Is ESO available in China? New law regarding Loot Boxes!

Cazzy

Starting next year China are enforcing a law that states loot boxes in games must disclose odds. This is a good step forward! So I wondered what this means if ESO is available in China and if they may release odds worldwide if they need to disclose them.

MyNameIsElias

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO

Nope. As it looks, Chinese law demands that online games are run by chinese companies. Obviously there are players in China but they're using VPN - pretending they're elsewhere.

Abeille

I don't think it affects ESO.

I wonder if it affects GW2. I remember the chinese release.

anitajoneb17_ESO

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

ItsGlaive

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.

Khaos_Bane

Xabien wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.

Hey, they need to fund their game some way. There are real people with real families behind this game. We want to see it continue to grow, that is why I choose to subscribe. I'm glad they also put in other forms of spending money on the game so it doesn't always have to be in sub fees. NONE of the items in the crates make your character better, so these crates aren't required.

People need to have some personal responsibility and decide whether or not it's good for them.

SanTii.92

Xabien wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.

'money-making racket' sometimes I wonder if this forum thinks zos runs the game for philanthropic reasons.

NordSwordnBoard

Xabien wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.

The so called free market is guided by an "invisible hand", and China is not governed by anything Karl Marx was getting at.

FoolishHuman

Xabien wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.

No matter what you think of this "money-making racket", the chinese regime is doing way worse things than milking some gamers for a few dollars. Think of the real price here, some things are just not worth it.

summitxho

its no secret that the Chinese government does whatever it can to restrict access to gambling and keep more of Chinese citizens money inside China, this is simply an extension of that spun in such a way to make it look like its for the Chinese people. Video game addiction is a huge issue in China, same with gambling, the government does not like money going outside the country. This has more to do with controlling its citizens in the long run than being any kind of good step forward, unless you like oppression at least. I prefer freedom. The issue is much bigger than what its made out to be, while I think its one positive step, when you look at the bigger picture its hard pressed to argue its for the good of its people, and not about creating roadblocks to keep Chinese money inside china while operating in a global economy. Sometimes you need to see the forest through the trees.

http://www.businessinsider.com/xi-declares-war-on-global-gambling-firms-2015-2

alexkdd99

Doesn't China sensor alot of the internet as is? I am not sure you can even play eso in China.

Cazzy

Do you think the rules could start becoming used in the western world?

Armitas

I can tell you the odds. The odds of getting what you want without spending way more money than you should are extraordinarily unlikely.

Rosveen

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.

Hey, they need to fund their game some way. There are real people with real families behind this game. We want to see it continue to grow, that is why I choose to subscribe. I'm glad they also put in other forms of spending money on the game so it doesn't always have to be in sub fees. NONE of the items in the crates make your character better, so these crates aren't required.

People need to have some personal responsibility and decide whether or not it's good for them.

That's true, every company needs to fund its operations and make a profit, this was never in question. But there's more than one way to finance a company and some are more ethical than others.

I would also like to remind you that the primary goal of this game - of any game - is to be enjoyed. Entertainment is the service we buy. Each of us is entertained by different things, it isn't always only the drive to make one's character better in combat. It is very possible that the crown crates might include items vital to someone's entertainment - just ask @Abeille about her cryomancer (thankfully lucky enough to get her ice wolf without RNG).

Khaos_Bane

Rosveen wrote: »

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.

Hey, they need to fund their game some way. There are real people with real families behind this game. We want to see it continue to grow, that is why I choose to subscribe. I'm glad they also put in other forms of spending money on the game so it doesn't always have to be in sub fees. NONE of the items in the crates make your character better, so these crates aren't required.

People need to have some personal responsibility and decide whether or not it's good for them.

That's true, every company needs to fund its operations and make a profit, this was never in question. But there's more than one way to finance a company and some are more ethical than others.

I would also like to remind you that the primary goal of this game - of any game - is to be enjoyed. Entertainment is the service we buy. Each of us is entertained by different things, it isn't always only the drive to make one's character better in combat. It is very possible that the crown crates might include items vital to someone's entertainment - just ask @Abeille about her cryomancer (thankfully lucky enough to get her ice wolf without RNG).

Yes, I am glad they are funding the game from the crown store and subs. I don't believe there is any ethical issue with the crates either. People can choose to purchase them or not. People have to be accountable for their own actions and take responsibility for their own decisions. There is nothing shady in the crown crates.

Stopnaggin

China has nothing to do with ZOS. They are suppressing their people end of sentence. Precious poster was probably correct about keeping money in the country.

Now ESO is a game, and ZOS is in charge of that game. They do need to make money to fund the game and it's employees. How they do that is entirely up to them. I don't like the crown crates, for me it's not worth the reward without knowing the odds. For some it is different. I'm not going to get into the gambling addiction side of things. All that does is fuel further argument and invites insulting and childish remarks.

Yes ESO can make money, it's perfectly fine, I sub, and buy things from the Crown store. What I will not do is gamble for said items without knowing the odds. I believe, IMHO, they could be making money without these crates. Countless other games make plenty of money through DLC, add on packs or whatever, forza comes to mind, car packs add on content. They have a successful franchise . All the while I don't remember one random crate or chance drop that you had to pay real cash for. I would gladly spend my money on car packs and track packs, expansions and such. Because I knew exactly what I was buying up front.

NordSwordnBoard

Cazzy wrote: »

Do you think the rules could start becoming used in the western world?

Start with lobbying politicians to get legislation started. You will have competition, but if you're passionate enough about the cause its possible.

You have to inform them, legislators actually don't go looking for causes to champion unless it benefits them or is actually an altruistic case. Believe it or not, people (just like you) do get laws made that benefit other people! (this right not available in all countries)

If you decide to take action about this, my advice would be to leave out the Chinese law as inspiration and just approach it from societal benefit angle. Most lotteries have to at least "fine print" odds on the backs of tickets due to legislation, you could use that as a premise to present to the people who can help you change this.

redspecter23

It's a shame that government has to make a law forcing game companies to do the right thing.

Khaos_Bane

Stopnaggin wrote: »

China has nothing to do with ZOS. They are suppressing their people end of sentence. Precious poster was probably correct about keeping money in the country.

Now ESO is a game, and ZOS is in charge of that game. They do need to make money to fund the game and it's employees. How they do that is entirely up to them. I don't like the crown crates, for me it's not worth the reward without knowing the odds. For some it is different. I'm not going to get into the gambling addiction side of things. All that does is fuel further argument and invites insulting and childish remarks.

Yes ESO can make money, it's perfectly fine, I sub, and buy things from the Crown store. What I will not do is gamble for said items without knowing the odds. I believe, IMHO, they could be making money without these crates. Countless other games make plenty of money through DLC, add on packs or whatever, forza comes to mind, car packs add on content. They have a successful franchise . All the while I don't remember one random crate or chance drop that you had to pay real cash for. I would gladly spend my money on car packs and track packs, expansions and such. Because I knew exactly what I was buying up front.

Agree 100%. I think the crates look terrible IMO, there is nothing there that I want or spend an incredible amount of money on getting. It simply does not look worth it to me and people vote with their wallet. If people don't like the idea don't buy the crates.

Callous2208

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

China has nothing to do with ZOS. They are suppressing their people end of sentence. Precious poster was probably correct about keeping money in the country.

Now ESO is a game, and ZOS is in charge of that game. They do need to make money to fund the game and it's employees. How they do that is entirely up to them. I don't like the crown crates, for me it's not worth the reward without knowing the odds. For some it is different. I'm not going to get into the gambling addiction side of things. All that does is fuel further argument and invites insulting and childish remarks.

Yes ESO can make money, it's perfectly fine, I sub, and buy things from the Crown store. What I will not do is gamble for said items without knowing the odds. I believe, IMHO, they could be making money without these crates. Countless other games make plenty of money through DLC, add on packs or whatever, forza comes to mind, car packs add on content. They have a successful franchise . All the while I don't remember one random crate or chance drop that you had to pay real cash for. I would gladly spend my money on car packs and track packs, expansions and such. Because I knew exactly what I was buying up front.

Agree 100%. I think the crates look terrible IMO, there is nothing there that I want or spend an incredible amount of money on getting.

Yet. To survive using this system as funding, they will need to find a way so that folks like you spend cash on crates. If you're just a tough sell and cosmetics will never get you off your wallet, they'll need to add whatever that thing is that you so desire. BiS gear? Flying purple people eater mounts?

JD2013

They're not getting rid of crates.

It's highly unlikely they'll have to publish odds.

In the words of Frozen

Let it go ....

Stopnaggin

Callous2208 wrote: »

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

China has nothing to do with ZOS. They are suppressing their people end of sentence. Precious poster was probably correct about keeping money in the country.

Now ESO is a game, and ZOS is in charge of that game. They do need to make money to fund the game and it's employees. How they do that is entirely up to them. I don't like the crown crates, for me it's not worth the reward without knowing the odds. For some it is different. I'm not going to get into the gambling addiction side of things. All that does is fuel further argument and invites insulting and childish remarks.

Yes ESO can make money, it's perfectly fine, I sub, and buy things from the Crown store. What I will not do is gamble for said items without knowing the odds. I believe, IMHO, they could be making money without these crates. Countless other games make plenty of money through DLC, add on packs or whatever, forza comes to mind, car packs add on content. They have a successful franchise . All the while I don't remember one random crate or chance drop that you had to pay real cash for. I would gladly spend my money on car packs and track packs, expansions and such. Because I knew exactly what I was buying up front.

Agree 100%. I think the crates look terrible IMO, there is nothing there that I want or spend an incredible amount of money on getting.

Yet. To survive using this system as funding, they will need to find a way so that folks like you spend cash on crates. If you're just a tough sell and cosmetics will never get you off your wallet, they'll need to add whatever that thing is that you so desire. BiS gear? Flying purple people eater mounts?

Hmm dlc, mounts, hair styles, name change tokens, riding lesson a few pets, now if the sold an anti rng potion I would snatched those in a heartbeat.

I couldnt care less about the crates, I bought a 15 pack, got nothing special, so to mee there weren't worth the investment. I know some people will buy them, and that's fine, but to me there isn't enough value. I sub, use my crowns on what I want to buy, I will buy a chance to get something. I wouldn't go to Mc Donalds and hand them 10 dollars and tell them just throw a bunch of crap in there I'll take it. With my luck I'd end up with a box full of straw wrappers.

andreasranasen

Abeille wrote: »

I don't think it affects ESO.

I wonder if it affects GW2. I remember the chinese release.

GW been in the game for soooo long. They know how to work around it

vamp_emily

I know I am only 1 person but this is my spending trend.

Eso, puts a $40 dollar mount in the crown store... I quit spending.
Eso puts crowns on sale... I spent a lot of money on crowns
Eso puts crates in crown store.. I quit spending and now am thinking about cancelling my sub

I wonder how many others are like me.

Woeler

Zenimax Online is based in the USA and Germany. Both with offices and servers. This law does IN NO WAY affect this game, and neither shall it affect any other triple A MMO because they are not specifically located in China.

I wonder when people will stop trying to find something, anything against these things. It's starting to get rather pathetic.

Callous2208

Stopnaggin wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

China has nothing to do with ZOS. They are suppressing their people end of sentence. Precious poster was probably correct about keeping money in the country.

Now ESO is a game, and ZOS is in charge of that game. They do need to make money to fund the game and it's employees. How they do that is entirely up to them. I don't like the crown crates, for me it's not worth the reward without knowing the odds. For some it is different. I'm not going to get into the gambling addiction side of things. All that does is fuel further argument and invites insulting and childish remarks.

Yes ESO can make money, it's perfectly fine, I sub, and buy things from the Crown store. What I will not do is gamble for said items without knowing the odds. I believe, IMHO, they could be making money without these crates. Countless other games make plenty of money through DLC, add on packs or whatever, forza comes to mind, car packs add on content. They have a successful franchise . All the while I don't remember one random crate or chance drop that you had to pay real cash for. I would gladly spend my money on car packs and track packs, expansions and such. Because I knew exactly what I was buying up front.

Agree 100%. I think the crates look terrible IMO, there is nothing there that I want or spend an incredible amount of money on getting.

Yet. To survive using this system as funding, they will need to find a way so that folks like you spend cash on crates. If you're just a tough sell and cosmetics will never get you off your wallet, they'll need to add whatever that thing is that you so desire. BiS gear? Flying purple people eater mounts?

Hmm dlc, mounts, hair styles, name change tokens, riding lesson a few pets, now if the sold an anti rng potion I would snatched those in a heartbeat.

I couldnt care less about the crates, I bought a 15 pack, got nothing special, so to mee there weren't worth the investment. I know some people will buy them, and that's fine, but to me there isn't enough value. I sub, use my crowns on what I want to buy, I will buy a chance to get something. I wouldn't go to Mc Donalds and hand them 10 dollars and tell them just throw a bunch of crap in there I'll take it. With my luck I'd end up with a box full of straw wrappers.

True enough. But it would seem all of those things you listed have not been, and will not be enough. Crates are the hope for the future, holdouts gotta have a reason to spend money on them.

wayfarerx

Woeler wrote: »

Zenimax Online is based in the USA and Germany. Both with offices and servers. This law does IN NO WAY affect this game, and neither shall it affect any other triple A MMO because they are not specifically located in China.

That's not exactly how things work. To do business in certain countries you frequently need to follow their regulations, regardless of if the servers reside in that country or not. See a lot of the recent hoops that social networks are having to jump through to get access to the Chinese or Russian markets.

IANAL, so I am unsure exactly how this new regulation will apply to ZOS, but it's certainly not as simple as "no server, no problem."

Woeler wrote: »

I wonder when people will stop trying to find something, anything against these things. It's starting to get rather pathetic.

No one is looking for things against these crates, we have plenty on that front. We're looking for solutions. Call it pathetic if you like, some people have different priorities than you.

Wollust

Xabien wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.

Do you work for free?
If not, why would you expect a company and the people behind it to do it? It's a business after all.

Stopnaggin

Callous2208 wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

China has nothing to do with ZOS. They are suppressing their people end of sentence. Precious poster was probably correct about keeping money in the country.

Now ESO is a game, and ZOS is in charge of that game. They do need to make money to fund the game and it's employees. How they do that is entirely up to them. I don't like the crown crates, for me it's not worth the reward without knowing the odds. For some it is different. I'm not going to get into the gambling addiction side of things. All that does is fuel further argument and invites insulting and childish remarks.

Yes ESO can make money, it's perfectly fine, I sub, and buy things from the Crown store. What I will not do is gamble for said items without knowing the odds. I believe, IMHO, they could be making money without these crates. Countless other games make plenty of money through DLC, add on packs or whatever, forza comes to mind, car packs add on content. They have a successful franchise . All the while I don't remember one random crate or chance drop that you had to pay real cash for. I would gladly spend my money on car packs and track packs, expansions and such. Because I knew exactly what I was buying up front.

Agree 100%. I think the crates look terrible IMO, there is nothing there that I want or spend an incredible amount of money on getting.

Yet. To survive using this system as funding, they will need to find a way so that folks like you spend cash on crates. If you're just a tough sell and cosmetics will never get you off your wallet, they'll need to add whatever that thing is that you so desire. BiS gear? Flying purple people eater mounts?

Hmm dlc, mounts, hair styles, name change tokens, riding lesson a few pets, now if the sold an anti rng potion I would snatched those in a heartbeat.

I couldnt care less about the crates, I bought a 15 pack, got nothing special, so to mee there weren't worth the investment. I know some people will buy them, and that's fine, but to me there isn't enough value. I sub, use my crowns on what I want to buy, I will buy a chance to get something. I wouldn't go to Mc Donalds and hand them 10 dollars and tell them just throw a bunch of crap in there I'll take it. With my luck I'd end up with a box full of straw wrappers.

True enough. But it would seem all of those things you listed have not been, and will not be enough. Crates are the hope for the future, holdouts gotta have a reason to spend money on them.

If they truly want hold outs to buy them they need to have a bether return rate, either through adjusting the drop rate or uping the crown gem conversion rate. Adding things that I can't use is not going to get me to buy them, ahem argonian skin and head dress.

Callous2208

Wollust wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

MyNameIsElias wrote: »

China being pro consumer, strange times we live in

The "pro-consumer" might as well be a side effect, not the primary goal of the regulation.

Regardless, with so many Western devs exploiting players and turning gaming into a money-making racket, it has to sting a bit that the so called "free market" is having to be shown the way by a communist regime.

Do you work for free?
If not, why would you expect a company and the people behind it to do it? It's a business after all.

Exactly. I keep telling people but they don't wanna hear it. Gamble boxes with unknown odds and poor rewards are the only way ZOS can make money off of a video game. It's not a hard concept people. The game, expansions, and crown store items were all free. Crates are a neccesity.