Vampirism and Lycatropy should be curses not buffs

GreenSoup2HoT · November 2016

There are pretty good draw backs for being a vampire in pvp. Dawnbreaker and Meteor hurt real bad.

FoolishHuman · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

FoolishHuman wrote: »

This is an MMO, if these kinds of restrictions were on certain skill lines, then noone would choose them. So what would be the point then?
In single player games it is easy to live with certain restrictions, like you can pass time until night if it is day, you can kill the guards if they attack, you can load the game if something bad happens etc. It doesn't work that way in this game and nobody would voluntarily make their character unplayable.

I think it would make the Character more playable...more interesting not just another MIN\MAX FOM clone

And you are a very small minority with that. You have to ask yourself if it would be really worth it, from a game design standpoint to design and maintain an entire skill line, with quests and all that barely 1% of players would be willing to play. I don't think it would.

Talon_Draconis · November 2016

A little off topic but I am old school gamer started in the days of zork
I think you should play the game not rush to the end....clone the FOM cc warrior.
I like games to be hard...interesting... if I have to start over fine...it not being the most powerful it having a good time getting to the end.
My favorite part of RPG or MMO is developing a character not having the best stuff one shotting the boss.
In fact I have more fun dying in a close battle than wining.
I I get frustrated I admit I do sometime i will play or do something else for awhile.

The thing I hate most about MMOs is seeing FOTM clones dueling in the streets or in PVP and crying to nerf or buff anthing interesting more. powerful weaker...or just different then the FOTM

Back to topic.
Yeah cursing vamps/WWs would make them harder to play but would add to the character experience. and challenge
The person would have to decide weather the liabilities worth the extra ability.
Right now there is not very many liabilities to becoming a unread or werewolf and alot benefits but none of the traditional costs.
That is why so many people want the curse

cpuScientist · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Yea, no thanks. I'd rather just have my vampire buffs and the health regen buff it comes with.

Yeah that is why 75% of the population are either Vampires or Werewolves.
It should not be that way.

Where'd you get those numbers? Was it the dark smelly cavern most such numbers come from or did the devs release this figure?

Talon_Draconis · November 2016

cpuScientist wrote: »

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Yea, no thanks. I'd rather just have my vampire buffs and the health regen buff it comes with.

Yeah that is why 75% of the population are either Vampires or Werewolves.
It should not be that way.

Where'd you get those numbers? Was it the dark smelly cavern most such numbers come from or did the devs release this figure?

No it's just everywhere i go I see large numbers of werewolves ....I don't really know vampires on sight...I assume similar numbers from people begging bites

DocFrost72 · November 2016

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

It would be playable during daylight hours vampires hide in doors or in dungeons.
And the cure is cheap and easy compared with other TES games.

How would this work in PvP or with rain as rain blocks the sun but weather is client side time is server side.

Lokryn wrote: »

I agree there should be more social penalties (turned Werewolves and Stage 4 vamps should be KOS or receive a bounty from guards) but you have to be very careful about affecting gameplay aspects. This is not a single player game. I don't think it would be very fun to be forced to be in werewolf form in a dungeon or trial for example.

ZoS will never do that even with a 1,000,000 bounty you can still do quest. They stated that they will never stop players from questing so this is unlikely. As for the bounty players in full body Armor and polymorphes would hate that they would be penalized as it would be impossible to tell.

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Yea, no thanks. I'd rather just have my vampire buffs and the health regen buff it comes with.

Yeah that is why 75% of the population are either Vampires or Werewolves.
It should not be that way.

This is more to the fact that being human grants no extra powers or passives it's not like you loss a skill line when you go Werewolf or Vampire.

This, a hundred times this. Mortality ought to come with its own buff, that way tanks and stealthy nightblades still go vamp (niche) and stam berserker still exist (niche).

Nyx2 · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

I am not trying to take away things from the game.
I am trying to add to the game!
Make Vamp/WW a cruse would add a choice to the character development,
Do I be cursed with it's liabilities and abilities or do I find a cure.
Not like I have to get this cures so I can compete in pvp

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

FoolishHuman wrote: »

This is an MMO, if these kinds of restrictions were on certain skill lines, then noone would choose them. So what would be the point then?
In single player games it is easy to live with certain restrictions, like you can pass time until night if it is day, you can kill the guards if they attack, you can load the game if something bad happens etc. It doesn't work that way in this game and nobody would voluntarily make their character unplayable.

I think it would make the Character more playable...more interesting not just another MIN\MAX FOM clone

"Players should not want to be a Vampire or Werewolf."

Don't backpaddel from your own words. Your title says everything, you want to turn those two things into an inconvenience. Not being able to step outside for 4 hours because you want to be a vampire is not "interesting" or "more playable". Restrictions like these are not even worth discussing and everyone with a healthy understanding of MMO games should know that.

You sound like the guy that suggested "player mayors" should decide whether riding and running is permitted in cities. These "opinions" are self-centred nonsense that belong into singleplayer games. When your ideas are in direct conflict with the functionality of the game then there is no point in bringing it up in the first place. Not only that but your idea is completely one-sided with no thought for the people who want to be a vampire / werewolf because according to you they shouldn't.

Chrlynsch · November 2016

I would like to see werewolf form as a kill on sight crime, Vampire stage 4 kill on sight crime, 3 new vampire abilities, Werewolf constant stamina regen buff, New world skill lines including Lich/necromancer, Mara, Cyromancer. A blessing system to buff those not directly tied to a prince (similar to mundus system, involves shrines).

Crimsonwolf666 · November 2016

The only thing I would like to see is more dialogue when talking to NPCs that some notice you are a werewolf or a vampire...But making them unplayable??? Stupid. I think their are enough restrictions as it is, I don't see it even remotely as a Twilight-thing, if anything I wished both to be buffed a wee bit more. If you don't like Vampire or Werewolves, fine, don't like them. I do, and clearly so do maaaaaannnnnyyy other people. The changes you want would never happen unless ZOS felt like having about 50 percent of their players and subscribers disappear. I am sorry, but even in single player games I mod around the stupid restrictions for being a werewolf or vampire in town. I am the damn hero of the era, the town guards and citizens can look the other way since I saved their precious world and the other plethora of menial tasks I carry out for them :P lol!!!

Skcarkden · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

mb10 wrote: »

The type of vampirism in ESO is a different strain of the disease that was around in the 2nd era called Noxiphilic Sanguivoria.

Its type doesnt affect the person affect daylight and makes the vampire stronger at night.

Like I said they watched too much twilight
Maybe the will make vampires sparkle in the sunlight and irresistible to teenage girls
Although the world is more like Underworld with so many vampires and werewolves

You realise there have been Vampire stories where they can walk during the day before that trash known as twilight even existed, right?

If day walking is the only connection you can make then you need to re-consider.

Woeler · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Yea, no thanks. I'd rather just have my vampire buffs and the health regen buff it comes with.

Yeah that is why 75% of the population are either Vampires or Werewolves.
It should not be that way.

And you have the right to judge this because...? "It should not be that way" I find this argument rather... under-performing on the argument side of things.

jedtb16_ESO · November 2016

vermin or parasite...

why would anyone choose either?

bellanca6561n · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

I am not trying to take away things from the game.
I am trying to add to the game!
Make Vamp/WW a cruse would add a choice to the character development,
Do I be cursed with it's liabilities and abilities or do I find a cure.
Not like I have to get this cures so I can compete in pvp

As I said, it's an interesting question and this sort of issue has been handled in far more interesting ways in other online games. And it can enrich the experience.

For example, if you're a player killer in Ultima Online - meaning you were the aggressor against a non-hostile player character - you suffer a form of NPC banishment. Only certain healers can rez you, you cannot go into all towns, and so on. Many players enjoyed this status.

You typed, "I must consider my sins" to get your murder count and there were ways to burn off these murder counts....up to a point.

Outlaw status, outlaw towns, and similar designs can indeed make the game world more engaging. But I'm not convinced that ESO is that kind of game.

I often wonder if any old school so-called living world game can succeed today. Yes, UO still exists. Eve Online as well. No doubt other, smaller market games do too.

ESO is a AAA semi-multiplayer online game for a mass audience. Yes, it has outlaw refuges, murder for hire story lines and such but these are like rides at Disneyland. And that's okay. It does suffer a lot of churn but I the whole genre is tired and shopworn at the moment.

Fischblut · November 2016

Vampirism and lycanthropy made my gameplay much more interesting, and I'm actually upset that mobs (werewolves or vamps) are aggressive to my characters

And it's natural for me that guards and friendly NPCs in towns don't attack my characters if I don't attack them first - no matter if I look like a beast

If I do no harm, I expect no harm done to me.

Personalities of my characters didn't change at all after they were bitten - only the way they look changed. If I help, I should be respected - even by king

WalksonGraves · November 2016

Last time I checked my vampire lord in skyrim was flinging giants off of cliffs like pesky gnats, if anything vampirism has been toned down.

AshTal · November 2016

Vamps and werewolves should be balanced not have a system where the majority of players are one because it makes the character more powerful with no real down side.

Bobby_V_Rockit · November 2016

Theres no reason to be a vamp anyway. All 3 combat skills are weak compared to alternatives and reduced health regen, increased fire damage etc make it a silly choice.

I havent heard a single argument as to WHY vampires are good for stamina characters yet. Vampires are supposed to heal faster, move faster, be physically stronger, etc. We get none of that, we get these feeble flamable zombie things.

Talon_Draconis · November 2016

AshTal wrote: »

Vamps and werewolves should be balanced not have a system where the majority of players are one because it makes the character more powerful with no real down side.

That is what I am saying

acw37162 · November 2016

There are some people I am just plain giddy to estatic have no say in the design or development of the games I play.

The OP is one of these people.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · November 2016

mb10 wrote: »

The type of vampirism in ESO is a different strain of the disease that was around in the 2nd era called Noxiphilic Sanguivoria.

Its type doesnt affect the person affected in daylight and makes the vampire stronger at night.

So where are out buffs at Night time then?

TX12001rwb17_ESO · November 2016

This is how I would redo the vampirism & Lycanthropy in this game.

First of all read the whole thing, I would completely remove the quests and have it so when you are bitten, after 3 ingame days your character will become one like in other ES games, this would be more immersive as for one it's unimmersive to do the same quest more then once if you are becoming a vampire for the second time, if anything the quest could remain but can only be done the first time you become a vampire or werewolf and would be not much more then a tutorial.

VAMPIRE COMBAT RELATED THINGS

- As you go up stages 2,3 and 4 all potential feeding targets should glow in a similar manner to how Evil or Camo Hunter causes Undead targets to glow, perhaps have it so the target is outlined in a reddish hue which becomes stronger the higher the vampire stage, at stage 4 the glow should be quite annoying, this would help convince people that they should feed.

- Vampire's should gain a moderate resistance to both Poison and Disease to SIMULATE having an immunity to them, they wouldn't actually be immune as far as game mechanics were concerned but this small resistance would simulate it as they are supposed to have it in the lore.

- At Stage 1 your Healing should be vastly higher then normal but not too high of course, Lamae Bal is said to have healed from her wounds before the Nomads very eyes which suggested vampires are supposed to heal very fast but instead the player gets the opposite, we are of her bloodline are we not? But at stage 4 you shouldn't even heal naturally at all, you have no blood left in your system to heal yourself with and your undead so naturally should start decaying at this point, why do you think you look like a bloated undead corpse for?

- You lose 5% of your Maximum Health when outside during Sunlight Hours, the whole not being damaged by sunlight is stupid, the sunlight damage is a curse deployed upon their kind most likely by an Aedra so their is no lore or logical reason they should not be effected by it, you know what other vampire's didn't have fangs or took damage from Sunlight Damage and looked like EMO's with makeup on? TWILIGHTS VAMPIRES, by supporting the no sunlight damage your supporting Twilight Style Vampires did you know that?

VAMPIRE NON COMBAT RELATED THINGS

- At Stage 4 the guards should attack you, this combined with the slightly faster heal rate should be enough to convince at least some people to occasionally feed.

As for werewolves, they don't need much change although this is what I would do for them, They need a resistance to Disease related effects when transformed and need to be attacked by guards whenever transformed, while in beast form they should beable to detect all potential feeding victims in the same manner the vampire could.

STEVIL · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

Players should not want to be a Vampire or Werewolf.
Vampires should have the problems as other TES games
Werewolves should be forced into were form on a night of full moon and get fugitive status when they change to were form

Thay may be your view of a better game but its not mine.
I know of quite a few who seem to think the same about stealing.

Browiseth · November 2016

My immersionz
My precious immersionz

But no, yeah.
No.

Mortehl · November 2016

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Werewolf and vamp are allready crap. What more do you need to -do- to them?

Vampires buffs are allready situational and PVP oriented and werewolf is allready virtually useless exept to Stamina DPS. (And in many cases, not even usefull to them.)

Honestly they need buffed more than anything, but I really -doubt- that's gonna happen.

Vampire is amazing. My tank is a stamina making nearly impossible to kill machine because of it. If you know how to use it of course. If it's buffed, dear god.

Kram8ion · November 2016

I'm confused about what ......wait I think poster is misinformed about vamps and ww
They are a curse in game it's not a buff
Vamps and WW pay dearly for abilities that lets face it aren't game breaking let alone op
Most people I'm sure playing them have probably gone back and forth getting bit an curing themselves multiple times which is why it's so cheap to cure
Maybe get bitten and find out for yourself

SHADOW2KK · November 2016

Lol ok OP, not..

Nova Sky · November 2016

I think ESO vampires, even in stage 4, look better than Skyrim vampires. Well, aside from the glowing eyes in Skyrim. Those are cool.

Prabooo · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

Twilix01 wrote: »

The problem with causing day/night based restrictions on a player's freedom to play their character is the fact that, unlike Skyrim, Oblivion, etc., you can't control the time in the game. You can't pick a safe spot to wait a few in-game hours until night/day time, you would have to physically wait it out in real time, and that just isn't any fun to be forced to wait to leave a delve for example. And imagine if you AFK in a bank and it turns night on you as a werewolf and you suddenly transform, netting yourself a bounty at best and at worst coming back to find yourself murdered by guards because you weren't there to sprint for a hiding place to hole up for a while.

But is that apart of the were wold cures not being able to control yourself and the wolf form being hunted so you cant stay in civilization.
As far as hiding out the day is 4x as quick...maybe play a alt while your vampire is hiding.
And you can even play your vamp character...in dungeon...or even pvp in a indoor area or the sewers.
Part of vampire curse only coming out at night

If the night in ESO would last 12h, kinda like it is in real life, then I would agree.

notimetocare · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

Players should not want to be a Vampire or Werewolf.
Vampires should have the problems as other TES games
Werewolves should be forced into were form on a night of full moon and get fugitive status when they change to were form

These suggestions make trolls look smart

TheSeer · November 2016

Talon_Draconis wrote: »

AshTal wrote: »

Vamps and werewolves should be balanced not have a system where the majority of players are one because it makes the character more powerful with no real down side.

That is what I am saying

Vampires have an increased weakness to fire and in case you missed it almost 95% of the game has some player/NPC waving around some fire based spell/weapon. Not to mention the fire atronachs and also a lot of dungeons/delves have fire traps, hell City of Ash is literally a death sentence for Vampires.

I use to be a vampire, but got sick of being killed so easily by a Pyromaniac waving a flame staff around.

I'm a werewolf now, but wait I also get a horrible penalty, poison. *Stares at all the archers that spam poison injection, leathal arrow, ect.* The only upside is that only applies when I am transformed, otherwise I'm just as susceptable as everyone else.