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• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – September 8
• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
New Jump Points on almost every CP star - read before reassigning your CP
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FleetwoodSmack✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I'd... Just stay inside.
In seriousness though... Interesting results for sure. Tempted to check other forums about it after people have had a chance to play with it on live.Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies!1 -
TheRealPotoroo✭✭✭✭✭
✭IndyWendieGo wrote: »
I'd... Just stay inside.
In seriousness though... Interesting results for sure. Tempted to check other forums about it after people have had a chance to play with it on live.
It's real. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/340367/impact-of-mage-champion-point-rebalances/p1PC NA, PC EU
"Instead of taking the best of the dolmens (predictable rotation), the best of the geysers (scalability based on number of players), and the best of the dragons (map location and health indicators) and adding them together to make a fun and dynamic world event scenario, they gave us....... harrowstorms." https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6850523/#Comment_68505230 -
FleetwoodSmack✭✭✭✭✭
✭TheRealPotoroo wrote: »IndyWendieGo wrote: »
I'd... Just stay inside.
In seriousness though... Interesting results for sure. Tempted to check other forums about it after people have had a chance to play with it on live.
It's real. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/340367/impact-of-mage-champion-point-rebalances/p1
I know it's real. :P I wasn't contesting anything. I'm well aware of them since it was linked in the OP.Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies!0 -
Iselin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Jump points or no jump points you're all about to find out that 56CP and 75CP are going to be the most used allocations except in situations where you really can't think of anywhere else to add CP and waste 25 points for +1%.
On any +15% situation, 56 gets you 12% and 75 gets you 14%. The diminishing returns are rather harsh and will definitely get you looking at spreading things around a bit more.1 -
sekou_trayvond✭✭✭✭✭If I'm understanding this correctly, this is nothing new.
I first was "informed" of this math back when I was creating a blazing shield tank last year- that being, all CP is rounded to the nearest integer.
Odd? Definitely.
Misleading? Meh. The math involved here is inconsequential to a vast majority of players.
It does demonstrate one of the irksome facets of CP: it's just this large wall of mathy text that I assume makes the eyes of large swaths of players glaze over.
5 -
Majeure✭✭✭✭Good ol' breakpoints from D2 (Diablo 2), investing in too much FHR (Faster Hit Recovery) or FCR (Faster Cast Rate) was meaningless past certain points till the next 'breakpoint', as it would not impact the amount of frames in a given animation.
Breakpoints would differ for each skill/animation, as they had differing amounts of frames... and amount of FCR needed to reduce the animation by one frame would also differ.
What made this worse, was the randomization on items and their stats, so determining whether an item with FCR or FHR was an upgrade or not was based around these breakpoints, and which skills your build would utilize.
Oh the times... These breakpoints, or jump points if you will, seem rather simple in comparison, and as long as you have the information what the breakpoints are, and which stars (or assume all) are affected, just don't go beyond, or go beyond enough.
I'm assuming these are in place for optimization, so the server has to process less, resulting in less lag.
Now anyone who this should concern would find out about it one way or another, and to the casual player it doesn't make much of a difference.
If you are in the know.. think of it as an advantage.Edited by Majeure on May 22, 2017 12:00PM2 -
Rinmaethodain✭✭✭✭✭
✭I just found interesting thing in patch notes:In order to lower the gap between players with high and low CP, all Champion passive values are now significantly more frontloaded. This means that earlier points are worth much more, while later points are worth much less. In general, at the halfway mark of 50 points invested, you will obtain roughly 75% of an individual Champion ability’s total bonus (for example, at 50 points invested in Thaumaturge, you will have an 18.75% bonus to your damage over time effects).
Official patch notes state that 50CP invested in Thaumaturge will give 18.75% bonus but from discovered jump points, the bonus at 50CP is exactly same as 48CP which is 18%....
Not sure if that comment in patch notes was written by developer or not, but its clearly out of touch with what really happens in game. As other people mentioned, does ZOS know whats going on with CP right now? Maybe its a bug? Why no official source tells players about it?Edited by Rinmaethodain on May 22, 2017 5:38PM8 -
Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MaximusDargus wrote: »I just found interesting thing in patch notes:In order to lower the gap between players with high and low CP, all Champion passive values are now significantly more frontloaded. This means that earlier points are worth much more, while later points are worth much less. In general, at the halfway mark of 50 points invested, you will obtain roughly 75% of an individual Champion ability’s total bonus (for example, at 50 points invested in Thaumaturge, you will have an 18.75% bonus to your damage over time effects).
Official patch notes state that 50CP invested in Thaumaturge will give 18.75% bonus but from discovered jump points, the bonus at 50CP is exactly same as 48CP which is 18%....
Not sure if that comment in patch notes was written by developer or not, but its clearly out of touch with what really happens in game. As other people mentioned, does ZOS know whats going on with CP right now? Maybe its a bug? Why no official source tells players about it?
@MaximusDargus The fact that a prominent post was made on PTS about this and ZOS did not comment leads me to believe that this is a bug in their system that they are unable or unwilling to fix. I would love to know if there are plans to fix it eventually @ZOS_GinaBruno ?You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points1 -
Araviel2✭✭✭bumping this because it needs awareness.Araviel -Professional Zerg surfing mutagen spammer [DC-EU]2 -
STEVIL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭well for me it comes down to this...
anybody getting worked up over up to a 1% rounding difference is likely as not going to be doing due diligence and will find out from forums or web builds sites or reviews that they round down and its EASY if you have this knowledge to pick points on the screen... no charts needed, just round down and spend accordingly.
The casuals who never bother, wont notice and likely wont care.
So, while yes a "we round down to integer" notice makes sense, its not anything major in my book and not a sign of deception when most of the combat under-pinning math is not shown anywhere on the screen either.
Even the core W/SD+pool/10.46 is not shown and if you are vexed, enraged, or driven to frenzy by no "we round down now" notice on Cp screens, how have you survived the main character screen and damage tooltips without that formula shown with your sanity intact for this long?
this is a molehill with delusions of geographical significance, if you ask me.Proudly skooma free while talks-when-drunk is in mandatory public housing.
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me_ming✭✭✭✭✭MaximusDargus wrote: »
The sole existence of "jump points" aside, I personally thing that worst thing about it is that players are not properly informed about it. Why tell us we will get 0.5% increase of something if its not true? Why not make it show real numbers as "next increase at X CP"?
^^ Agreed!
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Uriel_Nocturne✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭If these "jump points" are indeed the truth of the matter; mix that with the massive front-loading of CP values, and you get a game that is even more so: "ESO: The ONLY MMORPG where you get weaker the more you play!"
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idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MaximusDargus wrote: »
Looks fairly strait forward. I expect each point is an even % or at least the closest without going under. I don't think CP rounds up, only down but have not tested it. Just heard it from someone who should be an authority but I am not sure if I'd trust the devs info. Lol.0 -
TheRealPotoroo✭✭✭✭✭
✭well for me it comes down to this...
anybody getting worked up over up to a 1% rounding difference is likely as not going to be doing due diligence and will find out from forums or web builds sites or reviews that they round down and its EASY if you have this knowledge to pick points on the screen... no charts needed, just round down and spend accordingly.
The casuals who never bother, wont notice and likely wont care.
So, while yes a "we round down to integer" notice makes sense, its not anything major in my book and not a sign of deception when most of the combat under-pinning math is not shown anywhere on the screen either.
Even the core W/SD+pool/10.46 is not shown and if you are vexed, enraged, or driven to frenzy by no "we round down now" notice on Cp screens, how have you survived the main character screen and damage tooltips without that formula shown with your sanity intact for this long?
this is a molehill with delusions of geographical significance, if you ask me.
Even casuals have the right to expect that they'll get what they're promised. When the tooltip says that the next CP point will boost a buff from, say 2.6% to 2.9%, then that is what should happen. No player should be forced to peruse the forums in order to find out how ZoS are deceiving them, it shouldn't even be an issue. If the tooltip says that spending that point gives a certain buff then that certain buff should be delivered as stated. It is inarguable.PC NA, PC EU
"Instead of taking the best of the dolmens (predictable rotation), the best of the geysers (scalability based on number of players), and the best of the dragons (map location and health indicators) and adding them together to make a fun and dynamic world event scenario, they gave us....... harrowstorms." https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6850523/#Comment_685052324 -
MasterLenman✭✭✭✭well for me it comes down to this...
anybody getting worked up over up to a 1% rounding difference is likely as not going to be doing due diligence and will find out from forums or web builds sites or reviews that they round down and its EASY if you have this knowledge to pick points on the screen... no charts needed, just round down and spend accordingly.
....
It's not a 1% difference. Consider this: Someone invests 99 points into a star. He assumes they all count, when in fact he just wasted 24 points. These points, when invested into a different star, could have given him a bonus of over 10%. So sure, the difference within a star might be negligible, but the amount of points you can potentially waste adds up to a large amount of stats.Edited by MasterLenman on May 22, 2017 10:27PM25 -
ofSunhold✭✭✭✭✭
Since there's no way to know, would you rather believe they aren't honest, or they aren't competent?
I don't love either of those options.Classes that don't need any class ability nerfs: Nightblades, Dragonknights, Sorcs, Templars, Wardens.0 -
AcadianPaladin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Easy on the 'casuals' -Lol. I am a casual because my magplar and magsorc are both Bosmer - for roleplay reasons. So I guess that makes me a casual. Thing is though, to compensate for that important (to me RP decsion) I go to great lengths to ensure so many other things are tweaked to the max - I have less wiggle room than if I picked an industry standard magicka race. So non-casual decisions like infused vs divines on which pieces of armor, which mundus stone, which sets and, yes, every single % from CP matter.
Thanks very much to OP for casting some light on this.
Edited by AcadianPaladin on May 22, 2017 10:54PMPC NA(no Steam), PvE, mostly solo14 -
NightbladeMechanics✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭These are caused by rounding errors. I doubt ZOS even knows they exist, so I wouldn't call it misinformation.
Regardless, they make a tiny difference in stats and give hardcore theorycrafters one more thing to test and number crunch to optimize builds. The game would be less exciting without some unexpected math under the hood from time to time, but I do agree that unexpected performance shouldn't make a major difference (which these don't).Kena
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STEVIL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MasterLenman wrote: »well for me it comes down to this...
anybody getting worked up over up to a 1% rounding difference is likely as not going to be doing due diligence and will find out from forums or web builds sites or reviews that they round down and its EASY if you have this knowledge to pick points on the screen... no charts needed, just round down and spend accordingly.
....
It's not a 1% difference. Consider this: Someone invests 99 points into a star. He assumes they all count, when in fact he just wasted 24 points. These points, when invested into a different star, could have given him a bonus of over 10%. So sure, the difference within a star might be negligible, but the amount of points you can potentially waste adds up to a large amount of stats.
i still say by the time someone has progressed that far nearly 300 cp minimum, then if minmaxing or even being moderately efficient matters to them a little bit of figuring out how things work is not too much to expect.
I dont disagree, there should be a "we round down" notice, but as i said, there are tons of more significant stuff not told explicitly to the player on the character screen than this.
i mean, really, they are "told" or can "see" by trial and error that max magica and spell damage boost damage but they wont "know" that the ratios vary depending on whether you are talking light attack or cfrags or force pulse - so they might make massively worse decisions between say necropotence and julianos for a build where they do a LOT of staff shots.
In the scheme of "stuff they keep behind the scenes and do not explicitly say" this is not anywhere near the top of the "how to maximize or be most efficient" missing links a cp 300 player who avoids forums or net info will suffer.
"Delusions of geographic relevance, this molehill has." so spake Geodea from Stone Wars 1978
Edit to add - btw about this...
"It's not a 1% difference."
you are right, its LESS THAN 1%.
In youe example, your hapless cp290+ spent 24 cp seeing fractions of fractions of fractions rising all less combined than 1%. he though he got like .99% or so... he wound up not getting it.
He already made the decision to not go spend those 24 points elsewhere for much better returns.
So he doesn't get to count that against the system. that was his choice.
What he lost out on was just what he did not get out of the 24 he spent that he expected and thats the less than 1%.
Edited by STEVIL on May 23, 2017 12:28AMProudly skooma free while talks-when-drunk is in mandatory public housing.
YFMV Your Fun May Vary.
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"The good way I used to get good kills *with good skill* was good but the way others kill me now is bad."2 -
Cryptical✭✭✭✭✭
✭Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »
Often Devs learn the details of how their game works from players like Asayre.
Are you for real?
You realize how foolish you sound, right?
What you said would be like claiming that an author learns the details of how their language works from their readers.
What you said would be like claiming that Orville and Wilbur Wright learn the details of how a plane flies from pilots.
What you said would be like claiming that Robin Williams learned how comedy works from people who watched his movies.
What you said would be like claiming that Henry Ford learned the details of how cars work from people who drive them.
The more I try to wrap my head around your claim, the more I feel that your backwardness may cause me to have a massive stroke.
@ZOS_GinaBruno We need a method of giving posts a thumbs-down.Xbox NA2 -
Dyride✭✭✭✭✭Could be an effort to reduce calculations needed for CP. Definitely should be better explained though.V Є H Є M Є И C Є
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