Make Ice Staff DPS viable? (+4% damage done passive)

Vaoh · March 2017

Yes

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

SaRuZ wrote: »

Ice stave taunt needs to be removed, whoever thought this up needs to be fired and whoever made it so it was implemented in the game needs to be drug tested and then fired for failing.

I am a frost mage, DPS. I like the style and you ruined it for me. There aren't any magicka tanks, wake the **** up and put the crack pipe down. Buff this build type here and now, don't ruin it for those of us that aren't going to jump on the warden train.

Lol, wait, I forgot who I was talking to! Hahahahaha.

That's the thing.... if the idea was to make Ice staff able to tank too then fine. the Heavy Attack taunt makes Ice Staves not just bad DPS, but a hazard in group content (especially vet trials) for anyone besides a tank to use. Inner Fire should become the 1st skill in the Undaunted Skill line as a clear and smart solution.

Ice Staff DPS can easily be increased the same way we saw Fire/Shock staves buffed - a % damage buff. Making it a middleground between these two elements allows it to be unique and viable over alternatives. Wardens would actually have incentive to use them too for actual DPS and not strictly roleplaying lol.

It would bring Ice staves into Vet trials which they are currently are never seen in (unless you are trying to get kicked ofc).

They did get buffed, you can block 20% more damage for 30% less stam. I say that is a huge buff.

Vaoh wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

SaRuZ wrote: »

Ice stave taunt needs to be removed, whoever thought this up needs to be fired and whoever made it so it was implemented in the game needs to be drug tested and then fired for failing.

I am a frost mage, DPS. I like the style and you ruined it for me. There aren't any magicka tanks, wake the **** up and put the crack pipe down. Buff this build type here and now, don't ruin it for those of us that aren't going to jump on the warden train.

Lol, wait, I forgot who I was talking to! Hahahahaha.

How is it ruined? You simply don't put skill points into the passive. Saves you 2 skill points. What is the problem.

The problem is that you are decreasing your damage dealt by a significant amount by using an Ice Staff. The equivalent would be slotting an Inferno Staff but then not using any jewelry or weapon sets... it's currently horrible and purposely for making you deal much less damage.

Yes you can go "roleplaying" as a Frostmage, but you will be kicked from any semi-serious group by doing so.

A 4% damage dealt buff (and removal of heavy attack taunt) would give Ice Staves the ability to be used in endgame for at least Warden DPS.

Do you even run Vet trials or am I talking with someone who is unaware of how endgame groups and builds look in ESO?

Okay let's put some numbers to this.

Let's say you somehow do 30,000 dps single target damage with a fire staff. This means that is you had an ice staff equiped, you would of done 27,778 damage instead. Now tell me that is that really significant? You would be able to complete literally all content in the game with that 27,778 dps.

But the truth is that you will be doing both single target and AOE damage, so the difference will be much less then that, I usually around 50/50 single target and AOE damage on my sorc, so that real world difference will be much less. And you will have much better survivability.

The point of all this is if you want to main an ice staff, it is VERY simple, like unreal how simple it is, just do not put points into the passive. End of story.

I'm not surprised you chose "No", that's cool with me. I'm just surprised you aren't smart enough to think these things through.

Let me try to break it down for you, as there are many factors in play.
- Inferno Staff grants 8% damage increase to Single Target skills.
- Dragonknights increase your Fire damage by 8%
- If you are a Magicka DPS, you will have an Inferno staff (almost always backbarred) to cast Blockade of Flame, which deals 20%+ more damage than Blockade of Shock/Ice, and gets buffed by the DK group buff as well as a Shock staff frontbar AoE damage buff.
- Magicka DPS will almost always slot an Inferno/Shock staff frontbar. The alternative is DW, never an Ice staff. Shock Staves increase your AoE DPS by 8% and is further buffed if you are a Sorcerer.
- Shock Staves have an *extremely* powerful AoE heavy attack which most Magicka DPS use to dish out high damage. Laying out AoE DoTs and Heavy Attacking with a Shock staff deals amazing AoE DPS.
- Your light attacks on Inferno staves will deal *much* more damage due to the plethora of buffs than an Ice staff.
- Fire staff and Lightning staff give very high Elemental Rage ultimate DPS which gets increased by numerous passives. Ice staff gains no buffs. A fire destro ult will deal *at least* 18% more damage than an Ice Staff ult due to the morph/DK group buffs, and is further increased for certain races and DKs themselves.
* - If you do not put points into the Destro Staff passive in order to remove the Ice Staff taunt, you purposely weaken your Shock/Fire staff DPS in the form of AoE/Single Target passive damage and making use of group buffs/skill morphs. Massive decrease in damage

I could go on and on. There are many, many factors.

The Ice staff has exactly zero benefit. Also Magicka DPS is not supposed to be blocking as that is the tanks job, whereas your is to deal damage.

This thread is meant to give Ice Staves a buff to desl 4% more damage dealt, which gives them some help in the case of being frontbarred by some Mag Warden DPS in the future.

If you wanna play politics on a gaming forum (lol) and use the literal definition of "viable" to make a point, then it is "viable" to slot Ice Furnace as a tank and punch Rakkhat with your fists in between spells as a DPS, since you can technically still win this way.

andreasranasen · March 2017

Yes

^ @Vaoh pulling the receipts

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · March 2017

No

Vaoh wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

SaRuZ wrote: »

Ice stave taunt needs to be removed, whoever thought this up needs to be fired and whoever made it so it was implemented in the game needs to be drug tested and then fired for failing.

I am a frost mage, DPS. I like the style and you ruined it for me. There aren't any magicka tanks, wake the **** up and put the crack pipe down. Buff this build type here and now, don't ruin it for those of us that aren't going to jump on the warden train.

Lol, wait, I forgot who I was talking to! Hahahahaha.

That's the thing.... if the idea was to make Ice staff able to tank too then fine. the Heavy Attack taunt makes Ice Staves not just bad DPS, but a hazard in group content (especially vet trials) for anyone besides a tank to use. Inner Fire should become the 1st skill in the Undaunted Skill line as a clear and smart solution.

Ice Staff DPS can easily be increased the same way we saw Fire/Shock staves buffed - a % damage buff. Making it a middleground between these two elements allows it to be unique and viable over alternatives. Wardens would actually have incentive to use them too for actual DPS and not strictly roleplaying lol.

It would bring Ice staves into Vet trials which they are currently are never seen in (unless you are trying to get kicked ofc).

They did get buffed, you can block 20% more damage for 30% less stam. I say that is a huge buff.

Vaoh wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

SaRuZ wrote: »

Ice stave taunt needs to be removed, whoever thought this up needs to be fired and whoever made it so it was implemented in the game needs to be drug tested and then fired for failing.

I am a frost mage, DPS. I like the style and you ruined it for me. There aren't any magicka tanks, wake the **** up and put the crack pipe down. Buff this build type here and now, don't ruin it for those of us that aren't going to jump on the warden train.

Lol, wait, I forgot who I was talking to! Hahahahaha.

How is it ruined? You simply don't put skill points into the passive. Saves you 2 skill points. What is the problem.

The problem is that you are decreasing your damage dealt by a significant amount by using an Ice Staff. The equivalent would be slotting an Inferno Staff but then not using any jewelry or weapon sets... it's currently horrible and purposely for making you deal much less damage.

Yes you can go "roleplaying" as a Frostmage, but you will be kicked from any semi-serious group by doing so.

A 4% damage dealt buff (and removal of heavy attack taunt) would give Ice Staves the ability to be used in endgame for at least Warden DPS.

Do you even run Vet trials or am I talking with someone who is unaware of how endgame groups and builds look in ESO?

Okay let's put some numbers to this.

Let's say you somehow do 30,000 dps single target damage with a fire staff. This means that is you had an ice staff equiped, you would of done 27,778 damage instead. Now tell me that is that really significant? You would be able to complete literally all content in the game with that 27,778 dps.

But the truth is that you will be doing both single target and AOE damage, so the difference will be much less then that, I usually around 50/50 single target and AOE damage on my sorc, so that real world difference will be much less. And you will have much better survivability.

The point of all this is if you want to main an ice staff, it is VERY simple, like unreal how simple it is, just do not put points into the passive. End of story.

I'm not surprised you chose "No", that's cool with me. I'm just surprised you aren't smart enough to think these things through.

Let me try to break it down for you, as there are many factors in play.
- Inferno Staff grants 8% damage increase to Single Target skills.
- Dragonknights increase your Fire damage by 8%
- If you are a Magicka DPS, you will have an Inferno staff (almost always backbarred) to cast Blockade of Flame, which deals 20%+ more damage than Blockade of Shock/Ice, and gets buffed by the DK group buff as well as a Shock staff frontbar AoE damage buff.
- Magicka DPS will almost always slot an Inferno/Shock staff frontbar. The alternative is DW, never an Ice staff. Shock Staves increase your AoE DPS by 8% and is further buffed if you are a Sorcerer.
- Shock Staves have an *extremely* powerful AoE heavy attack which most Magicka DPS use to dish out high damage. Laying out AoE DoTs and Heavy Attacking with a Shock staff deals amazing AoE DPS.
- Your light attacks on Inferno staves will deal *much* more damage due to the plethora of buffs than an Ice staff.
- Fire staff and Lightning staff give very high Elemental Rage ultimate DPS which gets increased by numerous passives. Ice staff gains no buffs. A fire destro ult will deal *at least* 18% more damage than an Ice Staff ult due to the morph/DK group buffs, and is further increased for certain races and DKs themselves.
* - If you do not put points into the Destro Staff passive in order to remove the Ice Staff taunt, you purposely weaken your Shock/Fire staff DPS in the form of AoE/Single Target passive damage and making use of group buffs/skill morphs. Massive decrease in damage

I could go on and on. There are many, many factors.

The Ice staff has exactly zero benefit. Also Magicka DPS is not supposed to be blocking as that is the tanks job, whereas your is to deal damage.

This thread is meant to give Ice Staves a buff to desl 4% more damage dealt, which gives them some help in the case of being frontbarred by some Mag Warden DPS in the future.

If you wanna play politics on a gaming forum (lol) and use the literal definition of "viable" to make a point, then it is "viable" to slot Ice Furnace as a tank and punch Rakkhat with your fists in between spells as a DPS, since you can technically still win this way.

You make some great points man, really. Also sweet move calling me not smart, really classy.

Now show me how you can not complete all content in the game without them?

I think you are hung up on being optimal, not just viable. There is a difference.

I like that the frost staff is more defensive, that is why I choose no, it makes no sense for a defensive weapon have the same buffs as an offensive.

Jemcrystal · March 2017

Yes

On the brighter note I can buy ice staves really cheap!

Ch4mpTW · March 2017

Yes

Vaoh wrote: »

Smepic wrote: »

Increasing damage done by 4% will not make ice staves viable, because they already are – it would simply make them better. I don't believe it's needed.

No, they aren't viable.

They are severely outclassed DPS-wise by Inferno/Shock staves in every way. This is why you will not find anyone using them in endgame unless they're roleplaying lol. In that case using your fists works too

Even before the passive 8% damage buff to Shock/Inferno staves arrived it was a rare sight to find endgame Frost staff users.

@Vaoh Careful now with calling things not viable. I created a thread asking if we (as a community) could all agree that bow builds aren't viable, and cease the double bow builds. And what did I get in return...? A bunch of players pointing out random bits of data here and there of not even a handful of people pulling high DPS with it. People went insane, talking about how bow builds are perfectly viable. And how I was wrong for asking such a thing, and having issues with those who go about using bow builds. Lol. I was called toxic, elitist, and all types of negative things. All for having an issue with bow builds, and bow build users.

But in all seriousness, I do agree with you. Something needs to be done about ice staves, because where they sit now (damage-wise) isn't acceptable.

Chilly-McFreeze · March 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

Smepic wrote: »

Increasing damage done by 4% will not make ice staves viable, because they already are – it would simply make them better. I don't believe it's needed.

No, they aren't viable.

They are severely outclassed DPS-wise by Inferno/Shock staves in every way. This is why you will not find anyone using them in endgame unless they're roleplaying lol. In that case using your fists works too

Even before the passive 8% damage buff to Shock/Inferno staves arrived it was a rare sight to find endgame Frost staff users.

@Vaoh Careful now with calling things not viable. I created a thread asking if we (as a community) could all agree that bow builds aren't viable, and cease the double bow builds. And what did I get in return...? A bunch of players pointing out random bits of data here and there of not even a handful of people pulling high DPS with it. People went insane, talking about how bow builds are perfectly viable. And how I was wrong for asking such a thing, and having issues with those who go about using bow builds. Lol. I was called toxic, elitist, and all types of negative things. All for having an issue with bow builds, and bow build users.

But in all seriousness, I do agree with you. Something needs to be done about ice staves, because where they sit now (damage-wise) isn't acceptable.

I guess some people cling on to the meaning of the word "viable". Per definition it's something that works. It not necessary works better or just as good as something else but one may complete most content with bows or frost staves. It's enough to get stuff done in itself. Doesn't mean I would advice to do just because in comparison they are much weaker. You two are right about that.

And just as a note for myself, why does a defensive weapon has to be on par with the offensive counterparts for dps? I may only speak for myself but I find it rather acceptable that 1H and Shield doesn't dish out as much damage as DW. And since the devs obviously changed the frost staff mechanics to be the magical equivalent to 1h&s it can be expected to have better defense and lower offense as flame/lightning staves.
BTW even before the damage buffs to fire and lightning staves I rarely saw someone using a frost staff. The gap wasn't as wide then as it is now. At least now frost staffs have a niche to fill. But all that doesn't mean that frost staves are in a really good place right now. Ice dmg hasn't much going for itself. And the taunt mechanic is just the most obvious flaw. It's far behind 1h&s for tanking. And even further behind flame and lightning staves for dps, as it's designed to. So, working as intended.

People doesn't use frost in addition to one of the other staves for the same reason they don't slot 1h&s as backbar to their DW as a pve dd. But let's see how the frost dmg buff of wardens play out on this issue.

Cherryblossom · March 2017

No

I voted No based on you have no idea what the Warden passive and skills will work off.

If your a Tank, your job is to keep aggro, the Frost staff just provides an alternative blocking resource. One thing no tank wants is some moron DPS with a Frost Staff pulling aggro because they get an "extra 4% damage you know, my frost build is awesome".

First you should petition removing the tanking, then think about the damage. If you can't get the taunt removed, forget it.

RoyJade · March 2017

Other - buff but in another way (or even nerf)

Ice staff is not that bad at the moment, except for the poor dps, the one-slot set for tanking and the hazardous taunt.
I want to see it boosted, but not with a raw increase.

First, the taunt should be moved. There is two skills in the staff skill line who may gain the taunt as a frost-exclusive effect : frost clench and elemental susceptibility (both the less-used morph).

Second, the one-slot set may be changed for Morrowind, they're already on it.

Third, the dps part. In my opinion, frost staff would be good if it was a defensive/support weapons for everyone, except warden. The 6% frost damage increase work well for that. I would like to see a morph who increase frost damage or who deal additional damage for each frost damage tick you deal to the enemy (such a morph for impaling shard seem perfect : transform the morph to a magicka-based damage skill, deal area damage, and additional damage for each frost tick you do).
But that's not all : I want to see some frost-based set who can compete with burning spellweave. Since proc damage sets are not good (fixed damage, no increase with your own power), I would like a set who either offer a good damage boost (such a "when you chill an enemy, your spell damage are increased by X", which synergize even better with warden), or apply a change to the ancien knowledge passive ("instead of reducing guard cost and damage received, deal X% more damage with frost abilities").

OrphanHelgen · March 2017

Other - buff but in another way (or even nerf)

Yes agree with ice staff change and good points. Took other to vote up the stamina issues. Dont forget it !

VierulSquirrel · May 2017

Yes

I agree with making the ice staves more viable for overall dps, some of the issues lay with the useless taunt, poor chilled passive, and poor route on the ice destro ultimate. So let's look into how we can fix this.
The ultimate - It should cost less compered to the other elemental counterparts.
Inferno does more dmg in the same time (10%) not including the burning status.
Lightning last 2 seconds longer. In a trial situation full buffs thats is roughly an additional 20-25k aoe damage, non crit.
Ice "immobilizes", however mobs and elite adds cannot be immobilized. I get in PvP this can be use full but all classes still use eye of the storm. With an inferno staff and gap close. With streak, Templar charge, ect.
The heavy attack - I'm sorry to kill the dreams of ice stave tanks. This will not work in end game pve. Sure you can pull a boss with it, or just use inner fire from Undaunted. This does however, not allow dps to use it because you start with heavy attacks and may use then during fights come morrowind.
This can be fixed by making the heavy attack grant MINOR HEROISM, for 3-5 second.
The ice wall let the snare from chilled stay, it's fine it helps PvP, and doesn't hinder pve, however add onto it, At the moment, if chilled enemies stay in a wall of elements too long or get hit woth Force pulse they can be immobilized, (another reason the ice stave ult is obsolete), when this happens make the immobilized target get minor maim. (15% damage reduction)
I know people voices their opinion on liking the taunt but I would suggest adding it to elemental susceptibility as someone did before. NOT ELEMENTAL DRAIN. Or take it out completely. I have yet to see anyone even use the heavy attack taunt.
As when it come to the Warden! The ice passive is fine where it is, for PvP, however this means you should, and I highly recommend this, increasing the dmg from ice based sets! YSGRAMORS for example. It's 400 on the 5peice does not scale near as much as Netches touch would on a sorc. Same for wets on dk. Etc. Elemental succession from VMA, forget it. It's 5 peice will need a 300% boost to be someone viable.
I know you, the makers of the game probably don't want "META" builds and having people play into their class passives full out, and making elemental casters and not just fire/inferno, doing this will help.

Artis · May 2017

No

andreasranasen wrote: »

Why would anyone vote no on this?

No one uses Ice Staffs right now. You get kicked from trial guilds for even thinking of slotting one.

Ice Staffs needs a dmg increase buff!

Because other staves are better, not because you can't complete with the ice staff.

I vote no because it will be OP. It already has that defensive bonus and you can block for magicka with it. If you give it damage and leave that thing - there will be no reason to choose. Especially in PvP. Even in PvE - why bother thinking which skill to put where and which staff to use on which bar, if you can just use ice staff and have ALL your damage increase AND be able to block better?

Ice staff is viable, just not optimal for dps. And still a sorc with Ice will probably outdps most other builds maybe even optimal builds like NB.

Are we gonna ask to make 1hand and sword viable (=optimal for you, looks like) for DPS?

Peekachu99 · May 2017

No

Ice staff just needs a faster HA to be perfectly viable for tanking, and even PVP dps at that. The fact that it takes 2s to taunt a mob is just bad design.

I think that should be it's passive: faster HA.

P.S. I have successfully, easily ice staff tanked every vet dungeon in the game with a 16K HP sorc and a 16K HP NB. It's a great addition to the playstyle, though it's in need of tweaks.

Oh, but I would never run a Trial with this setup.

Edit: Also fun is how one's strategy changes. Velindreth, for example, you taunt then either shield spam or just bolt escape (refreshing path if NB) around the room and she just spend the whole fight roaming in circles

VierulSquirrel · May 2017

Yes

Artis wrote: »

andreasranasen wrote: »

Why would anyone vote no on this?

No one uses Ice Staffs right now. You get kicked from trial guilds for even thinking of slotting one.

Ice Staffs needs a dmg increase buff!

Because other staves are better, not because you can't complete with the ice staff.

I vote no because it will be OP. It already has that defensive bonus and you can block for magicka with it. If you give it damage and leave that thing - there will be no reason to choose. Especially in PvP. Even in PvE - why bother thinking which skill to put where and which staff to use on which bar, if you can just use ice staff and have ALL your damage increase AND be able to block better?

Ice staff is viable, just not optimal for dps. And still a sorc with Ice will probably outdps most other builds maybe even optimal builds like NB.

Are we gonna ask to make 1hand and sword viable (=optimal for you, looks like) for DPS?

They should remove the block passive since they want players to better manage their resources. And you should not be able to compare Sword and board to ice staff in terms of dps or tanking in any game. Other MMOs tanks deal damage through their class abilities and aoe taunts/debuffs. Not an ice staff.
Also a sorc may be able to out dps with an ice staff, with a pet. Which isn't always viable in dps situations. The taunt also makes it obsolete in its current state.

Peekachu99 · May 2017

No

VierulSquirrel wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

andreasranasen wrote: »

Why would anyone vote no on this?

No one uses Ice Staffs right now. You get kicked from trial guilds for even thinking of slotting one.

Ice Staffs needs a dmg increase buff!

Because other staves are better, not because you can't complete with the ice staff.

I vote no because it will be OP. It already has that defensive bonus and you can block for magicka with it. If you give it damage and leave that thing - there will be no reason to choose. Especially in PvP. Even in PvE - why bother thinking which skill to put where and which staff to use on which bar, if you can just use ice staff and have ALL your damage increase AND be able to block better?

Ice staff is viable, just not optimal for dps. And still a sorc with Ice will probably outdps most other builds maybe even optimal builds like NB.

Are we gonna ask to make 1hand and sword viable (=optimal for you, looks like) for DPS?

They should remove the block passive since they want players to better manage their resources. And you should not be able to compare Sword and board to ice staff in terms of dps or tanking in any game. Other MMOs tanks deal damage through their class abilities and aoe taunts/debuffs. Not an ice staff.
Also a sorc may be able to out dps with an ice staff, with a pet. Which isn't always viable in dps situations. The taunt also makes it obsolete in its current state.

Um the block passive is amazing for utility since magical toons have such huge blue resource pools and next to no stam. Example: swap to an ice staff and block all the crap (meteors/ balls of fire) on the upper tier of VMSA. You can stand still for like that entire part except where you have to chase the moving shield.

Danksta · May 2017

Yes

The only reason I can see myself using an ice staff is so I could queue in gf as a tank, but really just be a DPS that holds agro. It's not viable for DPS or tanking, all it's viable for is to further water down loot tables.

Bobby_V_Rockit · May 2017

No

I never understood why people choose to be sub-optimal if given the option. Why would anyone deliberately be weaker?

Viable and optimal are different, but one is clearly better...

FoulSnowpaw · May 2017

Other - buff but in another way (or even nerf)

Just remove taunt then it's good. Defensive stats are fine as is.

ANGEL_BtVS · May 2017

Yes

Would love to make an ice mage dps. I think in addition to OP's suggestion, they also need to remove the taunt from ice staff's. Make it a morph of some skill or something, but don't force it onto all ice staffs. Those two changes and we may have something. But yeah, would really love a legit ice mage dps option.

ANGEL_BtVS · May 2017

Yes

Smepic wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

Smepic wrote: »

Increasing damage done by 4% will not make ice staves viable, because they already are – it would simply make them better. I don't believe it's needed.

No, they aren't viable.

They are severely outclassed DPS-wise by Inferno/Shock staves in every way. This is why you will not find anyone using them in endgame unless they're roleplaying lol. In that case using your fists works too

Even before the passive 8% damage buff to Shock/Inferno staves arrived it was a rare sight to find endgame Frost staff users.

phillyproduct wrote: »

Smepic wrote: »

Increasing damage done by 4% will not make ice staves viable, because they already are – it would simply make them better. I don't believe it's needed.

Viable in what content?

@Vaoh, @phillyproduct

Learn your words before you use them.

Just because ice staves are worse than the other two, DPS wise, does not mean it's not viable – hence my first reply.

Ice staffs are neither feasible nor will work successfully in end-game pve. So yeah, NOT viable.

QuebraRegra · May 2017

Yes

Sheva I 7 I wrote: »

well with stupid taunt they added in, it wont change a thing. Who wants a dps in trial, that constantly grabs aggro

agreed... who thought the taunt was a good idea?!?!? Yeah, the guy in light armor with a staff should be the tank?

The "taunt" feature should have been made a passive, then you could choose to spec'd into or not... I'd NOT.

would like a DOT percentage bonus or somesuch to make it DPS viable.

QuebraRegra · May 2017

Yes

Jemcrystal wrote: »

On the brighter note I can buy ice staves really cheap!

reminds me I need a ice necro staff

Magdalina · May 2017

Other - buff but in another way (or even nerf)

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Edit: Also fun is how one's strategy changes. Velindreth, for example, you taunt then either shield spam or just bolt escape (refreshing path if NB) around the room and she just spend the whole fight roaming in circles

...why'd you want to kite a boss, Veli of all things, around the room in a generally stationary fight(assuming you're with a proper group and not soloing or 2 manning or something)? You'd be halving your group's dps by pulling her out of all the ground aoes(including destro ulti), putting your group in danger by forcing them to spread out(especially if they're melee) and for that particular fight, on top of all that you'd also be screwing them into magicka spores because your magicka is higher than your other resources. It sounds like literally worst choice possible there.

In response to the OP, I'd say there're 2 things Zeni can do. Either remove the damn taunt and do something like what you propose or perhaps add some other unique dps/group buff/monster debuff related passive that'd make ice staff viable for dps or keep going the tanky route. In which case they need to really work on that heavy attack taunt thing or/and add more unique buffs/debuff to it as well as there's 0 reason to choose ice staff over s&b beyond being special, even if you're a magicka tank s&b is just so much better. Ice staff tanking could become a very awesome and unique thing but it'd need quite a bit of work for that.

As it is atm ice staff sits in that weird place where hardly anyone uses it to tank and pretty much no one uses it to dps. ...and for some reason I get the feeling Zeni is gonna take option 3 - do nothing and pretend it's fine as it is.

Queo · May 2017

Other - buff but in another way (or even nerf)

Wait... Why are we talking about making ICE staff DPS? We have the fire staff. The OP broke it down perfectly. FIRE = single DPS, Lightning = AOE, and ICE = "tanking"/or CC. What is the problem with this? Is it that hard to carry 3 staffs?

Danksta · May 2017

Yes

Queo wrote: »

Wait... Why are we talking about making ICE staff DPS? We have the fire staff. The OP broke it down perfectly. FIRE = single DPS, Lightning = AOE, and ICE = "tanking"/or CC. What is the problem with this? Is it that hard to carry 3 staffs?

The problem is that in end game it's completely useless. I'd love to see someone try to wind up heavy ice attacks to taunt the axes in vAA. I'm no tank but I'm guessing they'd die on the first attempt.

templesus · May 2017

No

I'd rather them fix the actual game and balance the classes before doing something like this that will only make 1% of the game happy while the other 99% remain neutral.

Queo · May 2017

Other - buff but in another way (or even nerf)

Danksta wrote: »

Queo wrote: »

Wait... Why are we talking about making ICE staff DPS? We have the fire staff. The OP broke it down perfectly. FIRE = single DPS, Lightning = AOE, and ICE = "tanking"/or CC. What is the problem with this? Is it that hard to carry 3 staffs?

The problem is that in end game it's completely useless. I'd love to see someone try to wind up heavy ice attacks to taunt the axes in vAA. I'm no tank but I'm guessing they'd die on the first attempt.

... Thats why you have the fire staff???

Ok i get it, it comes down to you wanting to RP as an "ice mage", however, the staffs are suto-classes that you can freely swap out. I guess thats why I'm kinda confused. Its not like you waist points in investing in a "ice Staff" skill line its the destruction staff skill line. they all swap out easy enough...

my main is really just a farmer, and its also a summoner. i find the Ice staff is great for holding an enemy while my pets Nom nom on its face. Also a i like to dual with a good friend, he is super squishy so i often end up tanking. Again the CC capability of the ice staff helps a lot.

instead of increasing the DPS, what about giving the user more tanking ability, like a bonus to block, or a stamina siphon?

alexkdd99 · May 2017

Yes

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

andreasranasen wrote: »

Why would anyone vote no on this?

No one uses Ice Staffs right now. You get kicked from trial guilds for even thinking of slotting one.

Ice Staffs needs a dmg increase buff!

No one ever used ice staffs in the way you are wanting them. They were never the bis for magic, they were always second or third class in dps. If you want to dps with an ice staff, do it, as long as you don't have the skill points into the first passive, you will be okay. You will be able complete all content in the game.

Now you are going to cry about ice staff usage not setting the world on fire in trials, geuss what, the type of person that wants to get those high scores and best times and such will not care how they get it done. It is all about efficiency and effectiveness for those people and the ice staff was never on the table for them. These type of people are literally 1% of the people in the game.

I for one love the changes to the ice staff and Really enjoy having more options for tanking then the s/b. They don't need more damage because you survive so much better then a fire or lightning staff. Think about, you are asking for a damage boost to a weapon that you will already take 20% less damage when blocking. That is huge.

So I take it you are using an ice staff to tank?

I was one of those people who used an ice staff before they made this idiotic change. They are worse than a sword and shield at tanking and worse than fire and lightning at dps. They are garbage in their current state.

Remove the taunt and give them another bonus. They screwed the ice staff right before releasing an ice wielding class.

Ever since diablo 2 I have loved ice skills.

If ice staff tanking was as good as sword and shield tanking I would be OK with it. But they just aren't.

Shadow_Viper_vX · May 2017

No

Ice staff is not supposed to be used for DPS....

No change needed

It's Fine, Learn to Play

Adapt and Overcome

Stop Crying

FriedEggSandwich · May 2017

Other - buff but in another way (or even nerf)

Remove all the new passives from all 3 destro lines. 8% more damage is simply too much for a passive buff with 100% uptime, and a heavy attack taunt is useless and gimmicky. What we now have has taken choice away from the player.

ArchMikem · May 2017

Yes

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

I like that the frost staff is more defensive, that is why I choose no, it makes no sense for a defensive weapon have the same buffs as an offensive.

Since when was the Frost Staff officially a defensive weapon? It's a staff that shoots shards of ice and deals damage, and has done so long before that stupid "Heavy attacks now taunt" passive came into being. Many people want, and have wanted to have an Ice Mage dps for a very long while.