What do you think of necropotence nerf?

Zer0oo · August 2017

I think it is just one of the lazy band-aid-fixes.
Why does necro work with the unkillable pets like the warden netch? I think necro would have been perfectly fine if it only works with killable pets like scamp, twilight, the warden bear or even the engine guardian pet. It would have a counter and a downside since you have to have a pet alive.

Flameheart · August 2017

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

NukeAllTheThings wrote: »

Ok, since many here are pretty upset with a 400-500 loss in magicka on Necro and state it is now a DPS loss.....how much DPS have you lost in testing it. or how much will you lose?

Necropotence and Julianos were very close before the changes, like +/- 1% (Julianos better for Warden, Necro better for sorc). Julianos got buffed. Mother's Sorrow got buffed. Necro got nerfed.

It's not hard to see that Necro is out of the meta. It was barely in the meta before it got nerfed.

If you are interested in PvE performance and you are a Necropotence (and even Netch) user you should read that. It explains why the patch makes Necropotence "useless" (because not bis) in PvE now. Julianos + Sorrow seems to be the new meta. Maybe even without Ilambris or any other Undaunted set, because Ilambris got nerfed for 10% too in the last PTS patch already. What makes Necropotence so worse now is not the nerf itself, it's the nerf + the significant buffs other sets will get.

In addition I read an interesting thread about the 5% Minor Slayer Bonus from sets like Moondancer or Aether. It seems as if this bonus will more and more diminish in current game mechanics because of its additive nature.

On the one hand I am glad to get rid of the ugly argonian necropotence (and Netch) look being able to craft something in my favorite style. On the other side the sets I completed and upgraded to gold in the last months and even only weeks which will be useless now, are accumulating...

...so my gentle word to Zenimax would be that it might be a more successful method to handle things and balance in a game if you have a plan and a running system far beforehand, especially if it concerns PvP/PvE balance (the Necropotence nerf is a nerf clearly aimed towards PvP and shield stacking but hurts PvE significantly)

...and as I am not gentle I just have a "SHUT THE *** UP" for any more PvP nerfs that hurt PvE for Zenimax. Ready to get my warning now, it was well worth it.

Merlin13KAGL · August 2017

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

The problem with nerfing necro is that it kills build diversity. Everyone will be wearing the exact same gear next patch, where as before, at least sorcs and wardens could get away with something a little different.

Diversity is the issue, and it's not limited to Necro.

It's the consistent meta change. It's the fact that for any given class/stat, there are generally limited BiS options. It doesn't matter that those change with the patches, it's still the BiS limitation.

What would be nice if you could truly get comparable results with more than a small handful of gear choices.

FloppyTouch wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Sorcs wore Necro or Netch

Wardens wore Julianos or Necro

Templars wore Julianos

DKs wore Silks or BSW

I don't know what NBs wore

One of those sets was just removed from the meta for no reason. More than likely, warden, templar, and sorc will all be wearing Julianos next patch.

But most of pve was sorcss anyways was the point

@MLGProPlayer , NB's fight naked. Who has time to bother getting dressed when you can simply cloak and walk out the front door.

It would be awesome if we could see actual stats on class, stats, roles, and content from the game, vice everyone's perceived percentage of this and that. Then we could see what is, not what everyone assumes.

Qbiken · August 2017

Diversity is the issue, and it's not limited to Necro.

It's the consistent meta change. It's the fact that for any given class/stat, there are generally limited BiS options. It doesn't matter that those change with the patches, it's still the BiS limitation.

What would be nice if you could truly get comparable results with more than a small handful of gear choices.

Of course there´s a limited BiS options. That´s the defenition of BiS (more or less). And I´m curious about about your vision of "comparable results"? I´m guessing that the difference between the next BiS and the "old BiS" won´t be that huge as people believe it will be (and to be honest, it rarely is)

The BiS limitation is for the PvE raiders that compeats for scores. For the most/majority players the difference between 2nd BiS and #1 BiS is minimal, almost neglectable (in most cases).

But I can be wrong, we´ll just have to wait and see how it turns out to be next patch

Rikkof · August 2017

nerf is unfair and reason to uninstall this game
peace out

Merlin13KAGL · August 2017

Qbiken wrote: »

Diversity is the issue, and it's not limited to Necro.

It's the consistent meta change. It's the fact that for any given class/stat, there are generally limited BiS options. It doesn't matter that those change with the patches, it's still the BiS limitation.

What would be nice if you could truly get comparable results with more than a small handful of gear choices.

Of course there´s a limited BiS options. That´s the defenition of BiS (more or less). And I´m curious about about your vision of "comparable results"? I´m guessing that the difference between the next BiS and the "old BiS" won´t be that huge as people believe it will be (and to be honest, it rarely is)

The BiS limitation is for the PvE raiders that compeats for scores. For the most/majority players the difference between 2nd BiS and #1 BiS is minimal, almost neglectable (in most cases).

But I can be wrong, we´ll just have to wait and see how it turns out to be next patch

@Qbiken , of course there is only one "Best." I would say within 5% of BiS would be reasonable.

This would allow some alternate gear choices, instead of the almost always necessity of the old BiS same builds simply becoming differnt (new) BiS, while remaining virtually identical to each other.

TL;DR It would be nice if you couldn't automatically deduce what patch we were in based on typical gear and skill set.

You know, actual diversity.

Asardes · August 2017

It's not much anyway:

Now it adds 967x3+4000=6900 Maximum magicka
After patch 1096x3+3150=6440 Maximum magicka because the 1-4p maximum magicka bonuses get buffed by 13.3%

Only ~460 maximum magicka, which is equivalent to about ~44 effective spell damage.

Assuming your current spell damage is around 3K and maximum magicka around 55K your effective spell damage will be ~8240. The nerf will only be equivalent to about 0.5-0.7% DPS. The higher number assumes that a large portion comes from scamp, which only scales on maximum magicka. But in practice that's most likely not true, since LA and HA scale mostly on spell damage, which offsets the value. Let's say somewhere in the middle at 0.6%, or 240 DPS on a 40K parse. That's basically within the margin of error for consecutive rotations so you won't even notice it in practice. Furthermore, it will most likely be offset by the extra 10 CP you get to spend in the blue constellation.

However, other things may work against Necropotence nevertheless. Mostly the much stronger buff that 1-4p spell critical bonuses get, which is 55%. So sets with such bonuses may end up parsing close, or even beating Necropotence by a small margin.

Malamar1229 · August 2017

Banana wrote: »

Not big enough

"That's what."
-She

SanTii.92 · August 2017

Vaoh wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Wow my Mag Warden will only have 41,150 max magicka instead of 42,000 oh no!
People on this forum. lol

^That moment when you don't understand how stats work in this game....

The only place where this change is positive is in PvP, yet you'll still see those Pet builds that are broken in 1v1s since the inherent issues are untouched.

As for PvE, this set is now outclassed by other DPS sets which do not have a requirement for a living pet to be active.

Stop calling the living pet requirement, it's really a non factor. And I'm yet to see a parse where julianos outperform new necro on mag sorcs, no idea where you got your conclusions from. And even if that was the case, i'd bet it's quite close, much rather have that than the domination current necro have.

Aurielle · August 2017

All I'll say is that I'm glad my staves are gold Julianos, and not gold Necropotence... I was previously running Necro and Julianos, but it may be time for a switch to Julianos and something else after the patch. At least I could go back to using bound aegis and inner light -- there wasn't enough room for both on my skill bars with the stupid pet there.

lauykanson · August 2017

So trials gear not even matters anymore, good job ZOS for killing trials even more

KingJ · August 2017

Asardes wrote: »

It's not much anyway:

Now it adds 967x3+4000=6900 Maximum magicka
After patch 1096x3+3150=6440 Maximum magicka because the 1-4p maximum magicka bonuses get buffed by 13.3%

Only ~460 maximum magicka, which is equivalent to about ~44 effective spell damage.

Assuming your current spell damage is around 3K and maximum magicka around 55K your effective spell damage will be ~8240. The nerf will only be equivalent to about 0.5-0.7% DPS. The higher number assumes that a large portion comes from scamp, which only scales on maximum magicka. But in practice that's most likely not true, since LA and HA scale mostly on spell damage, which offsets the value. Let's say somewhere in the middle at 0.6%, or 240 DPS on a 40K parse. That's basically within the margin of error for consecutive rotations so you won't even notice it in practice. Furthermore, it will most likely be offset by the extra 10 CP you get to spend in the blue constellation.

However, other things may work against Necropotence nevertheless. Mostly the much stronger buff that 1-4p spell critical bonuses get, which is 55%. So sets with such bonuses may end up parsing close, or even beating Necropotence by a small margin.

@Asardes thank you so much for actually posting numbers for everyone.Instead of just saying its this with nothing to back it up.

Caligamy_ESO · August 2017

Amazing people.. really. It took a page and a half for someone to actually look at the entire sets numbers and realize this is only a change of 466 magicka instead of just parroting what some other mindless QQ post spewed out.

Asardes · August 2017

Most people playing this game and posting on the forums actually suffer from an aggressive form of magical thinking thar makes them fetishise certain sets and even traits that they've heard they are BiS without actually looking at maths which is plain, simple and not even hidden.

Remember the days when people endlessly farmed the illusive BSW sharpened inferno staff, even if the set, assuming a perfect rotation, only gave about 60 spell damage more than Julianos, that translated to less than 1% of overall damage? And it was nerfed so it's inferior to Julianos by a large margin now. Same goes for Automaton that is no better than Hunding's even on classes that have the highest proportion of their DPS as physical damage - even those have >20% of their DPS coming from PI, especially in the execute phase where it matters most? Or War Maiden, Netch Touch, Spider Cultist etc.

Or the divines trait that only boosts your DPS by ~0.5% per piece assuming very high critical multipliers. And people actually spent weeks farming those, losing out on more entertaining and challenging game or RL activities. I'd rather match crafted and dropped gear that mathematically comes within 1% of the supposed all dropped BiS setup then use the time saved to actually play what I like, practice for hard content I want to progress or simply play less.

dpencil1 · August 2017

The issue is not that the change is small from Live. The issue is that we are about to experience a significant power-creep moment game-wide. Every set that only got buffed will benefit from more CP and the hightened 1-4 piece values. So being nerfed below even the current level on Live puts Necro at a significant disadvantage.

I am working on a post that will detail the mathematical comparison between magicka sets, but I can tell you from what I've written so far that Necro is slightly weaker than Julianos with this nerf, which is particularly concerning since there are no requirements for Juli, but a pet requirement for Necro.

Yubarius · August 2017

The nerf to the overall set is not enough

FloppyTouch · August 2017

Asardes wrote: »

Most people playing this game and posting on the forums actually suffer from an aggressive form of magical thinking thar makes them fetishise certain sets and even traits that they've heard they are BiS without actually looking at maths which is plain, simple and not even hidden.

Remember the days when people endlessly farmed the illusive BSW sharpened inferno staff, even if the set, assuming a perfect rotation, only gave about 60 spell damage more than Julianos, that translated to less than 1% of overall damage? And it was nerfed so it's inferior to Julianos by a large margin now. Same goes for Automaton that is no better than Hunding's even on classes that have the highest proportion of their DPS as physical damage - even those have >20% of their DPS coming from PI, especially in the execute phase where it matters most? Or War Maiden, Netch Touch, Spider Cultist etc.

Or the divines trait that only boosts your DPS by ~0.5% per piece assuming very high critical multipliers. And people actually spent weeks farming those, losing out on more entertaining and challenging game or RL activities. I'd rather match crafted and dropped gear that mathematically comes within 1% of the supposed all dropped BiS setup then use the time saved to actually play what I like, practice for hard content I want to progress or simply play less.

So much this when everyone was using bsw and moon dancer I was upswing juli and willpower and random gold staffs. My dps was 31k with that set up after farming like crazy for months I go moondancer and divines bsw my dps went to 32k self buffed.

Point is I agree all those months of farming BiS for a 1k dps change just seemed like a waste of time.

Zbigb4life · August 2017

Yes nerf nerf nerf everything

Flameheart · August 2017

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Asardes wrote: »

Most people playing this game and posting on the forums actually suffer from an aggressive form of magical thinking thar makes them fetishise certain sets and even traits that they've heard they are BiS without actually looking at maths which is plain, simple and not even hidden.

Remember the days when people endlessly farmed the illusive BSW sharpened inferno staff, even if the set, assuming a perfect rotation, only gave about 60 spell damage more than Julianos, that translated to less than 1% of overall damage? And it was nerfed so it's inferior to Julianos by a large margin now. Same goes for Automaton that is no better than Hunding's even on classes that have the highest proportion of their DPS as physical damage - even those have >20% of their DPS coming from PI, especially in the execute phase where it matters most? Or War Maiden, Netch Touch, Spider Cultist etc.

Or the divines trait that only boosts your DPS by ~0.5% per piece assuming very high critical multipliers. And people actually spent weeks farming those, losing out on more entertaining and challenging game or RL activities. I'd rather match crafted and dropped gear that mathematically comes within 1% of the supposed all dropped BiS setup then use the time saved to actually play what I like, practice for hard content I want to progress or simply play less.

So much this when everyone was using bsw and moon dancer I was upswing juli and willpower and random gold staffs. My dps was 31k with that set up after farming like crazy for months I go moondancer and divines bsw my dps went to 32k self buffed.

Point is I agree all those months of farming BiS for a 1k dps change just seemed like a waste of time.

I may add, that BSW will be bis again for magDKs, so if you have one give him the staff :-)

Asardes · August 2017

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Asardes wrote: »

Most people playing this game and posting on the forums actually suffer from an aggressive form of magical thinking thar makes them fetishise certain sets and even traits that they've heard they are BiS without actually looking at maths which is plain, simple and not even hidden.

Remember the days when people endlessly farmed the illusive BSW sharpened inferno staff, even if the set, assuming a perfect rotation, only gave about 60 spell damage more than Julianos, that translated to less than 1% of overall damage? And it was nerfed so it's inferior to Julianos by a large margin now. Same goes for Automaton that is no better than Hunding's even on classes that have the highest proportion of their DPS as physical damage - even those have >20% of their DPS coming from PI, especially in the execute phase where it matters most? Or War Maiden, Netch Touch, Spider Cultist etc.

Or the divines trait that only boosts your DPS by ~0.5% per piece assuming very high critical multipliers. And people actually spent weeks farming those, losing out on more entertaining and challenging game or RL activities. I'd rather match crafted and dropped gear that mathematically comes within 1% of the supposed all dropped BiS setup then use the time saved to actually play what I like, practice for hard content I want to progress or simply play less.

So much this when everyone was using bsw and moon dancer I was upswing juli and willpower and random gold staffs. My dps was 31k with that set up after farming like crazy for months I go moondancer and divines bsw my dps went to 32k self buffed.

Point is I agree all those months of farming BiS for a 1k dps change just seemed like a waste of time.

I'm using now:
Magicka Sorcerer: 5 Law of Julianos + 4 Infallible Mage + 2 Ilambris
Stamina Dragonknight: 5 Hunding's Rage + 5 Sunderflame + 2 Kra'gh
Stamina Nightblade: 5 Night Mother's Gaze + 5 Vicious Serpent + 2 Velidreth

Note that the setup is not mathematically optimal, but provides adequate DPS, and in the case of the latter two also group support in the form of added penetration to the target. I only started practicing last week, but I can pull about 28K single target, self buffed and self sustained with only trash pots, heavy attack and class/weapon skill for major brutality. Only the NB has hit trials thus far, and I've managed to pull about 38K on the Mage in vAA. As the time has been short, I'm sure there's still plenty of room for improvement, and gear is only a small part of it.

Flameheart · August 2017

Asardes wrote: »

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Asardes wrote: »

Most people playing this game and posting on the forums actually suffer from an aggressive form of magical thinking thar makes them fetishise certain sets and even traits that they've heard they are BiS without actually looking at maths which is plain, simple and not even hidden.

Remember the days when people endlessly farmed the illusive BSW sharpened inferno staff, even if the set, assuming a perfect rotation, only gave about 60 spell damage more than Julianos, that translated to less than 1% of overall damage? And it was nerfed so it's inferior to Julianos by a large margin now. Same goes for Automaton that is no better than Hunding's even on classes that have the highest proportion of their DPS as physical damage - even those have >20% of their DPS coming from PI, especially in the execute phase where it matters most? Or War Maiden, Netch Touch, Spider Cultist etc.

Or the divines trait that only boosts your DPS by ~0.5% per piece assuming very high critical multipliers. And people actually spent weeks farming those, losing out on more entertaining and challenging game or RL activities. I'd rather match crafted and dropped gear that mathematically comes within 1% of the supposed all dropped BiS setup then use the time saved to actually play what I like, practice for hard content I want to progress or simply play less.

So much this when everyone was using bsw and moon dancer I was upswing juli and willpower and random gold staffs. My dps was 31k with that set up after farming like crazy for months I go moondancer and divines bsw my dps went to 32k self buffed.

Point is I agree all those months of farming BiS for a 1k dps change just seemed like a waste of time.

I'm using now:
Magicka Sorcerer: 5 Law of Julianos + 4 Infallible Mage + 2 Ilambris
Stamina Dragonknight: 5 Hunding's Rage + 5 Sunderflame + 2 Kra'gh
Stamina Nightblade: 5 Night Mother's Gaze + 5 Vicious Serpent + 2 Velidreth

Note that the setup is not mathematically optimal, but provides adequate DPS, and in the case of the latter two also group support in the form of added penetration to the target. I only started practicing last week, but I can pull about 28K single target, self buffed and self sustained with only trash pots, heavy attack and class/weapon skill for major brutality. Only the NB has hit trials thus far, and I've managed to pull about 38K on the Mage in vAA. As the time has been short, I'm sure there's still plenty of room for improvement, and gear is only a small part of it.

I use pretty the same on my stamblade. I change to Kragh in ST encounters though. I love VS for sustain and the Minor Slayer.
My Sorc now uses Necropotence (pet) and Netch (no pet). It will like your build after the patch (because I lack appropriate Aether and Moondancer staffs right now, otherwise it would be 5 x Aether/Moondancer on back bar).
My magDK (raid char) uses 5x SotS + 4 (5) Moondancer (SotS firestaff frontbar, Moondancer lightning staff backbar to grab a synergy there). After the patch SotS will be BSW (have BSW armor since ages, but I hate farming BSW flame staffs...I hate CoA1...)

I have no vMA staffs either for all my chars.

I just wonder if it will make sense to play 2 x 5-piece-sets as a DD after the patch goes live to get rid of undaunted sets (just 1 piece with a good bonus like magicka or crit, because those stats will be improved), because combos like Julianos + Spinner or Sorrow will be very powerful and what difference it will make if those five piece sets dont have jewelry with the Minor Slayer buff (otherwise one of them has to be Aether or Moondancer or comparable stamina sets).

Asardes · August 2017

Flameheart wrote: »

Asardes wrote: »

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Asardes wrote: »

Most people playing this game and posting on the forums actually suffer from an aggressive form of magical thinking thar makes them fetishise certain sets and even traits that they've heard they are BiS without actually looking at maths which is plain, simple and not even hidden.

Remember the days when people endlessly farmed the illusive BSW sharpened inferno staff, even if the set, assuming a perfect rotation, only gave about 60 spell damage more than Julianos, that translated to less than 1% of overall damage? And it was nerfed so it's inferior to Julianos by a large margin now. Same goes for Automaton that is no better than Hunding's even on classes that have the highest proportion of their DPS as physical damage - even those have >20% of their DPS coming from PI, especially in the execute phase where it matters most? Or War Maiden, Netch Touch, Spider Cultist etc.

Or the divines trait that only boosts your DPS by ~0.5% per piece assuming very high critical multipliers. And people actually spent weeks farming those, losing out on more entertaining and challenging game or RL activities. I'd rather match crafted and dropped gear that mathematically comes within 1% of the supposed all dropped BiS setup then use the time saved to actually play what I like, practice for hard content I want to progress or simply play less.

So much this when everyone was using bsw and moon dancer I was upswing juli and willpower and random gold staffs. My dps was 31k with that set up after farming like crazy for months I go moondancer and divines bsw my dps went to 32k self buffed.

Point is I agree all those months of farming BiS for a 1k dps change just seemed like a waste of time.

I'm using now:
Magicka Sorcerer: 5 Law of Julianos + 4 Infallible Mage + 2 Ilambris
Stamina Dragonknight: 5 Hunding's Rage + 5 Sunderflame + 2 Kra'gh
Stamina Nightblade: 5 Night Mother's Gaze + 5 Vicious Serpent + 2 Velidreth

Note that the setup is not mathematically optimal, but provides adequate DPS, and in the case of the latter two also group support in the form of added penetration to the target. I only started practicing last week, but I can pull about 28K single target, self buffed and self sustained with only trash pots, heavy attack and class/weapon skill for major brutality. Only the NB has hit trials thus far, and I've managed to pull about 38K on the Mage in vAA. As the time has been short, I'm sure there's still plenty of room for improvement, and gear is only a small part of it.

I use pretty the same on my stamblade. I change to Kragh in ST encounters though. I love VS for sustain and the Minor Slayer.
My Sorc now uses Necropotence (pet) and Netch (no pet). It will like your build after the patch (because I lack appropriate Aether and Moondancer staffs right now, otherwise it would be 5 x Aether/Moondancer on back bar).
My magDK (raid char) uses 5x SotS + 4 (5) Moondancer (SotS firestaff frontbar, Moondancer lightning staff backbar to grab a synergy there). After the patch SotS will be BWS (have BWS armor since ages, but I hate farming BWS flame staffs...I hate CoA1...)

I have no vMA staffs either for all my chars.

I just wonder if it will make sense to play 2 x 5-piece-sets as a DD after the patch goes live to get rid of undaunted sets (just 1 piece with a good bonus like magicka or crit, because those stats will be improved), because combos like Julianos + Spriggan will be very powerful and what difference it will make if those five piece sets dont have jewelry with the Minor Slayer buff (otherwise one of them has to be Aether or Mopondancer or comparable stamina sets).

Minor slayer bonus, which is 5% proportional damage increase - I've heard they are also fixing the execute skills inconsistencies next patch. In order to get the exact same bonus from penetration you will need to have 33.1K/10=3.3K penetration (33.1K is the resistance cap, which gives exactly 50% mitigation), which is almost exactly what Sunderflame or Spriggan give to a stamina char, or Spinner gives to a Magicka one, and less than Twice Fanged Snake gives to the former. That is unless you are overpenetrating which is only possible if there are already significant debuffs stacked on the target from other sources, or the intrinsic resistance is lower than the standard 18.2K. The latter is true for overland mobs and some of the enemies in vMA who only have half of that. Thus is easy to overpenetrate if using a combo like Spinner or Spriggan/TFS, sharp weapon and CP in spell erosion/piercing. Players in PvP have a minimum of about 9K phisical and 10-12K spell resistance so overpenetration is unlikely next patch even with those combos.

If debuffs are provided, like in group content, sets that give spell/weapon damage/critical become stronger. The ones that provide critical are stronger partly because those 1-4p piece bonuses receive a 55% buff, and because critical multiplier is increased by warhorn and trap/TR synergies, as well as CP in elf born/precise strikes, and a class passive. The damage bonuses are strong on builds that have a greater proportion of their damage output from heavy and light attacks that scale mostly on spell/weapon damage.

Since most monster sets receive a buff to their 1p bonus (the only exception is Kra'gh which received a slight nerf), but some of the more popular received a small overall damage nerf, 5+5+1 (two sets and a monster piece or special weapon) or 5+5+1+1 (two different monster pieces) setups will certainly become more popular. A special case are the sets which provide health bonuses (which are also increased), namely Nerien'eth, which has received a small damage buff, and Valkyn Skoria, open up other possibilities, by allowing players to use a buff drink like Whichmother's Brew, without dropping their health too low.

Strider_Roshin · August 2017

Rikkof wrote: »

nerf is unfair and reason to uninstall this game
peace out

Bye Felicia!

Merlin13KAGL · August 2017

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Wow my Mag Warden will only have 41,150 max magicka instead of 42,000 oh no!
People on this forum. lol

^That moment when you don't understand how stats work in this game....

The only place where this change is positive is in PvP, yet you'll still see those Pet builds that are broken in 1v1s since the inherent issues are untouched.

As for PvE, this set is now outclassed by other DPS sets which do not have a requirement for a living pet to be active.

Stop calling the living pet requirement, it's really a non factor. And I'm yet to see a parse where julianos outperform new necro on mag sorcs, no idea where you got your conclusions from. And even if that was the case, i'd bet it's quite close, much rather have that than the domination current necro have.

Me neither...

/facepalm

Aurielle · August 2017

Sigh, so the gear hawkers must have caught wind of the nerf and impending changing meta -- couldn't find any Mother's Sorrow pieces in divines for under 40K last night. I picked up a few cheap pieces in impen, and am wondering if it's even going to be worth it.

I previously ran 5 Necro, 4 Julianos, 2 Willpower (yeah, I know, no Monster sets... I couldn't be arsed to grind for keys while setting up my sorc, and still couldn't be arsed). Based on the minor buffs to Necro (excluding the 5-piece nerf), would I end up losing much if I went 5 Julianos, 4 Necro, 2 Willpower and swapped in bound aegis over volatile familiar for the 8% magicka boost? Or are the buffs to Mother's Sorrow really going to be THAT good? My current Willpower rings aren't arcane, as I wanted to add a bit of extra health for soloing dungeons. I'm wondering, though, if with the extra defense that bound aegis brings, I could swap those rings to the arcane version. Magicka shields kinda negate the need for healthy rings anyway. Thoughts? I'm not looking to be BIS, but I also don't want to be less effective than I was before.

Countcalorie · August 2017

SnubbS wrote: »

PeaNutShotz wrote: »

@SnubbS

Sorc pet builds will be unkillable in a 1v1. That made me chuckle.

No class is unkillable in a 1v1. Just gotta figure out that class's weakness in a single rotation.

I do understand that a pet build sorc won @Quantum_V dueling tournament last month if I'm not mistaken?

If you're playing Sorc pet build to it's fullest potential and using everything the game gives you, it's unkillable 1v1. Of course, when people say 'Unkillable' such as I did, we don't mean literally no one ever can kill one—we mean that it's by far the best option available in the game. Outside of the Sorc catastrophically messing up, they're not going to die.

I've never heard of that dueling tournament as I don't follow non-xbox na ones, but as for Xbox-NA, I haven't seen a dueling tournament in 5-6 months that didn't ban Sorc pets. However, if there were a tourney where literally anything goes—I'd put any money on a 5x Necro 2x InfernalGuardian pet build—nothing can even compete with that.

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

PeaNutShotz wrote: »

@SnubbS

Sorc pet builds will be unkillable in a 1v1. That made me chuckle.

No class is unkillable in a 1v1. Just gotta figure out that class's weakness in a single rotation.

I do understand that a pet build sorc won @Quantum_V dueling tournament last month if I'm not mistaken?

Realistically a pet sorcs biggest weakness is when they have to resummon,and the pets are so easy to kill. Although this should be obvious.

The pets really aren't that easy to kill—sure that's the "weakness"—but the weakness isn't very weak. The Sorc has infinite sustain, and is spamming 11k wards, and the twilight BoL.

sorc shields are closer to 17k with battlespirit active.harness would be closer to 11k

Vaoh · August 2017

Aurielle wrote: »

Sigh, so the gear hawkers must have caught wind of the nerf and impending changing meta -- couldn't find any Mother's Sorrow pieces in divines for under 40K last night. I picked up a few cheap pieces in impen, and am wondering if it's even going to be worth it.

I previously ran 5 Necro, 4 Julianos, 2 Willpower (yeah, I know, no Monster sets... I couldn't be arsed to grind for keys while setting up my sorc, and still couldn't be arsed). Based on the minor buffs to Necro (excluding the 5-piece nerf), would I end up losing much if I went 5 Julianos, 4 Necro, 2 Willpower and swapped in bound aegis over volatile familiar for the 8% magicka boost? Or are the buffs to Mother's Sorrow really going to be THAT good? My current Willpower rings aren't arcane, as I wanted to add a bit of extra health for soloing dungeons. I'm wondering, though, if with the extra defense that bound aegis brings, I could swap those rings to the arcane version. Magicka shields kinda negate the need for healthy rings anyway. Thoughts? I'm not looking to be BIS, but I also don't want to be less effective than I was before.

Luckily you won't need monster sets next patch for Magicka Sorc

.... well, maybe just one piece which is easy to get.

Mother's Sorrow will be that good. You will find much more success with DPS and have very good Surge heals/War Horn DPS gain from using 5x Julianos (4 armor+double lightning staves), 5x Mother's Sorrow (2 armor, 3 jewelry), and 1x Monster Piece with either Max Magicka or Spell Critical.

Wearing Julianos means you can craft pieces in medium or heavy to get a 5/1/1 setup in order to make full use of Undaunted passives. However, you'll need one Divines monster piece. It can be either head or shoulder, and any weight, as long as it is Divines and of one either the Ilambris, Grothdarr, Infernal Guardian, Iceheart, or Slimecraw sets.

The setup is very good and easy to get at any level. This is for what is essentially the "BiS" setup next patch for endgame PvE on Magicka Sorc.

dpencil1 · August 2017

Missed this thread earlier posting the link to my post: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/365185/magicka-dps-set-bonus-comparison-math/p1

It is worth looking at if you are wondering how Necro stacks against the other main dps sets in HotR.

Asardes · August 2017

Mother's Sorrow, the new BSW

Biro123 · August 2017

Countcalorie wrote: »

SnubbS wrote: »

PeaNutShotz wrote: »

@SnubbS

Sorc pet builds will be unkillable in a 1v1. That made me chuckle.

No class is unkillable in a 1v1. Just gotta figure out that class's weakness in a single rotation.

I do understand that a pet build sorc won @Quantum_V dueling tournament last month if I'm not mistaken?

If you're playing Sorc pet build to it's fullest potential and using everything the game gives you, it's unkillable 1v1. Of course, when people say 'Unkillable' such as I did, we don't mean literally no one ever can kill one—we mean that it's by far the best option available in the game. Outside of the Sorc catastrophically messing up, they're not going to die.

I've never heard of that dueling tournament as I don't follow non-xbox na ones, but as for Xbox-NA, I haven't seen a dueling tournament in 5-6 months that didn't ban Sorc pets. However, if there were a tourney where literally anything goes—I'd put any money on a 5x Necro 2x InfernalGuardian pet build—nothing can even compete with that.

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

PeaNutShotz wrote: »

@SnubbS

Sorc pet builds will be unkillable in a 1v1. That made me chuckle.

No class is unkillable in a 1v1. Just gotta figure out that class's weakness in a single rotation.

I do understand that a pet build sorc won @Quantum_V dueling tournament last month if I'm not mistaken?

Realistically a pet sorcs biggest weakness is when they have to resummon,and the pets are so easy to kill. Although this should be obvious.

The pets really aren't that easy to kill—sure that's the "weakness"—but the weakness isn't very weak. The Sorc has infinite sustain, and is spamming 11k wards, and the twilight BoL.

sorc shields are closer to 17k with battlespirit active.harness would be closer to 11k

Not sure about that. I'm sure my hardened in cyro is between 14 and 15k.. I have a very high magica build, much higher than most (53k) with a reasonable amount spent in bastion (over 50cp)