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Does nobody else see how wrong this is? (craft bags)

  • rotaugen454
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    Bottom line: nothing that anyone says will matter. ZOS made their decision, now we either sub and get the bag, or we don't sub and don't get the bag.
    "Get off my lawn!"
  • bloodenragedb14_ESO
    bloodenragedb14_ESO
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    Those of you that are crafters now have fleshed out your banks to be able to handle the influx of materials
    You have a system in place to store your materials
    If you dont have eso+, this wont change for you, literally the only difference is you now have a reason to pay for a sub.
    This is not a pay to win mechanic, you can still gather all the materials you need for free

    This is convenience, the fact that its only offered to eso+ members is not a bad idea, more money in their pockets means more content, better employee's hired, possibly hardware upgrades to fix the lag.

    The crafting bag is such a small thing, its not even a pay to win thing, its convenience, you can buy enough inventory slots and bank slots to fully house each material in the game with INGAME GOLD.

    I truly dont see the issue, for those without eso+, nothing is changing, for those with it, a convenience is added, something needed to actually give people a reason to sub
  • NewBlacksmurf
    NewBlacksmurf
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    In short.....
    -The bag should be a base game feature and the ability to obtain the bag should be in-line with:
    -crowns
    -in-game gold
    -ESO Plus

    There are a lot of arguments or opinions but bottom line is this. ZOS has moved away from their initial confirmation of what would be linked to a subscription and what would be in the crown store.

    Also, the fact that ESO Plus doesn't work as it should on Xbox One, the bag or any other features should be exclusive to a sub.

    How have they gone away with what they said as far as subscription and crown store? the BAG is convenience like literally if I could describe the bag I would say: a bag to conveniently store crafting items instead of having to visit the bank or mule alts.


    The first and most obvious is what I mention as respects to Xbox One...this has been the case since day 1 and it still occurs as recent as April 28th 2016

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/03/17/crown-store-showcase
    " Don't forget that members of ESO Plus receive a monthly allotment of crowns in addition to other in-game bonuses! "

    The other concern is items that are locked behind a sub or crowns
    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/02/12/the-road-ahead---february
    "he most important thing to remember about Tamriel Unlimited's virtual currency system is that we're not adjusting the base game—it will be exactly the same game, with the same leveling pace, experience point gain, user interface, etc.
    We're adding customization and convenience items in the Crown Store, but those will be added to the game as it is now; we're not going to make it harder for you to enjoy the game you already play to encourage you to use the Crown Store."

    "Game Director Matt Firor explained that the base game will maintain "the same levelling pace, experience point gain, [and] user interface" it always has, and promised that it won't be made more difficult to play for those who don't spring for real-money items."

    "An item in the Crown Store serves one of two purposes: It either provides a visual upgrade or distinction for your character, or it provides a way to save time at the expense of spending Crowns," he wrote. "When it comes to this second category of items, we will generally make in-game variants of similar items available either as drops or as player-craftable items as well."

    Not sure if you're on PTS but ther
    Thank you for your oppinion. However I disagree. ESO has every right to provide these bags exclusively to subscribers and no need to bow threads like this one.

    Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions are the prefered source of income for a great many reasons. At that this carrot added to the ESO+ benefits is a big plus for marketing subscriptions.

    In the end, crafting bag exclusive to ESO + is a win win for Zos. You can sub if you want to.

    @Giles.floydub17_ESO just read right above....its not a matter of opinion according to my comments above. While others have input their opinions and such, when the director of any company goes public with statements, that company should always make decisions around those statements.

    This literally makes the game more difficult in respects to inventory management without a sub so a few things.
    1. This is in conflict of earlier promises that were made on ESO Live about the words in the article linked above.
    2. The company hasn't resolved outstanding issues specific to xbox one and the crowns or DLC access under ESP Plus
    3. Making any feature exclusive to a subscription with no other options partial or incomplete of the subscription feature is not a win nor is it an intelligent business practice specifically due to earlier statement made by the companies director
    4. Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions ARE NOT a preferred source of income. Actual cash is a preferred source. All a subscription does is create another study pattern to monitor a customer base. Once you factor in charge-backs, canceled CC, failed charges, customer service costs, etc. its nothing more than another form of payment. thats all it is
    5. The real issue if that ZOS refuses to offer meaningful ESO Plus benefits so they've came up with this idea which is going to back-fire around June 20th 2016
    -PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
    ~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
  • Evergnar
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    As others have said subs need something, some incentive. Personally, I'm not about to re-sub just for crafting bags though. Have dealt with minimal bag/bank space for 2+ years so why change now.
  • clayandaudrey_ESO
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    Polls on this forum doesn't accurately depict the majority of players. Just the majority who come to the forums which is not indicative of the game population.

    Other than that I have no more issue with it being ESOplus as I will sub for a month (cancelling immediately afterwards), dump 6 maxed mules plus my guild bank into the bag, farm mats for 30 days and be done with it.
  • Reevster
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    First of all this post is not intended for ESO+ customers, you have no worries... Also please note: Where I use all caps for some words it is not intended as shouting. It is for EMPHASIS only to make a point. No offense is intended. I hope that this opinion post will not be a source of flaming posts... I just had to say something about a topic I feel strongly about.

    But for those of us who have spent a serious ammount of real $$$ on buying the game, all add-on world expansions, mounts, costumes, personal banker, etc. etc.. This needs to be an option available to us also.

    The crafting resource bags being available to JUST eso+ people is wrong.
    Im sorry but This is a major item(fundumental even) that ALL CHARACTERS need, especially with NEW CRAFTING SYSTEMS/ITEMS being added with the new expansion.

    I love the game but this is JUST Wrong. Having to get eso+ JUST to get CRAFTING BAGS feels a little bit like a slap in the face to those like me wh who have spent WAY in excess of the ammount that getting eso+ would have been ... I still have additional items (personal Merchant, New Assasins expansion etc.) I had planned to buy right away...

    Sadly despite all the upcoming changes, which I have no problem with, this one most necessary item not being available to ALL LOYAL customers just does not seem right. I love the game but this one thing... well it just is not right.

    I can not justify buying more at this point .. please keep in mind I have no problem with eso+ people getting it for free with subscription... My point is that those who have supported the game by purchasing everything up to this point should be allowed to get the much needed option also. Sell it as an option I would buy it even if it were 2000 crowns or whatever.

    Sorry it was so long... I just had to say something. I hope this oversight(in my opinion) gets resolved. I hate it when a favorite game becomes less fun because of what the company does to its structure. Its my greatest hope this will not be the case here.

    For those who want to say "Well just get eso+" I have to reply: think about it... After buying ALL the addons it just isnt fair to then FEEL FORCED to go mwith eso+ just for craft bags. What about all that money spent on the expansions? Would we be entitled to a refund since these purchased items are now included free? No there needs to be some fair mindedness and common sence applied here.

    Thanks for listening. Please no flamers. I just had to get this out. Peace.

    Why spend so much money when all you need to do is Sub, its like $180 a year and you get like $130 worth of Crowns, so for $50 a year you can have most of what you have paid "big" money for.

    I just dont get why people buy buy buy from the crown store but refuse to Sub.... must have money to burn i guess,
    Edited by Reevster on May 24, 2016 8:18PM
  • Gidorick
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    @BrotherChaz ... I completely agree. I HATED the buy to play transition. It almost made me quit ESO. I wanted to stay subbed. I gave ZOS ideas for sub benefits (which as still viable)

    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/150450/eso-subscription-benefits-suggestions/p1
    Gidorick wrote: »
    ESO PLUS SUGGESTED LIST OF BENNEFITS
    • 10% Public Crown Store discount: This would entice players to buy more as subscribers!
    • Ownership of DLC as Loyalty Bonuses over time If DLC pack 1 costs $45 require players be subscribed for a TOTAL of 4 non-consecutive months to own this DLC. If DLC pack 2 costs $30, require players be subscribed for an additional 3 months (7) to own this DLC. The total cost of the months subscribed should be MORE than the cost of the DLC. Players shouldn't lose access to these owned DLC if they unsubscribe.
    • Able to join up to 10 Guilds Players who subscribe should be able to join more guilds than those who do not. The additional guilds should be under the "subscriber guilds" and should be clear as to which the player will loose access to if they unsubscribe.
    • +4 Additional Character slots Players should have access to an additional 4 character slots, which they loose access to if they unsubscribe.
    • Priority queuing when entering game and zoning: Subscribers should be at the front of the line to get into the game and to move from one area to another.
    • Access to a subscriber-exclusive area of the Crown Store. In a special subscriber-only area of the crown store players will still have to buy items with Crowns but the 10% Subscriber discount should NOT apply to these items. ALL players should be able to view the Subscriber Crown Store, but only Subscribers should be able to buy from it. Additionally, this could include the following 3 features.
      • 1 month early access to all Costumes and Mounts: Giving a month's early access to Costumes and Mounts will do a lot to make subscriptions desirable. Subscribers who buy these items early will not get the 10% crown store discount.
      • 5 day early access to all DLC expansions: Giving 5 days early access will entice players who feel like they must play the newest content right away won't be able to resist subscribing!
      • Longer access to limited time items: ZOS could add limited sale items to the ESO+ section of the crown store one week early... and take them out one week later.
      • More frequent Limited Item Rotation: If ZOS is planning to have a specific item only available one time a year in the Crown Store, it could be available one additional time per year in the ESO+ section of the crown store.
      • Ability to purchase the Pledge of Mara: Only in the Subscriber Crown Store should the Pledge of Mara be able to be purchased.
    • Monthly Subscriber Treasure Maps: Each month, Subscribers should get at least 1 map (1 in each faction would be nice) that leads players to treasures. These treasures could include special subscriber items.

    I really didn't want to unsub and pretty much begged for ANY sign of them improving ESO+...

    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/166473/so-my-subscription-has-2-weeks-left-last-plea-for-a-better-eso/p1
    Gidorick wrote: »
    I bought the 6 month subscription twice and now I have 2 weeks left and I still want to subscribe but I'm having a really hard time justifying it.

    The 10% bonuses really don't interest me and it makes more sense to buy the $40 pack of crowns whenever I need 'em.

    I made a thread with suggestions a while ago HERE. It had all sorts of suggestions that included mechanics and features that are not yet part of ESO. The ones that I think are vital to a subscription, and are reasonable to ask for, are:
    • Crown Store discount
    • Additional Character slots
    • Priority Queuing in Cyrodiil
    • Greater Character Deletion Limit
    • Grant more Crowns per month.

    I've actually given up the crusade to get DLC as loyalty bonuses but it would still be nice, as some of the other suggestions in my thread would be, such as monthly treasure maps and early access to Crown Store items.

    I feel I need to clarify that I would not use the additional Character Slots (I only play 3) I do not regularly delete characters, and I don't play in Cyrodiil (yet?). The $15 a month is negligible to me. These additional benefits would keep me subbed out of principle. It would make me feel like subscribers are getting something for their money. Especially the Crown Store Discount.

    If I'm not spending $15 a month on ESO I WILL just spend the $15 a month on another game. I never did play WOW. I've been thinking of trying FFXI again, or maybe FFXIV.

    The point is I WANT to pay the subscription, but I just can't justify it with the current ESO+ benefits. If I don't pay ESO's sub... I'll pay another's. If I pay another's, I'm playing THAT game and not ESO. If I'm playing that game, how can I be in Tamriel buying stuff from the Crown Store.

    I would still play ESO because I care about Tamriel. I care about the lore. I have grown up with The Elder Scrolls. It's a part of who I am. Those other games are not.

    So, with 2 weeks left of my subscription, I again feel the need to plead with ZOS. I want to give you my money... I just don't want it to feel like charity.
    fteDGXc.png?1

    UPDATE:
    Gidorick wrote: »
    Well, I spent enough time trying to convince myself to remain subscribed.

    VzF79fE.png?1

    I am 100% willing to resubscribe ZOS! I Still want to be a subscriber and will resubscribe if ESO+ is ever expanded to include other benefits, or when DLC is released. I will continue to be a player and a fan of ESO and a soapboxer on the forms! :smiley:

    But since they didn't seem to have any plans on updating ESO+ I followed ZOS' lead, unsubbed and have bought crown packs. Since then, I have bought all the collectors edition DLCs and I honestly love the collectors editions and want to continue to buy those...

    If ZOS had come out early and said their plan was to add a crafting bag in the future, I would have probably stayed subbed. But they said nothing, and they probably didn't have plans at the time. So, like I said, I unsubbed.

    On a separate but related note, I have hated the inventory management in ESO and have suggested ways to fix inventory...
    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/162693/limited-bags-crafting-bags-encumbrance-concepts/p1
    Gidorick wrote: »
    In light if the controversy the unlimited crafting bags for ESO+ members seems to be causing I thought it would be nice to re-visit this concept. I personally believe that the below concept for "Crafting Material Bags" could work in conjunction WITH the announced bags and would give non-ESO+ members the options they desire. The below "No-Restriction Inventory Bags" would also be able to be used by ESO+ members to increase their non-crafting inventory space.

    Inventory continues to be an issue in ESO, but this doesn’t mean that everyone can’t be given an opportunity to benefit from a few items that could be added to the crown store.

    The general rule for bags are as follows:
    • Will consume one inventory space.
    • Cannot contain other bags.
    • Can be moved between the Bank and Inventory while full.
    • Cannot be sold to or traded to another player.
    • Cannot be "destroyed" unless they are completely empty.
    • Should be able to name bags for easy reference and organization.
    • Right clicking items in a bag and selecting "Remove From Bag" would place the bag back into the main inventory.
    • Backpacks should be able to be equipped if desired, creating a visible backpack on the character model. This could be accomplished by allowing backpacks to be equipped in the costume slot OR in the accessory slot as described HERE

    Bag Suggestions
    • No-Restriction Inventory Bags: These bags provide a set number of inventory spaces. These bags should, by default, fall under the Miscellaneous Category and maybe players should be allowed to "assign" a category to the bag so that the bag appears in that inventory tab.
      1. Large Backpack (2000 Crowns): Provides 30 Inventory Spaces
      2. Medium Backpack (1500 Crowns): Provides 25 inventory spaces
      3. Small Backpack (1000 Crowns): Provides 20 inventory spaces
      4. Heavy Sack (750 Crowns): Provides 15 inventory spaces
      5. Sack (500 Crowns): Provides 10 inventory spaces
      6. Small Sack (250 Crowns): Provides 5 inventory spaces
    • Crafting Material Bags: These bags have enough spaces to hold one stack of every type of material for the specific craft. Only the specific craft’s materials can be placed within the corresponding bag.
      1. Alchemist Satchel (1500 Crowns)
      2. Blacksmith’s Haversack (1500 Crowns)
      3. Clothier’s Tote (1500 Crowns)
      4. Enchanter’s Purse (1500 Crowns)
      5. Provisioner’s Knapsack (1500 Crowns)
      6. Woodworker’s Duffel (1500 Crowns)
    • Lock-Boxes: These little portable lock-boxes are for players who would like a way to prevent themselves from accidentally selling or deconstructing items. Placing an item in a lockbox will keep it safe!
      1. Locked Box (1000 Crowns): Provides 10 inventory spaces
      2. Locked Purse (500 Crowns): Provides 5 inventory spaces

    Over-Encumbrance: This new inventory mechanic will allow players to pick up MORE than their inventory space permits. This allows players to temporarily over-burden themselves so they are not strictly limited to their inventory space. Since Over-Encumbrance only occurs when a player exceeds the number of inventory spaces they have available, players are able to purchase bags and immediately relieve themselves of their Over-Encumbered status.

    There are three stages of Over-Encumbrance. Players are only prompted of their Over-Encumbrance during the third stage, Heavily Over-Encumbered.
    • Slightly Encumbered
      • Players who are carrying up to 5 more items than their inventory allows
      • Players cannot use “go to”
      • Paying to travel to a Wayshrine costs 5X more than normal and players can use Wayshrines.
      • Player default speed is the normal running speed. If players press the sprint button they will spring but will receive the prompt “You are Slightly Encumbered”
      • Players can use their mounts normally
    • Moderately Encumbered
      • Players who are carrying up to 6-10 more items than their inventory allows
      • Players cannot use “go to”;
      • Paying to travel to a Wayshrine costs 10X more than normal and players can use Wayshrines.
      • Players default speed is reduced to walking speed. If they press the sprint button they will run, consume stamina, and will receive the prompt “You are Moderately Encumbered”.
      • Players can use their mounts, but cannot sprint. They can run normally and if they try to sprint they receive the prompt “You are Moderately Encumbered”.
    • Heavily Encumbered
      • Players who are carrying 11-15 more items than their inventory allows
      • Players cannot use “go to”,
      • Players cannot pay to travel to a Wayshrine, but can still use Wayshrines.
      • Player speed is reduced to walking speed. Players cannot run and if they try to run faster wish the sprint key, they will receive the prompt “You are Heavily Encumbered”.
      • Players can use their mounts. Mount speed is reduced to walking speed and cannot sprint. If they try to sprint they will move at regular running speed and will consume stamina. They will also receive the prompt “You are Heavily Encumbered”.
    • Greatly Encumbered
      • Players who are carrying 16-20 more items than their inventory allows
      • Players cannot use “go to”, cannot pay to travel to a Wayshrine, or use a Wayshrine.
      • Player speed is completely removed. If they try to move they receive the message "You are Greatly Encumbered." Players cannot sprint or run normally, but they can walk by using the sprint key. They will also receive the prompt “You are Greatly Encumbered”.
      • Players can use their mounts. Mount speed is reduced to walking speed and cannot sprint. If they try to sprint they receive the prompt “You are Greatly Encumbered”.
    • Over-Encumbered
      • Players who are carrying 20-25 more items than their inventory allows
      • Players cannot use “go to”, cannot pay to travel to a Wayshrine, or use a Wayshrine.
      • Player speed is completely removed. Players cannot sprint, run normally, or walk. They cannot move normally, or by sprinting. If they try, they will receive the prompt “You are Over-Encumbered”. Players are stuck right where they are.
      • Players can use their mounts. Mount speed is reduced to walking speed and cannot sprint. As they walk, they will consume stamina and they will recieve the message "You are Over Encumbered." If they try to sprint they just receive the message “You are Over Encumbered.".

    This might be simpler in chart format.
    OC2IwZO.png

    Potions for Over-Encumbrance
    • Potions of Feather: These potions allow a player who is over-encumbered to alleviate the symptoms of being burdened. ZOS could include these as craftable items or purchasable through the Crown Store. Potions can be stacked so a player who is Heavily Encumbered can use one Bargain potion and one Cheap potion to relieve their Encumbrance. If a player uses more than one potion of the same quality they increase the duration of the potion.
      1. Bargain Potion of Feather: Relieve one level of over-encumbrance for 10 minutes
      2. Cheap Potion of Feather: Relieves two levels of over-encumbrance for 10 minutes.
      3. Quaity Potion of Feather: Relieves three levels of over-encumbrance for 10 minutes.
      4. Advanced Potion of Feather: Relieves four levels of over-encumbrance for 10 minutes.
      5. Superior Potion of Feather: Relieves five levels of over-encumbrance for 10 minutes.
      6. Exclusive Potion of Feather: Relieves ALL levels of over-encumbrance for 5 minutes.

    I believe these additions will give players what they desire, more inventory, while providing ZOS with another means for revenue. Thoughts?

    And I even suggested a way for ZOS to implement crafting bags exclusively for ESO+ member while allowing all players to have them...
    Gidorick wrote: »
    So, ZOS has announced that they are considering having crafting specific inventory as an ESO+ benefit. There are many ways this can be accomplished, my suggestion is as follows:

    Crafting Bags could be items that take up one inventory slot, but can be opened to reveal that bag's contents and inventory. Crafting bags can be coded so that the crafting materials for that particular bag are automatically placed in that bag if that bag is in the players inventory when they harvest the material. Alternatively, players could place their previously gained items directly in the bag.These bags could be never-full bags so players could gather as much of the craft's materials as they want or they could simply be large enough to carry one stack of each material type for that particular craft. The bags should reject any items that are not crafting materials for their specific craft.

    Each craft could have their own bag that could be purchased by ESO+ members. A player wanting to carry materials for all crafts could carry a total of 6 bags (and more if more crafting types are introduced!) and they would consume a total of six spaces.

    These bags could be sold in an ESO+ exclusive section of crown store that has items that are only purchasable by ESO+ members. Once a player buys the bag, it is theirs. If a player leaves ESO+, they retain full rights and use of their Crafting Bags. Only their access to buy items from the ESO+ section of the Crown Store should be restricted. Bags shouldn't be able to be sold and they should be able to be freely moved from inventory to bank.

    Let's assume the bags could be sold for 1500 Crowns each (and for what they offer that is probably a pretty fair price). A player who wants to subscribe to ESO+ for one month and buys all available Crafting Bags would spend 9000 Crowns on the one month of ESO+ and six crafting bags. A player who wishes to use their ESO+ Crowns could simply stay subscribed to ESO+ for six months and their monthly allotment of crowns would pay for the bags.

    The Crafting Bags should not be the only items placed in the ESO+ section of the Crown Store. There could be a wide variety of items, pets, motifs, etc that are offered only to ESO+ members. ESO+ members could even be given a period of exclusivity on certain items by putting the item in the ESO+ section prior to offering the item in the public Crown Store.

    For those of who you think this sounds familiar, these thoughts were previously expressed in my ESO+ Subscription Benefits Suggestion thread and my More Bags and Encumbrance Thread.

    Thoughts?

    But none of that has even come close to becoming reality.

    Inventory has always been a struggle in ESO. Especially at lower levels. When ZOS was just not doing anything about it we were left with the ambiguity of hopefulness. Hopefully ZOS will fix this someday. Hopefully they will listen to us. Hopefully it will get better.

    Now? Now those who don't sub have an answer. No. It won't get better. Not unless you subscribe. ZOS's one answer, their ONLY solution to inventory woes is to add an ESO+ exclusive feature.

    What we are left with, as players who have been participating in the Buy2Play model of ESO, is a choice to abandon our purchases, continue to struggle with our inventory. There is no longer parity between the B2P and ESO+ models. ESO+ members have a CLEAR advantage when it comes to inventory management.

    The sub-benefit that I personally equate the crafting bags to is SWTOR's "Spring" benefit. In SWTOR, only subscribed players can sprint. To me, the philosophy is the same. SWTOR's subscription benefits are meant to annoy players into subscribing. ESO+ adding crafting bags are meant to do the same.

    I feel like they're trying to manipulate non ESO+ players into subscribing... and that is never a good feeling to have while playing a videogame for fun.
    What ESO really needs is an Auction Horse.
    That's right... Horse.
    Click HERE to discuss.

    Want more crazy ideas? Check out my Concept Repository!
  • TequilaFire
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    OP what will probably happen is a few months from now the crafting bag will be available in the crown store in some form.
    After the initial wave of subs dies down, ZOS will go for the rest of the money.
  • Acrolas
    Acrolas
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    Acrolas wrote: »
    The real issue is that my 12 characters will only have 20 bank spaces apiece even with the bag.

    Subscriptions can't fix basic math. Especially when one recipe takes up as much space as a 60 pound axe or a 3 ounce ring or 200 worms.

    It's doesn't make sense that with this new crafting bag you'll only have 20 empty spaces in your bank unless you have kept every drop received in every trait. Oh, and every recipie found.


    I never said anything about empty spaces.
    240 divided by 12.
    20.
    That is the new per-character maximum limit on bank space with maximum characters.

    If ZOS expects people to sub in order to accommodate both the cost and shared space of those four additional characters, then that's bad design and neither the crafting bags nor the additional slots should have been offered in the first place.
    signing off
  • BrotherChaz
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    ZOS_DaryaK wrote: »
    Hey folks, we have removed more posts that were not constructive. Please note that it's perfectly acceptable, even encouraged, to state differing opinions, just do it constructively and without personal attacks. Calling other forum members whiners, moochers, and babies constituted personal attacks.

    We've also removed posts about moderation as that is also against our community rules. If you have an issue with how a post or discussion was moderated, you are welcome to contact that moderator or another member of the moderation team via private message.

    Respect.
  • Reevster
    Reevster
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    OP what will probably happen is a few months from now the crafting bag will be available in the crown store in some form.
    After the initial wave of subs dies down, ZOS will go for the rest of the money.

    Probably , but if they are smart they wont, but if they get greedy they will.
  • BrotherChaz
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    In short.....
    -The bag should be a base game feature and the ability to obtain the bag should be in-line with:
    -crowns
    -in-game gold
    -ESO Plus

    There are a lot of arguments or opinions but bottom line is this. ZOS has moved away from their initial confirmation of what would be linked to a subscription and what would be in the crown store.

    Also, the fact that ESO Plus doesn't work as it should on Xbox One, the bag or any other features should be exclusive to a sub.

    How have they gone away with what they said as far as subscription and crown store? the BAG is convenience like literally if I could describe the bag I would say: a bag to conveniently store crafting items instead of having to visit the bank or mule alts.


    The first and most obvious is what I mention as respects to Xbox One...this has been the case since day 1 and it still occurs as recent as April 28th 2016

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/03/17/crown-store-showcase
    " Don't forget that members of ESO Plus receive a monthly allotment of crowns in addition to other in-game bonuses! "

    The other concern is items that are locked behind a sub or crowns
    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/02/12/the-road-ahead---february
    "he most important thing to remember about Tamriel Unlimited's virtual currency system is that we're not adjusting the base game—it will be exactly the same game, with the same leveling pace, experience point gain, user interface, etc.
    We're adding customization and convenience items in the Crown Store, but those will be added to the game as it is now; we're not going to make it harder for you to enjoy the game you already play to encourage you to use the Crown Store."

    "Game Director Matt Firor explained that the base game will maintain "the same levelling pace, experience point gain, [and] user interface" it always has, and promised that it won't be made more difficult to play for those who don't spring for real-money items."

    "An item in the Crown Store serves one of two purposes: It either provides a visual upgrade or distinction for your character, or it provides a way to save time at the expense of spending Crowns," he wrote. "When it comes to this second category of items, we will generally make in-game variants of similar items available either as drops or as player-craftable items as well."

    Not sure if you're on PTS but ther
    Thank you for your oppinion. However I disagree. ESO has every right to provide these bags exclusively to subscribers and no need to bow threads like this one.

    Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions are the prefered source of income for a great many reasons. At that this carrot added to the ESO+ benefits is a big plus for marketing subscriptions.

    In the end, crafting bag exclusive to ESO + is a win win for Zos. You can sub if you want to.

    @Giles.floydub17_ESO just read right above....its not a matter of opinion according to my comments above. While others have input their opinions and such, when the director of any company goes public with statements, that company should always make decisions around those statements.

    This literally makes the game more difficult in respects to inventory management without a sub so a few things.
    1. This is in conflict of earlier promises that were made on ESO Live about the words in the article linked above.
    2. The company hasn't resolved outstanding issues specific to xbox one and the crowns or DLC access under ESP Plus
    3. Making any feature exclusive to a subscription with no other options partial or incomplete of the subscription feature is not a win nor is it an intelligent business practice specifically due to earlier statement made by the companies director
    4. Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions ARE NOT a preferred source of income. Actual cash is a preferred source. All a subscription does is create another study pattern to monitor a customer base. Once you factor in charge-backs, canceled CC, failed charges, customer service costs, etc. its nothing more than another form of payment. thats all it is
    5. The real issue if that ZOS refuses to offer meaningful ESO Plus benefits so they've came up with this idea which is going to back-fire around June 20th 2016

    Insightful. Well thought out. Respect.

  • SneaK
    SneaK
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    I have ESO+ and 100% support the OP. ZOS, sell this guy his crafting bag.
    "IMO"
    Aldmeri Dominion
    Bosmer Nightblade AR 32 - Altmer Templar AR 26 - Dunmer Dragonknight AR 18 - Altmer Sorcerer AR 20 - Khajiit Dragonknight AR 18
    (+3 not worth mentioning, yet)
  • Gidorick
    Gidorick
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Reevster wrote: »
    First of all this post is not intended for ESO+ customers, you have no worries... Also please note: Where I use all caps for some words it is not intended as shouting. It is for EMPHASIS only to make a point. No offense is intended. I hope that this opinion post will not be a source of flaming posts... I just had to say something about a topic I feel strongly about.

    But for those of us who have spent a serious ammount of real $$$ on buying the game, all add-on world expansions, mounts, costumes, personal banker, etc. etc.. This needs to be an option available to us also.

    The crafting resource bags being available to JUST eso+ people is wrong.
    Im sorry but This is a major item(fundumental even) that ALL CHARACTERS need, especially with NEW CRAFTING SYSTEMS/ITEMS being added with the new expansion.

    I love the game but this is JUST Wrong. Having to get eso+ JUST to get CRAFTING BAGS feels a little bit like a slap in the face to those like me wh who have spent WAY in excess of the ammount that getting eso+ would have been ... I still have additional items (personal Merchant, New Assasins expansion etc.) I had planned to buy right away...

    Sadly despite all the upcoming changes, which I have no problem with, this one most necessary item not being available to ALL LOYAL customers just does not seem right. I love the game but this one thing... well it just is not right.

    I can not justify buying more at this point .. please keep in mind I have no problem with eso+ people getting it for free with subscription... My point is that those who have supported the game by purchasing everything up to this point should be allowed to get the much needed option also. Sell it as an option I would buy it even if it were 2000 crowns or whatever.

    Sorry it was so long... I just had to say something. I hope this oversight(in my opinion) gets resolved. I hate it when a favorite game becomes less fun because of what the company does to its structure. Its my greatest hope this will not be the case here.

    For those who want to say "Well just get eso+" I have to reply: think about it... After buying ALL the addons it just isnt fair to then FEEL FORCED to go mwith eso+ just for craft bags. What about all that money spent on the expansions? Would we be entitled to a refund since these purchased items are now included free? No there needs to be some fair mindedness and common sence applied here.

    Thanks for listening. Please no flamers. I just had to get this out. Peace.

    Why spend so much money when all you need to do is Sub, its like $180 a year and you get like $130 worth of Crowns, so for $50 a year you can have most of what you have paid "big" money for.

    I just dont get why people buy buy buy from from the crown store but refuse to Sub.... must have money to burn i guess,

    See my above post @Reevster ... I unsubed out of principal. ZOS said they wanted to go Buy2Play, I disagreed. I loved ESO being a sub based game. When they announced the ESO+ benefits I thought they were a joke... so I followed ZOS' lead and I unsubed and have bought DLC ever since. I have bought all the collectors editions of the DLC and I have enjoyed those colletions. At this point I actually prefer buying the collecctors editions over just getting base access for subscribing.

    Now ZOS is forcing me to make a choice: I have to subscribe and not get collectors editions, not subscribe and have to struggle with my inventory, or waste money by subscribing AND buying the collectors edition?

    ZOS forcing me to make one of those choices is asinine... and manipulative.
    What ESO really needs is an Auction Horse.
    That's right... Horse.
    Click HERE to discuss.

    Want more crazy ideas? Check out my Concept Repository!
  • BrotherChaz
    BrotherChaz
    ✭✭
    SneaK wrote: »
    I have ESO+ and 100% support the OP. ZOS, sell this guy his crafting bag.

    Thanks for posting. It seems likely my point will be lost to most. Thanks for the calm voice of reason. Respect.

  • Taisynn
    Taisynn
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    May I also reiterate:

    Subscriber's LOSE access to the DLC's the moment they stop paying. Poof. No more access even though you've been paying for ages.

    We don't get them "free." They're gone the moment we cancel.

    And the stipend of crowns? Cheaper just to buy the crowns outright.

    The extra experience, research time, and gold is hardly anything. I don't make anymore than non-subscribers do. Hell, only way to really get "rich" is to join a trading guild, and what you get is influenced by DROP RATE not GOLD RATE.

    And I pay extra, have to buy extra crowns, in order to afford the costumes, mounts, and pets. I also bought my banker in addition to my subscription!

    I pay more than you and then some. The difference is, even if you do somehow manage to pay more than me (doubt it), is that you don't lose access to your DLC or content if you chose to stop paying. You still have access to all of it.

    I stop paying? Goodbye the investment I made.

    Let us ESO+ members have ONE NICE THING THAT IS WORTH IT.
    Edited by Taisynn on May 24, 2016 8:32PM
    PC - @Taisynn - NA - CP 268
    Shizuko url=https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CvZa0PPdzAfUv9h_rd8J2vwc1B4NnZGkPL_n4WfgYfs/edit?usp=sharing"]RP Profile[/url - Bosmer - LVL50 - Nightblade 50 Provisioning, 50 Woodworking, 50 Clothing, 50 Alchemy Ebonhart Pact
    Nev'e - Bosmer - LVL 18 - Templar 50 Enchanting Ebonhart Pact

    Proud Member of the Guilds:
    Rusty Old Dragons (Trade) | Children of Skyrim (RP/EP) | Goldleaf Acquisitions (RP/EP)
    Spicy Economics (Trade) | The Jackals (RP/EP)
  • SwaminoNowlino
    SwaminoNowlino
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    In short.....
    -The bag should be a base game feature and the ability to obtain the bag should be in-line with:
    -crowns
    -in-game gold
    -ESO Plus

    There are a lot of arguments or opinions but bottom line is this. ZOS has moved away from their initial confirmation of what would be linked to a subscription and what would be in the crown store.

    Also, the fact that ESO Plus doesn't work as it should on Xbox One, the bag or any other features should be exclusive to a sub.

    How have they gone away with what they said as far as subscription and crown store? the BAG is convenience like literally if I could describe the bag I would say: a bag to conveniently store crafting items instead of having to visit the bank or mule alts.


    The first and most obvious is what I mention as respects to Xbox One...this has been the case since day 1 and it still occurs as recent as April 28th 2016

    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/03/17/crown-store-showcase
    " Don't forget that members of ESO Plus receive a monthly allotment of crowns in addition to other in-game bonuses! "

    The other concern is items that are locked behind a sub or crowns
    http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/02/12/the-road-ahead---february
    "he most important thing to remember about Tamriel Unlimited's virtual currency system is that we're not adjusting the base game—it will be exactly the same game, with the same leveling pace, experience point gain, user interface, etc.
    We're adding customization and convenience items in the Crown Store, but those will be added to the game as it is now; we're not going to make it harder for you to enjoy the game you already play to encourage you to use the Crown Store."

    "Game Director Matt Firor explained that the base game will maintain "the same levelling pace, experience point gain, [and] user interface" it always has, and promised that it won't be made more difficult to play for those who don't spring for real-money items."

    "An item in the Crown Store serves one of two purposes: It either provides a visual upgrade or distinction for your character, or it provides a way to save time at the expense of spending Crowns," he wrote. "When it comes to this second category of items, we will generally make in-game variants of similar items available either as drops or as player-craftable items as well."

    Not sure if you're on PTS but ther
    Thank you for your oppinion. However I disagree. ESO has every right to provide these bags exclusively to subscribers and no need to bow threads like this one.

    Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions are the prefered source of income for a great many reasons. At that this carrot added to the ESO+ benefits is a big plus for marketing subscriptions.

    In the end, crafting bag exclusive to ESO + is a win win for Zos. You can sub if you want to.

    @Giles.floydub17_ESO just read right above....its not a matter of opinion according to my comments above. While others have input their opinions and such, when the director of any company goes public with statements, that company should always make decisions around those statements.

    This literally makes the game more difficult in respects to inventory management without a sub so a few things.
    1. This is in conflict of earlier promises that were made on ESO Live about the words in the article linked above.
    2. The company hasn't resolved outstanding issues specific to xbox one and the crowns or DLC access under ESP Plus
    3. Making any feature exclusive to a subscription with no other options partial or incomplete of the subscription feature is not a win nor is it an intelligent business practice specifically due to earlier statement made by the companies director
    4. Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions ARE NOT a preferred source of income. Actual cash is a preferred source. All a subscription does is create another study pattern to monitor a customer base. Once you factor in charge-backs, canceled CC, failed charges, customer service costs, etc. its nothing more than another form of payment. that's all it is
    5. The real issue if that ZOS refuses to offer meaningful ESO Plus benefits so they've came up with this idea which is going to back-fire around June 20th 2016

    1) The game will be exactly zero percent more difficult for you by not having a crafting bag. So you're categorically irrefutably wrong. His statement that they provide a way to save time is a testament to that. "We will GENERALLY make in-game variants..." Not always, not even the majority of the time. So stop.
    5) Stop... Just please stop... I am actually an economist for a living and this is maybe the most ridiculous thing I have ever read. As a company, I can pay people to create stuff to feed one time purchases, that are inherently unreliable as to how they will impact revenues. Conversely, I could have a steady supply of income that I can rely on to make investment decisions, and spend next to zero in return as it has already been obligated. I can't count on you to buy a mount four months from now, but I can count on the money that I already have obligated to me through subscriptions in order to make investment decisions.


    So stop. Seriously. You are embarrassing yourself.
    Xbox NA : CP 160 StamPlar, MagNB, MagSorc, StamSorc, StamDK, StamNB, Level 10 MagDK & MagPlar, StamWarden, MagWarden

    "We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome." - The Balance Lord Wrobel
    - And now it sure does, better learn how to bash folks!

    I get by with a little help from logic.
  • Taisynn
    Taisynn
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    +1 to what SwaminoNowlino said above me.
    giphy.gif
    Edited by Taisynn on May 24, 2016 8:39PM
    PC - @Taisynn - NA - CP 268
    Shizuko url=https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CvZa0PPdzAfUv9h_rd8J2vwc1B4NnZGkPL_n4WfgYfs/edit?usp=sharing"]RP Profile[/url - Bosmer - LVL50 - Nightblade 50 Provisioning, 50 Woodworking, 50 Clothing, 50 Alchemy Ebonhart Pact
    Nev'e - Bosmer - LVL 18 - Templar 50 Enchanting Ebonhart Pact

    Proud Member of the Guilds:
    Rusty Old Dragons (Trade) | Children of Skyrim (RP/EP) | Goldleaf Acquisitions (RP/EP)
    Spicy Economics (Trade) | The Jackals (RP/EP)
  • RandalMarrs
    RandalMarrs
    ✭✭✭
    Feels like deja vu. Could have just revived one of the many threads about this. Quit beating a dead horse.
  • daemonios
    daemonios
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well, considering I think the game should always have remained sub based, no, I don't see anything wrong with it.
  • WhoThenNow7
    WhoThenNow7
    ✭✭✭
    This topic has been beaten to a realm far beyond death. I think it's funny when people who share their opinion of how "wrong" it is get mad when people who share their opinion on how "if you want it then subscribe". I mean seriously.. What's the point in subscribing if there are no perks that only subscribers can get? And to those that say, "no I agree subscribers should get perks but just not the crafting bag perk", then seriously what perks should we get then? DLC? Or just a special costume that says we pay $15 a month and nothing else? Seriously, get over yourselves..
    Edited by WhoThenNow7 on May 24, 2016 8:41PM
  • Kendaric
    Kendaric
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    Gidorick wrote: »

    The sub-benefit that I personally equate the crafting bags to is SWTOR's "Spring" benefit. In SWTOR, only subscribed players can sprint. To me, the philosophy is the same. SWTOR's subscription benefits are meant to annoy players into subscribing. ESO+ adding crafting bags are meant to do the same.

    I feel like they're trying to manipulate non ESO+ players into subscribing... and that is never a good feeling to have while playing a videogame for fun.

    That's not entirely correct (unless it was changed recently)... sprint is available to F2P players as well as subs in SWTOR, F2P players just need to get to level 10 to use it.
    The two business models aren't really comparable, though. BioWare/EA basically annoys players into subscribing by reducing their experience point gain, limiting the number of crafting professions, limiting the number of times you can gain loot from flashpoint bosses (their version of dungons), etc.
    ESO merely has convience features offered for subs (increased exp gain, reduced research times and now the crafting bag).
    That's, in my opinion, a fundamental difference... while ESO offers incentives to subscribe, SWTOR annoys you into subscription.
      PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!. Outfit slots not being accountwide is ridiculous given their price. PC EU/PC NA roleplayer and solo PvE quester
    • idk
      idk
      ✭✭✭✭✭
      ✭✭✭✭✭
      In short.....
      -The bag should be a base game feature and the ability to obtain the bag should be in-line with:
      -crowns
      -in-game gold
      -ESO Plus

      There are a lot of arguments or opinions but bottom line is this. ZOS has moved away from their initial confirmation of what would be linked to a subscription and what would be in the crown store.

      Also, the fact that ESO Plus doesn't work as it should on Xbox One, the bag or any other features should be exclusive to a sub.

      How have they gone away with what they said as far as subscription and crown store? the BAG is convenience like literally if I could describe the bag I would say: a bag to conveniently store crafting items instead of having to visit the bank or mule alts.


      The first and most obvious is what I mention as respects to Xbox One...this has been the case since day 1 and it still occurs as recent as April 28th 2016

      http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/03/17/crown-store-showcase
      " Don't forget that members of ESO Plus receive a monthly allotment of crowns in addition to other in-game bonuses! "

      The other concern is items that are locked behind a sub or crowns
      http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/02/12/the-road-ahead---february
      "he most important thing to remember about Tamriel Unlimited's virtual currency system is that we're not adjusting the base game—it will be exactly the same game, with the same leveling pace, experience point gain, user interface, etc.
      We're adding customization and convenience items in the Crown Store, but those will be added to the game as it is now; we're not going to make it harder for you to enjoy the game you already play to encourage you to use the Crown Store."

      "Game Director Matt Firor explained that the base game will maintain "the same levelling pace, experience point gain, [and] user interface" it always has, and promised that it won't be made more difficult to play for those who don't spring for real-money items."

      "An item in the Crown Store serves one of two purposes: It either provides a visual upgrade or distinction for your character, or it provides a way to save time at the expense of spending Crowns," he wrote. "When it comes to this second category of items, we will generally make in-game variants of similar items available either as drops or as player-craftable items as well."

      Not sure if you're on PTS but ther
      Thank you for your oppinion. However I disagree. ESO has every right to provide these bags exclusively to subscribers and no need to bow threads like this one.

      Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions are the prefered source of income for a great many reasons. At that this carrot added to the ESO+ benefits is a big plus for marketing subscriptions.

      In the end, crafting bag exclusive to ESO + is a win win for Zos. You can sub if you want to.

      @Giles.floydub17_ESO just read right above....its not a matter of opinion according to my comments above. While others have input their opinions and such, when the director of any company goes public with statements, that company should always make decisions around those statements.

      This literally makes the game more difficult in respects to inventory management without a sub so a few things.
      1. This is in conflict of earlier promises that were made on ESO Live about the words in the article linked above.
      2. The company hasn't resolved outstanding issues specific to xbox one and the crowns or DLC access under ESP Plus
      3. Making any feature exclusive to a subscription with no other options partial or incomplete of the subscription feature is not a win nor is it an intelligent business practice specifically due to earlier statement made by the companies director
      4. Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions ARE NOT a preferred source of income. Actual cash is a preferred source. All a subscription does is create another study pattern to monitor a customer base. Once you factor in charge-backs, canceled CC, failed charges, customer service costs, etc. its nothing more than another form of payment. thats all it is
      5. The real issue if that ZOS refuses to offer meaningful ESO Plus benefits so they've came up with this idea which is going to back-fire around June 20th 2016

      rotflmao. You say your stance is not a matter of oppinion yet all you state is oppinions and much of it misguided and slanted to favor your oppinion.

      Solid fact beyond contestation is subscriptions are more desirable that mere purchase of DLC. The mere FACT that ESO is offering this crafting bag as an exclusive for subs says it all.

      Additionall, other industries with subscription options and buy what you want (newspapers and magazines are let notable) value is based mostly on subscriptions. Newsstand sales have a much lower value. The value of ESO works off the same models.

      Basic economics and marketing. Very simple to understand.

      Oh, oh, almost forgot. Zos is probably following the example they followed over a year ago. That is SWTOR's move from pure subscription to a modified business model similar to what Zos ended up doing. And last year SWTOR introduced content that required a subscription to enjoy and participate. Previously SWTOR locked PvP behind the subscription wall.

      You can say whatever you wish. It doesn't make it reality. I have backed up my words with real facts. Industry and econ/marketing principles. Not mere oppinions to back up opinions.
      Edited by idk on May 24, 2016 8:48PM
    • Miszou
      Miszou
      ✭✭✭✭✭
      This needs to be an option available to us also.

      But... it is. :|

      It is available to everyone. You just aren't prepared to pay the price for it.

      The End.
    • Uriel_Nocturne
      Uriel_Nocturne
      ✭✭✭✭✭
      ✭✭
      In short.....
      -The bag should be a base game feature and the ability to obtain the bag should be in-line with:
      -crowns
      -in-game gold
      -ESO Plus

      There are a lot of arguments or opinions but bottom line is this. ZOS has moved away from their initial confirmation of what would be linked to a subscription and what would be in the crown store.

      Also, the fact that ESO Plus doesn't work as it should on Xbox One, the bag or any other features should be exclusive to a sub.

      How have they gone away with what they said as far as subscription and crown store? the BAG is convenience like literally if I could describe the bag I would say: a bag to conveniently store crafting items instead of having to visit the bank or mule alts.


      The first and most obvious is what I mention as respects to Xbox One...this has been the case since day 1 and it still occurs as recent as April 28th 2016

      http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/03/17/crown-store-showcase
      " Don't forget that members of ESO Plus receive a monthly allotment of crowns in addition to other in-game bonuses! "

      The other concern is items that are locked behind a sub or crowns
      http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/02/12/the-road-ahead---february
      "he most important thing to remember about Tamriel Unlimited's virtual currency system is that we're not adjusting the base game—it will be exactly the same game, with the same leveling pace, experience point gain, user interface, etc.
      We're adding customization and convenience items in the Crown Store, but those will be added to the game as it is now; we're not going to make it harder for you to enjoy the game you already play to encourage you to use the Crown Store."

      "Game Director Matt Firor explained that the base game will maintain "the same levelling pace, experience point gain, [and] user interface" it always has, and promised that it won't be made more difficult to play for those who don't spring for real-money items."

      "An item in the Crown Store serves one of two purposes: It either provides a visual upgrade or distinction for your character, or it provides a way to save time at the expense of spending Crowns," he wrote. "When it comes to this second category of items, we will generally make in-game variants of similar items available either as drops or as player-craftable items as well."

      Not sure if you're on PTS but ther
      Thank you for your oppinion. However I disagree. ESO has every right to provide these bags exclusively to subscribers and no need to bow threads like this one.

      Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions are the prefered source of income for a great many reasons. At that this carrot added to the ESO+ benefits is a big plus for marketing subscriptions.

      In the end, crafting bag exclusive to ESO + is a win win for Zos. You can sub if you want to.

      @Giles.floydub17_ESO just read right above....its not a matter of opinion according to my comments above. While others have input their opinions and such, when the director of any company goes public with statements, that company should always make decisions around those statements.

      This literally makes the game more difficult in respects to inventory management without a sub so a few things.
      1. This is in conflict of earlier promises that were made on ESO Live about the words in the article linked above.
      2. The company hasn't resolved outstanding issues specific to xbox one and the crowns or DLC access under ESP Plus
      3. Making any feature exclusive to a subscription with no other options partial or incomplete of the subscription feature is not a win nor is it an intelligent business practice specifically due to earlier statement made by the companies director
      4. Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions ARE NOT a preferred source of income. Actual cash is a preferred source. All a subscription does is create another study pattern to monitor a customer base. Once you factor in charge-backs, canceled CC, failed charges, customer service costs, etc. its nothing more than another form of payment. that's all it is
      5. The real issue if that ZOS refuses to offer meaningful ESO Plus benefits so they've came up with this idea which is going to back-fire around June 20th 2016

      1) The game will be exactly zero percent more difficult for you by not having a crafting bag. So you're categorically irrefutably wrong. His statement that they provide a way to save time is a testament to that. "We will GENERALLY make in-game variants..." Not always, not even the majority of the time. So stop.
      5) Stop... Just please stop... I am actually an economist for a living and this is maybe the most ridiculous thing I have ever read. As a company, I can pay people to create stuff to feed one time purchases, that are inherently unreliable as to how they will impact revenues. Conversely, I could have a steady supply of income that I can rely on to make investment decisions, and spend next to zero in return as it has already been obligated. I can't count on you to buy a mount four months from now, but I can count on the money that I already have obligated to me through subscriptions in order to make investment decisions.


      So stop. Seriously. You are embarrassing yourself.
      Economics 101.

      Simple.


      twitch.tv/vampire_nox
      PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say no to Crown Crates!


    • bloodenragedb14_ESO
      bloodenragedb14_ESO
      ✭✭✭✭✭
      Kendaric wrote: »
      Gidorick wrote: »

      The sub-benefit that I personally equate the crafting bags to is SWTOR's "Spring" benefit. In SWTOR, only subscribed players can sprint. To me, the philosophy is the same. SWTOR's subscription benefits are meant to annoy players into subscribing. ESO+ adding crafting bags are meant to do the same.

      I feel like they're trying to manipulate non ESO+ players into subscribing... and that is never a good feeling to have while playing a videogame for fun.

      That's not entirely correct (unless it was changed recently)... sprint is available to F2P players as well as subs in SWTOR, F2P players just need to get to level 10 to use it.
      The two business models aren't really comparable, though. BioWare/EA basically annoys players into subscribing by reducing their experience point gain, limiting the number of crafting professions, limiting the number of times you can gain loot from flashpoint bosses (their version of dungons), etc.
      ESO merely has convience features offered for subs (increased exp gain, reduced research times and now the crafting bag).
      That's, in my opinion, a fundamental difference... while ESO offers incentives to subscribe, SWTOR annoys you into subscription.

      I love SWTOR, but the f2p model is something of a example i use myself to tell game devs what NOT TO DO. i cant really blame bioware, they try, but they are saddled with the worst bosses in the industry, the money grubbing corporate zombie that is EA.

      Compared to many other buisness model's in the mmo industry, ESO's is by far one of the better ones. ON a scale of 1 to 10 of greed, 1 being not greedy, 10 being EA, id say eso's cash shop is 3
    • code65536
      code65536
      ✭✭✭✭✭
      ✭✭✭✭✭
      ZOS making the game B2P instead of subscription is viewed by many to be a mistake.

      This is a good compromise step in the right direction.

      Besides, why doesn't anyone argue for ways to buy the other "perks"? Ah, yes, only when there's a perk that you actually want that you bring out the unfairness argument.
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    • newtinmpls
      newtinmpls
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      I noted:

      4. Anyone with basic economic and marketing knowledge would understand that subscriptions ARE NOT a preferred source of income. Actual cash is a preferred source. All a subscription does is create another study pattern to monitor a customer base. Once you factor in charge-backs, canceled CC, failed charges, customer service costs, etc. its nothing more than another form of payment. that's all it is

      This did not make sense to me, however not being an economist, I couldn't argue it on actual knowledge, only logic and common sense.
      5) Stop... Just please stop... I am actually an economist for a living and this is maybe the most ridiculous thing I have ever read. As a company, I can pay people to create stuff to feed one time purchases, that are inherently unreliable as to how they will impact revenues. Conversely, I could have a steady supply of income that I can rely on to make investment decisions, and spend next to zero in return as it has already been obligated. I can't count on you to buy a mount four months from now, but I can count on the money that I already have obligated to me through subscriptions in order to make investment decisions.

      Thank you.
      Tenesi Faryon of Telvanni - Dunmer Sorceress who deliberately sought sacrifice into Cold Harbor to rescue her beloved.
      Hisa Ni Caemaire - Altmer Sorceress, member of the Order Draconis and Adept of the House of Dibella.
      Broken Branch Toothmaul - goblin (for my goblin characters, I use either orsimer or bosmer templates) Templar, member of the Order Draconis and persistently unskilled pickpocket
      Mol gro Durga - Orsimer Socerer/Battlemage who died the first time when the Nibenay Valley chapterhouse of the Order Draconis was destroyed, then went back to Cold Harbor to rescue his second/partner who was still captive. He overestimated his resistance to the hopelessness of Oblivion, about to give up, and looked up to see the golden glow of atherius surrounding a beautiful young woman who extended her hand to him and said "I can help you". He carried Fianna Kingsley out of Cold Harbor on his shoulder. He carried Alvard Stower under one arm. He also irritated the Prophet who had intended the portal for only Mol and Lyris.
      ***
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    • SneaK
      SneaK
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      SneaK wrote: »
      I have ESO+ and 100% support the OP. ZOS, sell this guy his crafting bag.

      Thanks for posting. It seems likely my point will be lost to most. Thanks for the calm voice of reason. Respect.

      Literally no good reason for any of these yahoos to be against your proposal. Even from a business standpoint with ZOS, they sell the bags they make more money, and make more people happy.

      "IMO"
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    • Cuyler
      Cuyler
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      Gidorick wrote: »
      Now ZOS is forcing me to make a choice: I have to subscribe and not get collectors editions, not subscribe and have to struggle with my inventory, or waste money by subscribing AND buying the collectors edition?

      Wouldn't you get a number of crowns cheaper for subscribing? and then be able to purchase the collector's edition with those crowns? while getting ESO+ benefits?

      Sooooo wouldn't it actually be cheaper for you? maybe I'm missing something here......
      Edited by Cuyler on May 24, 2016 8:59PM
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