My BIGGEST issue in this game..... Guild Traders

anitajoneb17_ESO · November 2015

C'mon guys, give auction horse a pat ! We had not seen him in a few days, missing him already ! :-)

Elsonso · November 2015

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

C'mon guys, give auction horse a pat ! :-)

The auction horse is destined to become the glue that binds us all together....

iamnotweakrwb17_ESO · November 2015

I want an auction house I absolutely loathe ESO's guild trader system and while its not a deal breaker for me, it is pretty close. I do wonder how many people have quit ESO over a lack of auction house.

Elsonso · November 2015

iamnotweakrwb17_ESO wrote: »

I want an auction house I absolutely loathe ESO's guild trader system and while its not a deal breaker for me, it is pretty close. I do wonder how many people have quit ESO over a lack of auction house.

Like with any feature of the game, I am sure it has contributed to people not sticking around. The game is what the game is, either you can accept that and play the game, or you cannot accept it and play a different game.

Pheefs · November 2015

Eshelmen wrote: »

I have to manually go to each guild trader to find the deals/items that I want...

The prices vary all over the place.

Yes, you have to travel around to find the best deals.

& EXACTLY! prices vary, that's a good thing not a negative.
A centralized Auction House would lead to price fixing and a forced economy, no thank you.

I like the Guild Traders the way they are, while the search ui itself could be improved (remember last search, search by name)
I am curious how they decide how many there are & where? ...particularly the ones out in the wild near a random wayshrine.

FlicksZ · November 2015

It sucks. That is all

Tholian1 · November 2015

FortheloveofKrist wrote: »

From PS4 perspective...

The Guild Trader system works fine except the kiosks are too cumbersome due to the search mechanics. No keyword search. No saved searches. It doesn't even remember your last search when going between 5-6 kiosks. If you could search faster, it would be perfect.

But I would vote no on the auction house concept. Played WoW, and I think this system is better.

I agree. The guild traders on console need the improvements you mentioned.

The only other issue I have with the system are all the sellers living in fantasy land with some of their prices for common goods. Can't fix that unfortunately. But they always give me a good laugh.

BCBUDZ · November 2015

Leave traders as is

RatedChaotic · November 2015

Only thing I have to say is...... These top trading guilds (not naming and shaming) on xbox need to look more closer at these casual/social guild prices. I've been buying alot of v15 - v16 mats at 1/4 of your price.

Tandor · November 2015

imnotanother wrote: »

Tannakaobi wrote: »

imnotanother wrote: »

You seem to be very stuck on the idea that you are entitled to everything without doing any of the work. Sounds like a case of L2P

imnotanother wrote: »

What is time wasting? Shopping or shopping for the lowest price? Traveling around? I just can't get over the entitlement.

"I want the lowest price and I want it now!"

I really can't be bothered trying to have a debate with someone that turns to such childish comments.

Fair enough. But when I read AH threads and post, all I hear is complaints from members who sound very entitled. This game does not have an AH, it has guild traders. If you are complaining that this game doesn't behave the way you want and that it should, you are feeling entitled. Sorry

If you really study those threads and posts, I think you'll find the only players who sound very entitled are the ones who are making loads of money out of the present system so don't want it changed thank you very much! And to be scrupulously fair, even those sellers are admitting that as buyers the system sucks!

Are you seriously suggesting that those who put forward suggestions for improving the game are only acting out of a sense of self-entitlement? If so, why do you not consider that those who argue against them are also acting out of a sense of self-entitlement? After all, as the saying goes, it takes two to tango!

Tandor · November 2015

kupacmac wrote: »

Can we please stop with the WoW comparisons? The reason I play ESO and not WoW is because ESO is better than WoW in every conceivable way, including Guild Traders. If you guys love WoW so much, by all means GO BACK! Don't try to turn this game into the steaming pile that WoW is. We don't want that crap here.

I agree, indeed I couldn't agree more. However, what we can also hopefully agree on is that the game should have a decent public trading system that is open to all sellers and readily accessible to all buyers. I'm not bothered whether that is some form of auction house, an improved version of the present system, or something different altogether.

However, those who really prefer a system that is accessible only to a small proportion of the playerbase for both selling and buying, the former being dependent on belonging to the right guilds at the right time, with the latter dependent on being of the right level and alliance to be able to access one by one those kiosks that happen to hold the items they're after until they find them, do need to find a stronger argument to defend the restrictive nature of the present system.

failkiwib16_ESO · November 2015

Pls give us search function + auction house. I do very well, in regards of selling and trading - however I loath the current search + guildtrader system.

I also hate having to depend that much on third party programs. Why should we download Master Merchant and Awesome Guildstore, when ESO can easily implement good search functions?

FireCowCommando · November 2015

Load screens + travel time = I only ever check one city, if they dont have what i want i give up.

I agree the current trader system is bad. Its cancer to ESO.

Callous2208 · November 2015

Tandor wrote: »

imnotanother wrote: »

Tannakaobi wrote: »

imnotanother wrote: »

You seem to be very stuck on the idea that you are entitled to everything without doing any of the work. Sounds like a case of L2P

imnotanother wrote: »

What is time wasting? Shopping or shopping for the lowest price? Traveling around? I just can't get over the entitlement.

"I want the lowest price and I want it now!"

I really can't be bothered trying to have a debate with someone that turns to such childish comments.

Fair enough. But when I read AH threads and post, all I hear is complaints from members who sound very entitled. This game does not have an AH, it has guild traders. If you are complaining that this game doesn't behave the way you want and that it should, you are feeling entitled. Sorry

If you really study those threads and posts, I think you'll find the only players who sound very entitled are the ones who are making loads of money out of the present system so don't want it changed thank you very much!

Are you seriously suggesting that those who put forward suggestions for improving the game are only acting out of a sense of self-entitlement? If so, why do you not consider that those who argue against them are also acting out of a sense of self-entitlement? After all, as the saying goes, it takes two to tango!

No, I've read and studied these posts and I don't find that to be the case. Keep in mind people on my side of the fence also have the advantage in the debate over "who is sounding entitled," because they are not actively lobbying to change a system that the developers have chosen to use in their game.

As far as your second point, it's all subjective. To a person who enjoys the system this game chose to use, and does not like the global auction house from other titles, you are not putting forth suggestions for improvement. You are indeed lobbying to have a system they enjoy replaced by one they despise. In that light, you are acting out of a sense of self-entitlement, not them. Your entire argument here hinges on the acceptance of the AH being a far superior system as fact. It is not fact. It is your opinion and is not shared by everyone.

imnotanother · November 2015

@Tandor Everyone is able to sell via trade window. Everyone is able to buy from any guild they are able to visit. 100% of the player database is capable of these actions. Players in a trading guild are privileged to list an item for 30 days in a searchable format. 100% of the player database is allowed to join a trade guild.

I think the system works fine. I do agree that the Guild Store UI could use improved search functions and more but the actual Guild Trading system is a great way to have niche economies and for gold sinks to not allow everyone to be millionaires already.

Waseem · November 2015

just no.
there is already people who buy cheap and sell expensive.. if this goes to eso for all sales well.. couple guys quit their jobs.. sit for a beer together and argue how to make a living of eso.
next day they buy everything cheap, sell in its price, make gold. sell gold for usd.. wait a moment.. people already doing that.

Tandor · November 2015

imnotanother wrote: »

@Tandor Everyone is able to sell via trade window. Everyone is able to buy from any guild they are able to visit. 100% of the player database is capable of these actions. Players in a trading guild are privileged to list an item for 30 days in a searchable format. 100% of the player database is allowed to join a trade guild.

I think the system works fine. I do agree that the Guild Store UI could use improved search functions and more but the actual Guild Trading system is a great way to have niche economies and for gold sinks to not allow everyone to be millionaires already.

So if say a level 10 unguilded player wants to sell a motif he's looted, he can do so provided he sells via the chat window on the PC version or by area voice chat on console, but not via the ingame trading system?

And that level 10 player can buy an item he needs, say a crafting writ recipe, from any of the guild kiosks his level and alliance restrict him to even tho' most of the low-level kiosks are dominated by those playing the veteran level instances of the only zone with kiosks that he's encountered?

To be honest, I don't think you get it. My guess is that you're a high level player in one or more successful trading guilds (probably on PC) and you aren't concerned about the large proportion of the playerbase who don't have the same access to the trading system that you have.

It's certainly a great way to ensure there are only a few millionaires! The trouble is that most people don't want to be millionaires, they just want to be able to sell their surplus stuff and buy the other stuff they need with the minimum of fuss. The present system doesn't permit that.

StrykerTheElite · November 2015

auction house would cause too much strain on server, plus you think prices be fixed but the problem would be botters under cutting.

biggest problem with wow yea stuff is cheap but taking something 3 hours work for couple gold while bot can create that in second. So auction house in wow is only rich if your botter because prices be too low that can't be compete against. Or you can have the opposite direction that person can dominate market by buying everything and jacking price.

So auction house doesn't fix anything it creates more problems.

Tandor · November 2015

Callous2208 wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

imnotanother wrote: »

Tannakaobi wrote: »

imnotanother wrote: »

You seem to be very stuck on the idea that you are entitled to everything without doing any of the work. Sounds like a case of L2P

imnotanother wrote: »

What is time wasting? Shopping or shopping for the lowest price? Traveling around? I just can't get over the entitlement.

"I want the lowest price and I want it now!"

I really can't be bothered trying to have a debate with someone that turns to such childish comments.

Fair enough. But when I read AH threads and post, all I hear is complaints from members who sound very entitled. This game does not have an AH, it has guild traders. If you are complaining that this game doesn't behave the way you want and that it should, you are feeling entitled. Sorry

If you really study those threads and posts, I think you'll find the only players who sound very entitled are the ones who are making loads of money out of the present system so don't want it changed thank you very much!

Are you seriously suggesting that those who put forward suggestions for improving the game are only acting out of a sense of self-entitlement? If so, why do you not consider that those who argue against them are also acting out of a sense of self-entitlement? After all, as the saying goes, it takes two to tango!

No, I've read and studied these posts and I don't find that to be the case. Keep in mind people on my side of the fence also have the advantage in the debate over "who is sounding entitled," because they are not actively lobbying to change a system that the developers have chosen to use in their game.

As far as your second point, it's all subjective. To a person who enjoys the system this game chose to use, and does not like the global auction house from other titles, you are not putting forth suggestions for improvement. You are indeed lobbying to have a system they enjoy replaced by one they despise. In that light, you are acting out of a sense of self-entitlement, not them. Your entire argument here hinges on the acceptance of the AH being a far superior system as fact. It is not fact. It is your opinion and is not shared by everyone.

Indeed, not even by me! You accuse me of basing my entire argument on the merits of an auction house, yet I have made it clear in this thread and others like it that I don't particularly argue for that, simply for an improvement of the present system in one way or another so that the game has an effective trading system open to players of all levels and alliances and not dependent on arbitrary restrictions like guild membership. I didn't even mention auction houses in the post you're replying to! What I said in that particular post is that those defending the present system do it every bit as much out of a sense of self-entitlement as those who argue against it, and you haven't countered that point at all.

Callous2208 · November 2015

Tandor wrote: »

imnotanother wrote: »

@Tandor Everyone is able to sell via trade window. Everyone is able to buy from any guild they are able to visit. 100% of the player database is capable of these actions. Players in a trading guild are privileged to list an item for 30 days in a searchable format. 100% of the player database is allowed to join a trade guild.

I think the system works fine. I do agree that the Guild Store UI could use improved search functions and more but the actual Guild Trading system is a great way to have niche economies and for gold sinks to not allow everyone to be millionaires already.

So if say a level 10 unguilded player wants to sell a motif he's looted, he can do so provided he sells via the chat window on the PC version or by area voice chat on console, but not via the ingame trading system?

And that level 10 player can buy an item he needs, say a crafting writ recipe, from any of the guild kiosks his level and alliance restrict him to even tho' most of the low-level kiosks are dominated by those playing the veteran level instances of the only zone with kiosks that he's encountered?

To be honest, I don't think you get it. My guess is that you're a high level player in one or more successful trading guilds (probably on PC) and you aren't concerned about the large proportion of the playerbase who don't have the same access to the trading system that you have.

It's certainly a great way to ensure there are only a few millionaires! The trouble is that most people don't want to be millionaires, they just want to be able to sell their surplus stuff and buy the other stuff they need with the minimum of fuss. The present system doesn't permit that.

Incorrect as far as PC/NA is concerned. Almost all major trading guilds recruit via zone chat in starter areas to keep that solid 500 membership. For a new player it's as easy as /tell @That Guy "Add me friend." Boom. Access to a fantastic trader. Smack down that motif at a reasonable price and there you have it. The only people without access to this system are the ones who voluntarily decide not to use it.

EZgoin76 · November 2015

This and no text chat for consoles are really my only two complaints about ESO. I've tried to join trade guilds and it's nothing but a huge pita. My experience with the guilds I joined are not indicative of what others may experience but I refuse to have someone set rules on where and at what price I sell my wares.

I cannot sell things in area chat because it becomes toxic and annoying in a matter of a few minutes unless I want to try yelling over people and that just causes more chaos.

As a buyer I absolutely hate spending an hour or more trying to find something specific unless I luck out and find it in the first city I try. I have a limited amount of time to play each day. I shouldn't have to spend a quarter or more of that time playing ESO shoppers online.

Now even after saying that, I don't think an AH is the answer. I would like to see an improved UI and search functions for the traders and an extra trader in each city that lets players, that are not in a trade guild, sell their wares for a nominal fee. Say 1 to 5 gold per every 100 gold the item is worth.

Waffennacht · November 2015

Pluses and minuses...

If it was global no way would my buddy get that Primal Motif for 100 gold. I would not have found arcane willpower ring for 20k.

It does get annoying, esp when your guild stupidly over prices...

It's convenience vs price.

Gobal means the standard price will be pretty set, I prefer putting in the work to save 30k in gold.

Callous2208 · November 2015

Tandor wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

imnotanother wrote: »

Tannakaobi wrote: »

imnotanother wrote: »

You seem to be very stuck on the idea that you are entitled to everything without doing any of the work. Sounds like a case of L2P

imnotanother wrote: »

What is time wasting? Shopping or shopping for the lowest price? Traveling around? I just can't get over the entitlement.

"I want the lowest price and I want it now!"

I really can't be bothered trying to have a debate with someone that turns to such childish comments.

Fair enough. But when I read AH threads and post, all I hear is complaints from members who sound very entitled. This game does not have an AH, it has guild traders. If you are complaining that this game doesn't behave the way you want and that it should, you are feeling entitled. Sorry

If you really study those threads and posts, I think you'll find the only players who sound very entitled are the ones who are making loads of money out of the present system so don't want it changed thank you very much!

Are you seriously suggesting that those who put forward suggestions for improving the game are only acting out of a sense of self-entitlement? If so, why do you not consider that those who argue against them are also acting out of a sense of self-entitlement? After all, as the saying goes, it takes two to tango!

No, I've read and studied these posts and I don't find that to be the case. Keep in mind people on my side of the fence also have the advantage in the debate over "who is sounding entitled," because they are not actively lobbying to change a system that the developers have chosen to use in their game.

As far as your second point, it's all subjective. To a person who enjoys the system this game chose to use, and does not like the global auction house from other titles, you are not putting forth suggestions for improvement. You are indeed lobbying to have a system they enjoy replaced by one they despise. In that light, you are acting out of a sense of self-entitlement, not them. Your entire argument here hinges on the acceptance of the AH being a far superior system as fact. It is not fact. It is your opinion and is not shared by everyone.

Indeed, not even by me! You accuse me of basing my entire argument on the merits of an auction house, yet I have made it clear in this thread and others like it that I don't particularly argue for that, simply for an improvement of the present system in one way or another so that the game has an effective trading system open to players of all levels and alliances and not dependent on arbitrary restrictions like guild membership. I didn't even mention auction houses in the post you're replying to! What I said in that particular post is that those defending the present system do it every bit as much out of a sense of self-entitlement as those who argue against it, and you haven't countered that point at all.

Ah, I've confused a few peoples statements with yours, my apologies. However, is it really fair to say those who are simply using and enjoying the system as it was intended, are acting entitled? How can one be In the wrong to defend something they don't see as needing to be changed, fixed, scrapped when they are enjoying it as is.

Waffennacht · November 2015

I would say self-interest over entitlement. I don't feel like in entitled to a cheaper ring of willpower, but I will get one out of self interest.

But then again, why would anyone buy anything NOT ot of self -interest?

imnotanother · November 2015

Tandor wrote: »

To be honest, I don't think you get it.

I understand what you are trying to say but you keep forgetting that any player is able to join a trade guild at any time.

My guess is that you're a high level player in one or more successful trading guilds (probably on PC) and you aren't concerned about the large proportion of the playerbase who don't have the same access to the trading system that you have.

Incorrect. I am a VR16 but on the PS4[NA] servers. I do manage a successful trading guild, that I started as a way to trade, that has 400+ members. I, personally, contribute over 150k a week to secure a Top tier (in my opinion) trader. I don't do it for myself, I do it for the 400+ members.

I like the game and the community. I'm always willing to help out other players.

Appleblade · November 2015

Never understood why "it mimics real life" is considered a positive in a high fantasy RPG.

You want realism? It's all unleveled PvP (your first fight at level 1 can be against a V16), and if your character dies, the game deletes itself and you can never play again. There's your realism.

I just want to be able to easily sell some spare stuff once in a while. Maybe a Consignment Camel?

RatedChaotic · November 2015

I love how most of you get so technical about things. When most of you are playing on up to 3 different platforms and things differ from each in some form or another. Lmao.

Elsonso · November 2015

Tandor wrote: »

If you really study those threads and posts, I think you'll find the only players who sound very entitled are the ones who are making loads of money out of the present system so don't want it changed thank you very much! And to be scrupulously fair, even those sellers are admitting that as buyers the system sucks!

Untrue. As a buyer, I find that the Guild Trader system works well. Again, on the PC/Mac. Your experience may be different on the console. It is very rare that I cannot find something at a price I am willing to pay.

As a casual seller, I sell a number of different things, from 1g/ea materials all the way up to excess motifs that are currently selling for thousands apiece. I do not make loads of gold doing this, but I have been doing this for more than a year, and I have accumulated some gold along the way.

People who want to sell in the traders need to find a guild with a trader that they can join and stick with. There are guilds out there that are not full, do not charge to be member, have no sales requirements, have a guild store, and actually have a trader. If anything, ESO needs a "Looking For Guild" as much as it needs "Looking For Group" so that people can find guilds. Heck, just a way to contact a guild would be nice. You should be able to send mail to a GUILD and have it go to the guild master.

Tandor · November 2015

lordrichter wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

If you really study those threads and posts, I think you'll find the only players who sound very entitled are the ones who are making loads of money out of the present system so don't want it changed thank you very much! And to be scrupulously fair, even those sellers are admitting that as buyers the system sucks!

Untrue. As a buyer, I find that the Guild Trader system works well. Again, on the PC/Mac. Your experience may be different on the console. It is very rare that I cannot find something at a price I am willing to pay.

As a casual seller, I sell a number of different things, from 1g/ea materials all the way up to excess motifs that are currently selling for thousands apiece. I do not make loads of gold doing this, but I have been doing this for more than a year, and I have accumulated some gold along the way.

People who want to sell in the traders need to find a guild with a trader that they can join and stick with. There are guilds out there that are not full, do not charge to be member, have no sales requirements, have a guild store, and actually have a trader. If anything, ESO needs a "Looking For Guild" as much as it needs "Looking For Group" so that people can find guilds. Heck, just a way to contact a guild would be nice. You should be able to send mail to a GUILD and have it go to the guild master.

I'm on the PC (EU).

Are you perchance veteran level with access to all alliance zones?

My point is in any event a fair one. It's common to these threads that those who defend the present system as sellers do want it improved, especially from their other position as buyers and that's reflected in this thread too. Those who simply defend the present system without wanting improvements are doing so because they're benefiting hugely from it and don't want that to change.

temjiu · November 2015

As a player of many MMO's with many different approaches to Auction houses, I have to honestly say that ESO is the first one in a long time that I've actually enjoyed from a gaming perspective (aside from the issues still present in the system itself, QoL items more then foundation issues...like the search approach, etc.)

It actually reminds me of a time when people didn't have immediate access to intricate detailed information from across the world. back when Merchants made their money personally by travelling to the ends of the earth to get the most exotic items at the cheapest prices, and selling for profit in the major trade centers.

Although it would be nice from an "efficiency" perspective, not everything is improved with "efficiency". I'm enjoying a Punch cigar at the moment (personal preference, I know not everyone is into cigars, but to my point....), and if i were to smoke it "more efficiently", it would be gone faster, and I wouldn't enjoy it as much.

Now to that point...there could be ways that ESO could improve the current system and streamline it. I'm not sure if this has been mentioned..but there are add-ons that do this. I am currently playing with Master Merchant. it has much more expanded search functions, easy icon based filtering, and even allows you to search based on a general range of "quality" of deals (i.e. is it a bad deal, decent deal, or dirt cheap). It even saves your search data so when you get to the next merchant, it's all there so all you have to do is click search. Saves a ton of time in the current system, and is "almost" all I need to get what I want. You can even get average "price checks" from it on items, so you have a ballpark figure of what you can sell things for.

It is an LUA memory hog, so just a fair warning...I usually turn it off unless i am really hunting stuff down. But that being said...there are alternatives out there, and stuff like MM really makes it a no brainer for me. I enjoy it. Now we just need to smooth out the rough edges and make the current system easy to use and get into.

the competitiveness of the store locations is also a benefit to the market. you tend to find the best deals often in places that are out of the way...if your serious about being a merchant, you go to these places frequently, look for deals in general, buy there...and sell in your own market with a mark-up. profit. Just like the merchants of old...

I admit, there are times when I just wish I could "find" a quick and easy resource. it can be irritating to have to hunt down materials for certain crafts, and have to go to multiple vendors at multiple sites...but this can be taken care of easily either in the current theft system or the thieves guild incoming "Soon" (trademarked).

Have an underground "black market" that is game wide. add a heavy markup from the dealer for access, and you can search whatever is on that market. you pay a heavy price...but it's there.

This was mentioned earlier, and I think it's a great middle-road solution. I for one also experienced the GW2 AH...and it plain sucked. search for one specific item...get 2 thousand results (seriously) all within a copper or two of each other...selling anything became a horrid chore. I log in once a week or so for the last 4 months and I'm still getting sales of 1-2 silver at a time from things I put up months ago.......months......

that kind of AH benefits only one aspect of the game...the buyer. ESO's market can benefit both if done right. I just think it needs more TLC.