PTS Update 16 - Feedback Thread for Templar

Cinbri · October 2017

Minno wrote: »

Test #2:
- UC final explosion hits targets after first target is dead. UC on live pittles into a light-fart if you kill the enemy it's on. This is a great change, and highly appreciated.
- still no player on the pts to test in pvp against, so no idea if it's still undodgeable. It's like a ghost town in there lol.

Will need to see how much they increase the DMG of the explosive portion. If it's enough, I'll be running it still despite the cc immunity; there's no other burst spell in the templars arsenal and the added cc immunity means the enemy either has to drain Stam or take the delayed DMG. It will take a little build changing but at least they will buff the DMG.

Tomorrow/Tuesday is going to be a long day lol.

Undodgeable but blockable on pts. And that is huge drawback. Because morph effect proc on break free, but this mechanic means press block and bash. No matter the damage buff of explosion coz every time effect proc it will be blocked damage, I.e. more than 50% reducted, coz of break free mechanic. And since we cant apply time bomb on cc immune enemy unlike on live - it would be fair to have unblockable explosion.

Minno · October 2017

Cinbri wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Test #2:
- UC final explosion hits targets after first target is dead. UC on live pittles into a light-fart if you kill the enemy it's on. This is a great change, and highly appreciated.
- still no player on the pts to test in pvp against, so no idea if it's still undodgeable. It's like a ghost town in there lol.

Will need to see how much they increase the DMG of the explosive portion. If it's enough, I'll be running it still despite the cc immunity; there's no other burst spell in the templars arsenal and the added cc immunity means the enemy either has to drain Stam or take the delayed DMG. It will take a little build changing but at least they will buff the DMG.

Tomorrow/Tuesday is going to be a long day lol.

Undodgeable but blockable on pts. And that is huge drawback. Because morph effect proc on break free, but this mechanic means press block and bash. No matter the damage buff of explosion coz every time effect proc it will be blocked damage, I.e. more than 50% reducted, coz of break free mechanic. And since we cant apply time bomb on cc immune enemy unlike on live - it would be fair to have unblockable explosion.

Tried looking for other options in the temps toolkit, and nothing came close still (aside from dark flare but I'm looking for consistency). Wrobel is still keeping it tied to cc

. But in my rotation, I'll be using topping charge to try to snag a cc before it grants the enemy the immunity. But since nobody was in cyro or the towns to duel last night when I was on, I couldn't test it for an ideal PvP setting.

The time bomb really needs to ignore cc immunity; idk why they got rid of it because it added consistency to the DMG output of the templar. Maybe they saw valkyn as the most extreme build potential for templars and decided they shouldn't have access to another easy burst option, much to the expense of templars looking to escape from the 2pc valkyn meta.

@Brutusmax1mus
I mentioned my numbers prior. Using my Frost-monk build they copied to pts, 31k mag, 3000 SD 51% crit, 78% crit DMG. I was getting around 5300 double-buffed before battlespirit. Both redirect+burst were this number and could crit often. Today on the pts that spell is promised by wrobel to get a DMG buff, and if it's enough of a buff I would use it over solar barrage.

Solar barrage is nice despite the cast time. But compared to other melee cast time abilities, it's DMG is terrible. It's clear they intend the ability to function in pve; otherwise why such low DMG before battlespirit? Since Dawn's wraith is more utility based than DPS based, it should have it's empower buff removed and given something that strengths your overall dmg or give major/minor speed buffs.

Minno · October 2017

@Cinbri also another thought; what happens after you break free? If it applies the DMG from the time bomb, is there enough time to block? Or does it count it right after you break free forcing the DMG to apply before another action can take place?

If they don't break free and just block, then that is a problem because templars don't have an unblockable cc like everyone else just received in this pts patch to force the DMG to go through. Of course this reduces the flexibility and the consistency of the spell, since we have to assume the best players will use an immunity pot prior to engaging further reducing the consistency of this ability.

FlamingBeard · October 2017

Minno wrote: »

@Cinbri also another thought; what happens after you break free? If it applies the DMG from the time bomb, is there enough time to block? Or does it count it right after you break free forcing the DMG to apply before another action can take place?

If they don't break free and just block, then that is a problem because templars don't have an unblockable cc like everyone else just received in this pts patch to force the DMG to go through. Of course this reduces the flexibility and the consistency of the spell, since we have to assume the best players will use an immunity pot prior to engaging further reducing the consistency of this ability.

Every other class gets a way to reduce hits taken; Ball of Lightning (Sorcerer), Dragon Fire Scale (Dragonknight), Shimmering Shield (Warden), and Shadowy Disguise (Nightblade)...

And Templar gets... a targeted, high-cost, low-effectiveness, CC breakable non-CC...

Just LOL is all I have to say.

Brutusmax1mus · October 2017

Every class has a cc through block except Templars too

Ashamray · October 2017

Kilandros wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

Yeah sun shield needs to be reworked. It used to be only useful on builds with highish health and now it's not even useful on those anymore... so got nothing to lose now may as well completely redesign it and make it scale in a way that all templar builds can use it.

Yes please. Templar really needs to see some of its defensive skills restored. Being a block healbot that occasionally mists is pretty lame.

It definitely needs restoration, but block healbot that occasionally mists will use renewed shield to be more disgusting

Minno · October 2017

FlamingBeard wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

@Cinbri also another thought; what happens after you break free? If it applies the DMG from the time bomb, is there enough time to block? Or does it count it right after you break free forcing the DMG to apply before another action can take place?

If they don't break free and just block, then that is a problem because templars don't have an unblockable cc like everyone else just received in this pts patch to force the DMG to go through. Of course this reduces the flexibility and the consistency of the spell, since we have to assume the best players will use an immunity pot prior to engaging further reducing the consistency of this ability.

Every other class gets a way to reduce hits taken; Ball of Lightning (Sorcerer), Dragon Fire Scale (Dragonknight), Shimmering Shield (Warden), and Shadowy Disguise (Nightblade)...

And Templar gets... a targeted, high-cost, low-effectiveness, CC breakable non-CC...

Just LOL is all I have to say.

The pain we suffer due to the ability to purge debuffs with a hot, slot a ranged class execute, mag based gap closer thats undodgeable, access to a spamable undodgeable/unreflected DPS ability that also procs extra DMG, ranged major prophecy buff with a dot, 10% extra DMG on blocking targets, a cheap rune that gives both minor protection/vitality with major armor buffs and a powerful burst heal.

Drdeath20 · October 2017

Minno wrote: »

FlamingBeard wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

@Cinbri also another thought; what happens after you break free? If it applies the DMG from the time bomb, is there enough time to block? Or does it count it right after you break free forcing the DMG to apply before another action can take place?

If they don't break free and just block, then that is a problem because templars don't have an unblockable cc like everyone else just received in this pts patch to force the DMG to go through. Of course this reduces the flexibility and the consistency of the spell, since we have to assume the best players will use an immunity pot prior to engaging further reducing the consistency of this ability.

Every other class gets a way to reduce hits taken; Ball of Lightning (Sorcerer), Dragon Fire Scale (Dragonknight), Shimmering Shield (Warden), and Shadowy Disguise (Nightblade)...

And Templar gets... a targeted, high-cost, low-effectiveness, CC breakable non-CC...

Just LOL is all I have to say.

The pain we suffer due to the ability to purge debuffs with a hot, slot a ranged class execute, mag based gap closer thats undodgeable, access to a spamable undodgeable/unreflected DPS ability that also procs extra DMG, ranged major prophecy buff with a dot, 10% extra DMG on blocking targets, a cheap rune that gives both minor protection/vitality with major armor buffs and a powerful burst heal.

Everyone has access to a purge....

Our execute is broken, it doesnt scale correctly..

Worst/least reliable gap closer in the game....

That dps ability is a melee ranged channel...

Slotting prophecy is attainable by everyone by slotting magelight....

Great our damage buff is 10% more on blocking targets. Soo instead of my hard hitting ability doing 2k vs a target that blocks, it now does 2.2k. Yipeee.....

Ok rune is great, ill admitt that.

Templars heal is great but im not even gurateed to recieve the heal from it. Whenever i cast a heal with 2 or more people around, i have to double sometimes triple cast it.

So yeah try again...

Fuxo · October 2017

Ten pages of feedback and the only change is a larger AOE for Unstable Core. Well done gang. Thanks for all your testing efforts and insightful comments. Not.

Minno · October 2017

UC's delayed DMG is now buffed by 50%. I was getting 5300 roughly on the pts doubled buffed in pve. This will probably be closer to 7950 in pve based on a simple calc. On my same build on live, I was getting around 8200-8300 on the delayed DMG. So it's a slight nerf based on raw numbers.

Pros:
- effect causes DMG even after target is dead (buff)
- DMG is undodgeable (no change from live)
- instant cast on multiple targets (no change from live)
- causes high delayed DMG (slight nerf to raw dmg )
- causes enemy to take DMG per direct attack used (buffed from live)

Cons:
- need to test if they fixed the mag drain casting this ability on cc immunity target. (Probably not fixed, nor will be fixed, as the solution for this problem was the creation of the current offering on live.)
- ability won't stop players from blocking and the delayed DMG is blockable and now it gives that target cc immunity. So the counter to this ability is to press block or consuming an immovable potion before engaging, both of which are not cons for other cc spells/reduce DMG spells.
- will not actually cc your target. You will still take DMG from their burst while they take a flat value.

Need to test:
-does breaking free causes the DMG to instantly happen? (it probably does but who knows).

Conclusion:
Because of cc immunity being given to Target without forcing them to choose between breaking free or doing nothing, this spell will not be used consistently enough to justify slotting it. If further tests show the DMG occurs after they break free, that would be a step in the right direction but most likely not enough DMG to be considered a slot.

Wall of elements + force pulse + purfying light would grant more consistent burst with area of denial and a strong hot. That is something to consider.

Minno · October 2017

Drdeath20 wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

FlamingBeard wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

@Cinbri also another thought; what happens after you break free? If it applies the DMG from the time bomb, is there enough time to block? Or does it count it right after you break free forcing the DMG to apply before another action can take place?

If they don't break free and just block, then that is a problem because templars don't have an unblockable cc like everyone else just received in this pts patch to force the DMG to go through. Of course this reduces the flexibility and the consistency of the spell, since we have to assume the best players will use an immunity pot prior to engaging further reducing the consistency of this ability.

Every other class gets a way to reduce hits taken; Ball of Lightning (Sorcerer), Dragon Fire Scale (Dragonknight), Shimmering Shield (Warden), and Shadowy Disguise (Nightblade)...

And Templar gets... a targeted, high-cost, low-effectiveness, CC breakable non-CC...

Just LOL is all I have to say.

The pain we suffer due to the ability to purge debuffs with a hot, slot a ranged class execute, mag based gap closer thats undodgeable, access to a spamable undodgeable/unreflected DPS ability that also procs extra DMG, ranged major prophecy buff with a dot, 10% extra DMG on blocking targets, a cheap rune that gives both minor protection/vitality with major armor buffs and a powerful burst heal.

Everyone has access to a purge.... only removes 2 abilities for 4-6k cost. Ours removes 5 for 3.1k mag and procs minor mending with a hot and teammates can synergize it for removal of all their debuffs

Our execute is broken, it doesnt scale correctly.. I'll give you that. Still undodgeable, unreflected.

Worst/least reliable gap closer in the game.... technically crit charge is bugged and shouldn't be letting you travel up rocks like it's does. Still only undodgeable gap closer in the game that can also proc burning light.

That dps ability is a melee ranged channel... and that's ok. It has to have some sort of drawback

Slotting prophecy is attainable by everyone by slotting magelight....magelight is one bar slot only. Our spell let's utilize major prophecy on both bars that also gives us a dot

Great our damage buff is 10% more on blocking targets. Soo instead of my hard hitting ability doing 2k vs a target that blocks, it now does 2.2k. Yipeee.....I agree it needs a buff considering there's no real downside to blocking aside from bleed builds. But remember dots do full DMG, and we can stack minor/major sorcery buffs easily and these dots drain Stam/mag of those blocking.

Ok rune is great, ill admitt that.

Templars heal is great but im not even gurateed to recieve the heal from it. Whenever i cast a heal with 2 or more people around, i have to double sometimes triple cast it. that's adrawback. It's an emergency heal; you still need another source of healing or a way to mitigate DMG to avoid spamming bol.

So yeah try again...

See above. Just because they get similar buffs or abilities, doesn't mean they are the same thing.

Solariken · October 2017

So they gut Repentance, reducing it to a crappy dog-eat-dog restore that no longer works on summoned/proc creatures...

And then the next DLC they give stamblade super-auto Repentance 2.0:

Nightblade
Assassination
Executioner: This passive ability no longer requires you to get the killing blow with an Assassination ability to trigger its resource return; it now has a 2-second grace period after damaging the enemy with an Assassination ability where it can still trigger the proc. It also now restores either Magicka or Stamina, whichever you have a higher maximum of, and restores that resource instantly instead of over 6 seconds.

Developer Comments:

This passive ability will be more useful for tanks who weren’t able to get killing blows, and stamina Nightblades who can now get stamina. It also makes the proc more reliable in multiplayer situation where multiple players attacking the enemy.

/discuss

casparian · October 2017

Solariken wrote: »

So they gut Repentance, reducing it to a crappy dog-eat-dog restore that no longer works on summoned/proc creatures...

And then the next DLC they give stamblade super-auto Repentance 2.0:
Nightblade
Assassination
Executioner: This passive ability no longer requires you to get the killing blow with an Assassination ability to trigger its resource return; it now has a 2-second grace period after damaging the enemy with an Assassination ability where it can still trigger the proc. It also now restores either Magicka or Stamina, whichever you have a higher maximum of, and restores that resource instantly instead of over 6 seconds.

Developer Comments:

This passive ability will be more useful for tanks who weren’t able to get killing blows, and stamina Nightblades who can now get stamina. It also makes the proc more reliable in multiplayer situation where multiple players attacking the enemy.

/discuss

I love the new Executioner. The logic of that dev comment is exactly the kind of logic we've been asking them to apply to Repentance for months now. Why they're willing to allow multiple nightblades per group to benefit from Executioner but only one templar per group to benefit from Repentance is beyond me.

Minno · October 2017

casparian wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

So they gut Repentance, reducing it to a crappy dog-eat-dog restore that no longer works on summoned/proc creatures...

And then the next DLC they give stamblade super-auto Repentance 2.0:
Nightblade
Assassination
Executioner: This passive ability no longer requires you to get the killing blow with an Assassination ability to trigger its resource return; it now has a 2-second grace period after damaging the enemy with an Assassination ability where it can still trigger the proc. It also now restores either Magicka or Stamina, whichever you have a higher maximum of, and restores that resource instantly instead of over 6 seconds.

Developer Comments:

This passive ability will be more useful for tanks who weren’t able to get killing blows, and stamina Nightblades who can now get stamina. It also makes the proc more reliable in multiplayer situation where multiple players attacking the enemy.

/discuss

I love the new Executioner. The logic of that dev comment is exactly the kind of logic we've been asking them to apply to Repentance for months now. Why they're willing to allow multiple nightblades per group to benefit from Executioner but only one templar per group to benefit from Repentance is beyond me.

I think we need to stop giving them ideas. They seem to be using them to buff other classes/abilities lol.

Joy_Division · October 2017

casparian wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

So they gut Repentance, reducing it to a crappy dog-eat-dog restore that no longer works on summoned/proc creatures...

And then the next DLC they give stamblade super-auto Repentance 2.0:
Nightblade
Assassination
Executioner: This passive ability no longer requires you to get the killing blow with an Assassination ability to trigger its resource return; it now has a 2-second grace period after damaging the enemy with an Assassination ability where it can still trigger the proc. It also now restores either Magicka or Stamina, whichever you have a higher maximum of, and restores that resource instantly instead of over 6 seconds.

Developer Comments:

This passive ability will be more useful for tanks who weren’t able to get killing blows, and stamina Nightblades who can now get stamina. It also makes the proc more reliable in multiplayer situation where multiple players attacking the enemy.

/discuss

I love the new Executioner. The logic of that dev comment is exactly the kind of logic we've been asking them to apply to Repentance for months now. Why they're willing to allow multiple nightblades per group to benefit from Executioner but only one templar per group to benefit from Repentance is beyond me.

Not too hard to figure out. You honestly think any combat dev mains a templar?

Soris · October 2017

It just created a mini game between templars about who will repent the bodies first.
Tension is getting higher when things are about to die. Im sure every templar making their middle finger ready to push that button to be able to repent first. I know it coz im doing it ahahaha.

Thanks ZOS! (not)

Gnortranermara · October 2017

These devs are slowly pushing me out of this game. Over the past year (plus) I've watched patch after patch buff Sorc and nerf Templar. Only ONE patch in this past year has been good to Templars. One. Since I main a Magplar, this prevents me from hitting the DPS numbers needed for the hardest endgame vet trials. I've done the Craglorn vet trials but I'm locked out of the rest by the devs' blatantly obvious Sorc master class favoritism. There's no excuse for this in an MMO that is supposed to be balanced. Of course I could just make a Sorc, and I have, but that means a total reset on Lore Book hunting, Skyshard grinding, mount training, Undaunted leveling, etc. The devs could escape criticism for this absurdly imbalanced combat performance IF AND ONLY IF fully developing a new character didn't involve a month-long grind. Account-wide CP helped, and is the only reason I haven't already quit this game. We still need more account-wide QoL improvements, such as readable lorebooks in housing and mount speed and skyshard markers on the map for those discovered on another character (for consoles without addons). As it stands, we players are forced to endure unforgivable nerf after nerf, (while watching Sorcs get buffed AGAIN, just to add insult to injury) and the only things we can do about it is embark upon a series of lengthy and boring grinds to develop a new character or quit the game altogether.

I don't know how many more patches of this non-sense I can take. I challenge the devs to make a Magplar build that can hit the same DPS numbers as a Sorc and post a video of your DPS test. Buff Templar until you can meet that challenge.

Tanis-Stormbinder · October 2017

Sadly I too and getting very disenchanted with the state of Templar's. As the months go by without and meaning full changes to Pve dps I seem to be playing less and less.

Mystrius_Archaion · October 2017

Minno wrote: »

FlamingBeard wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

@Cinbri also another thought; what happens after you break free? If it applies the DMG from the time bomb, is there enough time to block? Or does it count it right after you break free forcing the DMG to apply before another action can take place?

If they don't break free and just block, then that is a problem because templars don't have an unblockable cc like everyone else just received in this pts patch to force the DMG to go through. Of course this reduces the flexibility and the consistency of the spell, since we have to assume the best players will use an immunity pot prior to engaging further reducing the consistency of this ability.

Every other class gets a way to reduce hits taken; Ball of Lightning (Sorcerer), Dragon Fire Scale (Dragonknight), Shimmering Shield (Warden), and Shadowy Disguise (Nightblade)...

And Templar gets... a targeted, high-cost, low-effectiveness, CC breakable non-CC...

Just LOL is all I have to say.

The pain we suffer due to the ability to purge debuffs with a hot, slot a ranged class execute, mag based gap closer thats undodgeable, access to a spamable undodgeable/unreflected DPS ability that also procs extra DMG, ranged major prophecy buff with a dot, 10% extra DMG on blocking targets, a cheap rune that gives both minor protection/vitality with major armor buffs and a powerful burst heal.

Other classes also get a ranged class execute, and it does more damage. Radiant got neutered into being less than Dark Flare spam except when the enemy is below 20-15% health due to the super long cast time to do the damage, let alone the bad scaling.
Every other class may have an execute that doesn't trigger from as high, but at last they do amazing damage guaranteed at that point.

Mystrius_Archaion · October 2017

SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »

These devs are slowly pushing me out of this game. Over the past year (plus) I've watched patch after patch buff Sorc and nerf Templar. Only ONE patch in this past year has been good to Templars. One. Since I main a Magplar, this prevents me from hitting the DPS numbers needed for the hardest endgame vet trials. I've done the Craglorn vet trials but I'm locked out of the rest by the devs' blatantly obvious Sorc master class favoritism. There's no excuse for this in an MMO that is supposed to be balanced. Of course I could just make a Sorc, and I have, but that means a total reset on Lore Book hunting, Skyshard grinding, mount training, Undaunted leveling, etc. The devs could escape criticism for this absurdly imbalanced combat performance IF AND ONLY IF fully developing a new character didn't involve a month-long grind. Account-wide CP helped, and is the only reason I haven't already quit this game. We still need more account-wide QoL improvements, such as readable lorebooks in housing and mount speed and skyshard markers on the map for those discovered on another character (for consoles without addons). As it stands, we players are forced to endure unforgivable nerf after nerf, (while watching Sorcs get buffed AGAIN, just to add insult to injury) and the only things we can do about it is embark upon a series of lengthy and boring grinds to develop a new character or quit the game altogether.

I don't know how many more patches of this non-sense I can take. I challenge the devs to make a Magplar build that can hit the same DPS numbers as a Sorc and post a video of your DPS test. Buff Templar until you can meet that challenge.

The problem is that templars have way more easy self-healing than Sorcerers get. Ritual of Retribution and Puncturing Sweep is almost all you need to solo world bosses and at least normal mode dungeons.
They feel the ease of survivability compensates for lack of dps, which it mostly does because winning is all that matters. If you win by outlasting the enemy then you still win.

I'm happy I have the survivability on my templar over dps, but dps is all that matters to the elite raiders. It's not the design that is the problem there but the player mindset that has carried over from every other game they have played and still affects how group content is balanced.

Fuxo · October 2017

You know, there are stamplars too. And those have almost zero self-healing advantages in healing vs othe stam classes. And with all those sustain issues, this class is in a dire need of buffs.

Mystrius_Archaion · October 2017

Fuxo wrote: »

You know, there are stamplars too. And those have almost zero self-healing advantages in healing vs othe stam classes. And with all those sustain issues, this class is in a dire need of buffs.

I admit, I forgot. I bet the developers forget that also, or they just expect us to play how they want and use magicka skills for healing. Yeah, that has to be it.

Cinbri · October 2017

1. "resource restore over time is rough" - ESO Live 2017. And passive that restore resource over 6 sec changed to be instant with smart resource return.
Yes, it is rough, and it especially rough when it is your main spammable ability that's why Honor the Dead can get a bit of love. I offering a change to mana return to be more consistent because in harsh battle this effect will never proc even for 50% of its strength, just think about it for a sec. But ofc change too much will be OP, so I ssuggesting to change mana restore from 8 sec to 6 seconds.
Mana restore will look this way:
12%(i)+12%+12%+12%+12% - old formula
15%(i)+15%+15%+15% - new formula
As it seen upon instant spam in attempt to survive skill will get 3% more mana return, i.e. will become just 3% cheaper, not OP but appreciated buff. It will also promote more smart use: wait to get more mana returned and only than use it, i.e. use another tools to survive to get higher returns. And in such situations lets take example of 2 seconds before next cast: with current formula it will be 12+12=24% mana return, with new formula it would be 30%. 6% difference is not OP but would make morph more reliable given that Templar with such morph loosing his "oh crap" healbot capability.
As I said skill almost never proc for full strength, so morph effect in 80% situations wont proc for tooltip %, simply coz that is how battles going in PvP.
Or how about change it to even more self-sustainable morph and make return to be - restore 30% of spellcost as mana +30% as stamina. Or make it return currently drained resource over 8 sec, same as old Shards synergy.
All in all - resource return over time for this morph is even more punishing than for passive that even back in time would proc for 100% of its effect majority of time.

2. Radiant Aura cost adjustment. minor manasteal debuff was nerfed from 400 to 300 back in time, but cost of spell wasn't changed. While Drain cost zero mana and don't care about such change, Aura cost a lot and with such change effective use decreased coz spell cost - mana return profit decreased a lot. Making it 5-10% cheaper would help to maintain skill.

3. Eclipse - sadly but no fixes was made after 2 weeks for it.
1. It still ignore CC checks making your char spam it on immune target. (and when it is like 3 targets it become nightmare)
2. It still apply CC immunity after expire - it is soft CC, soft CCs don't apply immunity to itself after expire, only way to get immunity is active counter to it. Eclipse no longer is unbreakable reflect, so why this mechanic still kept for it? Nowdays people an afford to not pressing enemy for 5 sec just to get CC Immunity after..
Beter example?, Ok: Soft CCs, i.e. roots does punish your mobility while you have to use stamina to roll-dodge and get Root Immunity; Eclipse doesn't punish your mobility but apply debuff so you have to use CC break to get CC Immunity.
Without those fixes Eclipse wont be strong enough to be slotted sadly.
3. Unstable Core - damage buff is nice, but as was mentioned - it proc on CC breaks and this mechanic means press block+bash, so as result every (majority, since there is way to apply unblockable one but in cost of applying preemptive CCs) solar bomb will be blocked, and with block capabilities nowdays it is more than 50% damage reduction to it.

You have to make it unblockable. It is feature of this morph. Why would anyone use it when morph effect will be so tiny that no one even notice it, while Total Dark can be proced couple times before opponent react and grant a lot of survivability by healing procs. And since you pushing it in same category as new Petrify - being useless on CC immune enemies but strong CC itself, it would be fait to have such effect.

4. Nova need some serous changes, at least one morph for pvp. Like reduce its cost to 200(no one will use 240 ult which you can counter just by making 2 steps away), instead of snare make it apply unblockable knockdown in impact, remove knockdown from synergy. It means ult will be solo friendly and instead of hoping that there will be someone to activate synergy for CC you can drop nova to achieve it, while synergy will still have its damage. DKs got both of their Standart morphs to be amazing (while new Shifting even better than Might), while Nova is kept be useless for everything except vTrials no-death farms.

5. CP bugs - the worst class bugs, it should be first priority fix. And we cant ignore it anymore since there will be no no-CP bgs. Reported it in bug section but will duplicate here:
1. Sweeps - doesn't count as direct damage but as dot, so it buffed by Elem Expert and Thaumaturge. But than why does Ironclad count is as direct attack and does reduce damage from enemy sweeps in addition to Thickskinned and Elem Defender? Instead of fix Ironclad just make Sweeps to be threated as direct damage, it will help a lot to Templar dps, especially in pve.
2. Shards - despite being direct attack they not buffed by Master-at-Arms CP, however tooltip is increasing, but Ironclad once again count it as direct damage and decrease damage from direct attack. While ranged morph of Impusle works fine with both CP... Another "bug" is that this direct attack from Shards does counted as dot and can be buffed by Thaumaturge, and same way debuffed by Thickskinned CP. Keep dot scaling maybe but fix direct damage of it. Same as goes with Sweeps, both of skilled that can be duble buffed by your CP can be triple debuffed by enemy CP... Those bugs punish non-healers in pvp even more.

@Joy_Division how bout such post editing? I tried my best.
@ZOS_Wrobel

technohic · October 2017

I actually like our resource recovery in channeled focus for magicka but restoring aura cost too much so I use ele drain which also gives a debuff on the target and it's free.

They should reduce the cost on restoring aura and if they don't want Templars to repent the same body , it should just get changed into a stam steal for that aspect.

WeyounTM · October 2017

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

The problem is that templars have way more easy self-healing than Sorcerers get. Ritual of Retribution and Puncturing Sweep is almost all you need to solo world bosses and at least normal mode dungeons.

While both templar abilities have their upsides, they still are nowhere near close to what a Sorc can get away with. You only need to cast power surge and you will get a nice and juicy heal whenever you crit. And you can get that heal with any damage that actually crits...at a long range too. With Sweeps you always need to be near your target and are locked into a channel, while a Sorc can cast all kinds of abilities from a safe distance.
I am by no means a good player, maybe mediocre....but it was much easier for me to complete vMA with my sorc compared to my Templar.

Joy_Division · October 2017

@Cinbri - Your post is very well formatted, easy to follow along, and I agree with all your points.

Minno · October 2017

@Cinbri thank you for testing if it UC works on block!!!

I agree with all your points.

Minno · October 2017

Question, @Cinbri , @Joy_Division and everyone else:
- what do we do with total dark? I know Cinbri mentioned it's in a good spot, but I can't but feel it still needs some love.
- should total dark get a similar treatment as UC? Except with a different effect that's delayed? What about a strong HoT?

I feel like our talk on UC has overshadowed TD to the point where they may have missed our feedback on it.

Solariken · October 2017

casparian wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

So they gut Repentance, reducing it to a crappy dog-eat-dog restore that no longer works on summoned/proc creatures...

And then the next DLC they give stamblade super-auto Repentance 2.0:
Nightblade
Assassination
Executioner: This passive ability no longer requires you to get the killing blow with an Assassination ability to trigger its resource return; it now has a 2-second grace period after damaging the enemy with an Assassination ability where it can still trigger the proc. It also now restores either Magicka or Stamina, whichever you have a higher maximum of, and restores that resource instantly instead of over 6 seconds.

Developer Comments:

This passive ability will be more useful for tanks who weren’t able to get killing blows, and stamina Nightblades who can now get stamina. It also makes the proc more reliable in multiplayer situation where multiple players attacking the enemy.

/discuss

I love the new Executioner. The logic of that dev comment is exactly the kind of logic we've been asking them to apply to Repentance for months now. Why they're willing to allow multiple nightblades per group to benefit from Executioner but only one templar per group to benefit from Repentance is beyond me.

I know, when I play my stamblade I'll be loving it too. I'm just pretty upset that they literally JUST neutered one of the Templar hallmark abilities and then in the very next stroke give the same type of mechanic to another class but WAY BETTER.

It's like when they took one of the targeted heals from Breath of Life and in the same patch gave extra targets to Sorc Matriarch.

These clowns man...

Joy_Division · October 2017

Minno wrote: »

Question, @Cinbri , @Joy_Division and everyone else:
- what do we do with total dark? I know Cinbri mentioned it's in a good spot, but I can't but feel it still needs some love.
- should total dark get a similar treatment as UC? Except with a different effect that's delayed? What about a strong HoT?

I feel like our talk on UC has overshadowed TD to the point where they may have missed our feedback on it.

I think Unstable Core has potential, though Cinbri's explanation of how easy it is to mitigate undermines it too much. Total Dark is entirely dependent on the target's cooperation to take any damage and that is something even unthinking NPCs manage to avoid so I cannot see why a Templar would use that morph in any content or instance the game has to offer.

Someone earlier in the thread unfavorably contrasted Eclipse with other class specific skills meant to defend them and I thought is was insightful. All the other class skills defend against every enemy and Eclipse only does against one ... maybe. Such a specialized ability by nature needs to be noticeably stronger than more versatile and generalized counterparts and Eclipse isn't.