[Solved] Character appearance should NOT give me an unfair disadvantage in PvP

Voxicity · June 2017

Edit: According to most players this was a design choice to have your characters appearance dictate game mechanics, therefore I don't think there's gonna be much change so I decided to buy an appearance change to rectify this mistake. But this thread can be a heads up to people who may think about creating a tiny bosmer and don't want to have an unfair disadvantage in PvP. Cheers

I created a bosmer at almost the smallest height and little did I know this would actually end up biting me in the butt later down the line. While questing in morrowind I noticed that my wife's character could run through pools of shallow water with no problem, however I had to swim through them, directly behind her. We found it pretty funny and joked about it at first, but then a couple of weeks later, when taking our chars into PvP, I experienced something no one should ever experience in this game, which is an unfair advantage due to my characters appearance. I forget exactly where it was but I was fighting in a pool of water and the enemy could run around, dodge, use abilities etc while my dumb bosmer was there swimming around having a pool party. Obviously I couldn't use any abilities while swimming or dodge roll etc, in the exact same pool of water as my enemy. So I got rekt for something that wasn't my fault at all.

Now I'm no min-maxer, currently playing a bosmer magward, but I certainly don't wanna be having to literally avoid fighting in the shallowest pools of water. Is there anything that can be done about this or am I gonna have to fork out some real life money to buy an appearance change?

Video demonstrating this problem:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSMvW_7nhxw

Voxicity · June 2017

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

vrine · June 2017

Thanks for sharing this! I created the shortest possible bosmer too (also a warden) and pools in Cyrodil get me every time, when they usually wouldn't on my other characters. Pretty unfair that appearance can have silent effects like this.

CaptainBeerDude · June 2017

#shortpeopleproblems

Seriously.

Just curious, do you also have a smaller hit box?

SOLOistheNAME · June 2017

My wood elf goes through the same thing as well. Lol

vyndral13preub18_ESO · June 2017

On the good side all you short Bosmer look super cute while doing anything!

laksikus · June 2017

Well, it makes sense.
In skyrim the fastest char was altmer cos they were the tallest race and had the longest legs.

It's just realistic and fine for me

ThoraxtheDark · June 2017

realism at its finest lol. hard not to laugh though. maybe zos can have a crown store item , like shoe lifts?

CherryCake · June 2017

D`awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

!!!

Toc de Malsvi · June 2017

And all this time I thought I was just catching the edge of the deep end...

bennysbeastb16_ESO2 · June 2017

funny thing is people create small charector to avoid targetting in groups.. as we all know harder to see someone small in mid of normal charectors,

so i see this as Karma, you cant have it all ways..

Wolfenbelle · June 2017

Character size matters in other ways too. Climbing over rocks and other obstacles, for example. I noticed long ago that my "average" size Templar and smallish Sorc (females) had a more difficult time climbing over things than other taller (mostly male) characters. Mostly it never bothered me, but it does in groups when everyone is going somewhere fast and I'd be slow climbing rocks or something.

By the way, my Templar and Sorc are not small Bosmers. The Templar was an Imperial for three years until I recently changed her to Redguard, and the Sorc is a Breton.

Fur_like_snow · June 2017

Always make my orcs tall and THICK some characters look like children standing beside them. makes me laugh when I see tiny little keebler elves running around bunch of turbo manlets LOL. I'm pretty sure your hit box is smaller so I guess you got that going for you.

Voxicity · June 2017

laksikus wrote: »

Well, it makes sense.
In skyrim the fastest char was altmer cos they were the tallest race and had the longest legs.

It's just realistic and fine for me

That's fair enough in a single player game, but when we're talking about PvP to me it seems a bit strange that my characters appearance gives me a disadvantage or an advantage in different situations

Especially because I had no idea this would be the case when creating the character

ofSunhold · June 2017

Stick to the high ground?

Hope you can get a fix, but I suspect you'll have to go for appearance change token. GL

Sylosi · June 2017

laksikus wrote: »

Well, it makes sense.
In skyrim the fastest char was altmer cos they were the tallest race and had the longest legs.

It's just realistic and fine for me

Bringing "realism" into a video game doesn't make sense in the first place, I mean if realism was the factor to base things on then when your level 50 character died, that would be it, you'd have to roll a new lvl character, because that would be "realistic", but of course the game doesn't work like that, because gameplay > realism.

Bombashaman · June 2017

"Character appearance should NOT give me an unfair disadvantage in PvP"

Why not? You chose it. He is small. Ponds are deep. He can't run underwater.

Then again, he is small, harder to detect. Does it not even out?

And yes one of my toons is the smallest female Bosmer you could make.

xerikos · June 2017

I made two Bosmers, both to the smallest height possible mainly because that give the appearance they run faster than anyone else (even though I know that's not what really happens). And I'm pretty OK if they have this "problem" OP is describing because that's what's supposed to be.

In PVP I never run to the pools when trying an escape, not only because I know chances are I will have to swim, but because even if I could run through OK doing so will slow down the escape anyway.

More than Bosmer having this issue, I find it totally odd that Argonians, the best swimmers in the game and fit to watery environments by their very nature, also suffer from this slow down pace when entering water, when I would expect they should run at normal speed.

code65536 · June 2017

LOL.

This isn't a new problem. Some months ago, someone reported a similar problem in vMA stage 7, where a short bosmer would end up swimming in certain portions of the poison cleanse pool.

But, as others pointed out, if your character's hit box is smaller, wouldn't that be a kind of a compensatory advantage?

DeadlyRecluse · June 2017

It's worse than you think.

Last time i checked, character height determined when you got dismounted while riding by water....

reiverx · June 2017

I get dismounted in knee deep water.

This is actually how horses work though. Every video you have ever seen of a horse in deeper water is a fake. Every single one.

Voxicity · June 2017

Bombashaman wrote: »

"Character appearance should NOT give me an unfair disadvantage in PvP"

Why not? You chose it. He is small. Ponds are deep. He can't run underwater.

Then again, he is small, harder to detect. Does it not even out?

And yes one of my toons is the smallest female Bosmer you could make.

Sure it may even out, but the fact is I had no idea about these advantages or disadvantages before creating the character. Granted, I should have made a test character to test all of these things out beforehand, but still. Plus the 'pond' was not deep. It barely even reached my characters knees in the situation I described in pvp.

Character appearance should have no impact on in game mechanics.

Plus it's not even that he is submerged in the water. If you look at the video I linked, my wife's character is pretty much the same height and thus would have pretty much the same hit box as me. However her character can walk through water mounted or not perfectly fine.

Voxicity · June 2017

code65536 wrote: »

LOL.

This isn't a new problem. Some months ago, someone reported a similar problem in vMA stage 7, where a short bosmer would end up swimming in certain portions of the poison cleanse pool.

But, as others pointed out, if your character's hit box is smaller, wouldn't that be a kind of a compensatory advantage?

I don't really understand why people are justifying this awful bug by saying because the hit box is smaller (i have no idea if it is or not).

Your characters appearance in this game should NOT affect in game mechanics whatsoever. And if it did, they should communicate it more clearly when creating the character.

Voxicity · June 2017

xerikos wrote: »

I made two Bosmers, both to the smallest height possible mainly because that give the appearance they run faster than anyone else (even though I know that's not what really happens). And I'm pretty OK if they have this "problem" OP is describing because that's what's supposed to be.

In PVP I never run to the pools when trying an escape, not only because I know chances are I will have to swim, but because even if I could run through OK doing so will slow down the escape anyway.

More than Bosmer having this issue, I find it totally odd that Argonians, the best swimmers in the game and fit to watery environments by their very nature, also suffer from this slow down pace when entering water, when I would expect they should run at normal speed.

In my case it wasn't that I was trying to escape. I was trying to fight the enemy which was in the shallow water near the resource and I was unable to use abilities or dodge roll his attacks.

Technically that player could literally sit in that pool spamming me with ranged attacks while I would have no way to reach him if I didn't have a ranged attack on. All because of my character's appearance.

Also by pool I don't mean enough water to even reach the characters knees. I'm talking like a tiny puddle.

zaria · June 2017

laksikus wrote: »

Well, it makes sense.
In skyrim the fastest char was altmer cos they were the tallest race and had the longest legs.

It's just realistic and fine for me

Well its not realistic that it affect you then mounted. If anything mount height should determine how deep water it could take.

Fodore · June 2017

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

Always make my orcs tall and THICK some characters look like children standing beside them. makes me laugh when I see tiny little keebler elves running around bunch of turbo manlets LOL. I'm pretty sure your hit box is smaller so I guess you got that going for you.

Ehem, I believe the correct term is thicc

Enslaved · June 2017

So, you picked a hobbit yet you want to move over land as giant.
6055926+_e1415bfb5d855a39fa0e3c663dc555a9.jpg

Faylis · June 2017

Voxicity wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

LOL.

This isn't a new problem. Some months ago, someone reported a similar problem in vMA stage 7, where a short bosmer would end up swimming in certain portions of the poison cleanse pool.

But, as others pointed out, if your character's hit box is smaller, wouldn't that be a kind of a compensatory advantage?

I don't really understand why people are justifying this awful bug by saying because the hit box is smaller

It's not a bug, it's a choice that you made...FFS

Beardimus · June 2017

I think a smaller hit box would be something to kick off about like the N64 days everyone played as OddJob in GoldenEye

But height, I'm kinda ok with it. It's pretty explanatory that you wouldn't reach the bottom. Otherwise it could start to be unrealistic that you are fully submerged yet still running.

I prefer more realism in games so I'm kinda impressed it works this way.

(i too have a ultra small bosmer Alt)

Axoinus · June 2017

Don't go in the water.

BloodWolfe · June 2017

Your hit box is smaller which is the advantage of a smaller character. Your height is not just an "appearance", it is technically a physical attribute so STOP referring to it as your "characters appearance" because appearance is your face, hair, etc.... Size is a physical attribute not an aesthetic appearance as you claim! You went small to be less noticeable and for a harder target so accept this limitation with the water. Taller characters are easily noticed and easier to hit but can walk in shallow pools too deep for shorter characters.

You want to have your cake and eat it too but it just doesn't work that way. Are they supposed to make you like Jesus and walk on water FFS?!?! Choices make a difference and I am glad they paid attention to this level of detail. Don't like it then make a taller character!