The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Currently, (weaving) DW heavies are almost twice as fast as any other weapon, so I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you just press a button and wait for the whole animation to complete as if it were a channel?
Even without any weaving/animation cancelling (ie hold left click and let the full animation run), DW heavies take 1.75s between 2 consecutive hits, 2H take 2.2s and Fire Staff takes 2.5s
santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Currently, (weaving) DW heavies are almost twice as fast as any other weapon, so I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you just press a button and wait for the whole animation to complete as if it were a channel?
Even without any weaving/animation cancelling (ie hold left click and let the full animation run), DW heavies take 1.75s between 2 consecutive hits, 2H take 2.2s and Fire Staff takes 2.5s
I hold it until the attack completes like 90% of other players do. I'm not going to MLBPROGAMER this nonsense and time it to the millisecond. I don't know about you, but I don't hold my weapons in the air for 5 minutes before swinging them. It's complete and utter nonsense. It doesn't feel fluid at all and it's boring.
santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Currently, (weaving) DW heavies are almost twice as fast as any other weapon, so I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you just press a button and wait for the whole animation to complete as if it were a channel?
Even without any weaving/animation cancelling (ie hold left click and let the full animation run), DW heavies take 1.75s between 2 consecutive hits, 2H take 2.2s and Fire Staff takes 2.5s
I hold it until the attack completes like 90% of other players do. I'm not going to MLBPROGAMER this nonsense and time it to the millisecond. I don't know about you, but I don't hold my weapons in the air for 5 minutes before swinging them. It's complete and utter nonsense. It doesn't feel fluid at all and it's boring.
The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Currently, (weaving) DW heavies are almost twice as fast as any other weapon, so I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you just press a button and wait for the whole animation to complete as if it were a channel?
Even without any weaving/animation cancelling (ie hold left click and let the full animation run), DW heavies take 1.75s between 2 consecutive hits, 2H take 2.2s and Fire Staff takes 2.5s
I hold it until the attack completes like 90% of other players do. I'm not going to MLBPROGAMER this nonsense and time it to the millisecond. I don't know about you, but I don't hold my weapons in the air for 5 minutes before swinging them. It's complete and utter nonsense. It doesn't feel fluid at all and it's boring.
Well, that's what you're doing wrong then, you can cancel the animation roughly half way through (except for Lightning/Resto channel obviouly, and especially so with )santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Currently, (weaving) DW heavies are almost twice as fast as any other weapon, so I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you just press a button and wait for the whole animation to complete as if it were a channel?
Even without any weaving/animation cancelling (ie hold left click and let the full animation run), DW heavies take 1.75s between 2 consecutive hits, 2H take 2.2s and Fire Staff takes 2.5s
I hold it until the attack completes like 90% of other players do. I'm not going to MLBPROGAMER this nonsense and time it to the millisecond. I don't know about you, but I don't hold my weapons in the air for 5 minutes before swinging them. It's complete and utter nonsense. It doesn't feel fluid at all and it's boring.
I don't get it: a 1.7 to 2.5s animation is so long that you get bored watching it, but so short that you don't have enough time to cancel it (roughly) midway through? I'm not talking about milliseconds there. So basically what you want is for the full animation to be shortened so you can do the same dps and have it "feel" faster without any additional input or focus on your part? How is this less boring than the current version, in which improving your execution is actually more rewarding than mindlessly grinding towards your next +0.1% damage node?
Edit: I'm mostly talking about stam weapon weaving there, I'll be the 1st to admit that Fire/Ice destro staff HA are boring, precisely because you HAVE to sit through so much of the full animation before being able to cancel it.
The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Maybe use light attacks, which can still add damage. I mean, its simple really, unless people are unwilling to use light attacks, and heavy. I have in BG's, and in morrowind. It looks as if people are holding on to the resources unwilling to use their equipped weapons. Maybe instead of being part of the anti-resource nerf group, which is plenty, we could focus on adjusting cooldowns on enchants, considering making heavy attack interruptible (that apparently isn't a recognized word, but uninterruptible is), or even considering the weapon damage values to go higher.
santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Currently, (weaving) DW heavies are almost twice as fast as any other weapon, so I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you just press a button and wait for the whole animation to complete as if it were a channel?
Even without any weaving/animation cancelling (ie hold left click and let the full animation run), DW heavies take 1.75s between 2 consecutive hits, 2H take 2.2s and Fire Staff takes 2.5s
I hold it until the attack completes like 90% of other players do. I'm not going to MLBPROGAMER this nonsense and time it to the millisecond. I don't know about you, but I don't hold my weapons in the air for 5 minutes before swinging them. It's complete and utter nonsense. It doesn't feel fluid at all and it's boring.
Well, that's what you're doing wrong then, you can cancel the animation roughly half way through (except for Lightning/Resto channel obviouly, and especially so with )santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Currently, (weaving) DW heavies are almost twice as fast as any other weapon, so I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you just press a button and wait for the whole animation to complete as if it were a channel?
Even without any weaving/animation cancelling (ie hold left click and let the full animation run), DW heavies take 1.75s between 2 consecutive hits, 2H take 2.2s and Fire Staff takes 2.5s
I hold it until the attack completes like 90% of other players do. I'm not going to MLBPROGAMER this nonsense and time it to the millisecond. I don't know about you, but I don't hold my weapons in the air for 5 minutes before swinging them. It's complete and utter nonsense. It doesn't feel fluid at all and it's boring.
I don't get it: a 1.7 to 2.5s animation is so long that you get bored watching it, but so short that you don't have enough time to cancel it (roughly) midway through? I'm not talking about milliseconds there. So basically what you want is for the full animation to be shortened so you can do the same dps and have it "feel" faster without any additional input or focus on your part? How is this less boring than the current version, in which improving your execution is actually more rewarding than mindlessly grinding towards your next +0.1% damage node?
Edit: I'm mostly talking about stam weapon weaving there, I'll be the 1st to admit that Fire/Ice destro staff HA are boring, precisely because you HAVE to sit through so much of the full animation before being able to cancel it.
99% of the attacks in this game don't have a channel time and rather quick animations. You throw a heavy attack in there and it's off putting. The entire fluidity of combat is screwed up. I would rather use more skills than have to weave boring heavy attacks. Make heavy attacks twice as quick and I would have no issues with it. You also need to realize only a minority of people do animation cancelling, which was never even supposed to be a thing; it in fact as a bug they decided not to patch. Heavy attacks are boring. They have always been boring. We're going from a skill fluid combat to a boring hold your weapon heavy attacking combat. It sucks.The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Maybe use light attacks, which can still add damage. I mean, its simple really, unless people are unwilling to use light attacks, and heavy. I have in BG's, and in morrowind. It looks as if people are holding on to the resources unwilling to use their equipped weapons. Maybe instead of being part of the anti-resource nerf group, which is plenty, we could focus on adjusting cooldowns on enchants, considering making heavy attack interruptible (that apparently isn't a recognized word, but uninterruptible is), or even considering the weapon damage values to go higher.
You HAVE to heavy attack to sustain now or lose a metric ton of DPS to mundus and glyph changes. What we should consider is making heavy attacks twice as quick and we're done. Problem solved. They'd be significantly less clunky to use. More people would be enticed to using them. DPS would go up slightly as well. Heavy attacks can be blocked and dodged so there's no need for them to be interrupted.
santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »
Well, that's what you're doing wrong then, you can cancel the animation roughly half way through (except for Lightning/Resto channel obviouly, and especially so with )
santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Currently, (weaving) DW heavies are almost twice as fast as any other weapon, so I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you just press a button and wait for the whole animation to complete as if it were a channel?
Even without any weaving/animation cancelling (ie hold left click and let the full animation run), DW heavies take 1.75s between 2 consecutive hits, 2H take 2.2s and Fire Staff takes 2.5s
I hold it until the attack completes like 90% of other players do. I'm not going to MLBPROGAMER this nonsense and time it to the millisecond. I don't know about you, but I don't hold my weapons in the air for 5 minutes before swinging them. It's complete and utter nonsense. It doesn't feel fluid at all and it's boring.
Well, that's what you're doing wrong then, you can cancel the animation roughly half way through (except for Lightning/Resto channel obviouly, and especially so with )santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »The only heavy attacks that are fun are lightning and restoration staff, because they channel and it doesn't feel like you're taking 5 years to attack. DW heavy is even worse as you literally go slow-mo. Please either reconsider your sustain changes (provide more means of sustain outside of heavy attacks) or improve heavy attacks to be significantly more fun to do (aka make them faster!). I just don't understand going backwards. We did the heavy attack meta in like 1.3. It wasn't fun then and it's not fun now.
Currently, (weaving) DW heavies are almost twice as fast as any other weapon, so I'm not sure what you mean there. Do you just press a button and wait for the whole animation to complete as if it were a channel?
Even without any weaving/animation cancelling (ie hold left click and let the full animation run), DW heavies take 1.75s between 2 consecutive hits, 2H take 2.2s and Fire Staff takes 2.5s
I hold it until the attack completes like 90% of other players do. I'm not going to MLBPROGAMER this nonsense and time it to the millisecond. I don't know about you, but I don't hold my weapons in the air for 5 minutes before swinging them. It's complete and utter nonsense. It doesn't feel fluid at all and it's boring.
I don't get it: a 1.7 to 2.5s animation is so long that you get bored watching it, but so short that you don't have enough time to cancel it (roughly) midway through? I'm not talking about milliseconds there. So basically what you want is for the full animation to be shortened so you can do the same dps and have it "feel" faster without any additional input or focus on your part? How is this less boring than the current version, in which improving your execution is actually more rewarding than mindlessly grinding towards your next +0.1% damage node?
Edit: I'm mostly talking about stam weapon weaving there, I'll be the 1st to admit that Fire/Ice destro staff HA are boring, precisely because you HAVE to sit through so much of the full animation before being able to cancel it.
sentientomega wrote: »Yeah, I'd be wanting heavy attacks to take the same time to charge as the shortest-taking fully-charged one, which I think dw is. 2h heavy attack feels like the slowest...
DisgracefulMind wrote: »You're actually wrong. You have to charge a full heavy attack for the Resource restore.
rophez_ESO wrote: »Eh, I quite enjoy heavy attacks. Much better than spastic rotations that rely on cancelling ESO's broken animations.
rophez_ESO wrote: »Eh, I quite enjoy heavy attacks. Much better than spastic rotations that rely on cancelling ESO's broken animations.
LiquidPony wrote: »rophez_ESO wrote: »Eh, I quite enjoy heavy attacks. Much better than spastic rotations that rely on cancelling ESO's broken animations.
@rophez_ESO
The heavy attack meta requires animation canceling to work effectively.
We'll still be doing LA weaving on the back bar and with melee heavy weaving, you still want to cancel the heavy attack animation with an ability.
Not really sure what was "spastic" about the the LA weave meta, either. LA-->ability-->LA-->ability-->LA-->ability-->swap, etc. Fairly low APM and it flowed pretty nicely. It's not like we're playing Starcraft or something here.
LiquidPony wrote: »rophez_ESO wrote: »Eh, I quite enjoy heavy attacks. Much better than spastic rotations that rely on cancelling ESO's broken animations.
@rophez_ESO
The heavy attack meta requires animation canceling to work effectively.
We'll still be doing LA weaving on the back bar and with melee heavy weaving, you still want to cancel the heavy attack animation with an ability.
Not really sure what was "spastic" about the the LA weave meta, either. LA-->ability-->LA-->ability-->LA-->ability-->swap, etc. Fairly low APM and it flowed pretty nicely. It's not like we're playing Starcraft or something here.
LiquidPony wrote: »rophez_ESO wrote: »Eh, I quite enjoy heavy attacks. Much better than spastic rotations that rely on cancelling ESO's broken animations.
@rophez_ESO
The heavy attack meta requires animation canceling to work effectively.
We'll still be doing LA weaving on the back bar and with melee heavy weaving, you still want to cancel the heavy attack animation with an ability.
Not really sure what was "spastic" about the the LA weave meta, either. LA-->ability-->LA-->ability-->LA-->ability-->swap, etc. Fairly low APM and it flowed pretty nicely. It's not like we're playing Starcraft or something here.
One of the things that bugs me the most about this new heavy attack direction is that the entire concept of heavy attacks restoring resources is just fundamentally stupid. It makes no sense. Boxers don't throw haymakers to catch their breath, they pop jabs. I know realism isn't the goal here, but it still bugs me. Why on earth would swinging my giant sword as hard as I can give me stamina back? It's ridiculous.
timidobserver wrote: »My suggestion.
1. Reduce heavy attack channel by 30-50%
2. Increase resource return from heavy attacking by 30-50%.
timidobserver wrote: »My suggestion.
1. Reduce heavy attack channel by 30-50%
2. Increase resource return from heavy attacking by 30-50%.