"Sorc-owind" and "Sorcs of the Reach": Death of Class Diversity

Vercingetorix · July 2017

ZoS has now officially admitted to killing off Twisting Path. It's the final nail in the coffin for magblades, who were finally starting to come back. Here's the proof:

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Twisting Path was never intended to be a "direct damage" attack - it should be considered a "damage over time" attack (much like other area of effect ticking abilities such as Wall of Elements or Ash Cloud). This first PTS build has a partial fix to its behavior, and a later PTS build will have the full fix for it (and the accompanying patch note).

We are also investigating better ways to communicate what is a "direct damage" attack versus a "damage over time" attack (along with other tooltip terms such as "melee" attack), so that it is more clear how certain Item Set procs interact with certain abilities.

Goodbye magicka Nightblades. The life support from Scathing Mage was sufficient while it lasted, lol. With the destruction of sustain to struggling classes like DK and Templar (along with losing its class-defining buff, Major Mending), and then you consider the ridiculously weak nature of Warden's DPS, ZoS' message is quite clear to the rest of the community:
"GO SORC OR GTFO"

There are no other choices anymore. Grab a lightning staff, get your Necropotence set, and hold down the attack button.

EDIT: There seems to be a lot of people on this thread mentioning Cyrodiil. This is not concerned with Cyrodiil as the topic of this thread is about a change on the PTS that affects a class' PvE performance.

Keep_Door · July 2017

Overreacting much ?

Yes.

Takes-No-Prisoner · July 2017

tee-he-he Sorc's of the Reach.

Also what Keep_Door said

s7732425ub17_ESO · July 2017

So they will switch to Julianos now like every other class is using. Silly how a crafted set will outperform some of the hardest to grind sets in the game.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

Keep_Door wrote: »

Overreacting much ?
Yes.

Of course new players don't care because they have nothing to lose by switching classes or gear. This isn't an overreaction - this is the truth - it is what it is. Choosing to ignore it only continues to harm the game. People like yourself are contributing to the problem by ignoring it.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

s7732425ub17_ESO wrote: »

So they will switch to Julianos now like every other class is using. Silly how a crafted set will outperform some of the hardest to grind sets in the game.

Why work harder for something that's effortlessly performed by another class? I'm not calling for a sorc nerf- I'm calling for a "everything else" buff/revert.

Sigtric · July 2017

Magblades have died off and gone extinct every patch for the last what? 2 years?

altemriel · July 2017

Sigtric wrote: »

Magblades have died off and gone extinct every patch for the last what? 2 years?

and still people like Kena or Sypher can play them deadly

Keep_Door · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

Keep_Door wrote: »

Overreacting much ?
Yes.

Of course new players don't care because they have nothing to lose by switching classes or gear. This isn't an overreaction - this is the truth - it is what it is. Choosing to ignore it only continues to harm the game. People like yourself are contributing to the problem by ignoring it.

Want to know a secret?

Im not a new player and you are overreacting.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

Sigtric wrote: »

Magblades have died off and gone extinct every patch for the last what? 2 years?

Scathing Mage has barely sustained them through the patches. This nerf was always a possibility, but it was believed that ZoS would sensibly provide another option for NB's after ruining their endgame potential with such a change. This did not happen, and so now the class is effectively worthless.

For pugs and flower-pickers, they won't realize the crappy state their class is in. However, if other NB's want to ever do a vTrial, they might as well switch to sorc now or uninstall.

Fishoscandi · July 2017

altemriel wrote: »

Sigtric wrote: »

Magblades have died off and gone extinct every patch for the last what? 2 years?

and still people like Kena or Sypher can play them deadly

Yeah, but the average Joe isn't Sypher

Vercingetorix · July 2017

altemriel wrote: »

Sigtric wrote: »

Magblades have died off and gone extinct every patch for the last what? 2 years?

and still people like Kena or Sypher can play them deadly

PvP performance is not indicative of PvE performance, which is the more important factor. Also, Sypher doesn't really play that much anymore, either. I've never heard of this "Kena" person and frankly, one person's performance does not indicate the level of performance of a class across the entire player base.

Tryxus · July 2017

Sigtric wrote: »

Magblades have died off and gone extinct every patch for the last what? 2 years?

Since Thieves Guild, ZOS has been slowly killing them

VvardeFellow · July 2017

I disagree with GO or ****. Since the days of UO (Ultima Online for millennials) which class was over powered one day was nerfed the next, before the word nerfed was even in use. Some of the changes are intentional, as a correction from internal testing or from players, some is unintentional. I think for the vast number of us, who may not be total mechanic to the Nth degree types, most changes are not a big deal, certainly not a deal breaker.

rhapsodious · July 2017

It's patch one of the PTS. Give them the time to re-evaluate it and constructively express your concerns. They respond a lot more to identifying specific issues than crying that the class is "dead" with no other comments. I still miss the old Siphoning Attacks a lot, but the version that made it to live is leaps and bounds above what PTS patch one had. (Also keep in mind that even though it lasted for two years, it was technically a bug...)

That being said, I'd appreciate if the proc chance for scathing was upped, or we got more sources of direct damage.

I'm still going to be running trials on my nightblade, just like I did in Homestead. Never give up, never surrender! ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ

max_only · July 2017

I use Refreshing path anyway.... but I never geared for dps. That's why my Nb is a tank- no expectation for damage.

They killed magblades when they changed Siphoning Attacks. Spend magic to gain magic? BS. I want to see them try that shniz with Dark Deal. They need to revert Siphoning Attacks. I accepted I'm a masochist for playing nightblade.

It's been Sorc-owind this entire time. It was Sorc-stead as well. It was One Tamri-sorc too. Old news bruh, if you play nightblade you've been Wrobel's little whipping birch this entire time.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

rhapsodious wrote: »

It's patch one of the PTS. Give them the time to re-evaluate it and constructively express your concerns. They respond a lot more to identifying specific issues than crying that the class is "dead" with no other comments. I still miss the old Siphoning Attacks a lot, but the version that made it to live is leaps and bounds above what PTS patch one had. (Also keep in mind that even though it lasted for two years, it was technically a bug...)

That being said, I'd appreciate if the proc chance for scathing was upped, or we got more sources of direct damage.

I'm still going to be running trials on my nightblade, just like I did in Homestead. Never give up, never surrender! ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ

[snip]
"It's only patch one" LMFAO

Oh, this poor child... You actually believe that ZoS values your opinion or that they make changes based on player feedback? After EVERYTHING that happened during the Morrowind PTS.... [snip]

[Edited for flaming]

Stovahkiin · July 2017

Oh totally, OP. I mean, I've never seen a class other than sorcs get kills in pvp, it's ridiculous! It's like all of my other class abilities and skill lines are completely useless now and all I can do is QQ on the forums.

#sarcasm, go git good

ChildOfLight · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

"GO SORC OR GTFO"

There are no other choices anymore. Grab a lightning staff, get your Necropotence set, and hold down the attack button.

And what about stamDk?

The overall feeling is that to complete use DK Kit you are forced to go magika.

Plus the combustion nerf is a flat nerf ONLY for the stamina class.

Guessing how things will go on in pvp next patch for the stamDK after the Viper Set nerf:

Noxious Breath, Venomous Claw and then you have just to hope your opponent to die of old age.

Edit: The Train of ClassDiversity is long gone my friends.

Vercingetorix · July 2017

max_only wrote: »

I use Refreshing path anyway.... but I never geared for dps.

They killed magblades when they changed Siphoning Attacks. Spend magic to gain magic? BS. I want to see the try that shniz with Dark Deal.

It's been Sorc-owind this entire time. It was Sorc-stead as well. It was One Tamri-sorc too. Old news bruh, if you play nightblade you've been Wrobel's little whipping birch this entire time.

No, I gave up on NB a long time ago. I also stopped using Sorc when Thieves Guild ruined wards in PvE all because some kids qq'd in PvP. Can't cast *** with DK because everything costs 4K+ magicka. Templars aren't much better and lost their most important feature, Major Mending, that made them worth running. Wardens are overpowered in PvP and trash in PvE, so ZoS can't touch them as a result. People wanting their "bear buff" or "dps buff" will never get it.

There are no classes left to play. Nothing is fun - the game has become a chore. Sorc is the only viable DPS without having to jump through hoops to get it to work. Then, it still sucks because 80% of the time is spent holding down the attack button with a lightning staff.

Chairo_Kuma · July 2017

Chill out man. Readjust your CP and go make yourself a set of Julianos or get yourself a set of War Maiden twisting Path was always meant to be scaled off of thaumaturge and yes I do play a magblade.

DRXHarbinger · July 2017

How are magdks struggling???? Seriously. Too many scrubs need to l2p DK. I swear some people read the 1st page of this forum in the morning and then spam guild chats crying the world is ending..."everyone roll sorcs now"

casparian · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

altemriel wrote: »

Sigtric wrote: »

Magblades have died off and gone extinct every patch for the last what? 2 years?

and still people like Kena or Sypher can play them deadly

PvP performance is not indicative of PvE performance, which is the more important factor. Also, Sypher doesn't really play that much anymore, either. I've never heard of this "Kena" person and frankly, one person's performance does not indicate the level of performance of a class across the entire player base.

You don't know who he is because he uses cloak so effectively.

max_only · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

I use Refreshing path anyway.... but I never geared for dps.

They killed magblades when they changed Siphoning Attacks. Spend magic to gain magic? BS. I want to see the try that shniz with Dark Deal.

It's been Sorc-owind this entire time. It was Sorc-stead as well. It was One Tamri-sorc too. Old news bruh, if you play nightblade you've been Wrobel's little whipping birch this entire time.

No, I gave up on NB a long time ago. I also stopped using Sorc when Thieves Guild ruined wards in PvE all because some kids qq'd in PvP. Can't cast *** with DK because everything costs 4K+ magicka. Templars aren't much better and lost their most important feature, Major Mending, that made them worth running. Wardens are overpowered in PvP and trash in PvE, so ZoS can't touch them as a result. People wanting their "bear buff" or "dps buff" will never get it.

There are no classes left to play. Nothing is fun - the game has become a chore. Sorc is the only viable DPS without having to jump through hoops to get it to work. Then, it still sucks because 80% of the time is spent holding down the attack button with a lightning staff.

This is a joke response? Did you forget the /sarcasm?

Edit: Oh I get it now. The new heavy attack meta. Gotcha.

rhapsodious · July 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

rhapsodious wrote: »

It's patch one of the PTS. Give them the time to re-evaluate it and constructively express your concerns. They respond a lot more to identifying specific issues than crying that the class is "dead" with no other comments. I still miss the old Siphoning Attacks a lot, but the version that made it to live is leaps and bounds above what PTS patch one had. (Also keep in mind that even though it lasted for two years, it was technically a bug...)

That being said, I'd appreciate if the proc chance for scathing was upped, or we got more sources of direct damage.

I'm still going to be running trials on my nightblade, just like I did in Homestead. Never give up, never surrender! ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ

[snip]
"It's only patch one" LMFAO

Oh, this poor child... You actually believe that ZoS values your opinion or that they make changes based on player feedback? After EVERYTHING that happened during the Morrowind PTS.... [snip]

I'm not stupid, but thanks for the unneeded personal attack. They have actually changed stuff in response to player feedback, even if it wasn't a full revert. I even cited Siphoning Attacks as an example. They made it significantly better than what they had patch one. They made changes to light and heavy attacking to support the sustain changes. They reverted the Khajiit passive on SOTH PTS, and reverted Bone Shield one of those patches. They do, and have, reverted changes. It doesn't happen often, and I'm not saying it's likely, but it's possible. Your attitude certainly isn't going to inspire them to fix anything.

They have their vision for the game, and they rarely waver from it, but they make concessions for play styles every now and then.

[Edit to match quoted comment]

Morvane · July 2017

this is a payment for sorc pain during 1st Era (year) from release

and do u remember how OP was DK's? DKs were everywhere
and where is topics something like "DK DOMINATION? NEVER AGAIN"

Vercingetorix · July 2017

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

How are magdks struggling???? Seriously. Too many scrubs need to l2p DK. I swear some people read the 1st page of this forum in the morning and then spam guild chats crying the world is ending..."everyone roll sorcs now"

As I told someone else, everything costs 4K+ magicka - you *** through your magicka bar and Battle Roar (the only form of sutain a DK gets) now gives crap resources due to the "balance" adjustment. PvE performance is the issue - performance in PvP is irrelevant because everyone zergs: when there's 20+ players firing crap at your enemy, everything is "viable".

imredneckson · July 2017

Lmao it's the end of all classes other than sorcs xD. I think I'll stick with my "dead" Templar and play how I want. The only advice I can give ya OP is Darwin adapt or die aka improvise or rerole

Vercingetorix · July 2017

rhapsodious wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

rhapsodious wrote: »

It's patch one of the PTS. Give them the time to re-evaluate it and constructively express your concerns. They respond a lot more to identifying specific issues than crying that the class is "dead" with no other comments. I still miss the old Siphoning Attacks a lot, but the version that made it to live is leaps and bounds above what PTS patch one had. (Also keep in mind that even though it lasted for two years, it was technically a bug...)

That being said, I'd appreciate if the proc chance for scathing was upped, or we got more sources of direct damage.

I'm still going to be running trials on my nightblade, just like I did in Homestead. Never give up, never surrender! ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ

[snip]
"It's only patch one" LMFAO

Oh, this poor child... You actually believe that ZoS values your opinion or that they make changes based on player feedback? After EVERYTHING that happened during the Morrowind PTS.... [snip]

I'm not stupid, but thanks for the unneeded personal attack. They have actually changed stuff in response to player feedback, even if it wasn't a full revert. I even cited Siphoning Attacks as an example. They made it significantly better than what they had patch one. They made changes to light and heavy attacking to support the sustain changes. They reverted the Khajiit passive on SOTH PTS, and reverted Bone Shield one of those patches. They do, and have, reverted changes. It doesn't happen often, and I'm not saying it's likely, but it's possible. Your attitude certainly isn't going to inspire them to fix anything.

They have their vision for the game, and they rarely waver from it, but they make concessions for play styles every now and then.

Their "vision" is going to lead this game into a nearby dumpster. They don't fix problems, they create EVEN MORE problems, and worst of all, they refuse to speak about it to the player base. Siphoning Attacks never needed to be touched in the first place - it was literally the only thing NB's had left. Medium weaving, which is essential for magNB, is all but extinct.

[Edit to match quoted comment]

Vercingetorix · July 2017

imredneckson wrote: »

Lmao it's the end of all classes other than sorcs xD. I think I'll stick with my "dead" Templar and play how I want. The only advice I can give ya OP is Darwin adapt or die aka improvise or rerole

Every class is viable for flower-picking and writ crafting. This isn't about that.

SanTii.92 · July 2017

Keep_Door wrote: »

Overreacting much ?

Yes.

No he isn't. He lost 50-70 spell dmge, can't you see the tragedy?