"Sorc-owind" and "Sorcs of the Reach": Death of Class Diversity

imredneckson · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

imredneckson wrote: »

Lmao it's the end of all classes other than sorcs xD. I think I'll stick with my "dead" Templar and play how I want. The only advice I can give ya OP is Darwin adapt or die aka improvise or rerole

Every class is viable for flower-picking and writ crafting. This isn't about that.

Lmao I'll take that response as you saying that you're not going to adapt and you know what happens when something doesn't adapt.

DRXHarbinger · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

How are magdks struggling???? Seriously. Too many scrubs need to l2p DK. I swear some people read the 1st page of this forum in the morning and then spam guild chats crying the world is ending..."everyone roll sorcs now"

As I told someone else, everything costs 4K+ magicka - you *** through your magicka bar and Battle Roar (the only form of sutain a DK gets) now gives crap resources due to the "balance" adjustment. PvE performance is the issue - performance in PvP is irrelevant because everyone zergs: when there's 20+ players firing crap at your enemy, everything is "viable".

Please don't tell a magdk player who has done everything and got all skins and a 579k flawless vMA score on his magdk that they are suffering in PvE. Seriously they are not struggling. Evidently you have no clue how to play one.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

imredneckson wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

imredneckson wrote: »

Lmao it's the end of all classes other than sorcs xD. I think I'll stick with my "dead" Templar and play how I want. The only advice I can give ya OP is Darwin adapt or die aka improvise or rerole

Every class is viable for flower-picking and writ crafting. This isn't about that.

Lmao I'll take that response as you saying that you're not going to adapt and you know what happens when something doesn't adapt.

Yeah, the game dies and the player base takes their money elsewhere.

redshirt_49 · July 2017

Weak warden DPS? Mine parses 41k so I don't know what you're talking about.

One ability gets slight nerf -> THE CLASS IS DEAD NOW YOU GUYS

Broken infinite resource pool was nerfed -> OH MY GOD SUSTAIN IS BROKEN, WHAT DO YOU MEAN I HAVE TO MANAGE MY ABILITIES AND NOT POWER SPAM AND USE MY CPs AS A CRUTCH?????? ERMAHGERD.

Calm down. Adjustments are being made to mechanics that were abused and utilised out of their intended context.

Keep up the good work, devs.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

How are magdks struggling???? Seriously. Too many scrubs need to l2p DK. I swear some people read the 1st page of this forum in the morning and then spam guild chats crying the world is ending..."everyone roll sorcs now"

As I told someone else, everything costs 4K+ magicka - you *** through your magicka bar and Battle Roar (the only form of sutain a DK gets) now gives crap resources due to the "balance" adjustment. PvE performance is the issue - performance in PvP is irrelevant because everyone zergs: when there's 20+ players firing crap at your enemy, everything is "viable".

Please don't tell a magdk player who has done everything and got all skins and a 579k flawless vMA score on his magdk that they are suffering in PvE. Seriously they are not struggling. Evidently you have no clue how to play one.

One person does not equate to the performance of a class across the entire player base. Also, your argument with regards to "completing everything" is baseless and doesn't prove anything. I could easily retort that you were carried or took advantage of exploits/cheeses in dungeons/trials before patches were implemented for them...

DRXHarbinger · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

How are magdks struggling???? Seriously. Too many scrubs need to l2p DK. I swear some people read the 1st page of this forum in the morning and then spam guild chats crying the world is ending..."everyone roll sorcs now"

As I told someone else, everything costs 4K+ magicka - you *** through your magicka bar and Battle Roar (the only form of sutain a DK gets) now gives crap resources due to the "balance" adjustment. PvE performance is the issue - performance in PvP is irrelevant because everyone zergs: when there's 20+ players firing crap at your enemy, everything is "viable".

Please don't tell a magdk player who has done everything and got all skins and a 579k flawless vMA score on his magdk that they are suffering in PvE. Seriously they are not struggling. Evidently you have no clue how to play one.

One person does not equate to the performance of a class across the entire player base. Also, your argument with regards to "completing everything" is baseless and doesn't prove anything. I could easily retort that you were carried or took advantage of exploits/cheeses in dungeons/trials before patches were implemented for them...

Lol. At this point..everyone walk away.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

redshirt_49 wrote: »

Weak warden DPS? Mine parses 41k so I don't know what you're talking about.

One ability gets slight nerf -> THE CLASS IS DEAD NOW YOU GUYS

Broken infinite resource pool was nerfed -> OH MY GOD SUSTAIN IS BROKEN, WHAT DO YOU MEAN I HAVE TO MANAGE MY ABILITIES AND NOT POWER SPAM AND USE MY CPs AS A CRUTCH?????? ERMAHGERD.

Calm down. Adjustments are being made to mechanics that were abused and utilised out of their intended context.

Keep up the good work, devs.

A skeleton test doesn't count. It doesn't equate to actual combat performance because you don't have to manage adds, boss movement, fight mechanics, and incoming damage that needs warding - all of which disrupt and lower DPS. A skeleton test value is WORTHLESS.

Rohamad_Ali · July 2017

It's always the final nail in the coffin . There's so many nails you can't get the corpse in now .

Scyantific · July 2017

Lmao I've been posting consistent 540k+ scores on a willpower/julianos/iceheart magblade for the past 10 weeks.

This is like the n-th "OMG NERFS" thread that OP has posted. Ignore him.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

It's always the final nail in the coffin . There's so many nails you can't get the corpse in now .

No, Scathing Mage has kept the magblade on life support up until this point. Every patch has slowly harmed them - Morrowind was a large nerf, but this is really the last nail. There aren't any other sources of damage it can utilize to bring it up to par in vet Trials since Twisting Path has been taken away.

a1i3nz · July 2017

When wasn't it elder sorcs?

imredneckson · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

imredneckson wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

imredneckson wrote: »

Lmao it's the end of all classes other than sorcs xD. I think I'll stick with my "dead" Templar and play how I want. The only advice I can give ya OP is Darwin adapt or die aka improvise or rerole

Every class is viable for flower-picking and writ crafting. This isn't about that.

Lmao I'll take that response as you saying that you're not going to adapt and you know what happens when something doesn't adapt.

Yeah, the game dies and the player base takes their money elsewhere.

*grabs more popcorn* L2P buddy L2P

SanTii.92 · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

It's always the final nail in the coffin . There's so many nails you can't get the corpse in now .

No, Scathing Mage has kept the magblade on life support up until this point. Every patch has slowly harmed them - Morrowind was a large nerf, but this is really the last nail. There aren't any other sources of damage it can utilize to bring it up to par in vet Trials since Twisting Path has been taken away.

the *** are you talking about? They are doing great currently, 50 spell dmge (IF that since crit chance got buffed acrossed the board) will mean absolutly nothing.

CorsennaRyu · July 2017

Stovahkiin wrote: »

Oh totally, OP. I mean, I've never seen a class other than sorcs get kills in pvp, it's ridiculous! It's like all of my other class abilities and skill lines are completely useless now and all I can do is QQ on the forums.

#sarcasm, go git good

Good thing the OP wasn't talking about PvP. I've got news for you, there's a whole lot more to the game than PvP. I've had over a dozen trial guilds tell me if I want to keep running vet trials with them to sorc or don't run with them. The fact is ZOS is killing class/skill diversity. Though in fairness, skill diversity has been dead since the game released.

Feanor · July 2017

Oh look another nerf Sorc thread. How surprising. Can't have a new patch without the nerf Sorc discussion. That's like a nature law somehow.

rotaugen454 · July 2017

My 9 non-magicka sorc characters disagree...

rhapsodious · July 2017

The game will continue on, and we'll adapt. Sure, I guess if you're pushing scores it'll sting, but any class can still complete the content. Just wait before declaring that the world's ending, and you might just be surprised. They have at least four PTS feedback rounds to consider.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

Feanor wrote: »

Oh look another nerf Sorc thread. How surprising. Can't have a new patch without the nerf Sorc discussion. That's like a nature law somehow.

This isn't a nerf-sorc thread. This is a post talking about how everything else is weak by comparison and should be brought up to it, not the other way around.

redshirt_49 · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

redshirt_49 wrote: »

Weak warden DPS? Mine parses 41k so I don't know what you're talking about.

One ability gets slight nerf -> THE CLASS IS DEAD NOW YOU GUYS

Broken infinite resource pool was nerfed -> OH MY GOD SUSTAIN IS BROKEN, WHAT DO YOU MEAN I HAVE TO MANAGE MY ABILITIES AND NOT POWER SPAM AND USE MY CPs AS A CRUTCH?????? ERMAHGERD.

Calm down. Adjustments are being made to mechanics that were abused and utilised out of their intended context.

Keep up the good work, devs.

A skeleton test doesn't count. It doesn't equate to actual combat performance because you don't have to manage adds, boss movement, fight mechanics, and incoming damage that needs warding - all of which disrupt and lower DPS. A skeleton test value is WORTHLESS.

In terms of sustaining that number in combat? Yes. But as a benchmark to what your build is capable of it is servicable. I have no trouble running vets on my warden. My abilities aren't such that they're likely to mis-fire or suffer more than any other class from being interrupted in its rotation since it's mostly DoT based anyway.

My warden performs adequately, I still prefer running my sorc for things like vMA but that's because of Surge and not some godly over-performance over everything else.

Tryxus · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

It's always the final nail in the coffin . There's so many nails you can't get the corpse in now .

No, Scathing Mage has kept the magblade on life support up until this point. Every patch has slowly harmed them - Morrowind was a large nerf, but this is really the last nail. There aren't any other sources of damage it can utilize to bring it up to par in vet Trials since Twisting Path has been taken away.

1 set doesn't make or break the class, and Twisting Path isn't taken away. It just does a diff type of damage now

dennissomb16_ESO · July 2017

Not sure about night blades playing end game PvE but in Cyrodiil they are every where now. The meta has definetly changed from DKs everywhere to night blades easily being the class I see most in Cryodiil (although Sorcs are starting to pop up more and more.

In the end however we all know that when ZOS posts for a new DLC and the class changes that come with it the forums explode with "end of the world" claims. Then the DLC lands and a week later no one even remembers what the fuss was all about.

I would bet if there were meaningful stats showing classes by percentage played in end game enviroments (PvP, Raids Vet dungeons) that the percentage have never wavered by more then 1% year over year

ZOS_Bill · July 2017

A few comments have been edited or removed for flaming, as this thread has quickly become heated. Please keep in mind when commenting that even if you disagree with someone, you cannot directly or indirectly insult them, as that is against the forum rules.

Eirella · July 2017

Sigtric wrote: »

Magblades have died off and gone extinct every patch for the last what? 2 years?

Lol!

Alpheu5 · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

rhapsodious wrote: »

It's patch one of the PTS. Give them the time to re-evaluate it and constructively express your concerns. They respond a lot more to identifying specific issues than crying that the class is "dead" with no other comments. I still miss the old Siphoning Attacks a lot, but the version that made it to live is leaps and bounds above what PTS patch one had. (Also keep in mind that even though it lasted for two years, it was technically a bug...)

That being said, I'd appreciate if the proc chance for scathing was upped, or we got more sources of direct damage.

I'm still going to be running trials on my nightblade, just like I did in Homestead. Never give up, never surrender! ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ

[snip]
"It's only patch one" LMFAO

Oh, this poor child... You actually believe that ZoS values your opinion or that they make changes based on player feedback? After EVERYTHING that happened during the Morrowind PTS.... [snip]

[Edited for flaming]

Haunting Curse's first explosion coming after 6 seconds, Siphoning Attacks without the resource burst at the end, Frost Cloak making anybody it applied to look really messed up, the original Dragonknight Vomit Breath, lousy pets pre-TG, poison effectiveness, Fury being dodgable, Soul Assault being shut down by a simple CC, magDKs not having a flame Leap, and now, most recently, Viper not being a DoT.

Apherius · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

s7732425ub17_ESO wrote: »

So they will switch to Julianos now like every other class is using. Silly how a crafted set will outperform some of the hardest to grind sets in the game.

Why work harder for something that's effortlessly performed by another class? I'm not calling for a sorc nerf- I'm calling for a "everything else" buff/revert.

They should buff NB magicka dps , YES , i agree , but if they buff the dps of the templar / dragon knight ... they should also up the tanking / healing of the sorc / nb .

rhapsodious · July 2017

Alpheu5 wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

rhapsodious wrote: »

It's patch one of the PTS. Give them the time to re-evaluate it and constructively express your concerns. They respond a lot more to identifying specific issues than crying that the class is "dead" with no other comments. I still miss the old Siphoning Attacks a lot, but the version that made it to live is leaps and bounds above what PTS patch one had. (Also keep in mind that even though it lasted for two years, it was technically a bug...)

That being said, I'd appreciate if the proc chance for scathing was upped, or we got more sources of direct damage.

I'm still going to be running trials on my nightblade, just like I did in Homestead. Never give up, never surrender! ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ

[snip]
"It's only patch one" LMFAO

Oh, this poor child... You actually believe that ZoS values your opinion or that they make changes based on player feedback? After EVERYTHING that happened during the Morrowind PTS.... [snip]

[Edited for flaming]

Haunting Curse's first explosion coming after 6 seconds, Siphoning Attacks without the resource burst at the end, Frost Cloak making anybody it applied to look really messed up, the original Dragonknight Vomit Breath, lousy pets pre-TG, poison effectiveness, Fury being dodgable, Soul Assault being shut down by a simple CC, magDKs not having a flame Leap, and now, most recently, Viper not being a DoT.

Thanks, I had forgotten about stuff like the original poison FX! Although I do kind of wish they kept that giant default texture cube for Frost Cloak, I wanted to be a scary ice cube.

Stovahkiin · July 2017

CorsennaRyu wrote: »

Stovahkiin wrote: »

Oh totally, OP. I mean, I've never seen a class other than sorcs get kills in pvp, it's ridiculous! It's like all of my other class abilities and skill lines are completely useless now and all I can do is QQ on the forums.

#sarcasm, go git good

Good thing the OP wasn't talking about PvP. I've got news for you, there's a whole lot more to the game than PvP. I've had over a dozen trial guilds tell me if I want to keep running vet trials with them to sorc or don't run with them. The fact is ZOS is killing class/skill diversity. Though in fairness, skill diversity has been dead since the game released.

Congratulations, your forum QQ'ing skill has just increased!

But in all seriousness, why yes I do know that there is such a thing as PVE. But you know what? The majority of players keep on playing and adapting throughout every patch. It's just the people who think that loosing 5 points of damage is a disaster that are making such a big fuss. If your guilds tell you how to play and that you have to play a different class, then that's a community/guild problem.

Find a good group of friends to run with instead of a group of "l33t hardcore" player guilds.

Scyantific · July 2017

CorsennaRyu wrote: »

Stovahkiin wrote: »

Oh totally, OP. I mean, I've never seen a class other than sorcs get kills in pvp, it's ridiculous! It's like all of my other class abilities and skill lines are completely useless now and all I can do is QQ on the forums.

#sarcasm, go git good

Good thing the OP wasn't talking about PvP. I've got news for you, there's a whole lot more to the game than PvP. I've had over a dozen trial guilds tell me if I want to keep running vet trials with them to sorc or don't run with them. The fact is ZOS is killing class/skill diversity. Though in fairness, skill diversity has been dead since the game released.

Who are these guilds, because lol you need to find new raid guilds.

Looking forward to August and U15 when @LZH posts a 602k on a magblade in vMA

Kodrac · July 2017

Apherius wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

s7732425ub17_ESO wrote: »

So they will switch to Julianos now like every other class is using. Silly how a crafted set will outperform some of the hardest to grind sets in the game.

Why work harder for something that's effortlessly performed by another class? I'm not calling for a sorc nerf- I'm calling for a "everything else" buff/revert.

They should buff NB magicka dps , YES , i agree , but if they buff the dps of the templar / dragon knight ... they should also up the tanking / healing of the sorc / nb .

Clearly, making them all suck is the preferred method at ZoS HQ.

red_emu · July 2017

To all the people saying OP is overreacting? Every single time I play in Cyrodill all it takes is two sorcs to wipe a group of 20. You can try and try. Their shields are insane, their burst damage is insane, the balance in this game right now is insane! Give my warden some love!