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

So what is your actual question?
Title says fake tank but then you say he was a tank, just lower CP than you apparently deem worthy.

So you want people to tell you you did the right thing because you sort of feel bad for kicking someone? Or ...?

I just shared a story, irrelevant to my question. But low CP tank = fake tank.

No. A fake tank is a person without a tank and who doesn't have enough mitigation to tank a boss.

Low CP is not a problem if they know what they are doing.

Riejael · October 2017

SirAndy wrote: »

VinyParsley2016 wrote: »

But low CP tank = fake tank.

I've pugged many vet dungeons with low CP players just fine. Low CP does not make for a fake tank.
As long as the tank can taunt and hold aggro, what difference does low CP make?

You're pugging a dungeon, not running for a trial leaderboard spot.

A CP89 in CP80 gear should be ok. A CP135 in LV48 gear is going to get squished. Granted a CP300 in 48-CP70 gear will get squished harder, they are a bit more rare. In my experience, you're going to have better luck with a 160+ having 160 gear. Not always, but better than even chance.

I'm usually willing to give lower CP a chance.. if its a tank with a bit more HP than my healer (I don't have much fyi, just 19k unbuffed). And DPS I'll need to do more than I do as a healer (again.. I don't do much when healing, usually about 6-8k if mechanics aren't causing me to have to do stupid stuff). But then again.. if CP660+ isn't doing/having all that I boot them too. Its all fair.

Qbiken · October 2017

Try the dungeon and see if it works out, if not then kick or I leave my self

I don´t care if people que for the wrong role, if we manage to do the dungeon without trouble it doesn´t matter. And if you kick someone for queing the "wrong role" then you´re as much of an a-hole as those who kick people for being low cp

rotaugen454 · October 2017

I have never booted someone for CO or level. I have for faking being a tank to jump the line. If I run my DPS, I wait like everyone else. If I run my tank or healer, I am in quickly and people are glad I'm a real tank or healer.im not running with someone whose first action is to lie.

zaria · October 2017

Horowonnoe wrote: »

VinyParsley2016 wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

So what is your actual question?
Title says fake tank but then you say he was a tank, just lower CP than you apparently deem worthy.

So you want people to tell you you did the right thing because you sort of feel bad for kicking someone? Or ...?

I just shared a story, irrelevant to my question. But low CP tank = fake tank.

um no? Fake tank is a healer Qing as a tank, or a DPS Qing as a tank.
All you are showing here is that you are not a nice player by kicking a low CP without even giving them a chance, even tho they were a real tank. That player you kicked had to wait 15 more minutes in the Q without even a chance of proving themselves. How can you know, it could have been someones alt account. Also for tanks, CP doesn't matter quite as much as it does for DPS.

This, however pugging for an vet dlc or even random vet as cp60, show an lack of experience / common sense.
Don't hurt to give him an chance but might also be an idea to ask him if he knew that he was up to.
Its easy to mess up random normal and vet. was in an guild group doing the pledges, tank dropped out and we took the IcP on normal, I managed to mess up so we entered vet, group was to weak and tank admitted he hoped for an easier dungeon so we did it in normal. Did falkreath hold with guild, I joined for an normal run but we thought we could try, it worked well up to last boss, then it took almost 2 hours.

Enslaved · October 2017

VinyParsley2016 wrote: »

When U queue a random dungeon, and you get a fake tank/healer, what are you going to do?
Let me share 1 story 1st. Several days ago, I queued vCOS, got a CP70 tank, he is real tank, not fake, but still got kicked cuz low CP. I was going to say something to make him feel better, but I heard "OK, thank U. Fxxk U, U, and U". Then, I felt I did right thing.

I will buy a new 400 euro limited offer 1h only mount. That will solve everything, right?

WrathOfInnos · October 2017

Don't kick low CP players

VaranisArano · October 2017

When I queue as a real tank with 660CP what do I do with low DPS? Grin and bear it. Unless said DPS are running ahead or taunting the boss, I can handle a group that does slow but steady DPS. See, when I group with random players, I accept and plan for grouping with random players and their widely varying DPS.

I've been fortunately enough to never run into a fake healer. Healers who were trying their hardest and couldn't quite manage? Sure, that's when I'll use some extra self or group heals. Healers who did more DPS than the rest of the party combined and still kept us healed? Yeah, I've run into those guys too. (When the Healer and the Tank out-DPS the two DPS...that was a fun COH2 run. But even there, we completed it.)

My point of view:
1. Only queue for roles you can actually fulfill in every dungeon you queued for. If you can't tank vetCOA2 or vetWGT, don't queue as a tank for veteran randoms.
2. Daily Random Dungeons are NOT a guaranteed QUICK & EASY daily random dungeon. If you can't handle grouping with random players of various levels, CP or experience, do yourself and everyone else a favor and don't use groupfinder to queue for the daily random dungeon. You are the one who can't handle grouping with random players, so don't make your problem into a problem for other players.

VinyParsley2016 · October 2017

VaranisArano wrote: »

When I queue as a real tank with 660CP what do I do with low DPS? Grin and bear it. Unless said DPS are running ahead or taunting the boss, I can handle a group that does slow but steady DPS. See, when I group with random players, I accept and plan for grouping with random players and their widely varying DPS.

I've been fortunately enough to never run into a fake healer. Healers who were trying their hardest and couldn't quite manage? Sure, that's when I'll use some extra self or group heals. Healers who did more DPS than the rest of the party combined and still kept us healed? Yeah, I've run into those guys too. (When the Healer and the Tank out-DPS the two DPS...that was a fun COH2 run. But even there, we completed it.)

My point of view:
1. Only queue for roles you can actually fulfill in every dungeon you queued for. If you can't tank vetCOA2 or vetWGT, don't queue as a tank for veteran randoms.
2. Daily Random Dungeons are NOT a guaranteed QUICK & EASY daily random dungeon. If you can't handle grouping with random players of various levels, CP or experience, do yourself and everyone else a favor and don't use groupfinder to queue for the daily random dungeon. You are the one who can't handle grouping with random players, so don't make your problem into a problem for other players.

Last weekend, I use my DPS ran vet Falkreath with random. All 660, the tank is a Alkosh Tank, with MAW skin. After killed the 1st boss, the one using PVP boob, the tank called us trash, then left. LOL

I guess the reason is healer didn't give him synergy, so he pissed off. But he didn't ask, and didn't say anything before the fight. Actually, I was going to put my shards on skill bar cuz I saw the tank using Alkosh, but they rush to boss so quickly. I couldn't do anything.

Zippy81 · October 2017

What if that player was trying to get into a vet dungeon for the first time ever?

I don't mind lower CP players in group as long as they know what they're doing. I'm a bit more worried when the dps has 30k health. PVP builds in vet PVE content are not effective enough.

Fake tanks. I met them many times, especially all those overconfident who claim that 'just burn it' is the best idea.

As for kicking someone after the first boss in a pledge dungeon? Just be nice enough to go back there again and kill the first boss once more. It's thanks to that newcomer that you managed to finish your pledge in first place. He/She deserves your help.

I only wish the random dungeon wasn't always WGT/ICP because of people farming gear.

code65536 · October 2017

VinyParsley2016 wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

So what is your actual question?
Title says fake tank but then you say he was a tank, just lower CP than you apparently deem worthy.

So you want people to tell you you did the right thing because you sort of feel bad for kicking someone? Or ...?

I just shared a story, irrelevant to my question. But low CP tank = fake tank.

WTF?!

If they have and use a taunt, then they're a real tank.

If they position well, hold targets steady, and stay alive, then they're a good tank.

The only fake tank is someone who doesn't taunt.

The very first trash pull in vCoS is a good test of whether a tank is a real tank. Does the tank taunt the 2-hander or do the DPS and healer have to fend for themselves against the 2-hander's one-shot uppercut? (Also, the first pledge boss in vCoS is the second boss, so you have all those trash pulls plus the first boss with which to test someone before kicking.)

Low CP does not make someone a "fake" tank, and vote-kicking someone before you even give them a chance is pure douchbaggery. If I were in that group, I would've vetoed the vote-kick until I see the tank in action. And if I knew that it was you who initiated the vote-kick, I would immediately initiate a vote-kick against you.

watsbeef2 · October 2017

Although I agree low cp does not equal fake tank. I do have to question those wearing all light armor and "dont need" food buff while claiming the tank role.

BloodBeast_ESO · October 2017

I kick them the *** out, there would be no point in wasting peoples time with a fake [snip].

[Edited to remove profanity]

Firstmep · October 2017

I had 2 fake dps the other day, both with 30k hp, ironically one of em qued as a tanky,but he said he couldnt since he had dps gear on(39k hp).

Turelus · October 2017

For the thread title.
It depends, if it's content that needs a tank then sure it's annoying and might vote to kick. If it's content that doesn't (normal dungeons with high level players) then no I just power through and deaths mean nothing (no achievements).

For your actual story, you were a jerk.
If someone was actually a tank and queued as a tank then you kicked them based on CP without giving them any chance, you were just being a jerk. If you want to have groups which meet your standards form them via zone chat or create/join a guild for doing so.

zaria · October 2017

Firstmep wrote: »

I had 2 fake dps the other day, both with 30k hp, ironically one of em qued as a tanky,but he said he couldnt since he had dps gear on(39k hp).

LOL, why so much health? If so why not just wear sword and board and taunt and all will be happy.
granted healer would have to work a bit harder as they are noob tanks but that is no issue.

Qbiken · October 2017

eso_nya wrote: »

Talking to or running with dumb ppl will be a waste of your time. Not smart enough to tick right role-icon? -> kick

Never knew you were one of them........RIP xD

To OP. If I use the dungeonfinder I just see how the dungeon works out before starting kicking people left and right, regardless of what role they picked when queing for the dungeon. The only thing that matters at the end of they day is how smooth the dungeon went

, all else is irrelevant.

SoLooney · October 2017

lol fake tanks are only a problem in hard vet dungeons

my bigger problem is when i queue as a tank or healer and get horrible dps, cause u cant carry bad dps when you are not on your dps toon