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Grouping Tool Desaster

Bracteamentum
Honestly, I am furious with the new grouping tool.
If you want to do the normal pledge for Dungeons and use the grouping tool, you get thrown together with Level 42 people as a V16.
I know, that they get up scaled but what difference does it make when this person might be a new player and has no experience with dungeons. No offence to them of course because they still have to learn.
There should be a differ ice made between V16 and V15 + below. There might be still a few who have low experience with dungeons but far less than a Level 40 for example.
  • Fignutz821
    Fignutz821
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    Why does it matter? You get the silver key for the pledge regardless of what level you do it at, if you want to do it at a high level then get some v16 friends to run it with you.
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  • sadownik
    sadownik
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    Its this or no lfg tool - simple as that. I think not many players understood what that "fixed" lfg tool means. Simply put population is so low that only most drastic measures could help.

    Do you really think the devs like the idea of putting lvl 20 and v16 into the same dungeon?
  • Yattaq
    Yattaq
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    Normal dungeons aren't complex to begin with, that's exactly where a player learning group PVE belongs. Even after scaling all their stats to VR16, they're giving those players a 25% buff to damage. There are a lot of people at VR16 who are going through dungeons for the first time too, since we didn't have a working tool while leveling up. Doing dungeons with low levels is great because it keeps them more interested in the game. If players leveling up have positive dungeon experiences and receive guidance instead of this nonsense you're posting, this tool might just help cultivate a stronger end game community.
  • tcanaes
    tcanaes
    Soul Shriven
    I have a complaint about LFG tool.. is it the right place? Coz I think it is a disaster too!

    Im leveling another char. Im V6 with it now...
    When I find a group for gold key, I get instantly kicked out!
    It is easy to find v16 people around, but when you are low level, that you are walking around a low population map, its when we need the LFG tool the most! But people just wanna find v16 people in it...

    It should group people around same level...

    At least when it didnt work, I didnt bother using it, and didnt get pissed off.
    now, its worst, coz you get kicked out for no reason :/
    Edited by tcanaes on November 16, 2015 11:52PM
  • lolo_01b16_ESO
    lolo_01b16_ESO
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    Those players who kick you know that they are very bad themselves and need a top geared v16 player to carry them through the dungeon. (But they won't tell you that because they are ashamed of it.)

    In my opinion joining a guild is still much better than using the grouping tool. There people will know you after some time and recognize that you are able to do the dungeon even though you are not v16.
  • LadyNalcarya
    LadyNalcarya
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    I don't know. Once I used this tool to find a group for normal wgt, just out of boredom. 3 people in group were vr16, and our healer was level 20-something. He died a few times during the course of the dungeon, but it was better then I expected. Even though it was obvious that the healer was a newbie - he wore random armor and used random skills.
    That being said, me and another dd had decent dps and knew the strategy, dont know how it would work with a full group of lvl 20s.
    Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason

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  • tcanaes
    tcanaes
    Soul Shriven
    It does work with a full group of lvl 20, because, when you group (without the grouping tool), the DG get scalated to the party's leader.
    Using the group tool, looks like it will aways be a V16, and the players get scalated to v16. (I just tried veteran dungeons, for gold key)
    The problem is not the group tool. In theory it works... the problem is that people dont work. They think a v2 scalated to v16 will not be useful. I got kicked 3 times in a row withing 5 seconds after the group formed. And after waiting 20 minutes on queue.

    I do agree that, if you are in a guild, group tools becomes a lot less necessary.
    But, for people that are leveling, the group tools tends to be used more frequently.
    You cant use your main city chat for lfg because you are not there.
    You are probably on a map with very few people. And there is no point in abandon your quests to stay on main city finding a group. Its not that you CANT, but its not worth it. And since the tool now group people from other factions, it should have MORE people to group.

    Guildies tend to be doing high lvl stuff together, and I don't feel confortable asking them to stop what they are doing for something thats somehow useless to them. And beeing rushed trough a DG isnt really fun.
  • LadyNalcarya
    LadyNalcarya
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    Well, at least some vr16 dont mind low level players in group, if they're scaled to vr16 and have a basic knowledge of their role. ;)
    Perhaps, if more low-lvls will use this tool, it will make things easier. But people still seem to prefer zone chat for this.
    Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason

    PC/EU
  • code65536
    code65536
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    this person might be a new player and has no experience with dungeons
    "Might be"

    It might be that this person has done the dungeon before.

    It might be that you find a VR16 who had never done that group dungeon before (I've come across a few in PUGs).

    In any case, with the exception of Blackheart, nICP, and nWGT, normal dungeons are easy enough that I've 2-manned or soloed all of them. So if the VR16s are well-experienced, then it shouldn't matter that they have one or two lowbies that they're helping carry through the dungeon, and if they aren't, then it would be hypocritical of them to complain about the inexperienced lowbies.
    Edited by code65536 on November 18, 2015 9:57PM
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  • failkiwib16_ESO
    failkiwib16_ESO
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    Not every v16 is to be able to carry lowbies through a dungeon. Waiting for dungeon quest etc. is rare among v16's because many v16's have done those pledges so many times, and often they are motivated only to get the gold and silver keys because they want the shoulder pieces.

    The grouping tool is not working very well because people want to do dungeons due to different reasons, and battle scaling is not enough. Lower level players don't always have set items, unlocked skills and passives etc.

    I recently used the grouping tool out of boredom, and I ended up in a group with a v2 sorcerer damage dealer, who only had overload heavy attacks as AoE. The Dungeon was veteran Darkshade Caverns ^^
    - we finished the dungeon, when the sorcerer decided to leave and the other damage dealer also went offline for 10min+. We got 2 new damage dealers in and finished Grobull and the rest of the dungeon after that.

    I admit I really did enjoy that run, however the dungeon took 2 hours - meanwhile if I had asked my friends instead, the run would have taken 15 minutes max.
  • tcanaes
    tcanaes
    Soul Shriven
    How many times have you not finished vCOA on v14 coz the group you PUG, all made of v14s, was not good enough?
    Its the same thing. You can get a terrible V2 the same way you can get a terrible V16.
    Damage can be a little bit lower, but does not mean it's inefficient.

    Group Tools is a PUG.
    You cannot really compare with guild groups.
  • Bracteamentum
    Well, you all have some valid arguments.
  • David123
    David123
    I started playing this game a little over a week ago. This weekend I grouped with two guild mates (new players also). We all picked up the game from the sale, myself from Steam. They were level 10-14 and I was level 21 on my templar healer. They wanted to run their first dungeon and asked me to tag along. I healed this one previously (second run through in Spindlecrutch) and I have healed in previous mmos so I wasn't worried about it until we entered.

    We used LFG to get a tank and entered the dungeon. A level 28 or 38 player joins. As soon as we entered I moused over the mobs and told them up front this run isn't right. It appears the mobs were scaled up to Vet 16. I may be completely wrong. I've never run one before but what made me believe that it may be a V16 is the star symbol and "16" at the top of their unit frame. My health was scaled up to 14k and everyone else was 20k. The mobs had 80k + health and killing a group of 5-8 was a nightmare. We focused on the healers but we wiped a few times.

    We eventually got to the last boss and we didn't wipe on him. That run was brutal.

    The next day (Sunday) we ran Wayrest Sewers and it was scaled to our level (because a guild mate walked in - no LFG) and we owned it, even without a tank. Just 3 dps and myself. It was a blast. Only 1 player died due to him standing still while letting 3-4 mobs beat on him. Overall, it was a great time.

    I'm really enjoying this experience of learning the game with these other players. It's kinda nice not having someone experienced in the group, guiding you through it, telling you what to do and not to do, just learning it on your own.

    However, when I do pug, upfront I immediately say I'm new to the game and the dungeon. I know how it can go when someone doesn't say that up front and part way through the dungeon the group finds out the healer is new and doesn't know anything. On a side note, the way healing is done in this game is truly fun.

    Anyway, it's nice to be healing again (I also play GW2) and learning the ropes as well.

    Sincerely,

    David The Templar
    David The Templaer
    V16 Breton Templar Healer
    Daggerfall Covenant

    "Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen."
  • Docka
    Docka
    Soul Shriven
    I also suffer from the same as David. When you are sub Vet levels the scaling does NOT make up for it regardless of gear/ skill. It is too brutal when scaled to VR16. It takes 3-4 times as long to complete the dungeons, and is not as fun as when the content is actually for your level. This makes it nigh impossible to just keep running the dungeons for fun due to the amount of pain involved. This always make people leave the group who you are queuing with.

    I really think they need to roll this update to the dungeon finder back. Keep the ability to join with other factions, but kill off the vet scaling and return it to scaling the dungeon to the group leader, and allow us to put in some levels to look for more. Hell you could even keep an option search for all, but give back the choice to not do the scaled VR16 dungeons. I personally am skipping dungeons till VR1 because of this issue. Some things are just too hard and while I do enjoy a challenge its not fun when you are struggling when you are new it turns more people away than its going to help get groups.

    ESO needs to look at game like Rift, WoW, and FFXIV on how to correctly do a dungeon finder LFG tool as this one needs to be canned. There is zero reason to reinvent the system here when others perform amazingly already.
  • Seedier
    Seedier
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    Another issue, although it may just be me... i can't queue with the dungeon finder without getting automatically pulled into the instance 60 seconds later, no matter what...

    A not infrequent scenario is that as soon as the group forms, someone will leave... so naturally i'd like to continue what i was doing until a full group forms. Instead i get pulled in even if i'm mid-fight, and will keep getting pulled back every time i leave the dungeon - extremely frustrating when it's 2 am and no tank is immediately at hand...

    any one else having this issue? or am i doing something stupid?
  • Deandril
    Deandril
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    I could see an issue with a level 20 scaling to VR16 since they probably don't have enough passives unlocked yet. Someone in their 40's probably is way better off as long as they hunted their sky shards. I recommend to anyone to try to max out skill lines where passives are most essential and hunt all the sky shards in Cyrodil as well as the areas you have cleared. With passives unlocked and purple gear close to your level you should scale fine.
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