Is ESO available in China? New law regarding Loot Boxes!
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alexkdd99✭✭✭✭✭
✭Callous2208 wrote: »Callous2208 wrote: »Khaos_Bane wrote: »Stopnaggin wrote: »China has nothing to do with ZOS. They are suppressing their people end of sentence. Precious poster was probably correct about keeping money in the country.
Now ESO is a game, and ZOS is in charge of that game. They do need to make money to fund the game and it's employees. How they do that is entirely up to them. I don't like the crown crates, for me it's not worth the reward without knowing the odds. For some it is different. I'm not going to get into the gambling addiction side of things. All that does is fuel further argument and invites insulting and childish remarks.
Yes ESO can make money, it's perfectly fine, I sub, and buy things from the Crown store. What I will not do is gamble for said items without knowing the odds. I believe, IMHO, they could be making money without these crates. Countless other games make plenty of money through DLC, add on packs or whatever, forza comes to mind, car packs add on content. They have a successful franchise . All the while I don't remember one random crate or chance drop that you had to pay real cash for. I would gladly spend my money on car packs and track packs, expansions and such. Because I knew exactly what I was buying up front.
Agree 100%. I think the crates look terrible IMO, there is nothing there that I want or spend an incredible amount of money on getting.
Yet. To survive using this system as funding, they will need to find a way so that folks like you spend cash on crates. If you're just a tough sell and cosmetics will never get you off your wallet, they'll need to add whatever that thing is that you so desire. BiS gear? Flying purple people eater mounts?
By that same note every mmo would end up p2w. But that's not how it goes. Not everyone purchases extra items and zos doesn't expect everyone to. I don't like cosmetics and never purchased a single one until loot crates, but I love loot crates and the mounts inside them are better than any I've seen yet.
Luckily they don't add bis items to cash shop just because a couple people don't want to purchase cosmetics.
China new law doesn't effect eso anyways.
Again, yet. I don't know what they'll add in the future, neither do you. If they follow the normal gamble box, cash shop dependent model that most mmos do, then it is safe to assume they will add these things eventually. Perhaps not best in slot right away, you need to gradually condition your player base to get comfortable with the idea of non cosmetic things in the cs/crate first. To your first statement, well, sorry to burst your bubble but a great many f2p or non mandatory sub mmos do in fact end up becoming p2w. I'm not crying or gritting my teeth over it, that's just how the model works.
Ok so you are saying every game that is not a sub only game will be p2w? Then what's the point in people getting up in arms about it if they are all destined to be that way? If this is just how the model works I don't see how people can be angry about it
Nobody can say with any certainty that eso will become p2w or not, but it most certainly is not P2W now.
My post was replying to the point about zos not needing everyone to purchase items from crown store. If a section of the community doesn't purchase cosmetics this doesn't mean that they will add bis gear or anything close to it.
Saying that just because a few people don't purchase cosmetics, zos will add bis items to crown store is incorrect imo.0 -
Skcarkden✭✭✭✭jedtb16_ESO wrote: »MyNameIsElias wrote: »China being pro consumer, strange times we live inanitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »MyNameIsElias wrote: »China being pro consumer, strange times we live in
The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.
Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.
'money-making racket' sometimes I wonder if this forum thinks zos runs the game for philanthropic reasons.
Get out of here with this nonsense rhetoric. No one ever expects any business to operate out of pocket, but we also expect they not try to rip us off or gouge us for every single dollar. They should *earn* their money, not exploit for it.
But, i guess going by your lone comment you wouldn't see an issue if any business made millions even if it caused the death of someone. You know cause it's 'just business'
how are they gouging you for every single dollar and how are they ripping you off?
does zos's ninja brigade come round and put an arrow to your knee and force you to participate?
Well, i could waste my breathe on trying to explain it to you, but if you're dumb enough to miss the word 'try' in my comment and seem genuinely confused as to how these crates are a rip off, then i guess it's easier to just write you off as a lost cause.
For someone who takes words way too literally, you really suggest some very paranoid scenarios0 -
DreadKnight✭✭✭its no secret that the Chinese government does whatever it can to restrict access to gambling and keep more of Chinese citizens money inside China, this is simply an extension of that spun in such a way to make it look like its for the Chinese people. Video game addiction is a huge issue in China, same with gambling, the government does not like money going outside the country. This has more to do with controlling its citizens in the long run than being any kind of good step forward, unless you like oppression at least. I prefer freedom. The issue is much bigger than what its made out to be, while I think its one positive step, when you look at the bigger picture its hard pressed to argue its for the good of its people, and not about creating roadblocks to keep Chinese money inside china while operating in a global economy. Sometimes you need to see the forest through the trees.
http://www.businessinsider.com/xi-declares-war-on-global-gambling-firms-2015-2
All true.
I've lived here in China for 13 years, and play ESO almost every day (Xbox One NA).
The game isn't available here, and the Xbox One that is available here is made so that it can only connect to the Chinese 'Intranet' version of XBox Live, which is controlled by the Government. So if you have a Chinese Xbox then you can't actually download the game, or connect to the rest of the world (even if you do have a VPN).
I bought my Xbox from the UK (Yes I'm from the UK), and it works fine here apart from the known game issues. I do get the extra occasional disconnect no doubt.
That all being said, I'm pretty sure you can order a US Xbox from TaoBao in China.
I doubt that the game will ever be officially available here, the Government doesn't like fighting games unless it's home grown, and it would take years to censor the game for approval as it's so vast. As such, the law that the OP is talking about will never apply to ESO unless it became officially available.
Edited by DreadKnight on December 9, 2016 1:16AM2 -
Skcarkden✭✭✭✭NordSwordnBoard wrote: »MyNameIsElias wrote: »China being pro consumer, strange times we live inanitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »MyNameIsElias wrote: »China being pro consumer, strange times we live in
The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.
Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.
'money-making racket' sometimes I wonder if this forum thinks zos runs the game for philanthropic reasons.
Get out of here with this nonsense rhetoric. No one ever expects any business to operate out of pocket, but we also expect they not try to rip us off or gouge us for every single dollar. They should *earn* their money, not exploit for it.
But, i guess going by your lone comment you wouldn't see an issue if any business made millions even if it caused the death of someone. You know cause it's 'just business'
It is naive to believe that a corporation would stop making a profit from you for moral reasons.
Yes, it is "just business"
no video, but this explains the formula quite well:
https://youtu.be/wIdmkETuWeM
Never said i believe that they wouldn't, just that it's not acceptable to do. Of course ZOS would kill us all in our sleep if it meant being set for life in limitless wealth. Every loves the easy road because it means you don't have to invest any actual meaning behind what you're doing so if it fails you're not left broken at the end, they prefer to ironically break themselves making easy choices.0 -
DreadKnight✭✭✭anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »That's not exactly how things work. To do business in certain countries you frequently need to follow their regulations, regardless of if the servers reside in that country or not. See a lot of the recent hoops that social networks are having to jump through to get access to the Chinese or Russian markets.
IANAL, so I am unsure exactly how this new regulation will apply to ZOS, but it's certainly not as simple as "no server, no problem."
The situation of ESO in China is very simple though : it doesn't exist.
China requires by law that any online game operator is based in China. ZOS is not based nor represented in China. As a result, ZOS is not allowed to sell ESO in China and Chinese gamers are not allowed to play ESO. This is ensured via governmental firewalls that prevent connections. If you are in China and want to play ESO, you must use a VPN, that makes you look as if you were connecting from elsewhere. That is, to play in clandestinity. Laws do not apply, per definition, to clandestine activities. End of story.
In case you don't know, chinese internet users have to use VPN for many internet activities, because the government decides what they should or should not do on the internet and has the means to restrict / forbid access if people don't use a VPN.
Mostly true - I can still connect and play ESO without using the VPN. The Government turn up or down the Firewall depending on 'Political sensitivity'. Some weeks you can connect and some weeks you can't.
Facebook, Twitter, Google, YouTube.....all sites that Westerners take for granted (and many more) are all unavailable permanently though without a VPN.
Not only does the law here (officially) prevent ESO being available on the local Xbox One, but if it was the server would have to be based here as well as ZOS...so that the Government can ultimately control access.
Back to topic, I bought Crown Crates here in China, and now that ZOS has undoubtedly made Millions of $ from them - can you please invest some of that money into fixing some on the damn game issues!!?0 -
Recremen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »the crates are not a lottery.
they are a blind purchase.
caveat emptor.
Chattel property. Duty of care. I'm sure we could go on forever citing laws that might apply for either argument.
it is only chattel if you own it. if you purchased physical media you own that. but as far as the game is concerned your only right is a license to play it, you own nothing of it.
duty of care is about ensuring the safety of people who are engaged in any situation with relation to their physical well being. if i run a casino i have to ensure that the premises are 'safe' in terms of structural integrity and fire safety. that any refreshments are sound.
in all things..... not just this.
the onus is on the buyer to be aware of what they are purchasing.
caveat emptor.
I am not a lawyer, but I am pretty darn sure that duty of care covers more than just physical injury. You have a point regarding the chattel bit, though.
Either way, caveat emptor kind of falls flat in anything but a legal argument when the product for sale itself is inappropriate. For example, if someone was selling a fake medicine, like a homeopathic "cure", and people bought it and were harmed by its use, I would personally find the person selling the fake medicine to be at fault. While the legal system still has to catch up on that, I also feel that the legal system has to catch up on selling self-contained artificial risk, like gambling or these gambling boxes. At no point in history should we have looked at games of chance and gone "hmmm, we should monetize that". It's reprehensible.Men'Do PC NA AD Khajiit
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Shimmer✭✭✭✭✭
✭Honestly guys... I understand you are passionately against the crates but I think it's time to stop opening new threads for complaints about them.2 -
probablyafk✭✭✭I play from China via VPN. But it's a bit of a miserable experience in end game. 250-350ms ping averages, often spikes, make it very hard to do things like vMA. Probably gonna to unsub soon - leveling all my toons was fun, doing the story and stuff. But dealing with lag plus RNG end game just makes me over it.Edited by probablyafk on December 9, 2016 5:36AM0
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Honestly, the crown crate drop rate complaints are a bit of a storm in a teacup. Despite being similar to gambling, they're technically not the same as gambling. You're garranteed a prize no matter what, where as actual gambling, if you loose, you actually loose. Sure, the prizes are crap, but you still earn something, and technically you agree to the price of the item you are purchasing.
I used to be on Gaia Online and their RNG puchaces were a lot more obscure, they didn't even show what you get in them. At least with the crown crates you can see exactly what prises you get and exchange some items for crown gems (be it a crappy exchange) for a specific item, which is something I haven't seen in any other RNG purchase.
When you get right down to it, if someone wants that item so badly, they will pay for it. Sure some have gambling addictions, but it is up to the buyer to purchase responsibly, and there are helplines and organisations for those with the problem.
All in all, if you really want to get philosophical, life is a gamble, where's my drop rates for life?? Too bad there's no law for showing that.
That's just my 2 cents.~ Vvaelud | Dark Elf | Scorcerer | EP | Vampire | Lv 50 ~
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Aussie Player5 -
Riejael✭✭✭✭✭Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.
Players talk, but do very little action.
It'd be a simple matter to get on the horn with a state representative and get them to author a bill to do something similar. All it takes is ONE state in the US to require odds and everyone will know what the odds are.
Will anyone do it? Nope. Most people don't even know who their state-rep is without looking it up.
But in all honesty, people don't care as much about the crates as they say they do. Its a front. A nontroversy at best.0 -
Rosveen✭✭✭✭✭
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Yes, dumb laws exist. But so do good laws and good government-funded or supported insitutions and initatives that benefit us all. It would be great if we were all the very best of people, always kind and fair out of our own volition - but we are not, so I'm not a fan of a completely hands-off government. Every time I see someone harping on about how the government is the root of all evil, I'm reminded of the clip "What have the Romans ever done for us?"Rohamad_Ali wrote: »
Well that's simply absurd.Rohamad_Ali wrote: »Government getting involved in anything is always bad news .
Is it ? Many of these laws started with good intentions .
http://www.dumblaws.com/newest-laws
http://www.dumblaws.com/laws/united-states/california
(not that you were harping, I'm just being a bad forumite derailing the thread with irrelevant matters
) 0 -
FloppyTouch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Oh look another crown Crate topic from @Cazzy
This is interesting I wonder if more laws will start to pop up in other countries I'm sure America is working on something. I would like to know my odds TBH and also know that they are not being change when ever the company feels like it or if they do change odds they have to post it.1 -
ItsGlaive✭✭✭✭✭
✭Khaos_Bane wrote: »MyNameIsElias wrote: »China being pro consumer, strange times we live inanitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »MyNameIsElias wrote: »China being pro consumer, strange times we live in
The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.
Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.
Hey, they need to fund their game some way. There are real people with real families behind this game. We want to see it continue to grow, that is why I choose to subscribe. I'm glad they also put in other forms of spending money on the game so it doesn't always have to be in sub fees. NONE of the items in the crates make your character better, so these crates aren't required.
People need to have some personal responsibility and decide whether or not it's good for them.
You're absolutely right, they need to fund the game some way.
How about an upfront box price, paid-DLC, optional subscription with attractive benefits and items sold in some kind of store?
ZOS are not on skid row here. Pretty sure they were making a killing but greed got the better of them.Allow cross-platform transfers and merges1 -
ItsGlaive✭✭✭✭✭
✭redspecter23 wrote: »It's a shame that government has to make a law forcing game companies to do the right thing.
The truth - demonstrated through history time and again - is that companies will always do what's in their own interests regardless of the legal and ethical implications. Only regulation and a series of checks and balances keeps companies in line, and even then, companies will exploit any loophole that they can.Edited by ItsGlaive on December 9, 2016 8:37AMAllow cross-platform transfers and merges1 -
Glurin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »It's a shame that government has to make a law forcing game companies to do the right thing.
The truth - demonstrating through history time and again - is that companies will always do what's in their own interests regardless of the legal and ethical implications. Only regulation and a series of checks and balances keeps companies in line, and even then, companies will exploit any loophole that they can.
Half truth actually. If that. Plus a number of false assumptions. There's a lot that needs corrected in that statement, but I fear doing so will send this thread way off course and deep into territory that the mods don't seem to care for."He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you..."0 -
ItsGlaive✭✭✭✭✭
✭redspecter23 wrote: »It's a shame that government has to make a law forcing game companies to do the right thing.
The truth - demonstrating through history time and again - is that companies will always do what's in their own interests regardless of the legal and ethical implications. Only regulation and a series of checks and balances keeps companies in line, and even then, companies will exploit any loophole that they can.
Half truth actually. If that. Plus a number of false assumptions. There's a lot that needs corrected in that statement, but I fear doing so will send this thread way off course and deep into territory that the mods don't seem to care for.
PM me, I'm genuinely interested in your response
Regulation is obviously not the answer to everything, but consumer regulations tend to be there to protect customers from exploitative companies and also from themselves. Lockboxes are simply one of the newest forms of parting customers unfairly (imo) from their cash that has yet to be examined in this context in the U.S. or EU. If either are going to act on the practice then my money would be on the EU - they've always been ahead of the U.S. in terms of consumer rights and legislation.
I spent some time working with a consumer advice helpline several years ago, and you'd be shocked to know how often people need protecting from themselves and in many unexpected ways!Allow cross-platform transfers and merges0 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Either way, caveat emptor kind of falls flat in anything but a legal argument when the product for sale itself is inappropriate. For example, if someone was selling a fake medicine, like a homeopathic "cure", and people bought it and were harmed by its use, I would personally find the person selling the fake medicine to be at fault. While the legal system still has to catch up on that, I also feel that the legal system has to catch up on selling self-contained artificial risk, like gambling or these gambling boxes. At no point in history should we have looked at games of chance and gone "hmmm, we should monetize that". It's reprehensible.
Good analogy.
Homeopathy isn't "fake medicine". It is sold for exactly what it is. Whether YOU believe it to be efficient or not as a medicine is a different issue altogether. In the end, if you trust homeopathy, you buy and use it, if you don't trust it, you don't buy it and you don't use it.
"Fake medicine" would be to label sugar pills as aspirin and sell them as aspirin. That is a lie and a scam, and a dangerous one at that.
Same applies to crown crates. They're sold exactly for what they are : a chance at getting an item, based on RNG. You like them, you buy them, you don't, well, you don't. It might be a trap, but it's definitely not a lie and not a scam. What WOULD be a scam and a lie would be if the drop rates were actually zero and that chance people buy with crates didn't exist at all. But given how many strom atro items we see in the game, that is definitely not the case.
I think governments and laws should exist to combat scams and lies, but should never interfere with the consumer's free choice to buy or not to buy products and services that are offered and labeled for exactly what they are. I know better than them what's good for me or not.
Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on December 9, 2016 8:48AM1 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MyNameIsElias wrote: »China being pro consumer, strange times we live inanitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »MyNameIsElias wrote: »China being pro consumer, strange times we live in
The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.
Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.
Do you work for free?
If not, why would you expect a company and the people behind it to do it? It's a business after all.
Do something for me.
Read "A Modest proposal". Google it, third link down, it will take maybe ten to twenty minutes of your time depending on reading skill.
If you cannot, I will summarize. A man confronted with the poverty and famine of the ruling class in around 1970's england wrote a satirical essay on how to fix it.
The details of it were simple. Poor people would have a child, raise it to a year old on nothing but it's mothers milk, then sell it to the rich as food. This gave the poor money, and the rich food, all while costing no one anything more than what they were allready paying. So what was the problem?
The problem was morally you were eating children and that made you a monster. And that was the point of the essay, that you could use logic to solve the problem but morality was the cost.
That is you. Arguing for a logical point that while logically sound is morally reprehenseable, and you cannot fathom that. you work off the assumption that, logically, you would not work without pay thus crown crates are okay. Yet the product of this reasoning causes immoral buisness practices.
What one man in ages past made satire, you argue for seriously. And you are as rediculous now as he was then. Please. Do not simply dismiss this because I compared your arguing to eating babies, that is merely the example, allbiet extreme, by which I show you how insane your train of thought is.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on December 9, 2016 8:58AM4 -
Prof_Bawbag✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Stopnaggin wrote: »Prof_Bawbag wrote: »Prof_Bawbag wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Prof_Bawbag wrote: »Callous2208 wrote: »Stopnaggin wrote: »Callous2208 wrote: »Stopnaggin wrote: »Callous2208 wrote: »Khaos_Bane wrote: »Stopnaggin wrote: »China has nothing to do with ZOS. They are suppressing their people end of sentence. Precious poster was probably correct about keeping money in the country.
Now ESO is a game, and ZOS is in charge of that game. They do need to make money to fund the game and it's employees. How they do that is entirely up to them. I don't like the crown crates, for me it's not worth the reward without knowing the odds. For some it is different. I'm not going to get into the gambling addiction side of things. All that does is fuel further argument and invites insulting and childish remarks.
Yes ESO can make money, it's perfectly fine, I sub, and buy things from the Crown store. What I will not do is gamble for said items without knowing the odds. I believe, IMHO, they could be making money without these crates. Countless other games make plenty of money through DLC, add on packs or whatever, forza comes to mind, car packs add on content. They have a successful franchise . All the while I don't remember one random crate or chance drop that you had to pay real cash for. I would gladly spend my money on car packs and track packs, expansions and such. Because I knew exactly what I was buying up front.
Agree 100%. I think the crates look terrible IMO, there is nothing there that I want or spend an incredible amount of money on getting.
Yet. To survive using this system as funding, they will need to find a way so that folks like you spend cash on crates. If you're just a tough sell and cosmetics will never get you off your wallet, they'll need to add whatever that thing is that you so desire. BiS gear? Flying purple people eater mounts?
Hmm dlc, mounts, hair styles, name change tokens, riding lesson a few pets, now if the sold an anti rng potion I would snatched those in a heartbeat.
I couldnt care less about the crates, I bought a 15 pack, got nothing special, so to mee there weren't worth the investment. I know some people will buy them, and that's fine, but to me there isn't enough value. I sub, use my crowns on what I want to buy, I will buy a chance to get something. I wouldn't go to Mc Donalds and hand them 10 dollars and tell them just throw a bunch of crap in there I'll take it. With my luck I'd end up with a box full of straw wrappers.
True enough. But it would seem all of those things you listed have not been, and will not be enough. Crates are the hope for the future, holdouts gotta have a reason to spend money on them.
If they truly want hold outs to buy them they need to have a bether return rate, either through adjusting the drop rate or uping the crown gem conversion rate. Adding things that I can't use is not going to get me to buy them, ahem argonian skin and head dress.
A better return rate defeats the purpose though. You would be getting the items you wanted for at or less than the price they would be outright on the CS. They have to be tuned so that the majority of folks end up spending twice as much or more, than they would have on the item if it were available for immediate purchase.
It would also still go against the very thing people are claiming to be against - imposed gambling. People can't go around denouncing gambling, worrying about all those poor souls who have addictive personalities, then buy them just because the odds are suddenly stacked heavily in their favour. Even if the odds were upped to 99% a lot of people would be shown up for what they were - hypocrites that only hid behind their faux concern for others because in reality, they were only ever interested in themselves. After all, gambling is gambling. I'd ruin my laptop with all the coffee I'd have to spit out due to the shock revelation that they weren't ever concerned about little Timmy or that poor down in his luck Jonny "no mates" McSucker
hypocrites?
generally people are only interested in what they perceive as being the best outcome for themselves.
altruism is complicated.
You've obviously not been keeping up to speed on all things crown crates. We're all very, very concerned about all those people who will spend their kids college funds just so they get that damn sparkly mount. If that's not bad enough, they'll deprive their kids of food and also encourage those kids to spend all their parents credit on their cards. We're not concerned about ourselves, some of us are morally outraged on behalf of someone else we wouldn't generally give a flying **** about.
You're right, everyone everywhere merely uses compassion as a vehicle to stroke their own egos and serve their own ends. Everyone is actually a self-absorbed cynic playing a professional victim on the interwebs for the lulz.
Or, maybe, there is this thing called projecting that you are doing right now.
I'm sure it's one of those two things at least.
Aye, I'm zipped up the back. The simple fact of the matter is, if I lost my last penny on a crown crate you wouldn't lose a wink of sleep. Why? Because you don't give one jot about me. It's easy to claim we can show compassion for the well-being of others on the net that we don't know from Adam, it's another thing entirely to actually feel actual compassion. I mean, if someone on here that you claimed to harbour some sort of compassion for never showed up again on the forums, would you even care? Your life doesn't impact on mine and vice versa, so why would you even care what I could potentially get up to? I suspect it's a very similar feeling to reading about some sad story in a newspaper. You feel compassion whilst reading the article, then turn the page and carry on as you were.
You are absolutely correct, I wouldn't lose sleep over you losing your last penny. One story on here started all the addiction talk. Some had a genuine concern for a friend. You have no idea how many people here have had friends or family with addiction problems. So your generalization only serves to make your argument more pure, which it is not. Maybe you have no compassion, I don't know you, so it easy for you to assume everyone feel the same as you. This isn't the case for everyone else.
I had a horrendous gambling problem during my late teens to mid 20's as I mentioned in that other cluster**** of a thread that's floating around these forums, and I'll state here what I stated in there, i don't need anyone's sympathy, concern or what ever else people claim their faux concern covers. It's all a little bit patronising rather than genuine.
What about those people who have compulsive disorders that don't fall under gambling? For example, Does their faux concern also extend to those people whom can't control their spending regardless? Those who have to buy up every single item on the CS just because their impulsive personality dictates that they should. Do they even waste a second of their time wondering if those people have enough money to purchase those 5000cr motifs, never mind 5 or 6 5000cr motifs along with every other piece of tat on there? I'll take a stab in the dark and say they haven't because like almost everyone else on here, we don't really care what others do with their cash unless we ourselves have some sort of personal agenda to push.Edited by Prof_Bawbag on December 9, 2016 10:10AM0 -
Cazzy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭FloppyTouch wrote: »Oh look another crown Crate topic from @Cazzy
This is interesting I wonder if more laws will start to pop up in other countries I'm sure America is working on something. I would like to know my odds TBH and also know that they are not being change when ever the company feels like it or if they do change odds they have to post it.
I was trying to discuss the new information regarding the law in China. Please stop picking on me.2 -
ZOS_JohanaB✭✭✭✭This conversation has descend into a discussion about political standards, opinions, and definitions. As the thread has become a political conversation we will have to close it. Speaking on political matters is against the community rules and considered to be inappropriate content. In future posting please remember to be civil, constructive and follow the community rules.1
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