PTS Update 16 - Feedback Thread for Templar

technohic

Minno wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

The new version of Total Dark is awesome! So I must give credit to the Devs. A big thank you. I liked the previous version, but I must say that I'm having a blast with the newer version, more than I thought I would. Cheers.

It returned to be top pvp templar skill in U16, as was promised. Melee and stamina builds still think they can ignore and laugh at this black bubble. And price of their ignorance is costing them much... It still need small improvements that hopefully will made in U17.
But again I witness same situation as it was pre-IC: despite this skill is strongest in templar arsenal only minority of Templars use it, once again. And I didn't saw a single Templar using Unstable Core yet.

P.S.: PTS ended some week ago, no one monitoring this section, so don't bother posting here people. Better post in Combat section.

I started with UC, but the heals are much preferable with Total Dark. Lets you stay on the offensive without having to cast a heal. But it's the same experience. I think I've seen one Templar use it against me. And I seem to be the only one using it. And I"m using it non-stop on nearly every player I can Even when someone is attacking my teammate, I can cast it on them, protect my friend, damage the enemy....and then they are on the defensive.

I guess I'm okay with others not using it. It's unfortunate, but their loss. But if more ever do, I expect a thread to pop up from other classes claiming how OP it is

I had someone cast it on my Stamplar and took me a minute to remember it’s not just projectiles any more. Seems like I couldn’t just break free so I used extended. Thought it was still break free able?

I might try it for a while as long as people still don’t get that it’s changed. Haven’t decided which morph yet. Like the idea of going offensive and getting heals but if I hard CC them with toppling while up, I get no heals while UC will still do damage

Pick UC. While you get no heals, you get two different morphs in one with UC. It deals delayed DMG and gives you the chance to do thorns DMG helping you turn the tide in battle. Trick with UC is to keep pressure up, don't let them run away. Use the thorn DMG right when your enemy starts their first ability in their combo, if they are good players they will be using animation cancelling combos so they will take 12k DMG in 3 hits all while you hold block.

That's what makes UC sexy this patch. It's a defensive spell with a small delayed burst that let's the temps decide how the battle will go towards. Last patch, if someone started their AC combo, we almost certainly were going to be on the defensive till we got a valkyn proc to help start our offensive. Now it's different.

Ran it a few days, but I just really dislike magplar hard CC options. And after looking at Cowards in a magplar just decided it was too much fun on my Stamplar. UC and purifying light give some nice burst; but it just didn’t feel as strong without a good stun to set it up

Joy_Division

I'm not sure Wrobel or ZoS is paying attention to this forum.

Since it's been mentioned though, I would say less than 5% of the people I use Unstable Core (even the good players) are actually CC breaking it. This makes the skill (and the Total Dark morph) quite good.

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Minno

Joy_Division wrote: »

I'm not sure Wrobel or ZoS is paying attention to this forum.

Since it's been mentioned though, I would say less than 5% of the people I use Unstable Core (even the good players) are actually CC breaking it. This makes the skill (and the Total Dark morph) quite good.

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Total dark is screwed if people learn to cc break early. They really need to buff it.

At least UC applies it's DMG after cc break. And there are certain skills in the game that will cause the redirect DMG without the target knowing (jabs procing burning light, Sorc pets+curse+mines+implosion+blot escape, warden scorch+birds etc).

But yes it locks you out of following up with a hard cc, but I see a very solid use with UC, with or without player knowledge. For example:
- if the player refused to break free, they will take the unblocked DMG at the end which then gets added to your purfying light burst but they cannot attack which let's you pressure hard.
-if the player does break free early they waste stamina and still take DMG creating a condition where you just wasted their resorce and helped fill up puryfing light burst. You can follow up with a delayed UC burst that doesn't impact the cc immunity timer letting you follow up with another burst-delaying crowd control after the timer resets.
- and the best use, target begins their rotation, in which you apply UC as a "saving throw". Target doesn't react enough, taking 3 hits of attacks equal to around 15k DMG in the time it took for them to animation cancel everything while you block their burst instead.

So while some enemies can break free reducing the redirect portion, it still provides the only punishing spell directed at animation cancelling friendly combos in the entire game. And the unblockable DMG punishes block tanks, who now do 10% extra DMG if they are caught holding block which then filters into puryfing light which then adds another unblocked burst.

And I need to test the following:
- does UC redirect cause certain status effects to reflect against the enemy (Sorc implosion causing execute DMG to them)
- does the duration reset if you cast UC when they don't have the CC immunity, further causing them to staying the redirect bubble?

LordSlif

Cast time for empower... they are kidding me

Cinbri

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

The new version of Total Dark is awesome! So I must give credit to the Devs. A big thank you. I liked the previous version, but I must say that I'm having a blast with the newer version, more than I thought I would. Cheers.

It returned to be top pvp templar skill in U16, as was promised. Melee and stamina builds still think they can ignore and laugh at this black bubble. And price of their ignorance is costing them much... It still need small improvements that hopefully will made in U17.
But again I witness same situation as it was pre-IC: despite this skill is strongest in templar arsenal only minority of Templars use it, once again. And I didn't saw a single Templar using Unstable Core yet.

P.S.: PTS ended some week ago, no one monitoring this section, so don't bother posting here people. Better post in Combat section.

I started with UC, but the heals are much preferable with Total Dark. Lets you stay on the offensive without having to cast a heal. But it's the same experience. I think I've seen one Templar use it against me. And I seem to be the only one using it. And I"m using it non-stop on nearly every player I can Even when someone is attacking my teammate, I can cast it on them, protect my friend, damage the enemy....and then they are on the defensive.

I guess I'm okay with others not using it. It's unfortunate, but their loss. But if more ever do, I expect a thread to pop up from other classes claiming how OP it is

I had someone cast it on my Stamplar and took me a minute to remember it’s not just projectiles any more. Seems like I couldn’t just break free so I used extended. Thought it was still break free able?

I might try it for a while as long as people still don’t get that it’s changed. Haven’t decided which morph yet. Like the idea of going offensive and getting heals but if I hard CC them with toppling while up, I get no heals while UC will still do damage

Should be break freeable. But you can still stun them before it expires, too. Natural reaction is to break free when stunnned. So if they don't break free from the Eclipse, then dmg them a bit before stunning them.

Tbh works only against not very exp players. Eclipse is huge globe. And debuff tracks... Poisons aren't very bright to see but I learned to purge them immediately. Matter of practice

You know, people say that. "It doesn't work against experienced players" But I've used it against almost anyone, causing them dmg and healing myself. But I'll not get in a debate about eclipse again. I popped in here to thank the devs. That is all.

See your point. Total Dark is actually better than it was, but I can't thank devs for it, coz too many idiotic things are still in Templar's arsenal. I'll share your satisfaction when they upgrade Aedric ult, Healing ritual and solar barrage at last.

Minno wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

I'm not sure Wrobel or ZoS is paying attention to this forum.

Since it's been mentioned though, I would say less than 5% of the people I use Unstable Core (even the good players) are actually CC breaking it. This makes the skill (and the Total Dark morph) quite good.

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Total dark is screwed if people learn to cc break early. They really need to buff it.

At least UC applies it's DMG after cc break. And there are certain skills in the game that will cause the redirect DMG without the target knowing (jabs procing burning light, Sorc pets+curse+mines+implosion+blot escape, warden scorch+birds etc).

But yes it locks you out of following up with a hard cc, but I see a very solid use with UC, with or without player knowledge. For example:
- if the player refused to break free, they will take the unblocked DMG at the end which then gets added to your purfying light burst but they cannot attack which let's you pressure hard.
-if the player does break free early they waste stamina and still take DMG creating a condition where you just wasted their resorce and helped fill up puryfing light burst. You can follow up with a delayed UC burst that doesn't impact the cc immunity timer letting you follow up with another burst-delaying crowd control after the timer resets.
- and the best use, target begins their rotation, in which you apply UC as a "saving throw". Target doesn't react enough, taking 3 hits of attacks equal to around 15k DMG in the time it took for them to animation cancel everything while you block their burst instead.

So while some enemies can break free reducing the redirect portion, it still provides the only punishing spell directed at animation cancelling friendly combos in the entire game. And the unblockable DMG punishes block tanks, who now do 10% extra DMG if they are caught holding block which then filters into puryfing light which then adds another unblocked burst.

And I need to test the following:
- does UC redirect cause certain status effects to reflect against the enemy (Sorc implosion causing execute DMG to them)
- does the duration reset if you cast UC when they don't have the CC immunity, further causing them to staying the redirect bubble?

There is a trick with bubble - if enemy don't break it you can reapply 2nd bubble on him at end of duration of first. It will immediately grant him CC immunity but bubble will stay and make bubble overall 10sec.
That what happens when mechanics treated inconsistently.

Minno

Cinbri wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

The new version of Total Dark is awesome! So I must give credit to the Devs. A big thank you. I liked the previous version, but I must say that I'm having a blast with the newer version, more than I thought I would. Cheers.

It returned to be top pvp templar skill in U16, as was promised. Melee and stamina builds still think they can ignore and laugh at this black bubble. And price of their ignorance is costing them much... It still need small improvements that hopefully will made in U17.
But again I witness same situation as it was pre-IC: despite this skill is strongest in templar arsenal only minority of Templars use it, once again. And I didn't saw a single Templar using Unstable Core yet.

P.S.: PTS ended some week ago, no one monitoring this section, so don't bother posting here people. Better post in Combat section.

I started with UC, but the heals are much preferable with Total Dark. Lets you stay on the offensive without having to cast a heal. But it's the same experience. I think I've seen one Templar use it against me. And I seem to be the only one using it. And I"m using it non-stop on nearly every player I can Even when someone is attacking my teammate, I can cast it on them, protect my friend, damage the enemy....and then they are on the defensive.

I guess I'm okay with others not using it. It's unfortunate, but their loss. But if more ever do, I expect a thread to pop up from other classes claiming how OP it is

I had someone cast it on my Stamplar and took me a minute to remember it’s not just projectiles any more. Seems like I couldn’t just break free so I used extended. Thought it was still break free able?

I might try it for a while as long as people still don’t get that it’s changed. Haven’t decided which morph yet. Like the idea of going offensive and getting heals but if I hard CC them with toppling while up, I get no heals while UC will still do damage

Should be break freeable. But you can still stun them before it expires, too. Natural reaction is to break free when stunnned. So if they don't break free from the Eclipse, then dmg them a bit before stunning them.

Tbh works only against not very exp players. Eclipse is huge globe. And debuff tracks... Poisons aren't very bright to see but I learned to purge them immediately. Matter of practice

You know, people say that. "It doesn't work against experienced players" But I've used it against almost anyone, causing them dmg and healing myself. But I'll not get in a debate about eclipse again. I popped in here to thank the devs. That is all.

See your point. Total Dark is actually better than it was, but I can't thank devs for it, coz too many idiotic things are still in Templar's arsenal. I'll share your satisfaction when they upgrade Aedric ult, Healing ritual and solar barrage at last.

Minno wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

I'm not sure Wrobel or ZoS is paying attention to this forum.

Since it's been mentioned though, I would say less than 5% of the people I use Unstable Core (even the good players) are actually CC breaking it. This makes the skill (and the Total Dark morph) quite good.

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Total dark is screwed if people learn to cc break early. They really need to buff it.

At least UC applies it's DMG after cc break. And there are certain skills in the game that will cause the redirect DMG without the target knowing (jabs procing burning light, Sorc pets+curse+mines+implosion+blot escape, warden scorch+birds etc).

But yes it locks you out of following up with a hard cc, but I see a very solid use with UC, with or without player knowledge. For example:
- if the player refused to break free, they will take the unblocked DMG at the end which then gets added to your purfying light burst but they cannot attack which let's you pressure hard.
-if the player does break free early they waste stamina and still take DMG creating a condition where you just wasted their resorce and helped fill up puryfing light burst. You can follow up with a delayed UC burst that doesn't impact the cc immunity timer letting you follow up with another burst-delaying crowd control after the timer resets.
- and the best use, target begins their rotation, in which you apply UC as a "saving throw". Target doesn't react enough, taking 3 hits of attacks equal to around 15k DMG in the time it took for them to animation cancel everything while you block their burst instead.

So while some enemies can break free reducing the redirect portion, it still provides the only punishing spell directed at animation cancelling friendly combos in the entire game. And the unblockable DMG punishes block tanks, who now do 10% extra DMG if they are caught holding block which then filters into puryfing light which then adds another unblocked burst.

And I need to test the following:
- does UC redirect cause certain status effects to reflect against the enemy (Sorc implosion causing execute DMG to them)
- does the duration reset if you cast UC when they don't have the CC immunity, further causing them to staying the redirect bubble?

There is a trick with bubble - if enemy don't break it you can reapply 2nd bubble on him at end of duration of first. It will immediately grant him CC immunity but bubble will stay and make bubble overall 10sec.
That what happens when mechanics treated inconsistently.

Ok I thought I was going crazy when I recast it on a player but the bubble stayed.

Lol this is a buff.

maxjapank

Joy_Division wrote: »

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Right now, you are right that many don't know to cc break Total Dark. But I have seen a few players adapt and cc break right away. Thing is that even these "better" players can deal 7-10k dmg to themselves before they realize it is on them. I've used it many times not just to protect myself, but when they are charging into my teammates. They are so caught up in the moment going for a kill, and now their health is half gone. I'm not too worried about them cc breaking either. If they do, it still takes pressure off of me or my teammate. It puts a hiccup in their burst.

Perhaps in dueling, Total dark will be less effective. I mostly play in size from 5-16, usually around 8-10.

Cinbri

maxjapank wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Right now, you are right that many don't know to cc break Total Dark. But I have seen a few players adapt and cc break right away. Thing is that even these "better" players can deal 7-10k dmg to themselves before they realize it is on them. I've used it many times not just to protect myself, but when they are charging into my teammates. They are so caught up in the moment going for a kill, and now their health is half gone. I'm not too worried about them cc breaking either. If they do, it still takes pressure off of me or my teammate. It puts a hiccup in their burst.

Perhaps in dueling, Total dark will be less effective. I mostly play in size from 5-16, usually around 8-10.

In duels it even stronger because noone will cc your opponent. As I said my main cc was toppling charge but i removed it for total dark and as result - it is cc that disabling enemy burst and transform it into your own burst, and even when enemy cc break - it still deal more damage than any other cc and becoming unblockable and undodgeable stamina drainer, i.e. CC that actually works. Some people stop attacks waiting till it expire but at least it means you have 5sec of safe time that you can invest into even more offense. Stamblades or any other build that made on high burst now completely countered by Total Dark, thats why this morph even stronger than Core and dont need further buffs.
Some dks even stoped using their razor armor and switched to Chudan because it makes eclipse as a complete bain for tham - every time their armor return melee damage it proc eclipse and as result even if they just hold block it not stop from proc eclipse on cooldown.

Minno wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

The new version of Total Dark is awesome! So I must give credit to the Devs. A big thank you. I liked the previous version, but I must say that I'm having a blast with the newer version, more than I thought I would. Cheers.

It returned to be top pvp templar skill in U16, as was promised. Melee and stamina builds still think they can ignore and laugh at this black bubble. And price of their ignorance is costing them much... It still need small improvements that hopefully will made in U17.
But again I witness same situation as it was pre-IC: despite this skill is strongest in templar arsenal only minority of Templars use it, once again. And I didn't saw a single Templar using Unstable Core yet.

P.S.: PTS ended some week ago, no one monitoring this section, so don't bother posting here people. Better post in Combat section.

I started with UC, but the heals are much preferable with Total Dark. Lets you stay on the offensive without having to cast a heal. But it's the same experience. I think I've seen one Templar use it against me. And I seem to be the only one using it. And I"m using it non-stop on nearly every player I can Even when someone is attacking my teammate, I can cast it on them, protect my friend, damage the enemy....and then they are on the defensive.

I guess I'm okay with others not using it. It's unfortunate, but their loss. But if more ever do, I expect a thread to pop up from other classes claiming how OP it is

I had someone cast it on my Stamplar and took me a minute to remember it’s not just projectiles any more. Seems like I couldn’t just break free so I used extended. Thought it was still break free able?

I might try it for a while as long as people still don’t get that it’s changed. Haven’t decided which morph yet. Like the idea of going offensive and getting heals but if I hard CC them with toppling while up, I get no heals while UC will still do damage

Should be break freeable. But you can still stun them before it expires, too. Natural reaction is to break free when stunnned. So if they don't break free from the Eclipse, then dmg them a bit before stunning them.

Tbh works only against not very exp players. Eclipse is huge globe. And debuff tracks... Poisons aren't very bright to see but I learned to purge them immediately. Matter of practice

You know, people say that. "It doesn't work against experienced players" But I've used it against almost anyone, causing them dmg and healing myself. But I'll not get in a debate about eclipse again. I popped in here to thank the devs. That is all.

See your point. Total Dark is actually better than it was, but I can't thank devs for it, coz too many idiotic things are still in Templar's arsenal. I'll share your satisfaction when they upgrade Aedric ult, Healing ritual and solar barrage at last.

maxjapank

@Cinbri Well, that's good to know about duels. Thanks. I've been debating about moving from Toppling to Explosive. I'll play around with it. I still like the fact that I can use Total Dark, cause dmg to the enemy, and still stun them with Toppling before they break free. Right now, many don't know to break free from Eclipse. And I noticed that if I stunned them with Toppling before it expired, they would automatically break free from the stun cause that is natural reaction. Thus breaking free from Eclipse, too. So I've been holding off. Getting the most of Total Dark. And stun them before it expires.

As more an more learn to break free, I'll likely move over to Explosive. I used to use Explosive when everyone was using Toppling. I liked that I could hit people who dodged, and even NBs when they tried to cloak. Aoe dmg is welcome in group play, too. But I'll hold off a bit longer.

maxjapank

@Minno Does the new Innate Axion set also apply spell dmg to Burning light? Noticed you were using that in your other thread.

Minno

maxjapank wrote: »

@Minno Does the new Innate Axion set also apply spell dmg to Burning light? Noticed you were using that in your other thread.

No idea. I don't have combat metrics to test.

Minno

Cinbri wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Right now, you are right that many don't know to cc break Total Dark. But I have seen a few players adapt and cc break right away. Thing is that even these "better" players can deal 7-10k dmg to themselves before they realize it is on them. I've used it many times not just to protect myself, but when they are charging into my teammates. They are so caught up in the moment going for a kill, and now their health is half gone. I'm not too worried about them cc breaking either. If they do, it still takes pressure off of me or my teammate. It puts a hiccup in their burst.

Perhaps in dueling, Total dark will be less effective. I mostly play in size from 5-16, usually around 8-10.

In duels it even stronger because noone will cc your opponent. As I said my main cc was toppling charge but i removed it for total dark and as result - it is cc that disabling enemy burst and transform it into your own burst, and even when enemy cc break - it still deal more damage than any other cc and becoming unblockable and undodgeable stamina drainer, i.e. CC that actually works. Some people stop attacks waiting till it expire but at least it means you have 5sec of safe time that you can invest into even more offense. Stamblades or any other build that made on high burst now completely countered by Total Dark, thats why this morph even stronger than Core and dont need further buffs.
Some dks even stoped using their razor armor and switched to Chudan because it makes eclipse as a complete bain for tham - every time their armor return melee damage it proc eclipse and as result even if they just hold block it not stop from proc eclipse on cooldown.

Minno wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

The new version of Total Dark is awesome! So I must give credit to the Devs. A big thank you. I liked the previous version, but I must say that I'm having a blast with the newer version, more than I thought I would. Cheers.

It returned to be top pvp templar skill in U16, as was promised. Melee and stamina builds still think they can ignore and laugh at this black bubble. And price of their ignorance is costing them much... It still need small improvements that hopefully will made in U17.
But again I witness same situation as it was pre-IC: despite this skill is strongest in templar arsenal only minority of Templars use it, once again. And I didn't saw a single Templar using Unstable Core yet.

P.S.: PTS ended some week ago, no one monitoring this section, so don't bother posting here people. Better post in Combat section.

I started with UC, but the heals are much preferable with Total Dark. Lets you stay on the offensive without having to cast a heal. But it's the same experience. I think I've seen one Templar use it against me. And I seem to be the only one using it. And I"m using it non-stop on nearly every player I can Even when someone is attacking my teammate, I can cast it on them, protect my friend, damage the enemy....and then they are on the defensive.

I guess I'm okay with others not using it. It's unfortunate, but their loss. But if more ever do, I expect a thread to pop up from other classes claiming how OP it is

I had someone cast it on my Stamplar and took me a minute to remember it’s not just projectiles any more. Seems like I couldn’t just break free so I used extended. Thought it was still break free able?

I might try it for a while as long as people still don’t get that it’s changed. Haven’t decided which morph yet. Like the idea of going offensive and getting heals but if I hard CC them with toppling while up, I get no heals while UC will still do damage

Should be break freeable. But you can still stun them before it expires, too. Natural reaction is to break free when stunnned. So if they don't break free from the Eclipse, then dmg them a bit before stunning them.

Tbh works only against not very exp players. Eclipse is huge globe. And debuff tracks... Poisons aren't very bright to see but I learned to purge them immediately. Matter of practice

You know, people say that. "It doesn't work against experienced players" But I've used it against almost anyone, causing them dmg and healing myself. But I'll not get in a debate about eclipse again. I popped in here to thank the devs. That is all.

See your point. Total Dark is actually better than it was, but I can't thank devs for it, coz too many idiotic things are still in Templar's arsenal. I'll share your satisfaction when they upgrade Aedric ult, Healing ritual and solar barrage at last.

Minno wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

I'm not sure Wrobel or ZoS is paying attention to this forum.

Since it's been mentioned though, I would say less than 5% of the people I use Unstable Core (even the good players) are actually CC breaking it. This makes the skill (and the Total Dark morph) quite good.

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Total dark is screwed if people learn to cc break early. They really need to buff it.

At least UC applies it's DMG after cc break. And there are certain skills in the game that will cause the redirect DMG without the target knowing (jabs procing burning light, Sorc pets+curse+mines+implosion+blot escape, warden scorch+birds etc).

But yes it locks you out of following up with a hard cc, but I see a very solid use with UC, with or without player knowledge. For example:
- if the player refused to break free, they will take the unblocked DMG at the end which then gets added to your purfying light burst but they cannot attack which let's you pressure hard.
-if the player does break free early they waste stamina and still take DMG creating a condition where you just wasted their resorce and helped fill up puryfing light burst. You can follow up with a delayed UC burst that doesn't impact the cc immunity timer letting you follow up with another burst-delaying crowd control after the timer resets.
- and the best use, target begins their rotation, in which you apply UC as a "saving throw". Target doesn't react enough, taking 3 hits of attacks equal to around 15k DMG in the time it took for them to animation cancel everything while you block their burst instead.

So while some enemies can break free reducing the redirect portion, it still provides the only punishing spell directed at animation cancelling friendly combos in the entire game. And the unblockable DMG punishes block tanks, who now do 10% extra DMG if they are caught holding block which then filters into puryfing light which then adds another unblocked burst.

And I need to test the following:
- does UC redirect cause certain status effects to reflect against the enemy (Sorc implosion causing execute DMG to them)
- does the duration reset if you cast UC when they don't have the CC immunity, further causing them to staying the redirect bubble?

There is a trick with bubble - if enemy don't break it you can reapply 2nd bubble on him at end of duration of first. It will immediately grant him CC immunity but bubble will stay and make bubble overall 10sec.
That what happens when mechanics treated inconsistently.

Ok I thought I was going crazy when I recast it on a player but the bubble stayed.

Lol this is a buff.

Best thing is that while bubble keep staying for 5sec, enemy cc immunity is already counting, it means 2sec after your bubble will expire you can already recast it, literally force enemy to drain stamina on CC break or be locked down in bubble.

I have a feeling it's also redirecting Sorc implosion. The build editor says implosion is buffed by direct DMG increases and in one of my videos I saw the Sorc take execute DMG after his mages fury disappeared from my toon.

Can you test if eclipse is also redirecting direct DMG passives? Like burning light, CP reposte passive, etc.

Also does the redirect DMG also count pet attacks?

Cinbri

Minno wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Right now, you are right that many don't know to cc break Total Dark. But I have seen a few players adapt and cc break right away. Thing is that even these "better" players can deal 7-10k dmg to themselves before they realize it is on them. I've used it many times not just to protect myself, but when they are charging into my teammates. They are so caught up in the moment going for a kill, and now their health is half gone. I'm not too worried about them cc breaking either. If they do, it still takes pressure off of me or my teammate. It puts a hiccup in their burst.

Perhaps in dueling, Total dark will be less effective. I mostly play in size from 5-16, usually around 8-10.

In duels it even stronger because noone will cc your opponent. As I said my main cc was toppling charge but i removed it for total dark and as result - it is cc that disabling enemy burst and transform it into your own burst, and even when enemy cc break - it still deal more damage than any other cc and becoming unblockable and undodgeable stamina drainer, i.e. CC that actually works. Some people stop attacks waiting till it expire but at least it means you have 5sec of safe time that you can invest into even more offense. Stamblades or any other build that made on high burst now completely countered by Total Dark, thats why this morph even stronger than Core and dont need further buffs.
Some dks even stoped using their razor armor and switched to Chudan because it makes eclipse as a complete bain for tham - every time their armor return melee damage it proc eclipse and as result even if they just hold block it not stop from proc eclipse on cooldown.

Minno wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

The new version of Total Dark is awesome! So I must give credit to the Devs. A big thank you. I liked the previous version, but I must say that I'm having a blast with the newer version, more than I thought I would. Cheers.

It returned to be top pvp templar skill in U16, as was promised. Melee and stamina builds still think they can ignore and laugh at this black bubble. And price of their ignorance is costing them much... It still need small improvements that hopefully will made in U17.
But again I witness same situation as it was pre-IC: despite this skill is strongest in templar arsenal only minority of Templars use it, once again. And I didn't saw a single Templar using Unstable Core yet.

P.S.: PTS ended some week ago, no one monitoring this section, so don't bother posting here people. Better post in Combat section.

I started with UC, but the heals are much preferable with Total Dark. Lets you stay on the offensive without having to cast a heal. But it's the same experience. I think I've seen one Templar use it against me. And I seem to be the only one using it. And I"m using it non-stop on nearly every player I can Even when someone is attacking my teammate, I can cast it on them, protect my friend, damage the enemy....and then they are on the defensive.

I guess I'm okay with others not using it. It's unfortunate, but their loss. But if more ever do, I expect a thread to pop up from other classes claiming how OP it is

I had someone cast it on my Stamplar and took me a minute to remember it’s not just projectiles any more. Seems like I couldn’t just break free so I used extended. Thought it was still break free able?

I might try it for a while as long as people still don’t get that it’s changed. Haven’t decided which morph yet. Like the idea of going offensive and getting heals but if I hard CC them with toppling while up, I get no heals while UC will still do damage

Should be break freeable. But you can still stun them before it expires, too. Natural reaction is to break free when stunnned. So if they don't break free from the Eclipse, then dmg them a bit before stunning them.

Tbh works only against not very exp players. Eclipse is huge globe. And debuff tracks... Poisons aren't very bright to see but I learned to purge them immediately. Matter of practice

You know, people say that. "It doesn't work against experienced players" But I've used it against almost anyone, causing them dmg and healing myself. But I'll not get in a debate about eclipse again. I popped in here to thank the devs. That is all.

See your point. Total Dark is actually better than it was, but I can't thank devs for it, coz too many idiotic things are still in Templar's arsenal. I'll share your satisfaction when they upgrade Aedric ult, Healing ritual and solar barrage at last.

Minno wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

I'm not sure Wrobel or ZoS is paying attention to this forum.

Since it's been mentioned though, I would say less than 5% of the people I use Unstable Core (even the good players) are actually CC breaking it. This makes the skill (and the Total Dark morph) quite good.

If people learn to CC break it, it's value (especially Total Dark) will go down by quite a bit.

Total dark is screwed if people learn to cc break early. They really need to buff it.

At least UC applies it's DMG after cc break. And there are certain skills in the game that will cause the redirect DMG without the target knowing (jabs procing burning light, Sorc pets+curse+mines+implosion+blot escape, warden scorch+birds etc).

But yes it locks you out of following up with a hard cc, but I see a very solid use with UC, with or without player knowledge. For example:
- if the player refused to break free, they will take the unblocked DMG at the end which then gets added to your purfying light burst but they cannot attack which let's you pressure hard.
-if the player does break free early they waste stamina and still take DMG creating a condition where you just wasted their resorce and helped fill up puryfing light burst. You can follow up with a delayed UC burst that doesn't impact the cc immunity timer letting you follow up with another burst-delaying crowd control after the timer resets.
- and the best use, target begins their rotation, in which you apply UC as a "saving throw". Target doesn't react enough, taking 3 hits of attacks equal to around 15k DMG in the time it took for them to animation cancel everything while you block their burst instead.

So while some enemies can break free reducing the redirect portion, it still provides the only punishing spell directed at animation cancelling friendly combos in the entire game. And the unblockable DMG punishes block tanks, who now do 10% extra DMG if they are caught holding block which then filters into puryfing light which then adds another unblocked burst.

And I need to test the following:
- does UC redirect cause certain status effects to reflect against the enemy (Sorc implosion causing execute DMG to them)
- does the duration reset if you cast UC when they don't have the CC immunity, further causing them to staying the redirect bubble?

There is a trick with bubble - if enemy don't break it you can reapply 2nd bubble on him at end of duration of first. It will immediately grant him CC immunity but bubble will stay and make bubble overall 10sec.
That what happens when mechanics treated inconsistently.

Ok I thought I was going crazy when I recast it on a player but the bubble stayed.

Lol this is a buff.

Best thing is that while bubble keep staying for 5sec, enemy cc immunity is already counting, it means 2sec after your bubble will expire you can already recast it, literally force enemy to drain stamina on CC break or be locked down in bubble.

I have a feeling it's also redirecting Sorc implosion. The build editor says implosion is buffed by direct DMG increases and in one of my videos I saw the Sorc take execute DMG after his mages fury disappeared from my toon.

Can you test if eclipse is also redirecting direct DMG passives? Like burning light, CP reposte passive, etc.

Also does the redirect DMG also count pet attacks?

Well, I tried Riposte. And it didn't reflected beside by hitting me it proc damage from bubble.

technohic

So I am running magplar again and giving UC a fair shot and it’s actually pretty good. With animation canceling; you catch even knowing people with a few hits. I like to hit UC , POTL, then shock reach to ensure no purge of POTL burst. Nuked some NB with a staff that was trying to range us from the top of Nickel last night He was weaving siphon and going for the bow proc. He broke reach fast and backed out of Los but POTL got him

Minno

technohic wrote: »

So I am running magplar again and giving UC a fair shot and it’s actually pretty good. With animation canceling; you catch even knowing people with a few hits. I like to hit UC , POTL, then shock reach to ensure no purge of POTL burst. Nuked some NB with a staff that was trying to range us from the top of Nickel last night He was weaving siphon and going for the bow proc. He broke reach fast and backed out of Los but POTL got him

It's even more fun if you catch a Sorc with it lol.
https://youtu.be/ZSRqw7w09zo

technohic

Minno wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

So I am running magplar again and giving UC a fair shot and it’s actually pretty good. With animation canceling; you catch even knowing people with a few hits. I like to hit UC , POTL, then shock reach to ensure no purge of POTL burst. Nuked some NB with a staff that was trying to range us from the top of Nickel last night He was weaving siphon and going for the bow proc. He broke reach fast and backed out of Los but POTL got him

It's even more fun if you catch a Sorc with it lol.
https://youtu.be/ZSRqw7w09zo

Lol Watching him vaporize was awesome

Minno

technohic wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

So I am running magplar again and giving UC a fair shot and it’s actually pretty good. With animation canceling; you catch even knowing people with a few hits. I like to hit UC , POTL, then shock reach to ensure no purge of POTL burst. Nuked some NB with a staff that was trying to range us from the top of Nickel last night He was weaving siphon and going for the bow proc. He broke reach fast and backed out of Los but POTL got him

It's even more fun if you catch a Sorc with it lol.
https://youtu.be/ZSRqw7w09zo

Lol Watching him vaporize was awesome

Lol yea. Though I'm not sure why he got an implosion proc. I didn't see any lighting DMG being done.

Kaliki

I have to say that I am positively surprised by UC.

But it has happened to me a few times in 1v1 situations against melee players that although they have my black bubble around them they wreck me with a series of direct damage attacks while seemingly not taking any damage themselves.

Has this happened to anyone else? Are there ways to avoid the damage completely, except perhaps someone being really lucky with high dodge chance? It has only happened 2 or 3 times for me and every time I was quite surprised.

Joy_Division

Kaliki wrote: »

I have to say that I am positively surprised by UC.

But it has happened to me a few times in 1v1 situations against melee players that although they have my black bubble around them they wreck me with a series of direct damage attacks while seemingly not taking any damage themselves.

Has this happened to anyone else? Are there ways to avoid the damage completely, except perhaps someone being really lucky with high dodge chance? It has only happened 2 or 3 times for me and every time I was quite surprised.

They arent avoiding the damage, they are just ignoring it. It's like 2.5K per second, which is certainly manageable for aggressive players