Templar Thaumaturge Sweep Bug - Fix coming for Live

Nifty2g · April 2016

Multiple sources are telling me since the change to thaumaturge, is affecting Puncturing Sweeps and possibly Radiant Destruction (unsure on that one)

Thaumaturge: Fixed an issue where this Champion ability was increasing the damage of various non-damage over time effects, such as Daedric Curse or Magicka Detonation.
Known Issue: Currently, Thaumaturge is still increasing the tooltip values of those abilities. This will be fixed in a future PTS patch.

I hope to god this is not intended because if it was you have just *** Templars completely, last patch was fine, but this is a bit too much. To be fair, Puncturing Sweeps itself acts like a DoT, deals damage per tick as does Radiant Destruction. They don't function like Proximity Detonation nor Daedric Curse.

Please fix this... if this isn't fixed for Live, I'm out.

timidobserver wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno
I need asap clarification on thins

Thaumaturge: Fixed an issue where this Champion ability was increasing the damage of various non-damage over time effects, such as Daedric Curse or Magicka Detonation.

Does this affect puncturing sweep and it's morphs?

Can someone test this for me

@Nifty2g
I can confirm that Puncturing Sweep no longer gains DPS from Thaumaturge. The tooltip still goes up, but the damage actually done is no longer impacted.

Hope people realise how stupid this is and get if fixed. Sounds like a bug since Sweeps/Jabs do damage per tick unlike curse/det

@ZOS_GinaBruno

It is kind of strange. My Radiant Destruction ticks are still benefiting from Thaumaturge, but my Puncturing Sweep ticks are not. This is going off of testing damage numbers not tooltips.

I posted a topic mind getting me some testings i cant get on pts at the moment

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/262103/templar-thaumaturge-are-you-***-kidding-me-zos

I am going to bed now, but here is a quick video I put together. It shows that 73 points into precise strikes and 73 points into thaumaturge = no change in damage if you look at the combat log in the chatbox.

We start with CPs in Precise Strikes and then move them into Thaumaturge. There is no change in damage output.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CaKKZlEgCEI

Video showing Rapid Strikes the same sort of skill as Puncturing Sweep being affected by Thaumaturge

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r59CameQ9ZA

Nifty2g · April 2016

I forgot to throw a tag @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert

ginoboehm · April 2016

well if this goes through templar will lose soooo much damage. i could understand if thrauma stops buffing dark flare but this. they killed the class if that is true

SublimeSparo · April 2016

Could be worse, they could have ruined all our Nirnhoned swords as well... oh wait...

Nifty2g · April 2016

They just replaced nirn with sharpened by the looks of it and buffed it for stam

But I don't understand this what so ever, it is a damage over time it deals damage per tick not at the end of the cast like the abilities mentioned

reclaimervii.sierra117ub17_ESO · April 2016

I'll see if I can post pictures with my current live cp set up and then changing my cp set up with nothing in thaurmaturge. I r in Starbucks right now scoping out slooots brb guise

Nifty2g · April 2016

reclaimervii.sierra117ub17_ESO wrote: »

I'll see if I can post pictures with my current live cp set up and then changing my cp set up with nothing in thaurmaturge. I r in Starbucks right now scoping out slooots brb guise

im pretty sure its been confirmed to only affect tooltip but the damage doesn't increase

Strider_Roshin · April 2016

So if a bug that allows you to double dip champion points on abilities that are obviously not DoTs is fixed you're leaving the game? Good thing you're not a fan of the Battle Axe.

Nifty2g · April 2016

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

So if a bug that allows you to double dip champion points on abilities that are obviously not DoTs is fixed you're leaving the game? Good thing you're not a fan of the Battle Axe.

Please tell me, how is Puncturing Sweep not a DoT?
Channeled ability that deals damage per tick
Sounds like a damage over time to me.

I'll leave until they fix it up, it's absolute garbage they keep shitting on Templar DPS when it finds a good spot. It's not the strongest and it's good where it is at, but they just completely destroyed it with this

Lexxypwns · April 2016

@Nifty2g at least you're not a sorc

I feel your pain though, magplars are actually very well balanced atm, outside of mobility, there's no reason to give them ANY nerfs.

That being said, incoming stamblade pvp meta again, rolling mine tonight.

hedna123b14_ESO · April 2016

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

So if a bug that allows you to double dip champion points on abilities that are obviously not DoTs is fixed you're leaving the game? Good thing you're not a fan of the Battle Axe.

it IS a dot

Astanphaeus · April 2016

Puncturing Sweep isn't a DOT, it's 4 consecutive attacks from one skill. Radiant Destruction is a DOT however and should be affected by Thaumaturge.

Nifty2g · April 2016

Astanphaeus wrote: »

Puncturing Sweep isn't a DOT, it's 4 consecutive attacks from one skill. Radiant Destruction is a DOT however and should be affected by Thaumaturge.

How does that make sense
Channeled ability that deals damage per ticks, it's the same as Radiant Destruction. Both deal damage per tick and is a channeled ability

Also from what I'm hearing Rapid Strikes is getting benefits from Thaumaturge. Please.

code65536 · April 2016

Well, it's a channeled ability, which is kind of a gray area. Not direct damage, but not what most people would think of as a traditional DoT. It really deserves to be in its own classification.

They should probably buff the damage a bit to offset this CP change.

The other things that I would wonder about are...

* Is it still considered a DoT for Skoria?
* Is it still considered a DoT for the DW vMA weapon enchant?
* Does this affect Flurry?

NewBlacksmurf · April 2016

It's damage over time.
We can't strike independent....don't let an animation throw you off

Damage over Time, generally abbreviated as DoT or simply dot, refers to inflicting some damage on one's foe which will be applied at a regular interval for a limited duration. Abilities and debuffs that inflict damage over time are referred to as DoTs. Some AoE effects also deal damage over time.

Nifty2g · April 2016

code65536 wrote: »

Well, it's a channeled ability, which is kind of a gray area. Not direct damage, but not what most people would think of as a traditional DoT. It really deserves to be in its own classification.

They should probably buff the damage a bit to offset this CP change.

The other things that I would wonder about are...

* Is it still considered a DoT for Skoria?
* Is it still considered a DoT for the DW vMA weapon enchant?
* Does this affect Flurry?

It procs Skoria
No it's never worked when I tested it with RD, never tried sweeps.
and no it doesn't affect flurry from what I hear. Flurry benefits from Thaumaturge.

In ZOS's 2 examples they gave

such as Daedric Curse or Magicka Detonation.

they gave us examples of skills that deal damage after a certain amount of time. That is not a damage over time in technical sense. But abilities like Puncturing Sweep, Radiant Destruction and Flurry deal damage per tick over an amount of time which falls in the "Damage over Time" category, I don't believe it needs their own classification, it sounds like a DoT to me and acts like one.

blabafat · April 2016

Interested to see how or if ZOS responds.

Alcast · April 2016

This change would cripple Templars. Both Magicka AND Stamina.

@ZOS_GinaBruno Can we have clarification if that is intended or only a sideeffect of the change and it will be fixed?

DividendGamer · April 2016

Yeah, this needs to be addressed.

Nifty2g · April 2016

confirmed thaum buffs rapid strikes.

thanks zos

Ajaxduo · April 2016

If they are sticking to this change then both morphs of jabs will need some love. <.<

EgoRush · April 2016

They really need to clarify what certain abilities are. Puncturing Sweeps can proc Valkyn but not Nerien'eth, indicating it is a DoT. But also, each individual hit of Puncturing Sweeps can proc Scathing Mage, suggesting it isn't a DoT.

Going strictly by the definition of damage-over-time I really think Sweeps should still benefit from Thaumaturge. Alternatively, change it so that all 4 hits strike simultaneously and give us a Templar Molten Whip basically. Homogenize the classes!

susmitds · April 2016

Nifty2g wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

So if a bug that allows you to double dip champion points on abilities that are obviously not DoTs is fixed you're leaving the game? Good thing you're not a fan of the Battle Axe.

Please tell me, how is Puncturing Sweep not a DoT?
Channeled ability that deals damage per tick
Sounds like a damage over time to me.

I'll leave until they fix it up, it's absolute garbage they keep shitting on Templar DPS when it finds a good spot. It's not the strongest and it's good where it is at, but they just completely destroyed it with this

By the same logic, almost every channel is a DoT. They have Ticks too. Why should only Sweeps take advantage of a bug?

Nifty2g · April 2016

susmitds wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

So if a bug that allows you to double dip champion points on abilities that are obviously not DoTs is fixed you're leaving the game? Good thing you're not a fan of the Battle Axe.

Please tell me, how is Puncturing Sweep not a DoT?
Channeled ability that deals damage per tick
Sounds like a damage over time to me.

I'll leave until they fix it up, it's absolute garbage they keep shitting on Templar DPS when it finds a good spot. It's not the strongest and it's good where it is at, but they just completely destroyed it with this

By the same logic, almost every channel is a DoT. They have Ticks too. Why should only Sweeps take advantage of a bug?

That's my point? Every channel in game is considered a dot lol, everything is being buffed it seems but Sweeps
And it's not a bug they are being buffed by thaum, that is an actual mechanic by definition of what a damage over time is. If it's not fixed, rework sweeps into Puncturing Sweep and make it deal damage per hit much like Whip from a dk of swallow soul from a nightblade.

Complete BS if it is intended with no fix to the actual skill

PriorityBalle · April 2016

Nifty2g wrote: »

Please fix this... if this isn't fixed for Live, I'm out.

Yes pls yes pls

susmitds · April 2016

Nifty2g wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

So if a bug that allows you to double dip champion points on abilities that are obviously not DoTs is fixed you're leaving the game? Good thing you're not a fan of the Battle Axe.

Please tell me, how is Puncturing Sweep not a DoT?
Channeled ability that deals damage per tick
Sounds like a damage over time to me.

I'll leave until they fix it up, it's absolute garbage they keep shitting on Templar DPS when it finds a good spot. It's not the strongest and it's good where it is at, but they just completely destroyed it with this

By the same logic, almost every channel is a DoT. They have Ticks too. Why should only Sweeps take advantage of a bug?

That's my point? Every channel in game is considered a dot lol, everything is being buffed it seems but Sweeps
And it's not a bug they are being buffed by thaum, that is an actual mechanic by definition of what a damage over time is. If it's not fixed, rework sweeps into Puncturing Sweep and make it deal damage per hit much like Whip from a dk of swallow soul from a nightblade.

Complete BS if it is intended with no fix to the actual skill

Nope not any other Channel gets affected by thaumatarge. My Flurry certainly doesnt.

Nifty2g · April 2016

susmitds wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

So if a bug that allows you to double dip champion points on abilities that are obviously not DoTs is fixed you're leaving the game? Good thing you're not a fan of the Battle Axe.

Please tell me, how is Puncturing Sweep not a DoT?
Channeled ability that deals damage per tick
Sounds like a damage over time to me.

I'll leave until they fix it up, it's absolute garbage they keep shitting on Templar DPS when it finds a good spot. It's not the strongest and it's good where it is at, but they just completely destroyed it with this

By the same logic, almost every channel is a DoT. They have Ticks too. Why should only Sweeps take advantage of a bug?

That's my point? Every channel in game is considered a dot lol, everything is being buffed it seems but Sweeps
And it's not a bug they are being buffed by thaum, that is an actual mechanic by definition of what a damage over time is. If it's not fixed, rework sweeps into Puncturing Sweep and make it deal damage per hit much like Whip from a dk of swallow soul from a nightblade.

Complete BS if it is intended with no fix to the actual skill

Nope not any other Channel gets affected by thaumatarge. My Flurry certainly doesnt.

about that

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r59CameQ9ZA

richardjameshillb16_ESO · April 2016

Just get into a good place with My Templar, and get smashed back again,

I left last time because of constant "balancing" changes, and I'm getting fed up again now,

At least take a look or explain the reasoning please ZoS

Solinur · April 2016

richardjameshillb16_ESO wrote: »

Just get into a good place with My Templar, and get smashed back again,

I left last time because of constant "balancing" changes, and I'm getting fed up again now,

At least take a look or explain the reasoning please ZoS

There is still a good chance it's just a bug given how incoherent this change is regarding Radiant Destruction and Flurry. But of course it could be those get nerfed as well oO

Daveheart · April 2016

From the listed change, it looked like delayed damage attacks (det., curse, Wrecking blow, snipe, and Dark Flare) would be the types of abilities hit. Jabs/sweeps, and flurry, definitely don't fall into that category.

Also, for anyone complaining about multiple sources of CP boost, ele wall, destructive reach/clench, burning, liquid lightning, vamp bane, and several DK abilities function as both elemental attacks and DoTs.

Chillic · April 2016

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

So if a bug that allows you to double dip champion points on abilities that are obviously not DoTs is fixed you're leaving the game? Good thing you're not a fan of the Battle Axe.

it IS a dot

I always looked at a DoT as one attack/strike, cause damage over time. Isn't puncturing sweeps several strikes? That's the only way it would make sense anyway.