Best in slot gear is craftable and farmable?

code65536 · August 2017

gameshark79 wrote: »

I agree with skill over gear, but skill players don't want to just craft gear to be best, they want to work for it. That's the whole reason. No MMO player that I know of has ever said, let's just make the best gear and go beat the latest raid and be done until the next. It's always do the latest gear to get the latest gear to prepare for the next.

So your whole premise is that people play content only to clear it. This makes no sense. If all I cared about was the skin and title, I would've stopped after my first vHoF clear. So why have I cleared it 20 more times since then? I can tell you, it has nothing to do with the gear.

There needs to be incentive to replay the content, but gear is frankly a dumb and unhealthy reason. A game is supposed to be "fun". Not "work". People play games to get away from work. I don't run trials to work on my gear; I run trials to have fun, and the gear grind that I do in order to have that fun is one that I detest and see as a mindless chore that gets in the way of my fun.

ESO lets people jump straight into the endgame and have fun, provided that they are skilled. If you don't want to grind mindlessly for whatever the FotM set is, Julianos has always been very potent in the hands of the skilled player. And that's the way it should be. I frankly dgaf about the backwards ways other MMOs work.

Zedrian · August 2017

Trials gear no longer means anything, as so many players unfortunately spent more time exploiting vMOL than ever attempting it.

deadlychaos1991 · August 2017

Zedrian wrote: »

Trials gear no longer means anything, as so many players unfortunately spent more time exploiting vMOL than ever attempting it.

And so the solution to that would be just to make crafted gear best in slot so they stop exploiting it? Lol

kojou · August 2017

I for one hate the grind for "BiS" weapons and am glad that Julianos is viable.

I want to run the content for fun, not bore myself grinding the same thing over and over for gear.

DDuke · August 2017

I'm sorry OP, I know you mean well - but it's too late to save this MMO when it comes to itemization.

Most of the hardcore PvErs who live for progressive raiding (with progressive rewards) already left years ago when it became clear those would never be a thing in this MMO.

To be fair though, there is some "BiS" gear still to be had from trials, War Machine for example. It's just not much of an "upgrade" really, and only useful for PvE.

I miss the good old days when Trials dropped clear upgrades to your gear and being good in this game was actually rewarded.

For example, Vicious Ophidian used to be like Hunding's 2.0, giving you 220 weapon damage. Then they nerfed it to 170, then to 129 and finally they slapped a "Minor Slayer" PvE buff to it as 3-piece to make sure it'd never see use in PvP again.

Practically flipped the bird to the crowd that was asking for more gear progression (and more raids).

And no, it wasn't unfair that PvErs got such advantages, because you could get that set as campaign leaderboard reward as well back then.

Oakmontowls_ESO · August 2017

I feel like people grossly overestimate the gap between bis gear (scathing, bsw, necro, etc) and the closest crafted substitute. The difference is usually below 5%. There are obviously some exceptions like vma weapons before they were nerfed and trial gear with minor slayer since you will want that in pve content. However besides these exceptions, the only thing keeping you from completing pretty much all content is player skill. I am sure that guild like hordor could easily compete any of the hard mode content using crafted gear. The only reason for needing the absolute bis gear is if you are attempting leader board content.

Chrlynsch · August 2017

gameshark79 wrote: »

So you'd rather your time invested in the game mean nothing?

1. Looks at this post...
2. Looks through his rewards of the worthy and thanks a bunch mails from grand overlords...
3.

Darlgon · August 2017

BraidasNM wrote: »

if you like grinding for the sake of it, i would suggest bdo

In BDO, you have your slaves.. err.. workers.. craft it for you....

Rungar · August 2017

another reason why this is the best mmo.

Earrindo · August 2017

I can't help but chime in with my experiences the past few days, as some of the comments I've read here are super interesting.
I was horrified of running vet dungeons, but I love decorating and collecting rare furnishings.
So I sucked it up, and on my bow/bow stamina warden, with my bear, in my hircines veneer 5 piece, hundings crafted 5 piece and no monster sets, (because I like the look ^^)I started queueing for vet dungeons.

And do you know what? I got a really pleasant surprise.

I have been playing MMOs for 17 years. Mostly as a filthy casual, but off and on with more challenging content. I even helped start and run a raiding guild in EQ2 when DoV came out.
I am a good player. I do my homework, I keep strata on my other monitor if needed, and most of all I pay attention.
The only thing that stopped me from completing every vet dungeon I entered (in DF btw) was the folks who joined and didn't know their nose from their elbow.
Some of the best runs I had were with folks that had way WAY less than 630cp (I myself only have 420 or so) and were definitely NOT in "BiS" gear. And some of the worst experiences I had were with the 630cp, fully kitted divas who were more concerned with the numbers after each party members name than with whether or not they were good players.

To bring this back to the whole crafted vs trial gear being best in slot, I say there is no such thing as best in slot.

If a stamina warden with his bear and wearing gear just for the looks can clear every vet dungeon there is and make a good showing of himself to boot (few deaths, decent dps, dealt with mechanics, including ruins of mazzatun) and I had never run a single vet dungeon before ever.
That is good gameplay.

That is amazing that I can choose to pursue that part of the game and because I am a good player, I can succeed.
I dare you to show me another MMO where you don't need to run the dang gear treadmill to experience and enjoy all the content available.

So yeah, BiS Gear isn't craft able and it isn't farmable, there is no BiS, theres just being a good player, or not, and how you play is entirely up to you, and that's why I love this game, and why I couldn't care less about what some people view as being right or good.
As others have said, if you want to grind out progression gear, every other MMO out there has that, go play those games, let eso break the mold and let people like me enjoy being rewarded for our skill, not the number of times we have run a trial to get the best gear.

UrbanMonk · August 2017

BiS is what Zo$ thinks should be the flavour of quarter. Both MS and Julianos has been here for more than 3 quarters, but they came and gone. Unlike so many other sets that have fallen and gone up again just to fall once more, Juli's Mother sorrow are gonna be flavour of the quarter. So enjoy while it lasts, because soon it'll be something else...

olsborg · August 2017

Countcalorie wrote: »

please stop.crafted gear needs to be relevant again.

Most of the crafted sets, like 80% of them, needs to be buffed/changed to be competetive with the dropped sets. Right now they aint even in the same competition.

zassasaurus · August 2017

I am SO excited for crafted gear to be bis, all the time and gold I spent getting all the motifs and researching all the traits will FINALLY be worthwhile....

MehrunesFlagon · August 2017

gameshark79 wrote: »

VMA staves are not going to be worth it next patch. Gold jewelry will be the only incentive.

well from what i'm getting it would be worth to enchant over an infused staff for the spell damage.

Strider_Roshin · August 2017

Thank goodness! I bought this game to play it not mindless farm the same content over, and over.

At least motifs are relevant again.

Banana · August 2017

Good because I dont do trials and WOW is for children

ccfeeling · August 2017

So... hardcored dungeon for fun only?

Malic · August 2017

It depends on what happens with Torugs. Julianos has always been good, like wise hundings, seducers, orgnum and kags.

Crafted sets have always been very good, when your talking BIS the difference isnt that great. Additionally there is very little content in the game that necessitates a 2% increase.

Its like getting a 96 on a test and the kid in the back got a 98. You both got A's

MLGProPlayer · August 2017

Nobody runs vet trials/dungeons for gear...

You farm normal mode for that, which even the worst players can complete.

If anything, people will be running vet trials and dungeons more now than before.

MLGProPlayer · August 2017

gameshark79 wrote: »

So you'd rather your time invested in the game mean nothing? I mean you might as well make the game pay to win. Just allow me to buy want I want to become the best. That's not why I play MMO's and do raids. I want to collect gear from the hardest trial to prepare me for the next one, not just be given it.

Gear doesn't make you the best...

If you aren't on leader boards, you aren't the best. That should be your goal.

Trashs1 · August 2017

so.... on my sorc... just got my vma lightningstaff and infused julianos will be better than this next patch? cry

Bobby_V_Rockit · August 2017

So what IS the BiS gear after HotR? I want to craft/farm now before price of gold mats skyrockets...

Stam and Mag, its all a scary mystery to me

Kronuxx · August 2017

gameshark79 wrote: »

Julianos and mother's sorrow is going to be best in slot for magicka? So all I have to do to become a great player is make some gear and farm for a day? Where's the incentive to do trials or dungeons? Is this how you want your game to be?

No. Crafted gear needs to be relevant again. More than half the crafted sets are essentially useless. And if you're talking about time invested, you ever wonder how damn long it takes to research all traits in order to even craft 9 trait sets? Your post is essentially moot.

LZH · August 2017

ESO end-game PvE is less about progressing to completion and more about progressing to mastery. Most people don't care what gear or class is BiS.

If anything, this update is amazing. Now anyone and everyone has the tools to compete for scores and hopefully it causes the community to grow.

Qbiken · August 2017

Oakmontowls_ESO wrote: »

I feel like people grossly overestimate the gap between bis gear (scathing, bsw, necro, etc) and the closest crafted substitute. The difference is usually below 5%. There are obviously some exceptions like vma weapons before they were nerfed and trial gear with minor slayer since you will want that in pve content. However besides these exceptions, the only thing keeping you from completing pretty much all content is player skill. I am sure that guild like hordor could easily compete any of the hard mode content using crafted gear. The only reason for needing the absolute bis gear is if you are attempting leader board content.

Pretty much sums it up.

Sru · August 2017

gameshark79 wrote: »

Julianos and mother's sorrow is going to be best in slot for magicka? So all I have to do to become a great player is make some gear and farm for a day? Where's the incentive to do trials or dungeons? Is this how you want your game to be?

I can understand this from a min/max'er point of view but perhaps you can also understand the hours and work that goes into master crafting. I bet I have spend longer getting all 9 traits than you have ever spend in trials or any dungeon.

Maybe the balance needs to be towards the top tier crafted being equivalent to the trail gear - Julianos is quite a low tier crafted set in the scheme of things.

Don't disparage crafters - it is a large part of the game to many. I'd bet more craft than ever run the very top tier content. There is absolutely no reason why we should not be able to make some of the very best gear in the game - period.

sudaki_eso · August 2017

Some people spend a couple of month becoming a master crafter others spend a couple of month grinding for gear - whatever suits your playstyle and you have fun with. Why should a crafted set be much worse than a set you get by running trials? if they are somehow similar i am fine with it

FakeFox · August 2017

gameshark79 wrote: »

Julianos and mother's sorrow is going to be best in slot for magicka? So all I have to do to become a great player is make some gear and farm for a day? Where's the incentive to do trials or dungeons? Is this how you want your game to be?

Gear alone doesn't make you a great player. Look at how many players have best in slot gear and still do only 15k DPS.

Enslaved · August 2017

Even if this is true for magicka builds, stamina users will once again get the shaft, since they still will need trial gear for their BiS minmax experience.

method__01 · August 2017

sudaki_eso wrote: »

Some people spend a couple of month becoming a master crafter others spend a couple of month grinding for gear - whatever suits your playstyle and you have fun with. Why should a crafted set be much worse than a set you get by running trials? if they are somehow similar i am fine with it

ehm,still researching my last 2 heavy nirnroot trait- weapons for my master crafter
and i can assure its wayyyy more than 2 months