Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

I suggested in the official thread that they keep the 2 cleanses on cast and then cleanse an additional 2 effects every 2 seconds. This way, we can't spam wipe all the bad stuff but the Templar house becomes like a self-cleaning oven. I don't even care about the crappy damage they added especially because I'm a Stamplar.

This would give the spell more utility with less spam. I hate fighting other Templars because in an instant they undo my Poison Injection, axe bleed, snare, Minor Defile, all of it. It basically turns into a jab war, which Mageplars always win due to their superior morph.

You hate that they do they're only one left defense skill? Use caltrops as snare, stop exploiting axe bleed, add knockdown uppercut morph to your panel if you start to spam jabs and rely on cleancable dots in fight with magplar while you in stamina - it's definitely L2P issue.

Your suggestion is viable for stamina perspective, but it will not work for magicka templar who cannot roll dodge 4 seconds in a raw.

@Sugaroverdose I have no idea what the point of your above response is. I was offering a personal anecdote about the power of 5 cleanses in one button press and a legitimate concept for balancing the ability. I'm not sure why you felt the need to jump in and teach me how to fight magplars.

Purifying Ritual is not, as you say, the Templar's "only one left defense skill," and I don't plan on ever running your Caltrops and Wrecking Blow cheese spam. Also, axe bleed is not an exploit, they fixed it with the last major update and is a valuable part of my build.

I'm not saying that there shouldn't be counters to DoT builds like mine. However, I think ZOS is finally starting to get a handle on class balance and they are getting a lot of things right this update in my opinion. They are swinging the nerf bat a little too hard with Purifying Ritual, we all agree, but I also agree with them that 5 instant cleanses is over the top (and let me remind you that I main a Templar so I wear a flame-proof suit).

What surviving tools does magplar have now?
BoL which is a not a cheap heal? Or i must run light armor and run annulment(which isn't class ability)? Templars don't have anything comparable to invisibility which by design will completely disable dot for whole invisibility duration, don't have reflects which gives you and offensive and defensive superiority at range, not streak which allows you to run from guy on fully trained horse while sprinting? No even closely comparable f thing templars does have with this changes.

Your build relies on dot's and it's completely clear that it will not work on heal-specific class in any game just because it's healer thing - negating the f dots and other negative effects. And your "balance" is nothing than happiness about your build start to work 100% in time without investing anything to make it better vs magplars.

DDuke wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Essiaga wrote: »

Consider Templar also has no passive buff to max stat, regen, spell damage, etc. I don't think that's fair. Cleanse almost makes up for that. We have weak utility in our skills when compared to many others.

It's also not fair that Templare doesn't have Brutality in class like all others. We stuck with a 2-hander or DW ... what if i want S&B w/ Bow? All other classes have other options. We're stuck.

The templar is a different animal then the rest. Fair doesn't really fit in the argument.

I'll have to correct you there :P

Templars get +5% spell damage from passives and around 1k(!!!) worth of "magicka regen" from using Channeled Focus & Honor the Dead (with heavy armor, with light armor you get less regen from Honor the Dead). Undoubtedly the best magicka sustain of all classes.

And I'll have to correct you there.

SOME templars get around 1K worth of magick regen IF they take the Channeled Focus morph AND they slot it on their bar AND use the skill AND manage to stay in it every 8 seconds AND take the honor the Dead morph.

Just because you think these are obvious choices, does not make them automatically come to all Templars in every situation.

And it most certainly not "undoubtedly" the best magicka sustain of all classes. It can be good given specific morphs, choices, gameplay, and - sacrifice - to get those benefits, I have to take morphs that aren;t as good, something classes with actual regen passives do not have to worry about. It is undoubtedly the worst if a templar does not make all those specific choices.

Well, I get your point but... is there any templar *not* using Channeled Focus? :P

I can understand not using Honor the Dead, since the other morph can be better for a group healer in light armor - but channeled focus alone is worth 480 "magicka regen". Just by casting the skill, you get over twice the cost of the skill back even if you never return to the circle (and this is while wearing heavy armor, with light it's even more cost efficient).

If you're having sustain issues as a templar, slot one or both of these skills - problem solved.


I do get your point about the passives though, Templar ones aren't necessarily the strongest when it comes to sustain - so it's good they got active abilities to compensate ;P

Some of them are actually completely useless for most templars & should be mentioned here for the sake of constructive criticism - like the Light Weaver passive for instance.
Who uses healing ulti, Healing Ritual or Restoring Aura (not Repentance, the other morph)? I'd say this is a "dead passive" for most templars.

Yeah, me. I don't use Channeled Focus. Maybe I wanted to use the other morph for 8% minor protection to go with the Cyrodiil's Light set and the Crescent Sweep morph to get a ton of passive mitigation while spamming my channels. You can't just take it as a given that every templar has it.

And since when is "balancing" a class around 1 morph, that you think everyone uses, a good idea? Like, why bother having choices, build diversity, or options? I get the logic that since tempalrs have zero passives for sustain that it is good they have active skills to compensate, but it's just that - compensation. It isn't a given and not part of the standard templar package the way 15% passive regen is to NBs or even for DKs who don't have to pick inferior morphs or ultiamtes to get anything from Helping Hands or Battle Roar. The templar magic regen doesn't automatically happen, does not apply to all templars, comes with opportunity costs (and thus not free), and requires specific morphs and conditions

In general I do agree with your outlook upon most things in ESO as to what makes for compelling gameplay, but the change to purifying is particularly hard for me to swallow because debuffs are so common in Cyrodiil - bombard stacks [!], all it takes is for some random NB to mark me and all of a sudden I got to spam Purify just to move - this was pretty much all templars were left with in the wake of the removal of Blinding Flashes, the evisceration of Eclipse, and the nerfs to what was the templar's signature ability in Breath of Life. It was fine one class was good at cleansing because the other classes were good at their own defensive niches and thus this smacks of an unnecessary nerf that is most certainly unwanted by many templars and wasn't asked for before this patch by non-templars.

Fair enough.

Yeah, my biggest concern is also the immobilizes & what not being able to purge them means for a magicka templar (particularly melee one), but if there was a system for priorization of those immobilizes that'd make it fine in my opinion - not being able to purge all DoTs with one click would of course make magicka DKs particularly more difficult - but in my books that'd be a good change for the overall balance of the game.

That's a big "if" though - as long as there's no priorization of certain abilities when using purge, I'll probably end up hating this change to Purifying Ritual (no matter how much I love it otherwise) when trying to 1vX & having some DK holding block & spamming roots next to me while the people I can't reach due to the uncleansable immobilize spam Lethal Arrows & Dark Flares at me, making even more debuffs to cleanse before I can cleanse the immobilize and...........

---

I think I'm going to have nightmares

Dreddnawt wrote: »

I agree that if one morph is to be removed it should be the Extended Ritual. That morph does nothing to improve or change the skill, it merely extends the effect duration.

Where Purifying actually has usefulness for pure healer builds as the only versatile cleanse that can remove multiple negative status effects. It has application in PvE and PvP and adds to the original skill, as opposed to Extended which simply prolongs the original effects.

PS. Big fan of the new morph though.

Gottbeard wrote: »

The patch notes were a little unclear on this nerf. If it really lost the 5 effects then that is kind of crappy. I feel like every cleanse in the game should at least remove 3 effects or it can never win the gcd war. Almost every skill in the game has some kind of doo doo kicker effect. Some have 3 in one gcd. How am I supposed to effectively counterplay something like a Jesus beam/dark flare/bombard spammer if I only get 2 purges per cast? I am more than likely going to waste my time removing half a mark target or a crappy burning proc while I am trying to purge that soul assault. If you don't want purges to work then take them out of the game but please stop toying with my emotions.

AfkNinja wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

To be fair, cleansing 5 negative effects with one button press was kind of silly in 1v1 scenarios - so I'm happy it's more balanced there now. Your one instant cast button press taking one global cooldown was negating 4-5 button presses of opponent & multiple seconds of time spent applying them.

Also, one of the biggest lacks of a templar is the damage. It's good but... it's not enough vs certain builds. This morph will help with that a lot.


Of course, if you play a melee magicka build with Sweeps - getting root spammed becomes a much bigger problem with this change. Not in 1v1, but when you are outnumbered. In 1v1 you match opponent's one button press with a button press of your own - so I don't see why you'd have problems against anyone there. In 1vX... root spam is pure annoyance for a melee build.

We'll see how you will be happy when you get from magblade:
Piercing mark(3 negative effects) + Entropy + Crippling grasp spam = 3 cleanses until you have an ability to start turning around.

I've already learned that you happy with everything, maybe you'll just make a post about that?
PS: Something tells me that your next vid will be about stamblade.

sounds like l2p
time to unlock purge

Purifying ritual is better than purge in everyway.

In a group setting Purge is better actually as it doesn't require a synergy to remove ally debuffs.