TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Jawasa wrote: »

All shield sets are kinda weak because They are cut i half. So a 4K shield every 6 sek is not that good for example.

A 4k damage shield every 6 secs is 40k complete damage negation per minute...

That's very valuable IMHO...

1) Combat Physician Armor set...
2) High Spell Crit...
3) Profit...

But why would you go with something like Combat Phys, when you can use Wizards Riposte which is much more effective.

Wizards Riposte is only effective against opponents that attack you directly...correct?

Combat Physician can benefit any friendly around you; its better all-round IMHO...

But as a healer in any group you will be focused...a lot. So Wizards Riposte becomes more effective. If the shield wasnt so small on combat phys it would be really good, but as far as defensive light armour sets go in PvP it's definitely outpreformed by others. (Wizards Riposte, Transmutation....even Gossamer probably)

Lets do the math on 15% damage negation with Wizards Riposte...

It would reduce a 100 point attack down to 85; saves you 15 health...

It reduces a 1000 point attack down to 850; saves you 150 health...

It reduces a 10000 point attack down to 8500; saves you 1500 health...


The Combat Physician damage shield negates 4.1k damage in a 6 sec span; someone with Wizards Riposte would have to withstand 27340 damage in a 6 sec span just to equal the damage negation you get over 6 secs from Combat Physician (which means your Wizards Riposte user absorbed 23240 damage)...

Think about that...

Combat Physician is better than Wizards Riposte...

In just 1-2sec you can get hit with a suprise attack (~4k), incap (~6k), viper(~3k) and selene (~6k, total ~19k give or take)from one person. Open world you're very rarely going to encounter just one person, so taking 30k+ damage in 6 seconds is more than likely.

In that 19k burst situation, Combat Physician is better than Wizards Riposte; Wizards Riposte will only negate 2850 damage in that span...Combat Physician will negate 4100.


If you are in 5 Light Armor and are subject to a 30k burst, you aren't surviving it without shields; Wizards Riposte isn't saving you against that...

But me with my 28.6k health + my 4.1k Combat Physician shield will...

If you're talking solo then yeah Combat Physician will work wonders. However if you're in a group (which this thread is about), it's incredibly unreliable and will only affect one team mate every 6 seconds. However something like Wizards or Transmutation are always up and help every single player in the group.
In the situation I described earlier with the procblade...assume you're in a 3v5 fight when this burst occurs. Combat Physician proc'd 2 seconds ago on another ally. Now it's useless for the next 4 seconds while the stamblade is bursting your ally. However other sets like Transmutation, Gossamer or Wizards could potentially save them.
If you're solo or maybe 2 people then yeah Combat Physician is probably really good. But as far as group based pvp goes, Combat Physician isnt as good as it's alternatives.

If I'm in a group, I can insure that I get the damage shield...

Afterall, there are dps abilities that proc it...

That's part of the beauty with this set; I can simultaneously (and utilize it in this fashion on a regular basis) damage my opponent, heal, and proc the damage shield (all in a single button push)...


And yes, I do agree that in group PvP that some of the other sets outclass it...

But once again, as I've stated earlier, from top to bottom (in other words when factoring in every aspect of this game), Combat Physician is superior...

Transmutation (for example) is vastly inferior to Combat Physician in PvE, and so is Wizards Riposte when facing a single powerful opponent in PvE (as I demonstrated mathematically when facing a Overworld Boss)...


But to each his own...

Those other sets are good and shine in a more narrow set of circumstances than Combat Physician does...

This is a pvp healer thread...

In pve healers basically buff dps..

Jawasa wrote: »

A Guy ask for advice for a group pvp healer and then you prove that one set is better in solo overland pve the easiest content in the game.

I was thinking more in terms of fighting bosses in Imperial City...


Maybe I should have made that more clear...

It's a great question as i was looking for ideas for BG too

I roll with Heavy / Transmutation / vMA staves and do ok, but i wanted to learn the best skills as I'm still unsure what's best to slot.

Which purge also.

Tho i agree don't rule out Sorc Heal. They are very surviveable in PvP, and do better natural DPS/burst i think. I run both and whilst my HA Templar should be better i do better with the Pet Sorc

I think as she can kill things easier. Suriviveabily is ok if you want to get whaled on but if you can kill them....

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Jawasa wrote: »

All shield sets are kinda weak because They are cut i half. So a 4K shield every 6 sek is not that good for example.

A 4k damage shield every 6 secs is 40k complete damage negation per minute...

That's very valuable IMHO...

1) Combat Physician Armor set...
2) High Spell Crit...
3) Profit...

But why would you go with something like Combat Phys, when you can use Wizards Riposte which is much more effective.

Wizards Riposte is only effective against opponents that attack you directly...correct?

Combat Physician can benefit any friendly around you; its better all-round IMHO...

But as a healer in any group you will be focused...a lot. So Wizards Riposte becomes more effective. If the shield wasnt so small on combat phys it would be really good, but as far as defensive light armour sets go in PvP it's definitely outpreformed by others. (Wizards Riposte, Transmutation....even Gossamer probably)

Lets do the math on 15% damage negation with Wizards Riposte...

It would reduce a 100 point attack down to 85; saves you 15 health...

It reduces a 1000 point attack down to 850; saves you 150 health...

It reduces a 10000 point attack down to 8500; saves you 1500 health...


The Combat Physician damage shield negates 4.1k damage in a 6 sec span; someone with Wizards Riposte would have to withstand 27340 damage in a 6 sec span just to equal the damage negation you get over 6 secs from Combat Physician (which means your Wizards Riposte user absorbed 23240 damage)...

Think about that...

Combat Physician is better than Wizards Riposte...

In just 1-2sec you can get hit with a suprise attack (~4k), incap (~6k), viper(~3k) and selene (~6k, total ~19k give or take)from one person. Open world you're very rarely going to encounter just one person, so taking 30k+ damage in 6 seconds is more than likely.

In that 19k burst situation, Combat Physician is better than Wizards Riposte; Wizards Riposte will only negate 2850 damage in that span...Combat Physician will negate 4100.


If you are in 5 Light Armor and are subject to a 30k burst, you aren't surviving it without shields; Wizards Riposte isn't saving you against that...

But me with my 28.6k health + my 4.1k Combat Physician shield will...

If you're talking solo then yeah Combat Physician will work wonders. However if you're in a group (which this thread is about), it's incredibly unreliable and will only affect one team mate every 6 seconds. However something like Wizards or Transmutation are always up and help every single player in the group.
In the situation I described earlier with the procblade...assume you're in a 3v5 fight when this burst occurs. Combat Physician proc'd 2 seconds ago on another ally. Now it's useless for the next 4 seconds while the stamblade is bursting your ally. However other sets like Transmutation, Gossamer or Wizards could potentially save them.
If you're solo or maybe 2 people then yeah Combat Physician is probably really good. But as far as group based pvp goes, Combat Physician isnt as good as it's alternatives.

Transmutation (for example) is vastly inferior to Combat Physician in PvE, and so is Wizards Riposte when facing a single powerful opponent (as I demonstrated mathematically when facing a Overworld Boss)...

Yes, because NPCs don't do crit damage.

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

To those that champion Transmutation, isn't it capped at affecting the caster and up to 3 other players?

What % of a players crit damage is reduced by Transmutation btw? I'd like to know the numbers so I can actually calculate out the damage negation instead of just declaring it better than Combat Physician based on what people believe...

It may very well be better, but lets use a medium that wont pick sides...the math.


So give me numbers people...

The math tells me that (atleast based on one on one fights) that Combat Physician is superior to Wizards Riposte (how many targets can Wizards Riposte affect at once btw?)...

Lets see what the math says as pertains Transmutation vs Combat Physician...

It doesnt matter what the math says, if you're in a 4 man group and need to decide what sets to wear (which this thread is about), it's not a hard choice between a set that affects one ally every 6 seconds or one that affects most, if not all of them, during combat.

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

To those that champion Transmutation, isn't it capped at affecting the caster and up to 3 other players?

What % of a players crit damage is reduced by Transmutation btw? I'd like to know the numbers so I can actually calculate out the damage negation instead of just declaring it better than Combat Physician based on what people believe...

It may very well be better, but lets use a medium that wont pick sides...the math.


So give me numbers people...

The math tells me that (atleast based on one on one fights) that Combat Physician is superior to Wizards Riposte (how many targets can Wizards Riposte affect at once btw?)...

Lets see what the math says as pertains Transmutation vs Combat Physician...

It doesnt matter what the math says, if you're in a 4 man group and need to decide what sets to wear (which this thread is about), it's not a hard choice between a set that affects one ally every 6 seconds or one that affects most, if not all of them, during combat.

It absolutely matters what the math says; the math wont lie...

So the math matters; yes, Transmutation will protect the wearer and up to 3 additional targets, but to what extent?

I know that in a 1 minute period, I can theoretically get Combat Physician to proc 10 times and negate 40,000+ points of damage in that time span...

How much damage will Transmutation negate in an identical period of time?

Theoretically, yes. Realistically? No. You can not reliably proc it on allies when they need it. Eg. You cast Breath of Life because you need the shield but it crits on an ally rather than you resulting in a wasted proc and you now having to waste further resources in an effort to survive.

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Caza99 wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

To those that champion Transmutation, isn't it capped at affecting the caster and up to 3 other players?

What % of a players crit damage is reduced by Transmutation btw? I'd like to know the numbers so I can actually calculate out the damage negation instead of just declaring it better than Combat Physician based on what people believe...

It may very well be better, but lets use a medium that wont pick sides...the math.


So give me numbers people...

The math tells me that (atleast based on one on one fights) that Combat Physician is superior to Wizards Riposte (how many targets can Wizards Riposte affect at once btw?)...

Lets see what the math says as pertains Transmutation vs Combat Physician...

It doesnt matter what the math says, if you're in a 4 man group and need to decide what sets to wear (which this thread is about), it's not a hard choice between a set that affects one ally every 6 seconds or one that affects most, if not all of them, during combat.

It absolutely matters what the math says; the math wont lie...

So the math matters; yes, Transmutation will protect the wearer and up to 3 additional targets, but to what extent?

I know that in a 1 minute period, I can theoretically get Combat Physician to proc 10 times and negate 40,000+ points of damage in that time span...

How much damage will Transmutation negate in an identical period of time?

Theoretically, yes. Realistically? No. You can not reliably proc it on allies when they need it. Eg. You cast Breath of Life because you need the shield but it crits on an ally rather than you resulting in a wasted proc and you now having to waste further resources in an effort to survive.

Oh yes I can...

Here is one of the several awesome things about the Combat Physician armor set; it only procs if I hit you with a Crit Heal (and my Crit chance is around 67%, so 2 out of every 3 heals is a Crit on average)...

Thus, you only get it if you've been damaged, so you always get it when you need it...

As long as I keep Mutagen up along with Rite of Retribution, my teammates are getting heals constantly, and I see a lot of exclamation marks when healing like this...so yeah...I come close to my theorectical minute by minute damage negation performance regularly.

Because of that, I am able to negate a lot of incoming damage...

How about you give this gear set a chance and see for yourself...it absolutely rocks.

@exeeter702 ...nightblade "healer"...blew my mind on that one...that sounds like hella fun

Rianai wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Thus, you only get it if you've been damaged, so you always get it when you need it...

You don't neccessarily need a shield after you got damaged. You need a shield if you are about to take dmg. But since you have no control over when and on who the shield will proc, it can be completely wasted on somebody who doesn't take any dmg within those 6 seconds. And even if you would always get the full value out of it, it won't outperform transmutation or riposte in a group scenario.

So lets see your numbers and decide based on that...

You cant seriously be declaring Transmutation/Wizards better "just because"...

I've already provided solid numbers to support my belief that Combat Physician is better than Wizards Riposte; lets see yours that support your stance that Transmutation/Wizards is better, or are you just going to debate without anything of substance to back up your argument?


Edit: the Combat Physician shield allows you the opportunity to heal back to full health without sustaining further damage, and the chances are that whatever damaged you isn't going to land a single attack and just stop; the attacker will attack again...Combat Physician protects you from the second attack while allowing you time to heal in the process.

So players have to get hit by more than 27,3k dmg in 6 seconds for Riposte to be better? If you look at multiple players, that's nothing. A single EotS castet on 5 players can deal 20k+ dmg per second (assuming 4k dmg per hit - which is quite low actually). 2 seconds and we are already at 40k+ dmg. 10 players getting hit by 2 EotS which isn't an unrealistic scenario and we are already at 80k+ dmg taken per second. In that situation, riposte can mitigate 12k dmg/s and more. Add more players, more dmg skills, more aoe and the dmg flying arround will be higher and higher - and therefore the efficiency of riposte will rise. Meanwhile CP is capped at a maximum of 4,1k per 6 seconds (683/s), which would be in my example ~5% of the mitigation that WR would provide.

Similar is true for Transmutation. It provides 20% crit dmg reduction. If we assume 50% critchance, that's roughly 10% dmg reduction (to keep math simple) for everyone arround with pretty much 100% uptime. Looking at my 10 player getting hit by 2 EotS example, that's about 8k mitigation/s. Again, any additional dmg will increase the efficiency of transmutation compared to CP. Because it scales with the number of players and dmg involved.

CP will only be better if we look at a singe player who takes sustained dmg over time. Which is pretty much irrelevant when looking at actual pvp.

I would say, a healer should stay close to his allies. With WR + Trans you are quite tanky even in light armor, so you can take some hits without any issues. If he stays back, the healer becomes a good target for a gank. And CP will be most likely not up to save you then.
And you don't need 100% uptime of WR for it to be better. A single EotS caster critting you and it will pull ahead already.

You will get crit, don't worry. If you want it or not. And even if you would magically avoid getting critically hit at all, there is still transmutation ...

@Rianai

I appreciate the answers btw; you actually provided numbers to support your argument, and in the examples you gave, your numbers are sound...

So now, I'll concede; Transmutation and WR are both (especially Transmutation) potentially better than Combat Physician as pertains to damage negation...