What an interesting read. Glad I didn't buy the cave. I was very sorely tempted to, but decided against it as it was a /lot/ of money to drop on a digital area.
Gina's comment says they closed off an area that was not intended for use. Thus it is clear you were never supposed to be able to go there.
Gina's comment says they closed off an area that was not intended for use. Thus it is clear you were never supposed to be able to go there.
Hi again. I'm in the process of putting all evidence together... However, just going over Gina's comment, I have noticed that you have paraphrased her and thus changed the meaning of ZOS's statement. I'm pointing this out here, not as an argument, or attack, but just to highlight to everyone concerned with this debate, that this is not what was said. It's important to keep on track with specificity.
Gina never stated they closed off an area inside the Cavern that was not intended for use. The statement was "this was actually an intentional change in order to prevent an issue where you could access an unplayable area outside of the home".
So, this clarification brings an end to the argument or debate about the unplayable area being inside the base. It is NOT. ZOS has declared the unplayable area was OUTSIDE the home, not inside.
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Ok everyone, regarding the changes made to Earthtear Cavern, this was actually an intentional change in order to prevent an issue where you could access an unplayable area outside of the home. As such, we will not be reverting this change since it was done to fix an issue. These changes went live sooner than we expected, which is why there wasn't a documented patch note for it; we apologize for the confusion this caused.
Which area outside of the house was it giving access to, and how? Why is that even an issue? Why do far more serious issues get ignored while a $150 item has part of it removed for a bogus excuse as the *only* time something is ever supposedly "fixed" ?
Refunds for all the people ZOS scammed?
Honestly i very much doubt that's the true answer for the changes
Stopnaggin wrote: »ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Ok everyone, regarding the changes made to Earthtear Cavern, this was actually an intentional change in order to prevent an issue where you could access an unplayable area outside of the home. As such, we will not be reverting this change since it was done to fix an issue. These changes went live sooner than we expected, which is why there wasn't a documented patch note for it; we apologize for the confusion this caused.
Which area outside of the house was it giving access to, and how? Why is that even an issue? Why do far more serious issues get ignored while a $150 item has part of it removed for a bogus excuse as the *only* time something is ever supposedly "fixed" ?
Refunds for all the people ZOS scammed?
Honestly i very much doubt that's the true answer for the changes
There were areas in the cavern that you could get outside of the playable area. I have done it. With that being said, I don't like the fact they changed it to this extent. An invisible wall would have fixed the problem, add a pile of boulders
psychotrip wrote: »
atlgirl29_ESO wrote: »psychotrip wrote: »
13,000 crowns unfurnished, 16,300 furnished.. it's roughly $130 furnished. Edit: (not including if you bought extra furniture packs via the crown store to decorate)
To make sure I understand the situation correctly, I'm going to analogize the thread...
I go and look at a condo or house for sale @ a price of $130,000, it is shown to me and listed at 1300 sq. ft. and I verify this by exploring all rooms, closets etc., I like it , choose to buy it and begin to move in. 1 month later, I come home from work to find a storage closet is now gone. Like, the door is gone and it has been dry walled over. Thus making my home now 1200 sq. ft. and ~1 month after that I'm contacted after multiple inquiries and told that the area was not even supposed to have been built.
If this is correct, then aside from all the legalities of actually changing something after the sale, wouldn't the seller also have to offer some sort of compensation for changing the amount of space offered for x price to a now smaller amount of space?
Note: I did not purchase this home myself (I went with the Cyrodiil Jungle House) but am sympathetic for those who did as this seems like a pile of BS. And if they are allowed to get away with it once, then where will the line be drawn? Aesthetic things like other homes, mounts, costumes? Or Even full areas of DLC/expansions? What if they decide to make a Trial smaller, or even bigger but flip it and say you have to pay more now?
Kind of scary as a consumer, and leaving me not wanting to spend money on anything else regarding the game.
To make sure I understand the situation correctly, I'm going to analogize the thread...
I go and look at a condo or house for sale @ a price of $130,000, it is shown to me and listed at 1300 sq. ft. and I verify this by exploring all rooms, closets etc., I like it , choose to buy it and begin to move in. 1 month later, I come home from work to find a storage closet is now gone. Like, the door is gone and it has been dry walled over. Thus making my home now 1200 sq. ft. and ~1 month after that I'm contacted after multiple inquiries and told that the area was not even supposed to have been built.
If this is correct, then aside from all the legalities of actually changing something after the sale, wouldn't the seller also have to offer some sort of compensation for changing the amount of space offered for x price to a now smaller amount of space?
Note: I did not purchase this home myself (I went with the Cyrodiil Jungle House) but am sympathetic for those who did as this seems like a pile of BS. And if they are allowed to get away with it once, then where will the line be drawn? Aesthetic things like other homes, mounts, costumes? Or Even full areas of DLC/expansions? What if they decide to make a Trial smaller, or even bigger but flip it and say you have to pay more now?
Kind of scary as a consumer, and leaving me not wanting to spend money on anything else regarding the game.
First issue. You dont BUY anything on ESO. You sign a long term lease. ZoS still owns it. If they shut down the servers tomorrow.. no one will own any property in ESO.
As a landlord, I reserve the right to make changes to any property I for which, I own the title. Including removing a closet.
To make sure I understand the situation correctly, I'm going to analogize the thread...
I go and look at a condo or house for sale @ a price of $130,000, it is shown to me and listed at 1300 sq. ft. and I verify this by exploring all rooms, closets etc., I like it , choose to buy it and begin to move in. 1 month later, I come home from work to find a storage closet is now gone. Like, the door is gone and it has been dry walled over. Thus making my home now 1200 sq. ft. and ~1 month after that I'm contacted after multiple inquiries and told that the area was not even supposed to have been built.
If this is correct, then aside from all the legalities of actually changing something after the sale, wouldn't the seller also have to offer some sort of compensation for changing the amount of space offered for x price to a now smaller amount of space?
Note: I did not purchase this home myself (I went with the Cyrodiil Jungle House) but am sympathetic for those who did as this seems like a pile of BS. And if they are allowed to get away with it once, then where will the line be drawn? Aesthetic things like other homes, mounts, costumes? Or Even full areas of DLC/expansions? What if they decide to make a Trial smaller, or even bigger but flip it and say you have to pay more now?
Kind of scary as a consumer, and leaving me not wanting to spend money on anything else regarding the game.
First issue. You dont BUY anything on ESO. You sign a long term lease. ZoS still owns it. If they shut down the servers tomorrow.. no one will own any property in ESO.
As a landlord, I reserve the right to make changes to any property I for which, I own the title. Including removing a closet.
Just for the sake of argument - you might be well within your rights as a property owner to come and sneakily wall off the closet in the middle of the night with no warning whatsoever, however if you were to do that I could see the renting people moving out really quick and telling everyone they know to never rent anything from you again. Is that closet's privacy really worth that?
Side note, this may be legal(I can't believe they can possibly not allow refunds after changing things bought with real money. Is there seriously no law against that?) but it's just a very mean thing to do and just goes to show (for those who needed another proof) how much Zenimax cares for its customers, even the generously paying ones.
To make sure I understand the situation correctly, I'm going to analogize the thread...
I go and look at a condo or house for sale @ a price of $130,000, it is shown to me and listed at 1300 sq. ft. and I verify this by exploring all rooms, closets etc., I like it , choose to buy it and begin to move in. 1 month later, I come home from work to find a storage closet is now gone. Like, the door is gone and it has been dry walled over. Thus making my home now 1200 sq. ft. and ~1 month after that I'm contacted after multiple inquiries and told that the area was not even supposed to have been built.
If this is correct, then aside from all the legalities of actually changing something after the sale, wouldn't the seller also have to offer some sort of compensation for changing the amount of space offered for x price to a now smaller amount of space?
Note: I did not purchase this home myself (I went with the Cyrodiil Jungle House) but am sympathetic for those who did as this seems like a pile of BS. And if they are allowed to get away with it once, then where will the line be drawn? Aesthetic things like other homes, mounts, costumes? Or Even full areas of DLC/expansions? What if they decide to make a Trial smaller, or even bigger but flip it and say you have to pay more now?
Kind of scary as a consumer, and leaving me not wanting to spend money on anything else regarding the game.
First issue. You dont BUY anything on ESO. You sign a long term lease. ZoS still owns it. If they shut down the servers tomorrow.. no one will own any property in ESO.
As a landlord, I reserve the right to make changes to any property I for which, I own the title. Including removing a closet.
To make sure I understand the situation correctly, I'm going to analogize the thread...
I go and look at a condo or house for sale @ a price of $130,000, it is shown to me and listed at 1300 sq. ft. and I verify this by exploring all rooms, closets etc., I like it , choose to buy it and begin to move in. 1 month later, I come home from work to find a storage closet is now gone. Like, the door is gone and it has been dry walled over. Thus making my home now 1200 sq. ft. and ~1 month after that I'm contacted after multiple inquiries and told that the area was not even supposed to have been built.
If this is correct, then aside from all the legalities of actually changing something after the sale, wouldn't the seller also have to offer some sort of compensation for changing the amount of space offered for x price to a now smaller amount of space?
Note: I did not purchase this home myself (I went with the Cyrodiil Jungle House) but am sympathetic for those who did as this seems like a pile of BS. And if they are allowed to get away with it once, then where will the line be drawn? Aesthetic things like other homes, mounts, costumes? Or Even full areas of DLC/expansions? What if they decide to make a Trial smaller, or even bigger but flip it and say you have to pay more now?
Kind of scary as a consumer, and leaving me not wanting to spend money on anything else regarding the game.
First issue. You dont BUY anything on ESO. You sign a long term lease. ZoS still owns it. If they shut down the servers tomorrow.. no one will own any property in ESO.
As a landlord, I reserve the right to make changes to any property I for which, I own the title. Including removing a closet.
I think both analogies are good and correct... However, they are just analogies.
In reality the core issue is the trend towards the players in this game. The main issue is gamers have paid for something expensive, only to have it changed, without notice, reducing the amount of room you can build, when there are already issues with good building areas that are walled off by invisible walls and thus inaccesible, unplayable/un-useable. In a ESO home that has months of reported issues, where these issues could have been fixed, someone at ZOS decided to just go around changing other things on a whim.
Analogies and metaphors aside, the key points to this issue are:
1. The game in general has lots of things that need fixing... but haven't been fixed
2. This particular property has things reported that need fixing... but haven't been fixed
3. A ZOS staff member changed the property cosmetically, reducing building area, for no actual real reason... and when so many things in the game actually needed to be fixed (points 1 and 2). Added a rock in the middle of the water, which just serves no purpose and looks stupid as its floating. And the Cavern now rains INSIDE even though it has a ceiling. This was all a waste of time and serves no resl reason.
4. The issue was reported... but over 4 weeks, no one at ZOS seemed to know who at ZOS changed the property and why.
5. The issue went ignored for 4 weeks
6. Finally, because this thread was gaining more attention and not going away, a ZOS response was issued, that is transparent and holds no weight or logic. That the changes (ALL CHANGES affecting different areas) were intended, and made to stop people getting outside the home from ONE area into an unplayable area outside the home. Makes no sense why you would change multiple things if the reason you provide is to do with one area, that could just be fixed by another invisible wall, over all the other invisible walls.
7. Purchasers of this expensive crown-store-only purchase were informed that the changes will NOT be reverted.
If you wish to boil the whole thing down into a bite size chunk, it's this: Anything that anyone purchases from Crown Store with real money, can be changed at any time, at ZOS whim, and with complete disregard for how the player feels about it; and there is nothing the player can do or say about it.
That's not good business for ZOS, and does nothing for their ever eroding reputation.
(...)
Gina never stated they closed off an area inside the Cavern that was not intended for use. The statement was "this was actually an intentional change in order to prevent an issue where you could access an unplayable area outside of the home".
(...)
To make sure I understand the situation correctly, I'm going to analogize the thread...
I go and look at a condo or house for sale @ a price of $130,000, it is shown to me and listed at 1300 sq. ft. and I verify this by exploring all rooms, closets etc., I like it , choose to buy it and begin to move in. 1 month later, I come home from work to find a storage closet is now gone. Like, the door is gone and it has been dry walled over. Thus making my home now 1200 sq. ft. and ~1 month after that I'm contacted after multiple inquiries and told that the area was not even supposed to have been built.
If this is correct, then aside from all the legalities of actually changing something after the sale, wouldn't the seller also have to offer some sort of compensation for changing the amount of space offered for x price to a now smaller amount of space?
Note: I did not purchase this home myself (I went with the Cyrodiil Jungle House) but am sympathetic for those who did as this seems like a pile of BS. And if they are allowed to get away with it once, then where will the line be drawn? Aesthetic things like other homes, mounts, costumes? Or Even full areas of DLC/expansions? What if they decide to make a Trial smaller, or even bigger but flip it and say you have to pay more now?
Kind of scary as a consumer, and leaving me not wanting to spend money on anything else regarding the game.
First issue. You dont BUY anything on ESO. You sign a long term lease. ZoS still owns it. If they shut down the servers tomorrow.. no one will own any property in ESO.
As a landlord, I reserve the right to make changes to any property I for which, I own the title. Including removing a closet.
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Ok everyone, regarding the changes made to Earthtear Cavern, this was actually an intentional change in order to prevent an issue where you could access an unplayable area outside of the home. As such, we will not be reverting this change since it was done to fix an issue. These changes went live sooner than we expected, which is why there wasn't a documented patch note for it; we apologize for the confusion this caused.
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Ok everyone, regarding the changes made to Earthtear Cavern, this was actually an intentional change in order to prevent an issue where you could access an unplayable area outside of the home. As such, we will not be reverting this change since it was done to fix an issue. These changes went live sooner than we expected, which is why there wasn't a documented patch note for it; we apologize for the confusion this caused.
The issue is made all the worse by poor timing. The sustain changes upset much of the player base, but much of the drama revolves around the customers who keep paying. Logically speaking, these are the worst people to displease.
-Morrowind being reclassified so as not to be covered under ESO+
-Crown Crates introducing ultra-rare items that cannot be purchased
-Alteration of items people paid real world money for, for no justifiable reason
With the only improvement to this group being:
-increased bank space
Hitting this group with multiple controversial issues in such a small window is just a glaring misstep. Because some people are bothered by everything, but some people are only bothered by one thing, but all it means is that your flood is both very wide and having spots of deepness. Again, in the group you least want to annoy.
Like, personally, I have no problem with the first (which is the only one that effects me), but the other two (which funny enough, don't) bother me because I don't like the trend they set at all. But even though I'm not directly, negatively effected, this is making me wary as a paying customer of when it will be my turn to have something awful happen. Will my crafting nook in Ebonheart manor suddenly find itself inside a new wall? Will my DLC motifs have their appearances changed? Will my crown crystals suddenly and silently be reset if I don't use them? Will my dwarven spider mount suddenly become a giant mudcrab? Nothing so far tells me that this won't be happening.
psychotrip wrote: »Welp, here it is, at last. I tried to chronicle this entire experience, but let me know if I missed anything: https://comicsverse.com/elder-scrolls-online-housing/
Lady_Rosabella wrote: »psychotrip wrote: »Welp, here it is, at last. I tried to chronicle this entire experience, but let me know if I missed anything: https://comicsverse.com/?p=152791&preview=true&preview_id=152791&preview_nonce=15c74e4844&post_format=standard&_thumbnail_id=152881
I tried the link and it said "Sorry you are not allowed to preview drafts"
Lady_Rosabella wrote: »psychotrip wrote: »Welp, here it is, at last. I tried to chronicle this entire experience, but let me know if I missed anything: https://comicsverse.com/?p=152791&preview=true&preview_id=152791&preview_nonce=15c74e4844&post_format=standard&_thumbnail_id=152881
I tried the link and it said "Sorry you are not allowed to preview drafts"
yes, correct one is this one:
https://comicsverse.com/elder-scrolls-online-housing/
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Ok everyone, regarding the changes made to Earthtear Cavern, this was actually an intentional change in order to prevent an issue where you could access an unplayable area outside of the home. As such, we will not be reverting this change since it was done to fix an issue. These changes went live sooner than we expected, which is why there wasn't a documented patch note for it; we apologize for the confusion this caused.
This is a really terrible decision. It's quite obvious you guys have much more precise world building assets at your disposal than giant boulders. Surely someone could have come up with a more effective solution with a flat rock wall or something instead? A cave wall rather than a giant rock? Pretty much anything.
Breeding this kind of uncertainty with a house mod that's more expensive than the entire game and its DLCs is just plain wrong. I'd not be surprised if it violates some sort of consumer rights laws for selling something that no longer matches the product promised to those who bought it.
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Ok everyone, regarding the changes made to Earthtear Cavern, this was actually an intentional change in order to prevent an issue where you could access an unplayable area outside of the home. As such, we will not be reverting this change since it was done to fix an issue. These changes went live sooner than we expected, which is why there wasn't a documented patch note for it; we apologize for the confusion this caused.
This is a really terrible decision. It's quite obvious you guys have much more precise world building assets at your disposal than giant boulders. Surely someone could have come up with a more effective solution with a flat rock wall or something instead? A cave wall rather than a giant rock? Pretty much anything.
Breeding this kind of uncertainty with a house mod that's more expensive than the entire game and its DLCs is just plain wrong. I'd not be surprised if it violates some sort of consumer rights laws for selling something that no longer matches the product promised to those who bought it.
Exactly. Collision planes can be placed much more intricately than just putting a big rock in the room. They just took the lazy man's way out and now are trying to justify their position.
To make sure I understand the situation correctly, I'm going to analogize the thread...
I go and look at a condo or house for sale @ a price of $130,000, it is shown to me and listed at 1300 sq. ft. and I verify this by exploring all rooms, closets etc., I like it , choose to buy it and begin to move in. 1 month later, I come home from work to find a storage closet is now gone. Like, the door is gone and it has been dry walled over. Thus making my home now 1200 sq. ft. and ~1 month after that I'm contacted after multiple inquiries and told that the area was not even supposed to have been built.
If this is correct, then aside from all the legalities of actually changing something after the sale, wouldn't the seller also have to offer some sort of compensation for changing the amount of space offered for x price to a now smaller amount of space?
Note: I did not purchase this home myself (I went with the Cyrodiil Jungle House) but am sympathetic for those who did as this seems like a pile of BS. And if they are allowed to get away with it once, then where will the line be drawn? Aesthetic things like other homes, mounts, costumes? Or Even full areas of DLC/expansions? What if they decide to make a Trial smaller, or even bigger but flip it and say you have to pay more now?
Kind of scary as a consumer, and leaving me not wanting to spend money on anything else regarding the game.
First issue. You dont BUY anything on ESO. You sign a long term lease. ZoS still owns it. If they shut down the servers tomorrow.. no one will own any property in ESO.
As a landlord, I reserve the right to make changes to any property I for which, I own the title. Including removing a closet.